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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Northamptonshire => England => Northamptonshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: fionnghal on Friday 11 April 08 15:09 BST (UK)
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hi folks, I'm wondering if SKS could possibly help me.
I have a STOKES family in Nassington, but am missing the 1851 census.
the 1841 HO107/812 / 10/5 pg.3 reads as
Town st, Nassington
Thomas Stocks, butcher, c.55 Y [should read Stokes]
Sarah, wife, 45 Y
Elzth 15 Y
Ann 12 Y
Catherine 9 Y
Emma 7 Y
Wllm 15 Y
James 15 Y
so far, so good. The kids are all b. in Nassington, but the parents birth places in NTH are, as yet, unknown
The above Thomas, full name John Thomas, dies aged 72yrs, 1857 in Nassington and I suspect his wife also dies in the 1850s though that could of course have occurred in the previous decade.
However, to confuse matters, a Collyweston b. Sarah appears in both the 1861 & '71 censuses, one alongside a correctly aged Emma who could fit as our dau. But, they're in Peterboro'. Searching back i found an 1841 Peterboro' Sarah the correct age in the Alms house - who may or may not be the same later Sarah who acc to the census is unmarried anyway. It does suggest they are not my Sarah, and that makes me believe even more that mine died in the '50s or earlier if she don't show up in the 1851 census ???
According to FreeBMD, 2 Sarah's die in the Oundle parish in the 1850s so either or both could have been Nassington burials.
Sarah Dalby/Dolby Stokes, 60yo, Oundle 3b127 [Nassington, age from burial index; our Sarah's marriage lines makes no mention of a Dolby middle name]
Sarah Stokes d1857 Oundle 3b122 [place unknown; no mention of her in burial the index] :-\
getting my sticky fingers on the 1851 transcription, will at least let me know if Sarah dies before or after 1851.
Thank you very much for your time and trouble
le durachd
fionnghal
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here is emma stokes(don't know if you already have this)
1851
HO107/1746/127/26.
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In 1861 son James is married to Eliza with 4 children .....
RG9/3350 F 115 P 33 Living Wortley nr Leeds
James Stokes hd m 35 midland railway policeman Nassington
Eliza wi m 35 seamstress Rutland Hambledon
William son 15 woolcloth finisher d/o d/o
John Thos son 10 scholar d/o Uppingham
Sarah Elizabeth dau 8 scholar d/o Preston
James Hanson Stokes son 6 scholar Leis Ashby de la Zouch
so in 1851 ......
HO107/2093 F 322 P 36 Seaton Rutland
James Stokes hd m 25 ag lab Hambledon
Eliza wi m 25 d/o
William son 5 Uppingham
John T son 2 months
Tazzie
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Not much luck with the others so far ......
Can see William & Elizabeth 1861 /1871 neither marry...not popping up in 1851
Thomas lost him completely......
Tazzie
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Thanks, Tazzie, I really appreciate your help,
no i didn't have Emma's 1851. Where is she? Do you mind? I don't have access to the 1851 with my sub.
I didn't have James' 1851 either, thanks for that.
Maybe the parents' name has got itself mis-transcribed ... or, maybe they're away from home!! just my luck!
ah, but, you're not finding some of the kids, except for Emma. There must be some of them in Nassington. That suggests it is a poor transcription - or, maybe, in defence of the poor transcriber, appalling writing on the original! doh! ???
That means I'll not find their birthplaces even :'(
Thanks again for your time, Tazzie
le durachd
fionnghal
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1851
HO107/1746/127/26
robert johnson age 58. b. oundle. occ. draper. head.
mary age 60. b. panxworth. wife.
emma stokes age 17. b. nassington. occ. house servant.
living at ;north street,oundle,northants.
reg.dist. oundle.
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Thank you Wozzle, that's much appreciated :)
le durachd
fionnghal
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Hi All
It seems as though Ann dies aged 14 in 1843.
Catherine also aged 16 in 1847.
Sarah Dolby Stokes is buried aged 60 in 1854.
All in Nassington.
Sandy
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And if you did not already know it.
From the Northants Marriage Index.
