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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Inverness => Topic started by: Nigel1959 on Wednesday 14 April 04 19:43 BST (UK)
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ANYBODY WITH INFO ON A FLORA AND ANGUS MACDONALD OR MCDONALD WHO HAD A DAUGHTER MORAG FROM AROUND THE MID TO LATE 1800s
ANGUS WAS A FISHERMAN AND OPERATED A FERRY--------BUT CANT FIND ANY INFO ON ANY RECORDS
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Hi Nigel,
What information do you already have ???
Rootschat :)
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Thankyou
All i have is Morag ( Marion ) Mcdonald marries my great grandad David Barclay in Glasgow around 1896 and her parents are listed as Angus and Flora, and i think Flora's maiden name was mcdonald as well. I know they came from the Ilse of Skye as my grandad used to holyday there. I think Angus was a fisherman amongst other things, and the mcdonald gets spelt macdonald aswell----Morag/Marion died of TB around 1908----thats all i am afraid, tried to get back further and hit a brick wall
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No good then Rootschat. ???????????????/
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Nigel have you tried searching on the Scotlandspeople website . :D lostribe
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Is that the one where you pay £6.00 ??? If it is , yes i have, and couldnt get any further back than what i have posted.
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Nigel, There is a fee of 6.00 on the site, I also have Macdonalds but on North Uist . Have you tried Family search site records held by the Morman church .Its free to search. Regards Dave and Teresa :)
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Thanks Dave + Teresa
From the family memory, our Macdonalds/Mcdonalds came from the Isle Of Skye and are supposed to have run a ferry at one time aswell, i know there was a crofters cottage there as my GG Grandad used to visit it on holiday but i cant find any trace of Angus/Flora anywhere at that time
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Hi - just a couple of thoughts and you may have already looked if you have tried Scotlandspeople , but ...
Have you tried to look for death certificates in that location. They may really be common names so it may cost a bit to look through Scotlandspeople. You can try and limit the dates by whether your Grandfather knew his grandparents or how old he was when he used to holiday there.
They would be statutory certificates which would have their parents names if known at the time.
The other option is to go sideways - were there any siblings - you can use their marriage and death certificates to go back as they tend to state whether the parent is deceased or alive.
A third option is can you find them on the 1881, 1891, 1901 census indices by name (or address if you know where Morag died or got married). This would also have place of birth.
You may have already tried these but thought I would suggest anyway.
Jenny
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Thanks Jenny
My GG Grandmother was down as Marion when she married, but then at birth we found her as Morag, Her parents listed as Angus And Flora disappear when back to Skye, no trace in those names, yet they show up on my GG Grandmothers birth and wedding. I know they came from Skye because of the family stories but i cant find anything more than what i put here and above.
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Hi Nigel
Having just returned from a trip to Skye I can tell you that there are LOTS and LOTS of MacDonalds there !
The famous Flora MacDonald (who saved Bonnie Prince Charlie in 1746) lived there and married another MacDonald (Allen) and had 7 children.....the MacDonald Clan have a centre there - just outside Portree....and Lord and Lady (Claire) MacDonald...run a guest house...
at : Kinloch Lodge, Sleat, Isle of Skye, IV43 8QY
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Yes Kathy i have been, great when the sun is shining but a pig of a place when its not which is 364 days of the year, i am on the west of Ireland which has similar weather and i am still not used to it, but i have no more info on my Mcdonalds either
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what year and where was your Morag/Marion born? Would she have been a young girl at the time of the 1881 census? That would be your easiest route. At least it would give the birth place of her parents for definite.
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Hi Debbie
Thanks for your help------ Morag died Barclay in 1908, so she must have been born around 1880 to Angus and Flora who i had down as both being mcdonald or macdonald
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so she would have been included in the 1881 census. As you can imagine, there are tons of Mary/Mary Ann/Marion MacDonalds in the 1881 census. No Morag's however.
You mention that at birth she was Morag, so you must have the christening or the birth certificate? Where was she born? That may narrow down the areas for the 1881 census.
