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General => Armed Forces => World War One => Topic started by: Mair on Wednesday 11 June 08 03:37 BST (UK)

Title: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Mair on Wednesday 11 June 08 03:37 BST (UK)
Listers

As per my local paper last Friday 6th June 08.....

A guy in Kirkby Lonsdale, Cumbria has found a brass plaque memorial, in a scrap yard, to the following soldiers of "this church" and now only the small task of finding the said church.  Here follows the memorial inscription as reported:-

To the Glory of God and in loving memory of the men of this church who gave their lives  in the Great War 1914-1919

THOMAS BLEZARD
ALAN DAVIES
F CYRIL FOTHERGILL
FRANK VALENTINE HARRISON
WILLIAM H LEES
THOMAS LITTLEMORE
WILLIAM RICHARD NOBLE
NORMAN WHALLEY


Personally i have no connection with the above....... only the presumed location of the memorial's intended home - a church/chapel in Blackpool or on/along the Fylde Coast.  How these men have been linked to the area I have no idea EXCEPT one glimpse on the CWWG site of an addy in what is now central Blackpool - "Grasmere Road". (Richard Noble's wife's address is 142 Grasmere Road"  )There are two "chapels" that would have been around the area at the time of WW1 - The Primitive Methodist Hall (1908) that is now attached to the Congregational Church on the corner of Lune Grove and Grasmere Road.

The War Memorials Trust is said to have traced the possible "home" of the plaque to the South Shore area of Blackpool.

Now listers I am no expert on the subject matter here - WW1 memorials - but I know you are!  Can you help me find a home for this forlorn brass plaque.

I am playing safe with regard to copyright; I will happily e mail a scan of the article for personal use (which I can not find on the internet so I have to assume copyright is held with the publication! ) to any interested party who can assist me and, unbeknown to them, the local paper!


Many thanks

Mair
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: km1971 on Wednesday 11 June 08 06:25 BST (UK)
According to CWGC 443577 Private Thomas Blezard of the CIF – British Columbia Regiment – was the son of Mrs Ruth Blezard of 3 Garden Terrace, South Shore, Blackpool. So I think you have the right area.

Frank Valentine Harrison was Private, later Lt, of the Manchester Regiment. But he is not listed on the CWGC site.

Ken
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Wendi on Wednesday 11 June 08 09:11 BST (UK)
There is a MIC for one Norman Whalley, 3237 and 241104 Royal Lancs Regiment, but I can not locate him on CWGC  :-\

Wendi  :)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Kevwood on Wednesday 11 June 08 10:35 BST (UK)
There is a FREDERICK Cyril Fothergill born 1898 Newport.

Just looking for any more info on him.


Kev.
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Kevwood on Wednesday 11 June 08 11:03 BST (UK)
Think maybe:

Frank Valentine Harrison, son of William Walpole Harrison  and Anne Rainer Valentine, living 78 bridge street Worksop in 1901

Born 1890 Boston, Lincs

Service Record on Ancestry, there is another Frank Valentine Harrison born Salford.

But the first one did die during wwI

Kev.
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: forester on Wednesday 11 June 08 21:11 BST (UK)
There are MICs for three Thomas Littlemores; Royal Eng, Cheshire/Norfolk Reg and RFA.

There is only one T. Littlemore on the CWGC, Thomas, a Corporal in the Australian MGC.
I haven't checked the Australian service records yet to see if he has English connections.

Phil
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: forester on Wednesday 11 June 08 21:30 BST (UK)
In brief, Thomas Littlemore, Cpl 2601, 2nd Coy Machine Gun Corps AIF, was born in Norley, Cheshire.
He enlisted in Melbourne, June 1915 and died 3rd Nov 1916.

http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=1455804

http://www.awm.gov.au/roh/person.asp?p=145-32517

His next of kin on his Attestation Paper is; E Littlemore, Station Road, Blackpool.

Phil
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: sallylynne on Wednesday 11 June 08 23:09 BST (UK)
There are three Frank Valentine Harrison's in the 1901 census !
1. born 1894 in Manchester to Charles V. Harrison
There is a medal card reg # 6996 for Lieut. Frank Valentine Harrison manchester Reg.
2. born 1889 in Hull Yorkshire
3. born 1890 Boston Lincolnshire
 Corpl. Frank Valentine Harrison reg # 17899  born c. 1890  Boston Lincolnshire
His WW 1 Service record shows he enlisted at Manchester in the Royal Scots Edinburgh Battalion Sep 26 1914. He was killed in Action 1/7/1916
Father - William Walpole  Harrison 10 Fir Grove Levenshulme, Manchester.
His religion is listed as Wesly, if that makes a difference.
His father is listed in the 1901 census in Worksop Nottinghamshire a shopkeeper. The children are listed as being born at various places, Frank V at Boston.
In 1891 he was at Wheatley Yorkshire.
Don't know if this helps.
Sallylynne
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: mmm45 on Wednesday 11 June 08 23:18 BST (UK)
Norman Whalley is 241104 Pte 2/5th  Kings Own Royal Lancasters KIA 26/10/17
Enlisted Blackpool.(Source SDGW) same lad as Wendi