Nassington Parish Church
24-Nov 1812
Thomas STOKES of Wansford, butcher Sarah HANDSON otp, spinster
Sandy
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Thanks for that, Seahall,
I've been aware of this Sarah Dalby/Dolby Stokes. She's dying at the right age and place, but there is also this other Sarah Stokes who dies in the same district, Oundle, 3yrs later, but without an actual placename or age. So far, i've been unable to rule her out as also, maybe, dying in Nassington. She doesn't show up in the Death index. She could be from another village entirely, or even be our Sarah's dau who also falls off the planet after the 1841 census.
Also, just to complicate matters, i haven't, so far, come on anything that indicates that my Sarah had the middle name Dolby/Dalby. So if this proves to be her, I'll be delighted as it'll give me another edge, maybe, for tracking her backwards. :) I had her purely as Sarah Hanson/Handson b.c.1893 [based on 1841 census] in Nassington [parents unknown]
Her marriage lines quotes:
24 Nov 1812, "Thomas Stokes of Wansford, butcher, & Sarah Hanson, otp, sp., at Nassington by license" but then, Thomas Stokes is really John Thomas Stokes, so he hasn't mentioned his other forename either. I got the John Thomas label from his son, Thomas's, marriage lines. Of course, mum didn't get a mention.
Thanks all the same, all grist to the mill :)
le durachd
fionnghal
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"From the Northants Marriage Index. Nassington Parish Church 24-Nov 1812 Thomas STOKES of Wansford, butcher Sarah HANDSON otp, spinster"
aha! snap, i'd just written this into my last e-mail. I suppose there isn't a Nassington Birth Index, is there?
le durachd :)
fionnghal
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You are welcome.
1851 Nassington Census
H.O. 107-1746 Pg 4 Folio 414 Sch 10 Church Street
Thomas Stokes Head Mar 65 Butcher Collyweston
Sarah Wife Mar 57 Schoolmistress Fotheringhay
Elizabeth Daur 27 Unm ----------------- Nassington
As to a middle name or a change of forename a lot of people added them at baptism etc or just gave them to themselves.
Sandy
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P.S. there is not another Sarah dying in Nassington at the time period noted.
Nassington and Yarwell are not listed under the site with censuses on that most of us use.
Sandy
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Wondered if this Charles is also a son of Thomas and Sarah.
1851 Nassington Census
H.O. 107-1746 Pg 23 Folio 439 Sch 73 Queen Street
Charles Stokes Head Mar 31 Labourer Nassington
Caroline Wife Mar 27 Deenethorpe
William Son 10 Deenethorpe
Sarah Jane Daur 9 Nassington
Mary Ann Daur 7 Nassington
John Thomas Son 5 Nassington
Harriett Daur 3 Nassington
Sandy
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Hi ......
Ah ha cousin Sandy ..... is that why I could not find them? I thought they may be under some really bad transcription somewhere.
Tazzie
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Hi Cus. :)
Good work anyway.
Sandy
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Ta muchly, Sandy, they do indeed belong :)
It was their 2nd attempt at having a son called Charles. He married Caroline Faulkener c.1840 in Deenthorpe i imagine, as that's where Caroline comes from and their first child was born there in '41.
The family were very smitten with the name Charles it would seem, so maybe it's John Thomas sen's father's name. However, the IGI has litttle to say on the matter. Spookily, it wasn't always lucky to be the 1st Charles born!
John Thos & Sarah, among other kids had:
Charles 1st chr.10 Dec 1817 Nassington NTH
he dies 24 Jan 1818 [date courtesy of the IGI]; no burial date.
Charles 2nd [above] chr.4 Jun 1819 - lives on!
John Thos & Sarah's son, Thomas, a teacher & surveyor, marr. Sarah Flint and amongst other kids, they had:
Charles Edward 1st b 4 Oct 1852 March CAM
he dies 1 Jun 1853, bur 4th in March CAM
Charles Edward 2nd b.23 Dec 1853 March CAM lives on!
understandably, not all the sons named a kid Charles!
Thanks for your help, Sandy, it's much appreciated :)
le durachd
fionnghal
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Well here is the inscription from their gravestone.
Nassington Cemetery.
In Loving Memory of
Our Dear Mother
Caroline Stokes
Born Dec 29th 1822
Died Mar 15th 1895
Also Our Dear Father
Charles Stokes
Born May 25th 1819
Died Dec 13th 1905
UNTIL THE DAY BREAK AND THE SHADOWS FLEE AWAY
Sandy
Time for bed.
