Author Topic: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?  (Read 2704 times)

Offline JAKnighton

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 459
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #9 on: Monday 13 August 18 21:31 BST (UK) »
You haven't said whether you have tried the Glasgow Poor Law records to find out what happened to her and her siblings after their parents died?
I have a summary of her father's two poor law applications that does provide some insight.

In May 1879, Felix's second application was rejected and he and his children were admitted to a poorhouse. Then, they were shipped off back to Ireland in June 1879. However, they must have come straight back as Felix died in Glasgow in December 1879.

Possible marriage for Matilda in Blythswood 1895 to George Jeffers

1891 census appears to have her at 50 Kent Road as a general servant
I did have the marriage to George Jeffers already but the census is new to me, thank you.



Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Argyllshire

Offline Forfarian

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 14,972
  • http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ruz/
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #10 on: Monday 13 August 18 21:46 BST (UK) »
In May 1879, Felix's second application was rejected and he and his children were admitted to a poorhouse. Then, they were shipped off back to Ireland in June 1879. However, they must have come straight back as Felix died in Glasgow in December 1879.
Can you be sure that thje children accompanied him back to Glasgow? Could he have left them in Ireland when he came back?
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline JAKnighton

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 459
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #11 on: Monday 13 August 18 22:17 BST (UK) »
In May 1879, Felix's second application was rejected and he and his children were admitted to a poorhouse. Then, they were shipped off back to Ireland in June 1879. However, they must have come straight back as Felix died in Glasgow in December 1879.
Can you be sure that thje children accompanied him back to Glasgow? Could he have left them in Ireland when he came back?
He could, and perhaps that is likely, although all three children did end up in Glasgow again at some point.
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Argyllshire

Offline sancti

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 8,447
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #12 on: Monday 13 August 18 22:18 BST (UK) »
Have you looked for Irish Poor Records?


Offline JAKnighton

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 459
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #13 on: Monday 13 August 18 22:23 BST (UK) »
Have you looked for Irish Poor Records?
Where would I go to find them please?
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Argyllshire

Offline sancti

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 8,447
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #14 on: Monday 13 August 18 22:45 BST (UK) »
Where in Ireland were they sent to?

Offline JAKnighton

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 459
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #15 on: Monday 13 August 18 23:30 BST (UK) »
Where in Ireland were they sent to?

I don't know. Felix and his wife were married in Moneymore, County Londonderry and their first few children were born in that area. But Felix himself was born in Ardboe, County Tyrone. I don't know if that has any bearing on where he would be sent.
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Argyllshire

Offline Forfarian

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 14,972
  • http://www.rootschat.com/links/01ruz/
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #16 on: Tuesday 14 August 18 09:03 BST (UK) »
I don't know. Felix and his wife were married in Moneymore, County Londonderry and their first few children were born in that area. But Felix himself was born in Ardboe, County Tyrone. I don't know if that has any bearing on where he would be sent.
The rules were that you were charged to the parish where you had 'settlement'.

You acquire 'settlement' by being born there, or by marrying a man who had 'settlement' there, or by living long enough in that parish. Initially you had to be there for 5 years, and latterly it was reduced to 3 but I forget exactly when.

If Felix lived long enough in Ardboe to acquire 'settlement' there in the eyes of the Glasgow parochial board, and his children were born in Ardboe, I would expect the Glasgow parochial board to have contacted the authorities there, told them that one of their parishioners had applied for relief and asked them to pay for whatever it cost them to deal with Felix's family. The authorities in Ardboe, instead of sending money to Glasgow, might have instructed the Glasgow parochial board to send the family to Ardboe, probably to the poorhouse or workhouse serving (but not necessarily in) Ardboe, because that might be cheaper.

Or they might have sent Felix to Moneymore and the children to Ardboe. It wasn't uncommon to separate families so there is no guarantee that they were all sent to the same place.

I am a little surprised if the Glasgow parochial board records apparently don't say where Felix and children had 'settlement'. This was a fundamental element of the system, because it enabled a parish to avoid bearing the cost of people from other parishes, or at least to claim reimbursement. So it was always one of the first details to be collected by the parochial board when someone applied for relief.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline JAKnighton

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 459
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Great-great grandmother was an oprhan, how do I find out what happened to her?
« Reply #17 on: Tuesday 14 August 18 21:43 BST (UK) »
I am relying on a summary of the record written by someone who visited the Mitchell Library on my behalf, so that could be why there isn't more detail on exactly where in Ireland he was sent. However, I have arranged a trip to the library for Friday so perhaps I can view the original then.
Knighton in Huntingdonshire and Northamptonshire
Tweedie in Lanarkshire and Co. Down
Rodgers in Durham and Co. Monaghan
McMillan in Lanarkshire and Argyllshire