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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Roxburghshire => Topic started by: bougie on Tuesday 16 May 06 14:22 BST (UK)
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HI
I HAVE A LIST OF ALL ARMSTRONG MI'S IN NEWCASTLETON CEMY.
WROTE THEM ALL DOWN WHILE RESEARCHING ARMSTRONGS IN MY FAMILY
JUST IN CASE I NEEDED THEM LATER. 43 GRAVES. WANT ME TO LOOK ANYONE
UP
BOUGIE
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Hi bougie
have you come across Esther Armstrong b abt 1740 Liddlesdale Rox. married unknown Jackson c 1760
Esther Jackson died 1800 Castleton
1st child I have is Simon Jackson born 1761
Betty 1762
Adam 1765
David ?
audrey
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hi audrey
i am trying to check out esther for you. as their are so many armstrongs
in cemys around here it takes some time especially when its a m.s.
i'll do my best
bougie
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Have following mi's if anyone wants more information on any
of them.
William Armstrong/Mary Porteous, William Armstrong/Margaret Telfer,
Archibald Armstrong/Ann ?, John Armstrong/Jane Murray, Abel Armstrong/
Betty Scott, Walter Armstrong/Agnes Murray, William Armstrong/Jean Hoison
James Armstrong/Ann Bell, Hugh Armstrong, George Armstrong/Elizabeth ?,
Archibald Armstrong, Andrew Armstrong/Helen Morton, John Armstrong/
Ann Scott, George Armstrong/Elizabeth Cumming, David Armstrong/ Hannah
Hogg, John Armstrong/ Helen Henderson, Walter Armstrong/ Isabella Wishart
Thomas Armstrong/ Margaret Moffat, Christopher Armstrong,
William Armstrong/ Mary McIntosh, Francis Armstrong/ Janet Beattie
John Armstrong/ Agnes Furnes, John Armstrong/ Jean Dickson,
Francis Armstrong/ Helen ?, Robert Armstrong, JamesArmstrong/ Elspeth Hope
will add more later
bougie
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Here's more
Andrew Armstrong/Jane Morton, Andrew Armstrong/Jane Murray,
John Armstrong/Helen Nixon, Adam Armstrong, Archibald Armstrong/
Isabella Kyle, James Armstrong and brother John Armstrong,
Walter Armstrong, Walter Armstrong/Janet Veitch, Archibald Armstrong,
Charles Armstrong/Janet ? , James Armstrong/Isabella ? , James Armstrong/
Margaret Little, James Armstrong,
Andrew Armstrong/Isabella Aitchison, John Armstrong/Margaret Barclay,
Andrew Armstrong/Sarah Bell, Thomasina Armstrong, Frank Armstrong ,
James Armstrong/Janet Turnbull, Andrew Telfer Armstrong,
These graves all date from late 1700's to very early 1900's but most of
them are mid 1800's . I have more information on them all if anyone's
interested.
bougie
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I have both ARMSTRONG and MURRAY, from Castleton area, in my line; they married each other and left Scotland as a young couple, about 1819. But, so far, I don't know the names of their parents or siblings.
It would be handy to have your transcriptions available to consult as the research progresses, might help me to make some links that otherewise wouldn't be clear. I wondered if you would be willing to share your document. If so, I will PM you an email address or whatever you need. The chances of my ever getting to the area are slim, alas!
Thanks for offering the lookups. If you don't feel comfortable sharing the document, I will let you know if I ever get more details on this family.
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Hi Loo
I'm afraid these mi's are not on a document that i could e-mail to you. They
are just written in a note bookas i copied them straight from the gravestones
myself on a long day out visiting cemetries in the area whilst researching the
Armstrong side of my family. When you have more info feel free to ask for
lookups anytime
bougie
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thanks, bougie.
Can you tell me how far back, historically, the transcriptions go?
Maybe we're related!
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Hi Loo
The grave inscriptions that i have collected date back to mid 1700's.
I'm afraid you may have a hard task on your hands researching your Armstrongs. There are hundreds of them in Roxburghshire and Dumfries
area and a lot of them have the same first names.
At the moment i am chasing a William Armstrong b c1790 in the Castleton
or Canonbie area and i have found 14 matching around these dates.
I haven't found which one is my William yet.
During my research i have collected a lot of data on Armstrongs and it
may be that your Armstrongs are among it. We may well find that we are
related.
When you find out your Armstrongs first names and roughly estimate their
year of birth let me know and i'll see if i've anything on them.
I live in Hawick Roxburghshire so i am quite handy to all these cemetries etc.
Local registers date back to the late 1500's and i have got most other
sides of my family back to late 1600's but the Armstrongs as i say are
very hard to research.
You could try putting a post on the Dumfries pages on this site as
Newcastleton and Castleton are not that far from Dumfriesshire and my
family seemed to hop between the two shires.
Good luck
bougie
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thanks; I will let you know.
There is a book I recently discovered called Dictionary of Scottish Emigrants to Canada before Confederation, 4 volumes, by Donald WHYTE, who is/was apparently a famous Scottish genealogist. I know that they are listed in there, but I don't know how much detail yet. am waiting for the book to arrive through interlibrary loan.
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Said book has arrived - at least, volume 1 of 4.
In this book, the couple I am interested in are listed as follows:
"ARMSTRONG, Thomas. From Castleton, ROX. To Queensbury par. York Co. NB prob 1819. m.Agnes MURRAY. children: Adam, James (alive 1877), Charles, Catherine, Elizabeth." The source for this information is said to be a letter to the author, 16 July 1979. Based on census information, I would say Thomas was born about 1796-1797. These children are listed in reverse birth order, as far as I can tell. I know nothing of Elizabeth. Catherine is the eldest that I have, born about 1827 in New Brunswick; and Adam is the youngest, born in Ontario 1839. Probably Elizabeth was born in New Brunswick, although it's possible she was born in Scotland, if they had married there; she may well have been married by the time of the 1851 census, hence invisible to me - this is the earliest census that I have.
