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General => The Common Room => Topic started by: DerekB on Thursday 11 May 06 14:22 BST (UK)
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I strongly suspect that a number of my ancestors were members of Non Conformist or Dissenting churches.
They were not baptised or married in their local parish churches at the LMA and I have checked the records held at the National Archives for the NC churches and Dr Williams Library to no avail.
They were living in the Bethnal Green/Spitalfields/Mile End areas before 1837.
There were lots of churches in the area but none contain my ancestors, names Jeffryes and Arrowsmith in particular.
Can anyone advise on where any additional records may exist?
Thanks in advance
Derek
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Hi Derek
Just a possibility - might any of them have been Jewish? Mile End particularly had a very high Jewish population, and so did Spitalfields I think.
Veron
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Hi Vernon,
Thanks for the reply but I don't think they were anything but Protestants, not even a Catholic in sight.
One even became a City Missionary.
Family were mostly Weavers or Undertakers, not that that affects their religion.
Derek.
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If you know which denomination they were, it's possible that the modern descendants of the chapels have archives. These are often lodged with the local record office, but not always.
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Thanks but I have no idea what denomination, understand there were a lot of them in the 18th and 19th centuries.
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Between 1754 and 1837 non-conformists were usually married in the local C of E church because only they were legally valid. Only Jews and Quakers were exempted. Baptisms and burials however were normally conducted in their own chapels. Whether or not non-conformist records have survived is a matter of luck.
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Non-conformists were often buried in Anglican churchyards since their own churches did not have burial grounds - though for London the largest non-conformist cemetery to check would be Bunhills.
Baptists did not agree with infant baptisms but you can find some Baptist church records where infant births were entered into the registers.
Non-conformists pre 1837 would often marry well away from their local Anglican church - they wouldn't give the local clergy the satisfaction of marrying them, so they chose churches where they were not known.
Many Anglican church records are not on the IGI so are you absolutely certain your ancestors were not Anglicans as it would be quite a search to check all the Anglican church records that may cover the areas you specify without resorting to indexes such as the IGI. Have you tried other marriage indexes for instance such as Pallots or Boyds?
Regards
Valda
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Thanks Valda some usefull tips.
As far as I know four of us have been checking churches for the missing Jeffryes marriages and baptisms and another couple of relatives have also been looking for the missing Arrowsmith baptisms for about 6 years.
We have found some of the children baptised in adulthood in various parish Churches these give a birth date and parents names were given, but still their parents marriages are missing.
We have found many burrials at the Abney Park cemetery.
Yes they may have been Anglicans but we have checked all the main parish churches in the area, surely if they were Anglican they would have married in their local parish church.
There is also a persistant family story of being Huguenot, but I have not proved that link, can't get back far enough.
Your suggestion about checking churches away from the area may well be the way forward but it's a big job checking all churches that are not on the IGI, even just those near East London.
It seemed that the only things left to check were the NC churches but they don't seem to be there either, except for one baptism at the Sion Church Mile End New Town in 1800.
Next port of call is going to be the apprenticeship records at the Merchant Taylors as we have heard that a Jeffryes who we suspect may be related was a Freeman. They recorded all family members of Freemen and apprentices.
Regards
Derek
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I would suggest checking the City of London Freemen's records - moved from the Corporation of London record office to the London Metropolitan Archives. The Freeman's records contain the apprenticeship indenture. Merchant Taylors apprenticeship records should be at the Guildhall. These records didn't record all family members but they do state who the father was of the apprentice and or freeman.
Abney Park cemetery (Bunhill was an earlier non-conformist cemetery) was very popular with non-conformists.
The oldest Arrowsmith burial at Abney Park is Adam aged 63 in 1850.
The National Archives have a Prerogative Court of Canterbury will for an Adam Arrowsmith.
Will of Adam Arrowsmith, Gentleman of Tottenham , Middlesex
Date 31 January 1851
Catalogue reference PROB 11/2125
There is an Adam Arrowsmith (age rounded down to 50) in Gravesend on the 1841 census with wife Mary (age rounded down to 40) neither born Kent.
