Author Topic: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493  (Read 7432 times)

Offline horselydown86

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 29 August 18 13:04 BST (UK) »
I can see 'prisoner' now. The scribe must use at least 3 different forms of 'r' in this writing!

Yes, the style used in ...poure prisoner... is very rare.

A late thought on the Ankerys:  (perhaps) = Anchoress = A female anchorite

Offline WillowG

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 29 August 18 21:14 BST (UK) »
Thank you so much, Goldie, Bookbox and HD!!! :) :D :)

Both for the transcription and the links! It really takes a village :) :) :)

It really is a window into a different world, isn't it?

I got claustrophobia just reading about the anchorites and anchoresses, lololol, HD! :) But super-fascinating! Elizabeth of York apparently had a few whom she regularly donated to!

From here:
https://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=moa&cc=moa&view=text&rgn=main&idno=AJQ4429.0001.001

7.-1493. Robert Aylmer, Mayor in 1481 and 1492. This mark, with his initials, is in several of the South windows in the clerestory. His gravestone, dated 1493, lies under the font.

That is so fascinating! Another mayor ... That is very interesting :) Thank you so much, Goldie!

Offline WillowG

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 29 August 18 21:17 BST (UK) »

Offline goldie61

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 29 August 18 22:56 BST (UK) »
snippet 5

dwelling by and without the v yate of Norwich whan myne executours thydre come to visite
them have ij d Item I bequeith to Richard my sonne so that he be curtous gentyll and humble
to his modre my wif C marke to be paide to hym his executours or certaigne attorneys in forme
folowing that is to say in the yere next aftre my decese L mark And in the yere than folowing
other L mark in full payment of the said C marke, Item I bqueith to Thomas my sonne C
marke undre like condition as is afore rehersede of Richard his brother to be paid to the same Thomas


Snippet 6
whan he commeth to thage of xxj yere in forme folowing that is to say when he is of the said
age of xxj yere L mark And other L mark in the yere than next ensuyng And if the said Thomas
dey or he come to the said age Than I will that the said C mark bequithen to him be disposed by
myn executours for my soule and the soules aforesaid item I bequeith to Cealie my daughter C mark
to be paid to hire therof such tyme as she ys maried or such tyme as she cometh to thage of xxj
yere L mark And in the yere than next ensuyng aftre the said mariage or next aftre the said age
other L mark Item I will that Thomas my sonne have all my Landes and tenementes in Higham


There is a contraction mark over at least 2 of the words 'than' in clipping 6.
Which reads as though it is 'then' in context, but if it's a contraction............
Do you know what the whole word would be HD or Bookbox?
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs


Offline horselydown86

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #13 on: Thursday 30 August 18 07:07 BST (UK) »
There is a contraction mark over at least 2 of the words 'than' in clipping 6.
Which reads as though it is 'then' in context, but if it's a contraction............
Do you know what the whole word would be HD or Bookbox?

These are the kind of semi-spurious contraction marks sometimes seen in these documents, where the contraction isn't obvious or necessary.

I agree than is written and then is the meaning.  I would transcribe as you have done.

The alternative is to force something like than(ne).

Note that in the first line of #5 he writes whan with a mark and in the first line of #6 the same word twice without the mark.  All mean when.


Some small enhancements to goldie's text:

...withoute the v yat(es) of Norwich...   [It's the -es brevigraph, therefore plural.]

Same line:   ...come thydre...   [Words reversed in the transcript.]

...curteis...   [There's a line across the fifth letter.]



...dey or he come...   [I agree with the transcript, but I'm sure or is to be read as ere = before]

...Cecile my dought(er)...   [possibly Cecilie, but unlikely, comparing the final e to that in age in the line above.]

Offline goldie61

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #14 on: Thursday 30 August 18 07:54 BST (UK) »
Thanks HD.
I'd seen the whan/when ones too.
I'd wondered about the 'double n' as the contraction - as you often get in 'sonne', but as you say, seems a little contrived.
Quite odd.

Glad you made 'or' to be 'ere'. That makes better sense. I couldn't make sense of it in context - just transcribed what was there.
Lane, Burgess: Cheshire. Finney, Rogers, Gilman:Derbys
Cochran, Nicol, Paton, Bruce:Scotland. Bertolle:London
Bainbridge, Christman, Jeffs: Staffs

Offline WillowG

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #15 on: Thursday 30 August 18 17:18 BST (UK) »
Thank you so much, the both of of you!!! :) :D :)

Oh, things just got exciting here! For a while I was worried he was going to stop at the name of his wife, but instead another family line is materialising :)

This is very exciting! Thus far we have a Robert Aylmer (d.1493), his wife Elizabeth and their sons Richard and Thomas and their daughter Cecil(i?)e ...

Are we going to make an educated guess that the Richard Aylmer (d.1512) in the link Goldie posted yesterday could be the Richard mentioned in this will, our testator's son?

Richard Aylmer, Grocer, Mayor in 1511. He was buried at the East end of the nave in 1512. On a seal to a deed dated 1506.

https://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=moa&cc=moa&view=text&rgn=main&idno=AJQ4429.0001.001

There is also a 1494. Richard Aylmer, Grocer. (?) mentioned in the same text.

The namesake of our testator's son and the possible father of our testator?

Still no Franceses, Annes, Johns or Edmunds :) That is interesting ... Very interesting indeed.

Thank you so much again!!! :) :) :)

Offline horselydown86

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #16 on: Thursday 30 August 18 17:39 BST (UK) »
Snippet #7:

...beside Norwich to hold to hym his heires and his assignes for ev(er)more whan he co(m)eth to laufull

age under condition that ^he^ be curteis humble and diligent to my wif his modre And I require

Richard my sonne as sonne and heire to me to make a state of the same landes and tenementes

in higham in fee simple to myn executo(r)s or to such p(er)sonnes as they shall name whan so ev(er)

the said Richard by myn executours therto be requyrede so that myn executo(r)s may do fulfill therof

this my last will Item I will that Elisabeth my wif have all my landes and tenementes in...

Offline horselydown86

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Re: Will of Robert Aylmer 1493
« Reply #17 on: Thursday 30 August 18 17:54 BST (UK) »
Snippet #8:

...helmyngton and other townes therto adioynyng with that appurtenannces to hold to the same

Elisabeth here heires and assignes for ev(er)more Item if the said Richard my sonne be Curteis humble

and diligent to my wif his modre as the sonne owith tobe to his modre Item I will than he have all

that my mes called the bell in the parissh of saint Petre of Mancroft in Norwich with all the

tenementes therto belonging to have and to hold to the foresaid Richard his heires and assignes for ev(er)

more Item I will that all myn other landes and tenementes in Norwich and in Northfolke be sold

by myn executo(r)s And the money therof co(m)myng disposed in paying of my dettes and in p(er)formance...



mes = mese