What about the 1891 census, and the 1901 census have you found Marion there yet?
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I will have another look at my stuff as it's been over 12 months since i last looked for this side of my family as no more leads.
From memory she was born Morag but married Marion and known as Marion to my mother who was told of her, she died of TB.
But it's her parents who i cant trace.
Her father was a Fisherman and operated a ferry i am sure on sky as my grandad always told the story of holidays there and the cottage which had no chimney just a hole in the thatch-this was a very big memory to him as the Barclay side of the family was extremely wealthy at this time
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There is a family on the LGS site -
Angus Mc Donald born 1853 North Uist
married c. 1880 - North Uist to Flora (born 1857 North Uist)
children
Isabella - 1881
Catherine 1882
Donald 1885
Janie 1888
Rachel 1889
No Marion/Morag though !
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Yep i think i had found that as well but thats the outer Hebrides not Skye or around Skye and because there is no Morag i dismissed it as being not the one, infact i think i looked for an Angus and Flora elswhere and still no good.
Also at the time of her wedding i did see her parents address as different but couldnt make it out, it didnt say Skye though something else
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I think you should check it out again !
There is a ferry from Lochmaddy (North Uist) across to Uig on Skye.......
the original 'famous' Flora Macdonald was (according to some sources) born in Benbecular......then lived on Skye later !
Also - when I searched for Morag - it brought up Sarah -
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So i can understand that me stupidly thinking that the ferry would go from Skye to the mainland, i never thought for one minute that a ferry would go any where else, but how does Marion who was really Morag suddenly become Sarah------Also you could have something here because my mom told me that there was something about the original Flora Macdonald but i just thought that was all fairy tale stuff
Thanks again
Nigel
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I always think that if you turn over enough stones, eventually you will find something under one of them!
If you go onto the LDS 'familysearch' website and in the search enter MORAG....it just brings up loads of Sarah's....... I don't know why - perhaps there is a connection ??
Another thing - I found a family tree for THE Flora MacDonald and there are both Angus' and Marion's in her family - YES! I know they are probably very popular Scottish names !
http://www.genealogy.com/famousfolks/floram/
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Ok Kathy certainly something to think about but where is the connection to your Angus and Flora to my Morag/Marion/Sarah when they dont have a kid of that name, and also in Flora Macdonalds tree there is no link to an Angus or Flora from her offspring.
I have phoned my mom who is out but will call me back later tonite to see if she can remember anything to help
Thanks
Nigel
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I have no idea Nigel !
I am just thowing out ideas - in the hope that something might trigger off an idea from some-one else -
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Hi there. i found something on the 1881 census for skye that may be of interest. :-\
here is a family that list 2 daughters by the name of marrion - either, there was an error of the name being recorded or in fact the 2nd marrion (aged 2 here) must have been a grand daughter or similar....
i have also added some info from the igi.
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i hope this might be the family you are looking for.
kind regards,
Lorna.
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Thanks Lorna thats very interesting i will check it out WHEN my mom gets back to me as she has all my Mcdonald stuff and has had for nearly 12 months even though she is sending it back to me every other week and was phoning me back on Sunday------is it any wonder tracing your family tree is so difficult, she never forgets the bingo i can tell you.
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Hi
We have just returned from a visit to Skye and there is a Museum called Clan Donald Centre who have info on the MacDonald's of Skye. Don't know if they have a website but maybe some else could help. We then visited Kilmore Cemetery at their suggestion.
I think there are several different families of MacDonald on the Island.
Hope this is of some assistance
Janette
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Thanks Janette i will check it out :)
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here is a family that list 2 daughters by the name of marrion - either, there was an error of the name being recorded or in fact the 2nd marrion (aged 2 here) must have been a grand daughter or similar....
Actually it was quite common for there to be 2 siblings with the same name.
At this time in Scotland there was a naming pattern that was followed quite strictly.
