Author Topic: Eliza Norris mystery  (Read 3510 times)

Offline janec123

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Eliza Norris mystery
« on: Wednesday 17 October 18 09:02 BST (UK) »
Hello, Am hoping someone might be able to help me , my gg grandmother was Eliza Norris , i cant find a birth record for her , she had two sons born in Roslin and Lasswade , she wasnt married , on her marriage certificate later on it says parents unknown . Is it a possibility she was abandoned ? Also when registering her sons births she registered them as Morris but clearly signs the cert as Norris . There was a Norris family in Lasswade at the time , does anyone know if it was a small place , just thought it was a bit of a coincidence . I had been trying to get to the bottom of this for years , just cant let it go ! Thanks in advance
Norris,Lilley,Mcfall,Timperley,Rowing,Janes,
Hodgen,Conroy,Irwin,Welch

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 09:57 BST (UK) »
Could you give us some dates to work on?
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline janec123

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 10:12 BST (UK) »
Elizas first child was Peter , on the cencus he was called Peter Gairns but birth cert was Peter Morris , second child was Alexander Morris 1/10/1863 , on cencus she was 20 so can only assume she was born around 1840 , marriage cert definately states parents unknown , i viewed it yesterday at records office , she went to marry Thomas Timperley and move to Glasgow and latterly Lancashire .
Norris,Lilley,Mcfall,Timperley,Rowing,Janes,
Hodgen,Conroy,Irwin,Welch

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 10:21 BST (UK) »
Elizas first child was Peter , on the cencus he was called Peter Gairns but birth cert was Peter Morris , second child was Alexander Morris 1/10/1863 , on cencus she was 20 so can only assume she was born around 1840 , marriage cert definately states parents unknown , i viewed it yesterday at records office , she went to marry Thomas Timperley and move to Glasgow and latterly Lancashire.
Assuming you mean the 1861 census
- where did it say she was born?
- did you find her in the 1851 census? What age and birthplace does that give?
- have you found her in the 1871 census? What age and birthplace does that give?
- and how old did she say she was on her marriage certificate?
- did she sign her name on that or on her sons' birth certificates, or does it say 'x' her mark?
- have you found her death certificate?
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.


Offline janec123

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 10:27 BST (UK) »
Hi , Yes it was the 1861 censcus , couldnt find her on the 1851 , she signed her name and it clearly says Norris ,couldnt find a place of birth , there are Eliza Norris in Edinburgh but i cant be sure it is her .
Norris,Lilley,Mcfall,Timperley,Rowing,Janes,
Hodgen,Conroy,Irwin,Welch

Offline janec123

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 10:49 BST (UK) »
Another thing that bothers me is , if she is the Eliza Norris from Edinburgh , why does she state parents unknown on marriage certificate , is all a mystery
Norris,Lilley,Mcfall,Timperley,Rowing,Janes,
Hodgen,Conroy,Irwin,Welch

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 10:54 BST (UK) »
Adding together what you have told us and what I have found by looking at the 1881 census, she was born in the city of Edinburgh in 1840/1841, and she was sufficiently literate to write her own name. She is very consistent in giving her age in the census - 20 in 1861, 30 in 1871, 40 in 1881.

If, in spite of of being able to write and confident about her age, she did not know the names of her parents, she must at least have been born illegitimate, and possibly even abandoned as you wondered.

The City of Edinburgh parochial board would undoubtedly have come across her in these circumstances, and would have collected a good deal of information about her. Unfortunately the Edinburgh parochial board registers of applications and registers of poor have not survived. There is a possibility that their minutes, which have survived, might contain a clue, but as the parochial boards were not set up until 1845, there may not be much reference to her. The surviving parochial board records are in Edinburgh city archives.

I think Lauriston is in the parish of St Cuthbert's. If so, and if Eliza came to the notice of the kirk session, and if the kirk session took an interest in her, and if they recorded information about her in their minutes, and if that record has survived, it is likely to be available in digital form in the historical search room of the National Records of Scotland in Edinburgh. But that is a lot of ifs.
Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 10:57 BST (UK) »
Another thing that bothers me is , if she is the Eliza Norris from Edinburgh , why does she state parents unknown on marriage certificate , is all a mystery.
What do you mean when you say "the Eliza Norris from Edinburgh"? You have not mentioned an "Eliza Norris from Edinburgh" before.

Never trust anything you find online (especially submitted trees and transcriptions on Ancestry, MyHeritage, FindMyPast and other commercial web sites) unless it's an image of an original document - and even then be wary because errors can and do occur.

Offline janec123

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Re: Eliza Norris mystery
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 17 October 18 11:07 BST (UK) »
in 1840, there is an Eliza Norris born in Edinburgh , however i cant be sure this is the correct person , in 1860 she is with her son Peter on the cencus , this information i know to be true , Alexander her son was born in 1863 , then she marries Thomas Timerley in 1870 in Glasgow , this also i know to be true , its on this cert that her parents are unknown , If Eliza born in Edinburgh in 1840 is mother of Peter and Alexander why are her parents unknown , family secret maybe , thanks for all your help so far .
Norris,Lilley,Mcfall,Timperley,Rowing,Janes,
Hodgen,Conroy,Irwin,Welch