Author Topic: Martin Tracey, my wife's great grandfather  (Read 27426 times)

Offline tidybooks

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *******
  • Posts: 2,862
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Martin Tracey, my wife's great grandfather
« on: Monday 17 September 07 02:09 BST (UK) »
Hi all,

My wife’s great grandfather Martin Tracey married Ann O’Shea on 11th October 1883 in Limerick according to son, John Tracey’s birth certificate. Martin died in Glasgow in 1913 at age of 46 on 7th September 1913. Ann, his widow registered his death and gave Patrick Tracey and Elizabeth Higgins as his parents. Both were deceased.

Patrick Tracey married Elizabeth Higgins 11 Jan 1861 RC Killinvoy and Killmain

They had the following children:-
Anne b. 20 August 1864 Roscommon
Henry b. 12 April 1866 Roscommon
John b. 26 October 1868
Catherine b. 19 June 1870
Elizabeth b. 23 July 1873
James b. 22 October 1875 Roscommon
Bridget b. 6 June 1877
Patrick b. 14 June 1879
All records from LDS IGI site.

Where is Martin, according to his death, he should have been born around 1867. Any ideas how to find him?

He is very elusive to find , I think he came to Glasgow after marriage in 1883, but cannot find him or family in the 1891 or 1901 census.

Tom
Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

Offline Christopher

  • Deceased † Rest In Peace
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 9,959
  • 1939 - 2009
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #1 on: Monday 17 September 07 02:27 BST (UK) »
Hiya Tom,

Going by Martin's age when he died there appears to be no arguement about when he was born but did guys marry when they were about sixteen in the 1880s?

Christopher


Offline tidybooks

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *******
  • Posts: 2,862
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #2 on: Monday 17 September 07 11:14 BST (UK) »
Hi Christopher,

I agree what you say about ages, but Ann O'Shea his widow, could not read or write, so she gave that age when  registering death. That is only document that gives his age that i have seen. Likewise the parents, it is only her say so, that Patrick and Elizabeth Higgins were given, I have no reason to disagree, but Patrick and Elizabeth registered all other births and more, it makes me a wee bit suspicious.

I was on a Tracey Clan website, http://www.traceyclann.com/, and I searched on marriage of Martin Tracey and one result was Martin Tracey, Limerick, 1st Quarter 1883 5 334, Surely October cannot be in 1st quarter?

Any ideas would be gratefully received.

Tom
Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

Offline aghadowey

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 51,335
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #3 on: Monday 17 September 07 12:48 BST (UK) »
First of all, not all Irish births for that period are on IGI.
Second, assuming 1867 is correct year of birth, not much of a gap between Henry (Apr.1866) and John (Oct.1868)- not impossible but very shortly after Henry's birth and then not long between John's.
Several possiblities (assuming 1867 is correct)- Martin was born in 1867 and not listed on IGI, Martin was a twin of Henry or John and not listed on IGI, or Martin was registered as Henry or John and for some reason went by Martin.
Church baptismal records might help but baptisms can be omitted from the register so not conclusive unless you do actually find a baptism for Martin (which may or may not be in 1867).
However, suspect that Martin was born before 1867 going by marriage in 1883. Quite likely Martin was born c1860-1863 but again, church baptismal records may clear up the mystery.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!


Offline InfoTracey

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 16
  • Tressach Bairrche Barr
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #4 on: Friday 02 November 07 12:19 GMT (UK) »
Hi Tom,

Saw your post. Here is a list of "Martin Tracey" state registrations for 1864-1870:

Tracy, Martin, Mountbellew, Galway. 1865 19 395
Tracy, Martin, Portumna, Galway. 1868 9 492
Tracy, Martin, Tuam, Galway. 1869 14 587
Treacy, Martin, Borrisokane, Tipperary North. 1869 13 414
Treacy, Martin, Roscommon, Roscommon. 1864 3 330
Treacy, Martin, Thurles, Tipperary. 1865 8 746
Treacy, Martin, Thurles, Tipperary. 1867 18 612
Treasy, Martin, Tuam, 1870 19 583

It may be possible that there is another "Patrick Tracey & Elizabeth Higgins". The recommon page is located at:

http://www.traceyclann.com/files/Roscommon.htm

This page also contains the 1901 census records. I think that they lived in Knockcroghery Village.

Did you sort out the marriage record. Perhaps they got married in 1882.

Regards,

Declan Tracey
Tracey Tracy Treacey Treacy O'Treasaigh

Offline tidybooks

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *******
  • Posts: 2,862
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 04 November 07 22:41 GMT (UK) »
Thanks Declan and Aghadowey etc,

I am beginning to think the Martin could have been his second name, how easy would it be to get marriage certificate of Martin Tracey and AnnO'Shea  in Limerick on 11th October 1883, I wonder if he would use the whole name or just Martin. Since he came to Scotland, I have been unable to get him in 1891 and 1901 census. I think I will start searching with his wife's name and see how many are married to Tracey's, regardless of husbands first name.

He was a pipemaker in Glasgow and I saw on the 1901 census that there were a few Tracey's into ppemaking. Could be sone sort of connection there.

Tom
Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

Offline InfoTracey

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 16
  • Tressach Bairrche Barr
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #6 on: Monday 05 November 07 10:19 GMT (UK) »
Hi Tom,

The record numbers refer to place, year, volume and page of the state registration of births and marriages.

You can apply to the Irish or UK authorities for records prior to 1922.

The Irish website is:
http://www.groireland.ie/about_us.htm

The marriage application form is available at:

http://www.groireland.ie/docs/Website_applformM_240203.DOC

Marriage certificates may contain the following information: Date of marriage, name, surname, age, condition (marital status), rank or profession, residence, father’s name and rank or profession of both bride and groom. Also place of marriage, practitioner and witnesses.

The photocopy version of the record is far cheaper but sometimes they can be difficult to read.

Regards,

Dec
Tracey Tracy Treacey Treacy O'Treasaigh

Offline tidybooks

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *******
  • Posts: 2,862
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 15 December 07 11:43 GMT (UK) »
Hi Dec,

I got the marriage certificate from records office in Roscommon,
Registered on 1st February 1883 by John Holmes (registrar) District no 3.
14th Day of October 1882 at Limerick Cathedral
Martin Tracey age 20 Bachelor Pipe Maker stayed at Mungret Street Patrick Tracey (Father) who was a Labourer.
Anne OShea age 18 Spinster No Occupation stayed at Mungret Street John OShea (Father) who was a Pipe Maker.

Martin Tracey made his mark x but Anne was able to write. The Parish Priest was James McCoy and witnesses James White and Mary Anderson.

So Martin was born around 1862, which makes him the oldest in the family but I still cannot find his birth registration. I thought his roots were in Roscommon but not sure now. Any help finding his roots would be great.

Tom
Scotland - Buchanan, Thomson, Pat(t)erson, Stewart, Ritchie, Tracey
Ireland - Tracey, Conroy, Pat(t)erson.

Offline aghadowey

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 51,335
    • View Profile
Re: Martin Tracey wife's great grandfather
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 15 December 07 13:02 GMT (UK) »
If he was born in 1862 there will be no birth registration- civil registration of births only started in 1864.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!