For Agnes, it says:
"MURRAY, Agnes, b. ca 1812. From Castleton, ROX. daughter of Charles M and Elizabeth ARMSTRONG. To York Co., NB poss 1820, m. Thomas ARMSTRONG." The source is the same as above. Based on censuses, Agnes was born about 1799-1800, not 1812. 1812 is not likely, given the births of children. However, perhaps she was a late baptism, and someone thought that represented her birth.
I note also the following persons of interest, who are obviously part of this clan:
"MURRAY, Adam, b. 1 Aug. 1808. From Castleton, ROX, son of Charles M. and Elizabeth ARMSTRONG. To York Co, NB, poss 1819; moved to Westminster Twp., Middlesex Co., Ontario. Farmer and schoolteacher. married Jane, daughter of William BEATTIE and Janet HOGG." Source same as above.
Also there are two other MURRAYs and two other ARMSTRONGs who immigrated from Castleton but there is no clear relationship.
William BEATTIE was Liddesdale, ROX, which I think is nearby. Moved to York Co NB about 1820, moved to Westminster Twp, Middlesex Co. Ontario 1836. He and Janet HOGG had 15 children, presumably in Canada, but the names might be familiar: John, William, Catherine, Margaret, Jane, James, Isabella, Andrew, Edward, Janet, Nancy, David, Mary, Peter, George. Same source as above.
There is also an Isabella BEATTIE, b. about 1794- Castleton ROX, daughter of John B. who moved to York Co NB about 1820, moved to Middlesex Co., Ontario 1836, m.John OLIVER 8 Dec.1837, d.1883. Same source as above. There are numerous OLIVERs listed, who seem to have come from the same area, and settled in various places in Canada. John OLIVER was the son of James O. (OLIVER) and Jean ARMSTRONG - not sure if the "O." is a middle name or his last initial.
Janet HOGG, from Liddesdale ROX to York Co NB about 1820, later to Middlesex Co., Ontario. wife of Willliam BEATTIE.
I don't know how much light this sheds, but perhaps something matches up with the data you have. FYI, Queensbury parish is in York County, New Brunswick, Canada, and was being settled at the time stated. It's clear that most of these folks immigrated first to New Brunswick, then they all migrated further inland to Westminster Township in Middlesex County in Ontario.
I find it curious that the "letter" which is the source of all this, and is modern, states that James ARMSTRONG (son of Thomas and Agnes) was alive in 1877. I wonder where that came from. In fact he lived until 1893; he was a very public figure, and merited front page news on his death, so it would not be any secret, in 1979, that he lived to 1893!
There are two other MURRAYs who are listed on the same land grant with Thomas in New Brunswick in 1828 (at least I believe it is our Thomas). They are John and Charles MURRAY. I have been wondering if they are related too. They are not listed in this volume 1, but Charles is obviously a name that could run in the family; I wonder if they too are siblings of Agnes.
I would like to know when Thomas and Agnes were married, if it was in Scotland.
There are 3 other volumes to this book, but they are only available at the Reference Library, so I must make a visit there. I may not find any more about these families in them, however.
When I get hold of the other 3 volumes, I will let you know if there is anything relevant in them.
I am going to post another thread asking if anyone knows how to get hold of the letters which Mr. WHYTE collected. I fear he may no longer be with us, as the book is 21 years old. I would really like to know who wrote the letter about Thomas and Agnes, and how they knew what they knew.
ta!
loo
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Hi Loo
I have noted down all the info you sent and i will have a look through
what i've got and see if i can come up with anything for you.
bougie
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Thanks very much.
KarenM has found Agnes MURRAY ARMSTRONG's death for me. She died at 89 yrs in 1889, so this confirms that she was born about 1800, not 1812.
Just to clarify, I think that Agnes MURRAY's parents are meant to be Charles MURRAY (not Charles M. MURRAY) and Elizabeth ARMSTRONG.
I have just learned that Agnes's brother, Adam MURRAY was born 1 August 1808. He is said to have been the youngest of 13 children. Apart from Agnes, the only other sibling whose name I have so far is Elspeth, but I don't know where she fits in the birth order. This information comes from the online History of the County of Middlesex, to which I was recently referred by another rootschatter. It also says that the ARMSTRONG family had been farming in the Lowlands for a long time.
This book also seems to suggest that Thomas and Agnes married in Canada, not in Scotland.
It also suggests that Agnes MURRAY's parents also emigrated, so it's unlikely their tombstones would be found in Scotland. I have, however, seen examples where a family tombstone in Scotland contained information on those who had emigrated and never
returned.
I don't want to overwhelm you with information. On the other hand, don't want to leave out something that might be a clue. apologies for the length of all this.
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Hi,
I am a descendant and have considerable info on Charles & Elizabeth (Armstrong) Murray who immigrated to New Brunswick c1818-20. Charles has been identified as a s/o Charles & Mary (Lithgow) Murray, born c1757, Rowanburnhill, Dumfriesshire, christened 8 Aug 1757. He was married on 2 Sep 1787 at Canonbie, Dumfriesshire to Elizabeth Armstrong (b. c1767, Castleton) d/o John Armstrong & Helen Nixon (apparently both reported to be buried in Ettrick Cemetery, Newcastleton). Elizabeth's sister, Jean (c1761) married James Oliver - The Murrays had Oliver cousins in Ontario. Janet, another sister of Elizabeth, married William Ballentyne and also immigrated to Ontario, settling in Smih Falls.