**Whelley on CWGC**** ;)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: mmm45 on Thursday 12 June 08 00:14 BST (UK)
Alan Davies is Probably
Alan Cunliffe Davies 33988 Royal Lancaster Regiment 28002 LNL Regiment Died of Wounds 3/8/17 Enlisted Blackpool Resident Broughton (SDGW)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: mmm45 on Thursday 12 June 08 00:43 BST (UK)
William Richard Noble
Born Leeds Enlisted BLACKPOOL
8th Royal Lancasters
Pte 32638 Died Of Wounds 5/4/18

SDGW
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: mmm45 on Thursday 12 June 08 00:47 BST (UK)
Fothergill....Frederick Cyril
DVR 701549
Royal Horse or Field Artillery(TF)
Born and Enlisted BLACKPOOL
Died of Wounds 18/10/17

SDGW
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: liverpool annie on Thursday 12 June 08 00:50 BST (UK)


I found a Thomas Blezard who was also in Royal Lancaster Regiment ( maybe that's the key !!)  but no address I'm afraid  :-\

In Memory of
Private Thomas Blezard
200627 1st/4th Bn., King's Own (Royal Lancaster Regiment)
who died on 8 August 1916
Remembered with honour
Thiepval Memorial

Medal card of Blezard Thomas

Royal Lancaster Regiment 2765 Private
Royal Lancaster Regiment 200627 Private

Date 1914-1920

Edit ...... Well that blew that theory  mmm45 !!!!!!!!!!  ::)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: liverpool annie on Thursday 12 June 08 01:02 BST (UK)


They have been doing Church alterations here .... maybe it was thrown out by mistake !!  :-\

http://www.htss.org.uk/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogsection&id=7&Itemid=34
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: AMBLY on Thursday 12 June 08 01:09 BST (UK)
These are on  CWGC:

Frank Valentine HARRISON
18th Batt Royal Scots
died 1 Juk 1916 age 26 (b 1890)
Son of Mr. W. W. and Mrs. A. R. Harrison, of 10, Fir Grove, Levenshulme, Manchester.
(same one Sallylynne, and Kev both posted up  ;D)
 
William Henry LEES
9th Batt Cheshire Reg
died 25 Jun 1919 age 30 (1889)
Son of William Henry and Emma Lees, of 76, Enbridge St., Salford, Manchester

Cheers
AMBLY
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: mmm45 on Thursday 12 June 08 01:18 BST (UK)
http://www.cwgc.org/search/casualty_details.aspx?casualty=876707

Found Norman Whalley on CWGC as Whelley so possible scanning error ....maybe need more proof before they can change it(if its wrong and SDGW and memorial are wrong)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: AMBLY on Thursday 12 June 08 01:20 BST (UK)
Here is the Blackpool Gazette article on the plaque
http://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/blackpoolnews/Blackpool-war-memorial-saved-from.4157647.jp

Cheers
AMBLY
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: AMBLY on Thursday 12 June 08 02:37 BST (UK)
A lady who loves lists, compiled a list of "Blackpool Churches in 1918"
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/ENG-LAN-FYLDE/2006-05/1148830491

Wesleyan
Hounds Hill.
Circuit Superintendent Minister, Rev. W Marshman Spencer, 68, Park Road.
Caretaker, Mr.F.Bland, 2, Hull Street.

Dickson Road, North Shore
Minister, Rev.Walter Floyd, 'Claremont Lodge', 50 Sherbourne Road.
Caretaker, Mr.Smithe, 24, Hawthorn Road.

Raikes Parade.
Minister, Rev.J.T.Green, 234, Hornby Road
Caretaker, Mr.F.Jowett, Craigmoor, Bennett Avenue

Rawcliffe Street. South Shore
Minister, Rev.Frederick A Speight, 50, Alexandra Road.
Caretaker, Mr.G.Wright, 16, Moore Street.

Highfield Avenue Mission, off Lytham Road, South Shore
Caretaker, Mr.Hawkins, 35 Highfield Road, South Shore.

Primitive Methodists
Chapel Street.
Superintendent Minister, Rev.David Oakley, 51 Park Avenue.
Caretaker, Mr.W.Howarth, 10 Wellington Road, South Shore.

Central Road
Minister, Rev.J.Swales.

Salem, Westcliffe Drive, Layton.
Supplies under the Rev.David Oakley.

Ebenezer, Egerton Road, North Shore
Supplies under the Rev.David Oakley.

