Author Topic: Using English BMD records before 1841  (Read 4294 times)

Offline Melbell

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #18 on: Friday 13 July 18 08:37 BST (UK) »
Dear Eric

Please be aware that it's not all that easy or cheap for people in the UK either, if they have ancestors from all over the four nations!  UK must look very little to people in Australia but not many here can afford to go travelling all over the country to the various record offices and repositories.  We're in the same boat to a large extent!

Good luck with your research,
Melbell

Offline Guy Etchells

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #19 on: Friday 13 July 18 13:34 BST (UK) »
Hi Guy, thanks for that useful information. The trouble is, I don't really have any choice about doing my UK research online. I may never visit UK again and if I do I will probably be visiting places I've longed to see, not researching in churches and records offices. (If I had more time, I would love to do that, but ....)

So it is online records that I need. Once I found a person who was in charge of a set of church records (I think maybe at a village in Devon) and he kindly sent me a copy of the page of the records I was interested in, but I can't expect that all the time.

But putting everyone's ideas together, and being aptient, I hope I can make progress. Thanks.

But you do have a choice Eric, as you and Kaybron have mentioned there are other options, the options I used back in the 1950s when I started and family historians for decades have used before the invention of the internet.

When I started there was not internet, only a very few Family History Societies (FHS) and very few transcriptions of records. By the mid 1970s there was a surge in FHS and they in turn took up the transcription challenge, leading to a higher availability of transcripts, most FHS will also help overseas members with their research and their records transcripts are a good start.
Many FHS members will visit local archives for other members as well.
In addition most of the familysearch microfilmed records are now digitised a few are even available on the internet. All their digitised records are available at their Family History Centers (FHC) in countries worldwide, this means if the parish is not only it will if it was microfilmed be available in a FHC “near” you.

I would also note that individuals, groups, councils etc. host transcripts and even digital records on their own websites, so even your internet use is not limited to the 4 main players many call to mind.

Cheers
Guy
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Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #20 on: Friday 13 July 18 16:53 BST (UK) »
I concur with Kaybron's and Guy's recommendation that you join a FHS in a county where your ancestors lived. Some have an online forum or FB page. The one I joined has 2 research centres with libraries. I also got a lot of help from volunteers at a heritage centre in a town where a branch of my family had lived for hundreds of years and owned a business.
Catalogues of some county archives are online. Some items in county archives are also included in Natonal Archives online catalogue.
The town or village in which your ancestors lived may have a website, FB page, community association, historical or heritage group.
Don't forget libraries!   :) Some allow remote membership. I've used my library card to view library catalogue and to access British Newspaper Archive from home. Some larger libraries have local studies sections.
Have you looked at Resources on the county boards on this forum?  People add new items to these.
Cowban

Offline Eric Hatfield

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #21 on: Sunday 15 July 18 05:52 BST (UK) »
Thanks again for all the ideas and assistance, especially yours Maiden Stone. I will certainly be trying some of them out.

(Also happy for any more ideas.)


Offline jbml

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 22 July 18 10:49 BST (UK) »
Before 1837 you are dependent on parish registers ("PRs") as your principal source. A standard, pre-printed format was introduced in 1813. Prior to that, what was recorded was often pretty much at the whim of the minister. Essentially, the further back in time you go, the less information you get.

A good way to get the hang of searching PRs is to start with the births, marriages and deaths you already know about from the 1840s and 50s and see if you can trace the corresponding baptisms, marriages and burials in the PRs. A couple of words of caution: in the early days of internet genealogy, the databases didn't tend to give you the PRs from after 1837, because the assumption was you would use the BMD records ... this is being addressed now, but I do not think the work is complete yet. Secondly, just because somebody was born, doesn't mean they were baptised either as an infant, or at all. So don't be dismayed if you cannot find a baptism to match a birth.

There are some things that come to your aid when you start working with the PRs. One is that you are into the age before mass transportation (the London & Birmingham Railway, Britain's first long-distance railway route, was opened in 1838). For the most part, people did not tend to travel long distances. And the rigorous enforcement of the Poor Laws meant that poorer people did not tend to leave their home parishes except on marriage, and when they did they seldom moved more than one parish.

The exception to this is the migration to the cities. There was a significant migration to the cities in the early 19th century. If you have labouring class ancestors in Birmingham they are likely to have been part of this. So movement through several parishes into the city is quite possible. But even so, people did not choose to go to Birmingham as such ... they went to the nearest city. So if you have a potential candidate for the baptism of somebody who ended up working in Birmingham in, say, Ryton-on-Dunsmore, then be hesitant to assume that this is necessarily your ancestor because to get to Birmingham he would have had to pass through Coventry. If he was looking for work, why did he not find a job in Coventry instead of pushing on to Birmingham? (That's not to say that he didn't - perhaps there were no suitable jobs in Coventry - but we are playing the odds here, and the odds favour that person going to Coventry rather than Birmingham).