Charles & Elizabeth (Armstrong) Murray's children were:
Helen m. John Elliot - to Ontario
Mary m. Richard Smith - remained in NB
John m.(1) Janet Nichol (2) Margaret McColl - remained in NB
Charles - died unmarried in NB
Thomas m.(1) Eliza Swan (2) Barbara - remained in NB
Jean m. Robert Gibson - to Ontario
David
Agnes m. Thomas Armstrong - to Ontario - at least 6 children
Janet m. John Ferris - to Ontario
Elspeth m. John Little - remained in NB
Walter m. Elizabeth Pearson - remained in NB
William - twin of Walter - died as an infant
Adam m. Jean Beattie - to Ontario
Hope this helps.
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Yes, this does help. Obviously we are umpteenth cousins!
Since I last posted on this thread, I have found Darlene Campbell's extensive gedcom at rootsweb, which seems to cover vast numbers of people! I have also gone to Middlesex and Lambeth counties (Ontario), and have done some local research on my branch of the family, which is the Agnes Murray - Thomas Armstrong marriage towards the end of your list. It seems that they had 8 children altogether, but several died young.
However, I didn't have some of the information which you have, so I will PM you, and perhaps we can discuss this further.
Thanks!
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Here's more
Andrew Armstrong/Jane Morton, Andrew Armstrong/Jane Murray,
John Armstrong/Helen Nixon, Adam Armstrong, Archibald Armstrong/
Isabella Kyle, James Armstrong and brother John Armstrong,
Walter Armstrong, Walter Armstrong/Janet Veitch, Archibald Armstrong,
Charles Armstrong/Janet ? , James Armstrong/Isabella ? , James Armstrong/
Margaret Little, James Armstrong,
Andrew Armstrong/Isabella Aitchison, John Armstrong/Margaret Barclay,
Andrew Armstrong/Sarah Bell, Thomasina Armstrong, Frank Armstrong ,
James Armstrong/Janet Turnbull, Andrew Telfer Armstrong,
These graves all date from late 1700's to very early 1900's but most of
them are mid 1800's . I have more information on them all if anyone's
interested. bougie
I think we can now assume that John ARMSTRONG and Helen NIXON, whom you found, are likely to be my (and elliojo's) ancestors. If you have any more info from that grave (or anywhere else for that matter!) on them, or can figure out any of their rellies from the info you have, I'm sure we would both appreciate it. Do you have a photo of the tombstone? If so, or if it could be gotten on a future visit, I would be thrilled to see it! This might be the oldest identified grave in my genealogy so far, and the ONLY one, with tombstone, in Britain. I never expected to find any in Scotland, so this is very exciting.
Many thanks!
Loo
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Hi Loo
Here is that MI that you asked for
IN MEMORY OF JOHN ARMSTRONG OF BURNMOOR, DIED 17TH FEBUARY 1789
AGED 67 YEARS, ALSO HIS WIFE, HELEN NIXON, DIED 16TH APRIL 1826 AGED
92 YEARS.
Next to it another grave reads
IN MEMORY OF ADAM ARMSTRONG, SON OF JOHN ARMSTRONG, BURNMOOR,
WHO DIED AT NEWCASTLETON ON 9TH SEPTEMBER 1806 AGED 43 YEARS.
I don't have a photo but i may be back at that cemy shortly and i will certainly take a pic for you.
Sorry but i couldn't find any of the other people that you mentioned but i only wrote down male Armstrongs and their wifes the last time i visited. when i go back i will check the other names for you.
bougie
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Thank you SO much, Bougie.
It seems to me that this must be the right couple: (1) the dates would fit with the birth of their daughter Elizabeth in 1767, when her mother Helen NIXON would have been 33years. (2) This is not completely reliable, but may be indicative - Helen's longevity @ 92yrs seems to run in the family - there are quite a few people descended from her who lived to the 88 to 92 age range that I know of through many generations, my father the most recent is 90 and living. (3) Tell me if I'm wrong, but Helen NIXON seems a less common name in the area than all the similar-sounding MURRAYs and ARMSTRONGs etc, and therefore unlikely that there would be other marriages with this exact combination of names in the same time frame.
Since you are in the area, Bougie, can you say whether elliojo's information (from older family histories) that they were buried in "Ettrick" would likely be the same place as the cemetery you found, or at least close by? I'm extremely fuzzy on the geography.
Can you give me the location of the cemetery? I will make a note of it in the hope that I will get there some day.
I do hope, however, that you are able to get a photo, as it could be quite some time before I am able to get there. It's so nice to think there will be something to see when I do!!
Thank you so very very much. :)
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P. S.
I don't want to trouble you too much, Bougie, with trying to find additional people in that cemetery in my lines. I strongly suspect that most of the people whose names I gave you earlier emigrated to Canada, so won't be found in Scotland. If they didn't emigrate, I don't think it would be easy to determine which ones they were exactly in Scotland, as there are so many with the same names!
I am curious, though, about two things:
(1) whether there are more NIXONs. Mostly wondering how common the name is/was there, not really expecting to make a link that far back.
(2) did you find Charles MURRAY and his wife Mary LITHGOW in that cemetery? They would have been born in approx the 1720s or '30s, but I have no idea when they died except that it would be after 1756.
Thanks again.
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Hi Loo
I did a quick check for you and there isn't another couple with the names that you are looking for in the time frame that you mention. Nixon is not as common a name as Armstrong in this area although it is still a well known Border family name.
The cemy containing the gravestone is Ettleton which is about a mile or so south of Newcastleton on the Canonbie road.