I got this from another site online, but I don't recall the source:
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TRADITIONAL NAMING PATTERNS IN SCOTLAND
These naming patterns are not iron clad, but were used extensively. We have found the patterns to be extremely useful in identifying possible family groups. Later research is then used to verify these family groups, such as Old Parish Records and census. By the latter part of the 1800's however, people were beginning to expand a little on the naming of their children. That gave far more variety; but then for us genealogists perhaps it was a step they should not have taken.
Daughters
1. Firstborn daughter - named after her maternal grandmother (her mother's mother)
• Variation - named after her paternal grandmother (her father's mother)
2. Secondborn daughter - named after her paternal grandmother (her father's mother)
• Variation - named after her maternal grandmother (her mother's mother)
3. Thirdborn daughter - named after her mother
4. Fourthborn daughter - named after her mother's oldest sister
• Variation - named after her maternal great grandmother (her mother's maternal grandmother)
5. Fifthborn daughter - named after her father's oldest sister
• Variation - named after her paternal great grandmother (her father's maternal grandmother)
Sons
1. Firstborn son - named after his paternal grandfather (his father's father)
• Variation - named after his maternal grandfather (his mother's father)
2. Secondborn son - named after his maternal grandfather (his mother's father)
• Variation - named after his paternal grandfather (his father's father)
3. Thirdborn son - named after his father
4. Fourthborn son - named after his father's oldest brother
• Variation - named after his paternal great grandfather (his father's paternal grandfather)
5. Fifthborn son - named after his mother's oldest brother
• Variation - named after his maternal great grandfather )his mother's paternal grandfather)
USE OF MIDDLE NAMES
One of the more perplexing questions we found was "Where did these middle names come from that sounded like surnames?"
Here are some of the tips we have found:
1. It was customary to name at least one child's middle name after the surname of the local parish minister who christianed that child. For example, in our Meikle family, we had a James Dewar Meikle. For years we looked for a familial connection to the Dewar family to no avail. Then we saw a tip somewhere about the parish minister. Sure enough, in the baptism records for James Dewar Meikle, the parish minister was Hugh Dewar.
2. It was also customary to name a child's middle name after the surname of the person for whom they are named. For instance, Agnes Templeton Meikle was the thirdborn daughter of George Meikle and Agnes Forrest Templeton. Hence, the name Agnes since she was thirdborn, and the middle name of Templeton, denoting her mother's maiden name.
3. It was also common to give sons and daughters a middle name denoting the maiden surname of the mother. This is helpful when trying to identify the maiden surname of the mother.
4. If a child died during the parent's childbearing years, it was VERY common to use that name again. Thus, if Elizabeth Wilson was born on 1 Jan 1800 and died 3 Feb 1803, the next daughter born was given the name of Elizabeth. That makes it difficult to follow the naming patterns.
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I had this experience in tracing one of my ancestor's family's where there was actually 3 ``Malcolm``s born! :
- the first son was named Malcolm (Father's father) - he died at 3 months of age
- the next son born was named Malcolm, again (Father's father had to be followed)
- the following son (2nd) was named after the mother's father
- the next son (3rd) was named after his father
- the next son (4th) must have been named after the father's oldest brother (again, Malcolm) to become the 3rd Malcolm born - and the 2nd living one!
I hope this helps.....
Jamie
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:)Thanks for the interesting info on names....was just browseing through...looking for MacDonalds of Morar and found this little gem
Ciao
Heather
Im new at this and all thumbs...can't get me smilies working!!!
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Hi,
On doing research for Christina MacDonald who married John McNeil I have found a lot of MacDonalds or MacQuien would like to know what is the connection between these two names I think my family came from Waternish by what my Mum tells me ,I find a Christian MacQuien married to John MacNeil in Camuslusta in the cencus could she be a MacDonald?
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From Annie Mac
I am supposedly a direct descendant of Flora Macdonald. We have the clan chief living close by. Donald Macdonald.
My father Gordon Macdonald who passed away recently helped establish thesuccessor.
The clan donald reunion has, or is about to happen at Kilimuir.
The females and males were often given the mother's maiden name as a middle name. Morag is Gaelic for Sarah.
Keep in touch
annie mac