An understanding of the geography of the places you are dealing with is going to be important in the next stage of your research. So for a while you may find that you have to stop looking for ancestors, and start looking for places instead. This is no bad thing. I have seen plenty of risible genealogy posted online by people who clearly never bothered to learn about the geography of the places where they claimed their ancestors lived, and hence had cobbled together totally implausible life stories which relied upon evidence of totally different people who just happened to share the same name. A little bit of map work can save you from this sort of error.

The Cassini Historical Map series are reprints of the first three series of Ordnance Survey maps, re-scaled and re-projected to match the modern OS 1:50 000 sheet numbers. The dates that each sheet conforms to will differ according to the map, because OS mapping in those days was a rolling process. For example, OS Sheet 177 is East London. In the Cassini Historical Map series, there is:

Old Series sheet 177 (1805 - 1822)
Revised Series sheet 177 (1897 - 1902) and
Popular Edition sheet 177 (1920 - 1922)

The Old Series is likely to be the map most useful to you if you are looking at pre-1837. This will show you the "lie of the land" at the end of the period you are researching, and enable you to see which places are where, and how they are connected by roads and canals. This will enable you to test the plausibility of the assumption that the man who was baptised in parish X was also the man of the same name who was married in parish Y and who had children baptised in parish Z.

Finally, once you are researching pre-BMD, the importance of WILLS comes to the fore. Even people of quite limited means made wills, and they give you the names of acknowledged children (and often as well grandchildren, and some siblings who might be appointed executors and so forth). This often enables you to verify the family grouping that your ancestor belongs to. So when you are looking at baptisms, don't just say "Ah yes ... my ancestor was John Jordan, and here is a John Jordan son of Philip and Mary being baptised in 1812 ... that looks like him". Make a note of all of the other children of Philip and Mary Jordan baptised in the same parish for 20 years either side of John. Then go and look for a will associated with John Jordan's death. If he appoints "my brother Zachary Jordan" to be his executor, and Philip and Mary did not baptise a son named Zachary, then you're probably looking at the wrong John Jordan baptism. BUT ... you DO now have a more distinctive name to search for. So go and search for some Zachary Jordan baptisms that fit ... and when you find one, check to see if the same parents had a son baptised called John (then check the burials to make sure that he didn't die at the age of 4 months ... ).

Hope this helps, and best luck with your researches!
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Offline Eric Hatfield

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 22 July 18 11:51 BST (UK) »
Thanks heaps. Lots of good information there. The wills sounds like a particularly good thing to try - I didn't realise so many people left wills.

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #24 on: Monday 23 July 18 21:28 BST (UK) »
Thanks heaps. Lots of good information there. The wills sounds like a particularly good thing to try - I didn't realise so many people left wills.

One I have is of a weaver whose worldly goods were worth £10. Most valuable items he owned were his apparel.
Wills of men in 18th & early 19thC usually stated their occupation or rank.
Married names of daughters would be given and their husbands may have been mentioned.
Two wills I read had provision for illegitimate grandchildren. Another mentioned a widowed daughter-in-law. A spinster left legacies to a favourite nephew and niece. Nephew was a clergyman. His life was well-documented. Researching him turned up more evidence about his father's family. One man left a small legacy to a woman who was probably his niece, so she became another jigsaw piece in a complicated family.


Cowban

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #25 on: Monday 23 July 18 22:30 BST (UK) »
I endorse jbml's post re knowledge of geography.
One of my families lived near a canal and a major road between north-west England and Scotland. Their skills, passed down from father to sons through the generations were in demand. Some members of the family went to & fro between towns and villages, others died where they were born. One had children baptised and buried in at least 3 parishes.
Another family lived off the beaten track. One branch farmed, another kept the town inn. Extension of the stagecoach route to the town meant the inn became a stagecoach inn, bringing more custom and therefore more work for sons, daughters and servants. The family remained, making a good living until the elder sons decided to set up on their own accounts, one in the nearest large town, his brother in the nearest city. Siblings and parents moved to join them over a period of time.
 Btw one innkeeper's widow married a maltster as her 2nd husband. Her eldest grandson, the one who moved to the bigger town, was in business as a miller for a while. Understanding how various occupations might be connected sometimes helps in FH. Marriage between children of business associates for example.
Cowban

Offline Treetotal

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Re: Using English BMD records before 1841
« Reply #26 on: Monday 23 July 18 23:04 BST (UK) »
I would just like to add a couple of ideas to the excellent advice that has been offered. Newspapers on findmypast can be very helpful, also looking for matching trees on Ancestry. You could also try googling the family name and County such as "Thompson Family history, Ledbury". I have found online Family trees using this method.
GenesReunited is also a good site for connecting with people with the same research interests.
I think you are going to be very busy, if you find info online, don't forget to make a note of the source in case you want to return to it.
Carol
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