I think that Elliojos maybe a wee bit mixed up with the cemy name as Ettrick is in a different area altogether [ Selkirkshire ]
If you ever manage to make the trip over here there is an Armstrong Heritage centre in Newcastleton where you can research your Armstrong roots free of charge , or the Hawick Heritage Hub where you can research all Border families
, also free of charge. It is possible to find your ancestors back to 1538 when the records started although i have only managed to get back to the mid 1600s with mine.
There are some very old graveyards in the area, one of them being Canonbie, which contains graves dating back to the mid 1600s so you may still find some more of your ancestors in them.
The next time that i go to Newcastleton i will look for Charles Murray and Mary Lithgows grave.
bougie
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Your information is extremely helpful, Bougie.
I would love to get to these research centres sometime. I'd always heard that Scottish records didn't go back very far in most cases, so it's exciting to learn that some of mine might go back to the 1500s. I have some in Argyllshire, where there apparently aren't records before about 1800. I'm really not familiar with Scottish records. I have another lot in Dunfermline, but I haven't gotten into that yet.
Thank you very much for your ongoing help.
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Hi Loo
Ifound this among some of my armstrong data and thought it could possibly be your Thomas Armstrong as the dates match.
29/10/1796 To JAMES ARMSTRONG and ISABEL TURNBUL a son THOMAS at Castleton
05/08/1805 To JAMES ARMSTRONG and ISABEL TURNBUL a daughter ISABEL at
Castleton
bougie
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Here's more
Andrew Armstrong/Jane Morton, Andrew Armstrong/Jane Murray,
John Armstrong/Helen Nixon, Adam Armstrong, Archibald Armstrong/
Isabella Kyle, James Armstrong and brother John Armstrong,
Walter Armstrong, Walter Armstrong/Janet Veitch, Archibald Armstrong,
Charles Armstrong/Janet ? , James Armstrong/Isabella ? , James Armstrong/
Margaret Little, James Armstrong,
Andrew Armstrong/Isabella Aitchison, John Armstrong/Margaret Barclay,
Andrew Armstrong/Sarah Bell, Thomasina Armstrong, Frank Armstrong ,
James Armstrong/Janet Turnbull, Andrew Telfer Armstrong,
These graves all date from late 1700's to very early 1900's but most of
them are mid 1800's . I have more information on them all if anyone's
interested.
bougie
Well done, Bougie.
So, I'm thinking that very near the grave of John ARMSTRONG and Helen NIXON is that of a James ARMSTRONG and an Isabella ____? I'm wondering if you have any more info on the latter pair. Does it look like these could be the parents of Thomas and Isabel?
loo
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Here's the mi on that one Loo
IN MEMORY OF JAMES ARMSTRONG, DIED AT RIGGARTON MILL ON 3RD JANUARY 1812 AGED 59 YEARS AND HIS WIFE ISABELLA , DIED 12TH MARCH 1814 AGED 58 YEARS
Also in another grave nearby
IN MEMORY OF JAMES ARMSTRONG DIED AT RIGGARTON MILL ON 12TH MAY 1855 AGED 63 YEARS ALSO HIS WIFE MARGARET LITTLE DIED 16TH JULY 1855 AGED 60 YEARS.
I think the second James could be the son of this James and Isabella. If so he was born c1792 when this James and Isabella would have been 39 and 36 respectively. They would have been 43 and 39 when Thomas was born and 52 and 48 or 49 whan Isabel jnr was born.
It is a possibility . In those days many children were born when their mothers were in their late forties.
What do you think
bougie
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It's a bit of a stretch, but I suppose it's possible.
I have not run into any births in mothers past 47 yet!
Another factor is that often people were not too precise about ages.
I do know that my Thomas was born in Castleton 1796 or 1797. So, if he is the only one on the register by that name in that time frame, it almost has to be him. The fact that you have him b.Oct. suggests that he was born in 1796 and probably baptized in 1797, which would fit with the two years in question.
If there is no birth surname on the MI for Isabella wife of James of Riggarton Mill, then this may or may not be the right one. I was hoping that perhaps her surname had not been clear when you visited the cemetery, but that it might be clearer if you had the clue of TURNBUL. If it is merely absent, then perhaps we are not much further ahead on that one, as the names are relatively common. Do you know if your question mark meant that there was no surname for her, or just that you couldn't read it?
The fact that Isabella died in March (1814) at 59yrs pushes her birthdate quite possibly back into 1754. Given that baby Isabella was born in Aug 1805, it is like that Isabella senior was by then 51 years, at least 50, if the numbers are correct. Help me if I've got the math wrong on that.
The location Riggarton Mill has not yet appeared in any other information that I have.
Certainly there were people named LITTLE who also moved to Canada in the same entourage I think.
Thanks for the extra info. It could still turn out to be the right people!
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Sorry Loo, there was no surname present for this Isabella. I had to look back to my origional scribblings for that one and during my search i found that there is something that i omitted to add on your Armstrong/Nixon mi. Here it is in full.
IN MEMORY OF JOHN ARMSTRONG IN BURNMOOR , DIED FEBUARY 17TH 1789 AGED 67 YEARS, JOHN HIS SON AGED 3 YEARS AND ADAM DIED NEWCASTLETON 9TH SEPTEMBER 1808 AGED 43 YEARS ALSO HELEN NIXON WIFE OF THE ABOVE JOHN , DIED APRIL 16TH 1826 AGED 92 YEARS.
When i wrote them out again at home i must have shortened it for convenience
but for a good job i held onto my origional notebook.
bougie
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Thanks for the extra bits, Bougie.