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Nice one, Sandy, thank you. Is that a Nassington Cemetery cd you're working from? if so, maybe it'd be worth me buying it to get my other Stokes folks. I suspect they all belong to the one family.
Night night :)
fionnghal
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Morning
Is that a Nassington Cemetery cd you're working from?
No it was not a cd just one of the places I have taken photographs off and Caroline and Charles were the only one photograph that I could see named Stokes.
Sandy
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ok, well, thanks for sharing it :)
I think i might have found my John Thomas's birth in Collyweston :) not a Charles as i suspected, but a Samuel Stokes & Elzth Baker. They also had a son, Charles. There is also another double Charles event amongst siblings. Spookeee!
Having discovered that my John T came from Collyweston, i sought all the Stokes of C/w that i could find in the 1841 and cross-checked them against the IGIs. Someone has been very busy in that area, though, being Memb subs, and variable at that, I'd need to go back to the film if i can find a way of doing it. Our LDS office up here, is tiny, part time, and never occupied so i can never get anyone to answer the phone to arrange an appointment and the ordering of film! frustrating that!
Thanks again
le durachd
fionnghal
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Hi again
I will willingly send you the photograph if you would like it. :)
Sandy
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brilliant, thank you very much, i'd love a copy :)
le durachd
fionnghal
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Will have to post on the Northamptonshire Board as you can not post photographs here.
Sandy
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i could send you my address by PM - might take me a minute to remind myself of how, of course :D. would that do it?
le durachd
fionnghal
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Hi
I have put it here for you. :)
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,298823.0.html
Sandy
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Hi Fionnghal
I'm sure we've been in touch before about some of our Appleyard/Tyas roots, but I just found this post...
I came across a small portion of 'tree scribbled on the back of an envelope - and I can't remember what the source was, which was why I was searching the net...anyway, it has the following:
John Thomas Stokes (son of Samuel Stokes of Collyweston & Elizabeth Baker (m 2 Jul 1775 Collyweston)) m Sarah Dolby Handson (dau of James Handson & Mary Dolby of Wood Newton).
The tree also mentions their son Edward as it mentions his marriage to Elizabeth Gray and their son Henry Gray Stokes (b 8 Oct 1849 in Bridlington) and living in Austin, Texas in 1870 with his brother John Thomas Stokes.
I guess this may assist your theory about Sarah's origins. Do give me a shout if you find anything, and I will try and see where the hell I dredged this info from!!
Also, while I'm here, I visited Northants last June looking for graves (I seem to remember Nassington churchyard was almost stripped bare...) but I do have a few gravestone photos of Stokes from Collyweston (and also a couple of Appleyards from Conisbrough) - let me know if you're interested!
Cheers
Dave M
(4G Grandson of Mr Stokes the Butcher)
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Dave 'Morris', isn't it. :-) nice to hear from you and yes i believe we have been in contact before ... some time ago now.
I would like to discuss where we are with the tree with you, but if you don;'t mind, may i postpone that a bit? My sister has just died, and i'm just not in the right frame f mind, so am spending most of my time in the garden or greenhouse. plants can be very therapeutic. I'll flag your message and get back to you in a couple of weeks.
I'd an e-mail from Donald Welbourn recently and i recall him saying you'd been in communication at some point. he says he's well but growing very forgetful. I know the feeling .. Age.. it never comes alone, does it.
thanks for getting in touch
talk to you again soon
le durachd
fionnghal
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hi Dave,
Long time no write. apologies for the lack of contact I haven't forgotten our shared Appleyards & Stokes and i haven't fallen off the planet either; it just seems like that sometimes. My sister died and when I'd finally picked myself up, my mum was on a downward spiral so I'm getting little time for my research. however, i will get back to it and will get in touch. I've heard from another Stokes researcher, Barry [bcundell1]. You heard of him? He wrote today today via the ancestry boards [boards.ancestry.com/]. If he sends me his e-mail address, I'll send it on to you direct. think i have your personal e-address somewhere from yonks back.
hope you are well and your research progressing in the right direction,
le durachd
Fionnghal :)