Roman Catholic Churches
Church of The Sacred Heart, Talbot Road.
Priests: Rev. Fathers Moss, Huson, and Riley
The Presbytery, 40, Talbot Road.

St.Cuthbert's, Lytham Road, South Shore.
Priests, Rev.Fathers Lupton and Adamson. Presbytery, Crystal Road, South
Shore.

St.Kentigern's, Newton Drive.
Priests, Rev.Fathers Blundell and Walsh, Newton Drive.

Hmm, which looks like it came from here:
http://newsarch.rootsweb.com/th/read/LANCSGEN/2000-03/0952645676
Blackpool Gazette-News Year Book 1918

CHeers
AMBLY
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: sallylynne on Thursday 12 June 08 02:46 BST (UK)
Hello
since Frank Valentine Harrison's religion is listed on his service record as a "Wesly"
the Weslyan churches might be a good place to start.
Sallylynne
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Mair on Thursday 12 June 08 15:36 BST (UK)
Hi

Wow it apparently took 12 months for the finder of this plaque, to track everyone down to the Blackpool area - you guys - 3 days  ;D

The Primitive Methodist Church is no longer with us and is next to the Congregational church on Grasmere Road.  Howwever, Trinity - the one Annie found - is C of E and I am tending toward the two non conformist chapels really.

We have the lads enlisting in Blackpool, one living in Blackpool one next of kin living in Blackpool, near to each other and one living nearer to Preston.

As the two next of kin are at Grasmere road and Station Road it has to be the churches around that area - Primitive, Congrational or Cof E.

Thank you so much for helping to narrow down the area of search.

Mair
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: forester on Thursday 12 June 08 23:13 BST (UK)
A bit more on Thomas Littlemore.............

He was a Methodist.

His next of kin was his mother, Mrs Ellen L Littlemore. At the time of his death her address had reverted to where they were living in 1901: Green Bank, Kingsley, near Frodsham, Cheshire.

Phil  :)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Conductor Mike on Friday 13 June 08 22:37 BST (UK)
Hi to all the Roots Chatters.  Mike Coyle here - I raised the lost memorial with the Gazette.  Just to say how fantastic you all are.  I've made more progress on this in the last 2 days than in now almost 2 years. Just brilliant. Thanks so much.

I hope to be able to restore it to a church willing to foster the memorial in the not too distant future so. Watch this space and I'll keep you posted.  If you have other info, photo's etc, my email address is mike.coyle(at)btinternet.com -(left the '@' symbol out to discourage spam)

Thanks again and happy to receive anything relating to this memorial.  Mike
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: liverpool annie on Friday 13 June 08 22:52 BST (UK)


Hi Mike and welcome to RootsChat !!  :D :D

Nice to see you and thank you for joining us !! .....

Where are you up to so far ? .... what direction would you like us to do in ?

or do you know ??   ::)

Annie  :)
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Conductor Mike on Friday 13 June 08 23:02 BST (UK)
Thanks Annie. Myplan is to find a sympathetic 'Wesleyan church close to Rawcliffe St. - the nearest athe moment I think is Raikes Parade. I'll be talking to them in the next couple of days, to try and fix something up for either Veterans Day or November 11.

It would be good to get some of the families involved and I have a couple of leads from the Gazette article. So... fingers crossed.  Thanks for getting in touch. and Watch this space.  Mike
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Conductor Mike on Saturday 14 June 08 17:32 BST (UK)
Further to my last.  I've discovered that Holy Trinity, Blackpool were given 4 stained glass windows from the Rawcliffe St Wesleyan Methodist Church when it was being demolished in 1972. Holy Trinity is in the next street to Rawcliffe St. So I will be talking to the Parish Priest about restoring it there.

Thanks for interest. Mike
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: liverpool annie on Saturday 14 June 08 17:35 BST (UK)


Fingers crossed Mike !  :D

They've been doing a lot of renovations .... that would be wonderful if they could fit it in !!  :D

I'm watching this space !!

Annie  :D

PS ........ and I'd like to just say that we've seen with great sadness - memorials in the form of brass plaques for sale on ebay - it's sad when they come on the open market .... memorials are not articles that should be sold in my opinion ..... I'm just glad this one is in safe hands !!
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Conductor Mike on Saturday 14 June 08 20:03 BST (UK)
Thanks Annie. my sentiments entirely.  I'm a volunteer with the War Memorials Trust, so if you see any more please let me know. I've included a picture of the 'Scrapyard' memorial.  Mike
Title: Re: Memorial Mystery
Post by: Mair on Saturday 19 July 08 20:59 BST (UK)
Hi

So that everyone is up to date follow the link from 9th July - sorry went on the old hols for the last 2 weeks - just playing catch up!

Thought you may like to know from a local at least !

Mair

http://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/blackpoolnews/Lost-heroes-tribute-comes-home.4266817.jp