It's a pity Isabella didn't manage to leave us with her name intact! lol
Just one question, for clarification:
In the first listing for this headstone which you gave, you said
"IN MEMORY OF JOHN ARMSTRONG OF BURNMOOR, DIED 17TH FEBUARY 1789
AGED 67 YEARS, ALSO HIS WIFE, HELEN NIXON, DIED 16TH APRIL 1826 AGED
92 YEARS.
Next to it another grave reads
IN MEMORY OF ADAM ARMSTRONG, SON OF JOHN ARMSTRONG, BURNMOOR,
WHO DIED AT NEWCASTLETON ON 9TH SEPTEMBER 1806 AGED 43 YEARS."
In the second one, you said:
"IN MEMORY OF JOHN ARMSTRONG IN BURNMOOR , DIED FEBUARY 17TH 1789 AGED 67 YEARS, JOHN HIS SON AGED 3 YEARS AND ADAM DIED NEWCASTLETON 9TH SEPTEMBER 1808 AGED 43 YEARS ALSO HELEN NIXON WIFE OF THE ABOVE JOHN , DIED APRIL 16TH 1826 AGED 92 YEARS."
In retrospect, do you think there were two headstones, both of which named this Adam who died at age 43? If not, do you think he died in 1806 or 1808?
I know how difficult it can be to get all these things down when you're out visiting a cemetery and all the names are so similar etc. Just wondering if you are able to clarify, as you never know when some tiny detail may prove significant!
Thanks,
loo
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My mistake Loo
When i wrote them out out[ after scribbling them in a notebook] i logged them by name and dates and must have written Adam A underneath John and Helen
so when i came to send them to you it looked like two graves.
They are all on the one gravestone and Adam died 1808. I must have misprinted this the first time i sent it .
bougie
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Thanks for the clairification, bougie.
At least this way we know for certain that he was the son of this set of parents!
loo
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Hi Loo
Did you get pm i sent you about John Oliver the other day
bougie
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I did, yes, thanks. Apologies for not responding yet. I need a little time to work it all through!
loo
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I think I have information that you were asking for a long time ago regarding the parents and siblings of Agnes Murray. I am descended from her sister Jean Murray..one of the many who moved to Ontario in the 1830's. I have more info on Jean Murray and Charles Gibson's children if you would like it and I'd love to see what you have found out also.
MURRAY: Charles Murray born c1757 at Rowanburnhill in Dumfriesshire,
Scotland, died 6 Apr 1834, s/o Charles Murray and Mary Lithgow, married
1787 at Canonbie, Dumfriesshire, Elizabeth Armstrong b. c1764 Castleton,
Roxburgshire, Scotland, died 13 Mar 1839, d/o John Armstrong and Helen
Nixon: came to NB about 1817: first settled at Apohaqui, then at Pearsonville
or English Settlement in Studholm Parish, Kings County:
Children born in Catleton Parish, Scotland:
1) Helen Murray born 17 Nov 1787 at Burnmouth, m. John Elliot and first
settled at Keswick, York County: had seven children: family moved to Ontario
in the 1830’s:
2) Mary Murray b. 26 Jul 1789 at Nicholforest, d. 18 Mar 1866 in Springfield
Parish, Kings County, NB, married 4 Oct 1825 Richard Smith born Jul 1790
at Whitehaven, England, d. 17/18 Dec 1852: they settled in English Settlement:
3) John Murray b. 6 Feb 1791 at Nicholforest, d. 26 May 1881, m. c1819 (1st)
Janet Nichol b. 1794, d. 12 May 1845: had three sons: m. (2nd) 11 May 1858
Margaret McColl born 1808, died 27 Feb 1885: settled at English Settlement:
4) Charles Murray Jr. born 21 Mar/Oct 1792 at Nicholforest, d. unmarried 28
May 1820:
5) Thomas Murray b. 18 Nov 1794 at Craigs, d. 9 Apr 1874, married (1st) 16
Jun 1819 Elizabeth Swan born c1788 at Roxburgshire, Scotland, died 16 May
1860 at English Settlement, m. (2nd) 3 Dec 1861 Barbara Thomas, widow of
John Thomas of Salmon Creek: settled at Keswick, York County:
6) Jean Murray b. 3 Oct 1796 at Craigs, m. Robert Gibson of Scotland: they
moved to Ontario in the 1830’s:
7) David Murray b. 29 Oct 1798 at Craigs, d. unmarried:
8) Agnes Murray b. 24 Dec 1800 at Harelane, married 14 Sep 1821 Thomas
Armstrong: settled at Queensbury, York County: family moved to Ontario in
the 1830’s:
9) Janet Murray b. 17 Aug 1802 at Bankhead, m. 18 Nov 1825 John Ferris :
settled at Keswick, NB: went to Ontario in 1830’s:
10) Elspeth Murray born 3 Aug 1804 at Carlside, Scotland, d. 17 Apr 1892,
m. 3 Dec 1824 John Little born 31 Oct 1800 at Dumfriesshire, Scotland, d. 16
Feb 1885: first settled at Richibucto, Kent Couty, later at Upper Millstream or
Berwick in Studholm Parish, Kings County:
11) Walter Murray b. 4 Nov 1806 at Greenholm, d. 24 May 1862, m. 24 Jul
1828 Elizabeth Pearson b. 5 Dec 1809 at Castle Carrick, Cumberland County,
England, d. 27 Apr 1893: they settled at Apohaqui, Kings County:
12) Adam Murray (twin) born 1 Aug 1808 at Greenholm, d. 10 Nov 1900 in
Chicago, IL, married Oct 1835 at Westminster, ON, Jean Beattie b. c1810 in
Scotland, d. 1892: they moved to Ontario in the 1830’s:
13) William Murray (twin) b. 1 Aug 1808 at Greenholm, d. in infancy.