Adam Arrowsmith married Mary Ann Averill at St Dunstan Stepney in 1840.
On the 1851 census Mary A. Arrowsmith aged 51 and born St Georges was living in Tottenham. She was a landed proprietress.
Looking at Abney Park Jeffryes' burials - and there are more than Arrowsmiths, I noticed Mary Temperance Jeffreys.
Temperance was a popular name amongst Arrowsmith marriages in Pallots marriage index.
Temperance Arrowsmith Thos Bennett 1800 Hackney, Middlesex
Temperance Arrowsmith Thos Beazley 1835 Hackney St John
Hackney marriages ususally don't appear on the IGI.
No marriage on Pallots for James Jeffryes and Mary Temperance ...... There is however a Jeffryes PCC will in Spitalfields at TNA.
Will of John Jeffryes, Cooper of Spitalfields , Middlesex 29 September 1834 PROB 11/1836
If any PCC wills prove usefully the beneficiaries can be tracked through the Death Duty registers at TNA.
As I don't know which Arrowsmiths and which Jeffryes you are interested in, so I can only speculate on possibilities.
Regards
Valda
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Hi Valda,
My cousin is going to go to check the Merchant Taylors records in the next couple of weeks. He was going to do so last year but discovered that they were unavailable while they were being moved from Guildhall to LMA while the Guildhall was reorganised, and has just not had time since they became available again.
You suggestion about NC marriages at churches outside of their area of residence does bring in additional possibilities. One is at St Andrew, Holborn between Thomas Jeffryes and Elizabeth Gerwin in 1798.
The missing Jeffryes marriages are Thomas and of his son James (my ancestors). Thomas would have married about 1800 and his son James about 1823.
James married Mary Temperance Arrowsmith (their last 3 children were born after 1837 so we have certificates).
Theirs is the second missing Jeffryes marriage, still no clues as to where that one took place.
James was baptised as an adult in 1839 age 36 at St Matthew BG. He is a weaver on the baptism records of his early children before 1830, after that he is an Undertaker. Could this have something to do with his baptism?
There are other records that I have found of Jeffryes being baptised as adults and one of them is an undertaker as well.
One of James sons William went on to become a City Missionary and preached on the steps of the Royal Exchange and the main post office.
Both James and Mary Temperance were buried at Abney Park. I do have a copy of the Abney Park burrials index thanks.
They were in the undertaking business and their son James was a co-founder of Manor Park Cemetery.
Thomas also became an Undertaker late in life and may have founded the family business and got his sons involved or it may have been started by his son or sons.
Kelly's directory lists the business but there is no history, just their names and the address.
Unfortunately I do not have an Adam Arrowsmith, but thanks for the info it may link in sometime.
The only deffinate Arrowsmith links I have are Mary Temperance's family she had brothers and sisters (mentioned in her will) but no Temperance mentioned.
Her parents were William Arrowsmith and Sarah (believed to be Sarah Trenell) married in 1798 at St Dunstan, Stepney.
William Arrowsmiths age from census and death cert puts his birth ca 1779 in Shoreditch but we have been unable to find any record of his birth so have no confirmed knowledge of his parents. It would be a real boost to find Williams birth record.
I have been looking for it for about 8 years, there are Arrowsmith descendants who have made a guess as to who he was but when I have challenged them to prove it they can't. So I will wait until I see it for my self, I do this to find out where I come from, not where I would like to have come from.
Regards
Derek
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The Freemen's records moved from the Corporation of London record office, not from the Guildhall (the record office was around the back of the Guildhall). Though there was building works at the Guildhall it remained open and it has the deposited London Guild apprenticeship records.
Have you looked at this PCC will for Shoreditch
Description Will of Elizabeth Arrowsmith, Spinster of Saint Leonard Shoreditch , Middlesex
Date 22 January 1799
Catalogue reference PROB 11/1317
Regards
Valda
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Have not looked at that will as I have no record of an Elizabeth Arrowsmith, have only looked for wills for know family.
There are an awfull lot of Arrowsmiths out there.
