Author Topic: Look Up Whittaker, Callan  (Read 116 times)

Offline navarrom

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Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« on: Saturday 11 August 18 01:41 BST (UK) »
Hello! I'm trying to locate the baptism record of James Whittaker, b. 1815 in Callan, Kilkenny.  Also, I'm looking for his marriage record that took place before 1836. I've been searching on Ancestry and FindMyPast, but it seems there are no old records at all. I've also searched on Irish Genealogy and no luck, and I've tried at the Catholic baptism and marriages on NIL, but I've dyslexia and I ended up giving up, as it was very challenging. Not sure if there are any other websites, with transcribed records, that I could search for.

James joined the army and he was based in India (1836-1857). He married there, and when I got his marriage record, it says he was born in Callan, c. 1815 and he was a widower, but in that certificate there was no questions about the name of their parents, etc. I've some of his military records, but unfortunately I haven't been able to locate the paperwork of when he listed and they are asked for a next of kin, etc. His second wife, Elizabeth White, was a widower too. All I know she was b. C. 1821 in Ireland.

I would appreciate any help trying to locate any info about him in Ireland. Thank you!

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Offline AMBLY

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Re: Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 11 August 18 05:53 BST (UK) »
Hi Navarrom,

I've not an answer but have done a bit of digging about - principally I was trying to discover any children born to a first wife. So I'll post my journey - you may have a lot of / all of it, or maybe there are some extra bits in there for you  ;D

Marriage 1:  This only has to be before 1845 (and probably before 1841) not necessarily before 1836.  Unless you have some record that he was unmarried when he joined Army in 1836?

Marriage 2:
He married Elizabeth WHITE 22 Sep 1845 in  Fort St George, India (Family Search)
If she was a widow, her maiden name may not have been WHITE?
Later English GRO Birth record of their daughter Caroline 1860 does say mms WHITE - but the the only GRO record I could find for daughter Louisa born abt 1856 - is one in 1857 mms HUNT...

India Birth Records: Parents James Whittaker & Elizabeth (family Search) - Twins:
Ellen, born 7 April 1854, Chr 23 Apr 1854, Madras
Elizabeth, born 7 April 1854, Chr 23 Apr 1854, Madras

Service Record - as at Discharge, 1857
Proceedings of a Regimental Board held Pembroke, Dock 21 April 1857.
    Attested for the 84th Regiment of Foot at Fermoy, Cork on 16th April 1836, age 21 years.
    Total Service 21 years & 6 days during which 12 years were abroad, in the East Indies.
    Discharge proposed in consequence of his having completed 21 years service and being on 
           the permanent staff of the Kings Own Staffordshire Rifles Militia.
    Conduct Very Good and was never a subject of a Court Martial.
    Promoted to Corporal in the 84th Regt.  on 1 July 1837, held to 31 May 1839
    Promoted  Sergeant in the 84th Regt. on 1 Jun 1839, held to 31 Jan 1849
    Transferred to the 51st Regt. on 1st Feb 1849, Rank to Private, held to 23 Feb 1839
    Promoted  Corporal in the 51st Regt. on 24 Feb 1849, held to 2 Mar 1850
    Promoted Sergeant in the 51st Regt. on 3 March 1850, held to 21 Apr 1857.
    End of Service, leaving from the 51st, 21st April 1857
    Intended Place of Residence: On the permanent Staff of the Kings Own Staffordshire Rifles,
           Newcastle under Lyme.

Note: The 84th was in Jamaica 30 Apr 1836, and it didn't return Home until May 1838. As James' record of service says he was in the East Indies ( India) for 12 years, and nothing about being in Jamaica - then he must have been with the Depot in Ireland for those first cpl of years? In 1836 this was in Limerick.

Note: After a period in Portsmouth around 1839 after return from Jamaica, the 84th - lock stock and depot - were in Ireland until 1842 when they then went to Madras. By the movements of the 84th, his son William, who is aged 20 in Census 1861 could have been born Kilkenny, Dublin, Naas or Limerick between about Jun 1839 and Apr 1842.

Examination of Invalid Soldiers, conducted at Pembroke Dock Tues 12 May 1857.
    51st Regiment of Light Infantry
    Nr 2273, Color Sergeant, James WHITTAKER, Labourer, age 42 years.
    Born Callan, Kilkenny
    He was  5' 8" tall. Relatively tall.
    Cause of Disability or Discharge - Regimental Surgeon's Report:
             To serve in the Kings Own Staffordshires

more follows.....
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
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    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

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Offline AMBLY

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Re: Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 11 August 18 05:54 BST (UK) »
more..........