Sources: MC1/Murray #3, 40 pages: see MC80/1 Grace Aiton’s The story of
Sussex and vicinity, page 57: see also MC80/223 The descendants of Charles
Murray, 70 pages: see also MC80/2354 Saint John Branch, NBGS: Arrivals
99: our first families in New Brunswick, pages 197-198: see also MC1581
Mary Ellen Christie fonds, Murray genealogy, 100 pages.
Hope this helps
Tammy
Clinton, Ontario
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bougie, re pg.1, 4 th, post, armstrong/tefler, there is a strong possibility that they are one of my maternal gg grandparents, my great grandfather was Walter Armstrong, b.c 1844/5 , Canonbie. Bodger
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Have following mi's if anyone wants more information on any
of them.
William Armstrong/Mary Porteous,
Hi Bougie,
Are you able to post the inscription on William Armstrong/Mary Porteous
Many thanks,
Derek
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Hi Derek
Here is the one you want
IN MEMORY OF WILLIAM ARMSTRONG WHO DIED AT GOLDILANDS COTTAGE 29TH JANY 1891 AGED 94 YEARS. ALSO MARY PORTEOUS HIS WIFE WHO DIED AT GOLDILANDS COTTAGE 23RD AUGT 1888 AGED 81 YEARS. AND ARCHIBALD ARMSTRONG THEIR SON WHO DIED AT GOLDILANDS COTTAGE 23RD SEPTR 1894 AGED 54 YEARS. ELIZABETH ARMSTRONG DAUGHTER TO WILLIAM ARMSTRONG, BROADLEEHOPE, WHO DIED AT CROSSLANDS AUGT 6TH 1854 AGED 25 YEARS.
This is all on the one headstone . Goldilands Cottage is still standing though it can't be seen from the road. It is in the middle of a small wood just outside Hawick next to Goldilands Tower.
Sheena
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Hi Bodger
Here is your one
IN MEMORY OF WILLIAM ARMSTRONG WHO DIED AT NEWCASTLETON 16TH AUGUST 1869 AGED 78 YEARS. MARGARET TELFER HIS WIFE DIED 12TH DECR 1884 AGED 82 YEARS. JAMES ARMSTRONG THEIR SON WHO DIED AT NEWCASTLETON 1ST MARCH 1913 AGED 75 YEARS. JANET JOHNSTONE HIS WIFE DIED 11TH MARCH 1915 AGED 69 YEARS. MARGARET FOOTE ARMSTRONG THEIR DAUGHTER DIED NOVR 5TH 1916 AGED 38 YEARS. ALSO MARY ANN ARMSTRONG THEIR DAUGHTER DIED AUGT 13TH 1952 IN HER 69TH YEAR.
Sheena
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Hi Sheena,
I tried to PM you my thanks for your reply, but understand that I have to make three postings before the PM function will work, hence my very public thanks (I have now made two postings...).
I am particularly interested if anyone has any information about where Mary Porteous came from.
Thanks again and regards
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Hi Derek
As Mary died in 1888 aged 81 she must have been born c1806/08.
The two nearest births are both in Johnstone Dumfriesshire to William Porteous and Sarah Graham in 1806 and to James Porteous and Katherine Halliday in 1807. I suspect that William and James could be brothers.
It is possible that Mary came from farther afield. These are the nearest in location. Suggest that you try the 1881 census as it will give her place of birth or better still look up her death on Scotlands people and you will get her parents on that.
Sheena
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Thank You. Bodger
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Hi Bougie
I am very interested in your MI of Archibald ARMSTRONG/Isabel KYLE
I have an Archibald ARMSTRONG married to an Isabella KYLE c 1820 - Archibald died in Strachur, Argyll in 1879 aged 93 (c1786 Cumberland, England) Isabella died in 1883 aged 93 also (c 1790 Castleton, Roxburgh)
Interestingly Archibald's death certificate lists his parents as Archibald ARMSTRONG/Isabella KYLE - who appear to have married in Castleton on 24 Aug 1770
any info your MI can provide to shed light on the above would be much appreciated
many thanks,
Jackie
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Hi Jackie
The MI reads as follows.
In memory of Archibald Armstrong, Solwaybank who died 24th May 1824 aged 83 years. Also his wife Isabella Kyle died 15th May 1833 aged 84 years.
There are also three sons buried next to them. As follows.
James Armstrong son of Archibald Armstrong, Solwaybank, died 8th July 1804 aged 24 yrs, also his brother John Armstrong [merchant, Langholm] died September 1814 aged 33 yrs.
Walter Armstrong, son of Archibald Armstrong, Solwaybank, died at Woodside on 12th April 1812 aged 19 yrs.
Hope this is of help to you
Sheena
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Hi Jackie
The MI reads as follows.
In memory of Archibald Armstrong, Solwaybank who died 24th May 1824 aged 83 years. Also his wife Isabella Kyle died 15th May 1833 aged 84 years.
There are also three sons buried next to them. As follows.
James Armstrong son of Archibald Armstrong, Solwaybank, died 8th July 1804 aged 24 yrs, also his brother John Armstrong [merchant, Langholm] died September 1814 aged 33 yrs.
Walter Armstrong, son of Archibald Armstrong, Solwaybank, died at Woodside on 12th April 1812 aged 19 yrs.
Hope this is of help to you
Sheena
Dear Sheena
very, very many thanks for the MI info - has helped a lot
all the best,
Jackie :-)
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Hi Bodger,
I wonder if you came across an MI for a William Armstrong (spouse Margaret Turnbul) of Mangertown.
They had a daughter Elizabeth on 7 Jan 1765.
It seems he might have been the last Armstrong tenant of Mangerton.
Thanks for any help you can offer.