Regards
Derek
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Hi Derek
When you get stuck like this, looking at wills for all those with the same surnames in the same area is often the way forward. I'm not saying that it will be fruitful but it's something that needs to be checked ................ just in case one of your relatives is mentioned - you don't know until you look - and a relationship may be proved!
In addition, I would almost certainly investigate those Temperence ARROWSMITH marriages that Valda mentioned ............... it's an unusual name and they may turn out to be relatives somehow.
Best wishes
Casalguidi
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From "The Times" 21 Sep 1846 ..............
William JEFFRYES a coffin maker and furnishing undertaker of 3 Leman Street, Whitechapel was the victim of threatening and abusive language from Samuel SHEEN, undertaker and proprietor of Sheen's Cemetery in Church Lane, Whitechapel ............... there's quite a write-up.
Is William one of yours?
Casalguidi
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Temperance Arrowsmith who married Thomas Beazely was born circa 1810 in Spitalfields (1871 census). She died in Mile End registration district in 1879.
This may be her baptism on the IGI
TEMPERANCE ARROWSMITH
Birth: 28 FEB 1810
Christening: 18 MAY 1810 Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London,
Father: JAMES ARROWSMITH
Mother: ELIZABETH
other siblings
JAMES ARROWSMITH
Christening: 22 JUL 1803 Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
WILLIAM ARROWSMITH
Christening: 08 SEP 1805 Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
ELIZABETH TEMPERANCE ARROWSMITH
Christening: 10 JUL 1808 Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London
1800 All Hallows London Wall
Jas Arrowsmith
Egth Hill
Regards
Valda
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I have seen all of those Arrowsmith births but without knowing who William's parents were, I can't know if they were his siblings or not.
Derek
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The William Jeffryes who suffered the verbal abuse may have been a brother of James. There are a number of Jeffryes who were undertakes in the same area. Suspect all part of the same family but lack the proof.
Regards
Derek
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It does rather make the case for going sideways and examining other sources such as Elizabeth of Shoreditch's PCC will in 1799. Unmarried peoples' wills can be very informative about family connections (plus following for this will the death duty register information). Elizabeth Arrowsmith is not the only PCC will available for the east end of London.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/
Regards
Valda
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Thanks Valda, I will take your advice and get going on wills. There do not seem to be many other avenues to explore.
Regards
Derek
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More information might open up other avenues. The National Archives in its catalogue is awash with Arrowsmith records for instance, but you can't tell whether they relate or not. The LMA also has wills but from a slightly earlier period (as well as a computerised index which might be worth looking at - at the LMA) and then there is the A2A website ............ more information more possible records.
The limitation is relying just on parish registers (which usually let you down in London by the C18th) and censuses and only researching down the direct line and not branching out to try and get around any blockages - but then I would say that I'm a one namer.
You just need to pin the familys down a bit more.
If Elizabeth's will does prove useful then don't forget to look at the Death Duty registers (1795-1905) to track down the beneficiaries after the will was proved. A much overlooked but very useful set of records
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=107&j=1
and
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=245
Regards
Valda
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Elizabeth Arrowsmith seems to have been quite wealthy leaving over £1400 plus property, etc in 1799. Unfortunately it is left to 4 people Robert Crawford and James Stump (executors) and Ann Judd and nephew Jeremiah Arrowsmith. I'm afraid I don't know of any of them.
As you say lots of Arrowsmith mentions on the A2A but most are the north western Arrowsmiths where the name seems even more common than in London.
Regards
Derek
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I really think you need a day at TNA working through possible wills not obtaining them individually because that is too much of an expensive risk.
Were any of the Guildhall fire insurnace records on A2A your family?
Regards
Valda
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The insurance records do not seem to be for anyone who is a known family member and none of the insured was a William.
As far as I know William Arrowsmith was a silk weaver, at least that is what is says on the 1851 census for the William Arrowsmith who is believed to be him. He died 1853.
There is one for a James Arrowsmith a Silk merchant who may be a brother or his father but it's a long shot. I have no information on who his father was or if he had any siblings.
There are a few other wills that may be worth checking when I get the time, maybe in a couple of weeks time.
Regards
Derek