Census 1861: at Militia --------, Hillingdon, Middlesex
Head: James WHITTAKER 44,  b Ireland (abt 1817)
Wife: Elizabeth WHITTAKER 34, b Ireland  (abt 1827)
Son: William WHITTAKER 20, b Ireland (abt 1841)
Dau: Mary A WHITTAKER 14, b East Indies (abt 1847)
Dau: Sarah J WHITTAKER 11, b East Indies
Son: James WHITTAKER 9, b East Indies
Dau: Ellen WHITTAKER 6, b East Indies (in Madras 1854)
Dau: Elizabeth WHITTAKER 6, b East Indies (in Madras 1854)
Dau: Louisa WHITTAKER 4, b ----------, Staffordshire (1857, GRO mms Hunt?)
Dau: Caroline WHITTAKER 3 (5?) mo., b Hillingdon (1860, GRO mms White)
RG 9 / Piece 766 / Folio 112 / Pg 58

Son William was born in Ireland, whilst James was still in the 84th Regt.

Distribution of the British Army:  (FS = Foreign Service)
The 84th were in Jamaica 30 April 1836, Depot: Limerick
The 84th were in Portsmouth 29 Jun 1839, having returned from Jamaica May 1838
The 84th were in Kilkenny 2 Nov 1839, having returned from Jamaica May 1838
The 84th were in Dublin 29 Aug 1840, having returned from Jamaica May 1838
The 84th were in Dublin 27 Feb 1841, having returned from Jamaica 1838
The 84th were in Naas (Leinster. Co Kildare) 2 Oct 1841, having returned from FS in Jamaica 1838
The 84th were in Limerick 1 Jan 1842, having returned from Jamaica 1838
The 84th went into Foreign Service in April 1842, Madras.
The 84th were in Madras 3 Feb 1849, Depot: Chatham. Went into FS Apr 1842
The 84th were in Madras 6 Apr 1850, Depot: Chatham. Went into FS Apr 1842

The 51st were in Madras 6 Apr 1850, Depot: Chatham. Went into FS July 1838
The 51st were in Madras 2 Apr 1853, Depot: Chatham. Went into FS July 1838
The 51st were in Burmah 21 Apr 1854. Depot: Chatham. Went into FS July 1838
The twins were born and baptised in Madras 23 Apr 1854.
The 51st were in Manchester 2 Sep 1854. Returned from FS Aug 1854, from Burmah
The 51st were in Malta 10 Nov 1855, Depot Manchester , Went into FS Aug 1855.
The 51st were in Buttevant (Cork, Ireland)  15 Jul 1856, returned Jun 1856 from Malta
The 51st were in Curragh (Kildare, Ireland)  30 May 1857, Depot: Pembroke.  Returned Jun 1856 from Malta

James' Foreign Service:
James left the 51st in April 1857.
The 51st left India for Burma in 1854,  at around the same time the twins were baptised in Madras.
The 51st only went briefly to Burma then back Home to Manchester for about a year before going to Malta in 1855 for a year , then Home again to the UK.  Again, James' record only mentions India, so by dates & births etc, it indicates James never went to Burma or Malta in 1854/55, rather he returned home about that same time, to the Home Depot of the 51st.

This - if correct deduction - means his India Service of 12 years was 1842 to 1854 - having gone there in April 1842 with the 84th and left around April 1854 with the 51st.

Cheers
AMBLY


Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline navarrom

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Re: Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 11 August 18 22:06 BST (UK) »
I am speechless. I can't thank you enough for your help, as his military records made no sense to me. Also, I always assumed that White was her maiden's name, I have never though that it could be her previous husband's surname.  I really appreciate all your help.  :)

Offline navarrom

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Re: Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 11 August 18 23:46 BST (UK) »
I searched for all Whittaker that died in British India between 1840 and 1845. Only two females among them:

Caroline Mary Ann, Whittaker   
b. 1842   
d. 1842   
Cawnpore, Christ Church, Bengal

-and-

Elizabeth, Whittaker   
b, 1818   
d. 1842   
Cawnpore, Christ Church, Bengal

I'm going to see if I find more records, but I'm wondering if Elizabeth was James's wife, and Caroline Mary Ann their daughter.

Offline navarrom

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Re: Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 11 August 18 23:50 BST (UK) »
It seems to be that it could be them, since there're no other Whittaker, and also her dad was called James.

Name:   Caroline Mary Ann Whittaker
Gender:   Female
Age:   0
Birth Date:   1842
Burial Date:   16 Aug 1842
Burial Place:   Cawnpore, Bengal, India
Father:   James Whittaker
Mother:   Elizabeth
FHL Film Number:   498980

Offline navarrom

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Re: Look Up Whittaker, Callan
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 11 August 18 23:53 BST (UK) »
Name   
Caroline Mary Ann Whittaker
Mother   
Betsey
Father   
James Whittaker
Birth   
05/04/1842
Baptism   
16/05/1842 Cawnpore, Bengal, India