Mosside
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I think I have information that you were asking for a long time ago regarding the parents and siblings of Agnes Murray. I am descended from her sister Jean Murray..one of the many who moved to Ontario in the 1830's. I have more info on Jean Murray and Charles Gibson's children if you would like it and I'd love to see what you have found out also.
MURRAY: Charles Murray born c1757 at Rowanburnhill in Dumfriesshire,
Scotland, died 6 Apr 1834, s/o Charles Murray and Mary Lithgow, married
1787 at Canonbie, Dumfriesshire, Elizabeth Armstrong b. c1764 Castleton,
Roxburgshire, Scotland, died 13 Mar 1839, d/o John Armstrong and Helen
Nixon: came to NB about 1817: first settled at Apohaqui, then at Pearsonville
or English Settlement in Studholm Parish, Kings County:
Children born in Catleton Parish, Scotland:
1) Helen Murray born 17 Nov 1787 at Burnmouth, m. John Elliot and first
settled at Keswick, York County: had seven children: family moved to Ontario
in the 1830’s:
2) Mary Murray b. 26 Jul 1789 at Nicholforest, d. 18 Mar 1866 in Springfield
Parish, Kings County, NB, married 4 Oct 1825 Richard Smith born Jul 1790
at Whitehaven, England, d. 17/18 Dec 1852: they settled in English Settlement:
3) John Murray b. 6 Feb 1791 at Nicholforest, d. 26 May 1881, m. c1819 (1st)
Janet Nichol b. 1794, d. 12 May 1845: had three sons: m. (2nd) 11 May 1858
Margaret McColl born 1808, died 27 Feb 1885: settled at English Settlement:
4) Charles Murray Jr. born 21 Mar/Oct 1792 at Nicholforest, d. unmarried 28
May 1820:
5) Thomas Murray b. 18 Nov 1794 at Craigs, d. 9 Apr 1874, married (1st) 16
Jun 1819 Elizabeth Swan born c1788 at Roxburgshire, Scotland, died 16 May
1860 at English Settlement, m. (2nd) 3 Dec 1861 Barbara Thomas, widow of
John Thomas of Salmon Creek: settled at Keswick, York County:
6) Jean Murray b. 3 Oct 1796 at Craigs, m. Robert Gibson of Scotland: they
moved to Ontario in the 1830’s:
7) David Murray b. 29 Oct 1798 at Craigs, d. unmarried:
8) Agnes Murray b. 24 Dec 1800 at Harelane, married 14 Sep 1821 Thomas
Armstrong: settled at Queensbury, York County: family moved to Ontario in
the 1830’s:
9) Janet Murray b. 17 Aug 1802 at Bankhead, m. 18 Nov 1825 John Ferris :
settled at Keswick, NB: went to Ontario in 1830’s:
10) Elspeth Murray born 3 Aug 1804 at Carlside, Scotland, d. 17 Apr 1892,
m. 3 Dec 1824 John Little born 31 Oct 1800 at Dumfriesshire, Scotland, d. 16
Feb 1885: first settled at Richibucto, Kent Couty, later at Upper Millstream or
Berwick in Studholm Parish, Kings County:
11) Walter Murray b. 4 Nov 1806 at Greenholm, d. 24 May 1862, m. 24 Jul
1828 Elizabeth Pearson b. 5 Dec 1809 at Castle Carrick, Cumberland County,
England, d. 27 Apr 1893: they settled at Apohaqui, Kings County:
12) Adam Murray (twin) born 1 Aug 1808 at Greenholm, d. 10 Nov 1900 in
Chicago, IL, married Oct 1835 at Westminster, ON, Jean Beattie b. c1810 in
Scotland, d. 1892: they moved to Ontario in the 1830’s:
13) William Murray (twin) b. 1 Aug 1808 at Greenholm, d. in infancy.
Sources: MC1/Murray #3, 40 pages: see MC80/1 Grace Aiton’s The story of
Sussex and vicinity, page 57: see also MC80/223 The descendants of Charles
Murray, 70 pages: see also MC80/2354 Saint John Branch, NBGS: Arrivals
99: our first families in New Brunswick, pages 197-198: see also MC1581
Mary Ellen Christie fonds, Murray genealogy, 100 pages.
Hope this helps
Tammy
Clinton, Ontario
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My great great great grand
father was Charles Murray, who married Mary Lithgow.Am I on the right track.
, They had a son William Murray, born 1767.I think I have information that you were asking for a long time ago regarding the parents and siblings of Agnes Murray. I am descended from her sister Jean Murray..one of the many who moved to Ontario in the 1830's. I have more info on Jean Murray and Charles Gibson's children if you would like it and I'd love to see what you have found out also.
MURRAY: Charles Murray born c1757 at Rowanburnhill in Dumfriesshire,
Scotland, died 6 Apr 1834, s/o Charles Murray and Mary Lithgow, married
1787 at Canonbie, Dumfriesshire, Elizabeth Armstrong b. c1764 Castleton,
Roxburgshire, Scotland, died 13 Mar 1839, d/o John Armstrong and Helen
Nixon: came to NB about 1817: first settled at Apohaqui, then at Pearsonville
or English Settlement in Studholm Parish, Kings County:
Children born in Catleton Parish, Scotland:
1) Helen Murray born 17 Nov 1787 at Burnmouth, m. John Elliot and first
settled at Keswick, York County: had seven children: family moved to Ontario
in the 1830’s:
2) Mary Murray b. 26 Jul 1789 at Nicholforest, d. 18 Mar 1866 in Springfield
Parish, Kings County, NB, married 4 Oct 1825 Richard Smith born Jul 1790
at Whitehaven, England, d. 17/18 Dec 1852: they settled in English Settlement:
3) John Murray b. 6 Feb 1791 at Nicholforest, d. 26 May 1881, m. c1819 (1st)
Janet Nichol b. 1794, d. 12 May 1845: had three sons: m. (2nd) 11 May 1858
Margaret McColl born 1808, died 27 Feb 1885: settled at English Settlement:
4) Charles Murray Jr. born 21 Mar/Oct 1792 at Nicholforest, d. unmarried 28
May 1820:
5) Thomas Murray b. 18 Nov 1794 at Craigs, d. 9 Apr 1874, married (1st) 16
Jun 1819 Elizabeth Swan born c1788 at Roxburgshire, Scotland, died 16 May
1860 at English Settlement, m. (2nd) 3 Dec 1861 Barbara Thomas, widow of
John Thomas of Salmon Creek: settled at Keswick, York County:
6) Jean Murray b. 3 Oct 1796 at Craigs, m. Robert Gibson of Scotland: they
moved to Ontario in the 1830’s:
7) David Murray b. 29 Oct 1798 at Craigs, d. unmarried:
8) Agnes Murray b. 24 Dec 1800 at Harelane, married 14 Sep 1821 Thomas
Armstrong: settled at Queensbury, York County: family moved to Ontario in
the 1830’s:
9) Janet Murray b. 17 Aug 1802 at Bankhead, m. 18 Nov 1825 John Ferris :
settled at Keswick, NB: went to Ontario in 1830’s:
10) Elspeth Murray born 3 Aug 1804 at Carlside, Scotland, d. 17 Apr 1892,
m. 3 Dec 1824 John Little born 31 Oct 1800 at Dumfriesshire, Scotland, d. 16
Feb 1885: first settled at Richibucto, Kent Couty, later at Upper Millstream or
Berwick in Studholm Parish, Kings County:
11) Walter Murray b. 4 Nov 1806 at Greenholm, d. 24 May 1862, m. 24 Jul
1828 Elizabeth Pearson b. 5 Dec 1809 at Castle Carrick, Cumberland County,
England, d. 27 Apr 1893: they settled at Apohaqui, Kings County:
12) Adam Murray (twin) born 1 Aug 1808 at Greenholm, d. 10 Nov 1900 in
Chicago, IL, married Oct 1835 at Westminster, ON, Jean Beattie b. c1810 in
Scotland, d. 1892: they moved to Ontario in the 1830’s:
13) William Murray (twin) b. 1 Aug 1808 at Greenholm, d. in infancy.
Sources: MC1/Murray #3, 40 pages: see MC80/1 Grace Aiton’s The story of
Sussex and vicinity, page 57: see also MC80/223 The descendants of Charles
Murray, 70 pages: see also MC80/2354 Saint John Branch, NBGS: Arrivals
99: our first families in New Brunswick, pages 197-198: see also MC1581
Mary Ellen Christie fonds, Murray genealogy, 100 pages.
Hope this helps
Tammy
Clinton, Ontario
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I think my great great great great grandfather Mr
I have been researching my family tree, and found Charles Murray, hopefully, by great, great, great grandfather, who married Mary Lithgow, they had a son William Murray born 1767 at Canonbie.I hopeI am on the right track.
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It sounds like you are dealing with the same family as some of the rest of us.
According to me, William was the 8th and final child of Chales Murray and Mary Lithgow. I have Mary Lithgow b. 21 Jan. 1722 at Galashiels. Son William b. 12 Apr. 1767 Canonbie.
Their son Charles, next eldest brother to William, married Elizabeth Armstrong and came to Canada - see earlier posts by elliojo etc.
What happened to William? I have nothing on him so far, or any of the rest for that matter. Did he emigrate or stay in Britain?
It is quite a while since I worked on this family so my memory is not fresh, and my records may be missing some sources etc.
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Message to Tammy of Clinton:
Yes, it's the same family.
I know nothing of what happened to the Gibsons except that I read somewhere that they had a son Robert. I don't even know where they settled, but if you are in Clinton, perhaps it was around London somewhere, with the rest of them?
I realize you posted this ages ago but I must have missed it somehow.
I will send you a PM.
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Just a quick reply to say I finally got back to this site and will post my Murray/Gibson info soon.
Sorry it took so long :(
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Hi There,
I'm looking for information on Catherine Margaret Murray, born in 1793 who Married George Powell. She was born in Ireland, and moved to Quebec Canada sometime before 1825. She died in 1859. Their son Niel is my great grandfather. I don't know where they lived in Ireland, or when they came to Canada. I was told stories by my grandma that Catherine Margaret Murray had Royal relatives, and that somehow were connected to Whitehaven England.
Information on George Powell (b: 1773 Ireland, d:1862 St. Dehalifax lower Iverness CA) would be nice too, if possible.
Sorry if this is not the correct place to post this, but doing a search, this message came up, and looked like it might be close, and I'm new to this, and wasn't really sure how, or where else to post this.
Thanks,
Scott
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Deleted
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Hi JackieW
I have all of this family in my tree and a great deal more. Could we share please?
boswells
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Hi
Dont forget the Armstrongs buried at Gilnockie Tower near Canonbie.
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Hi Bougie,
I'm wondering if you ever were able to take a photo of this gravemarker? It was requested years ago by Loo... and maybe you were able to send it to her?
IN MEMORY OF JOHN ARMSTRONG OF BURNMOOR, DIED 17TH FEBUARY 1789
AGED 67 YEARS, ALSO HIS WIFE, HELEN NIXON, DIED 16TH APRIL 1826 AGED
92 YEARS.
I am researching the same line. My connection is through the Farris/Murray marriage :)
All the best,
CGS