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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Oxfordshire => Topic started by: lisauk on Thursday 03 February 05 21:54 GMT (UK)

Title: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Thursday 03 February 05 21:54 GMT (UK)
Can anyone help no matter how small the information.

I am looking for the birth palce and the parents of James Alexander Breakspeare or Breakspear.

James married Selina Bridgwater in 1902 Oxford and was born around 1871.

I have found a record online which states his name as Alexander James Breakspeare for his marriage but I am unsure as I thought he name was james but I do know that this is definately my relation that married Selina Bridgwater in 1902.

Any information would be a great help, my breakspear's may have been travellers.....

Cheers Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Thursday 03 February 05 22:20 GMT (UK)
Oh, dear - not a lot of help, I'm afraid.

The only reference I can find so far is this:

Living 55 Nelson Street, Oxford St Thomas
 
 Ann Breakspeare born c. 1842  Stanton Harcourt,  Oxfordshire, England Unmarried, Housekeeper  Oxford St Thomas

 James Breakspeare born c. 1868  Hardwick, Oxfordshire, England Son, Oxford St Thomas 
 
 John French born c.a 1834  Heyford, Oxfordshire, England Head, Carpenter  Oxford St Thomas

Ann's relationship to John French is given as Housekeeper
and John Breakspeare's relationship to him is given as unknown.

Although Ann's birth year is given s 1842 it is very difficult to read on image - she may be younger.

I can't find them in 1871

Tricia :'(   
 
 
 


Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Thursday 03 February 05 22:24 GMT (UK)
If you send for the marriage cert it should give his father's name (or not if he was illegitimate). And, he probably called himself by his middle name -lots did.

Tricia
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: suttontrust on Thursday 03 February 05 22:27 GMT (UK)
Lisa, I can't answer your question but we may be of use to each other in the future.  I'm researching the tree of a friend who has cousins called Breakspeare.  We don't know the connection yet, she's waiting for information from her brother, but it's likely that a Breakspeare married a Scott early in the 20th century.  If you recognise that, PM me.
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Thursday 03 February 05 22:28 GMT (UK)
Update - have found him on 1871;-
 
 James Breakspear 3  Hardwick, Oxfordshire, England    Stanton Harcourt  Oxfordshire
   
 Hannah Clack 69  Stanton Harcourt Wife  Stanton Harcourt  Oxfordshire
 
 James Clack 70  Stanton Harcourt Head  Agric lab  Stanton Harcourt  Oxfordshire   

Sod's law........ Doesn't give an address and doesn't state relationship, if any, of James to these people!!!

Tricia
 

 
 
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Thursday 03 February 05 22:43 GMT (UK)
The mystery deepens - you'll wish you never asked.

1871; one possibility for mum??
 Ann E Breakspear 20  Oxfordshire, England Daughter Needlewoman  St Aldate  Oxfordshire
 
 Lydia Breakspear 11  Wellington St, London, England Daughter  St Aldate  Oxfordshire
   
 William Breakspear 44  St Peter Bailey, Oxfordshire, England Head  Plasterer  St Aldate  Oxfordshire   
 

 
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Thursday 03 February 05 22:56 GMT (UK)
I think you should send for marriage cert to verify his occup and father's name and possibly his name.
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Friday 04 February 05 08:28 GMT (UK)
Thank you for everyones input very much appriciated.

I have also found a James Breakspear, Born 1871 on the 1891 census he was 20 which would be the right age and he is a soldier.

Would this mans military record tell me anything and where could i get it from?

Please keep looking for me it is all very interesting.

Suttontrust i dont know of any scott as yet but i will let you know if i come across one.

Finding James parents is turning out to be a problem.

Cheers Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Friday 04 February 05 09:01 GMT (UK)
There is also a James Breakspeare on the 1901 census aged 40 married to a different person. Now, it can only be this chap if the 1st wife died and he re-married within 2 years. Perfectly feasible especially if all these ages are being recorded incorrectly.

 That's why it is important to send for his marriage cert with Selina - it should have a wealth of inform and should state if he was a batchelor or widower. If it is the soldier boy it may say this on the cert.(I can't see this soldier boy on 1901) but he may be the same person as the chap  on 1871 and 1891.

 Witnesses on certs can be important as well.It is also the only piece of concrete evidence that you have. This is not an easy search and I think everything hinges on sending for it. What do you think?? ??? If he has a named father we need to search again. Until then it is only guesswork.

Tricia
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Friday 04 February 05 09:10 GMT (UK)

1901 chap - but living in Lancashire
 
 Ellen breakspear 38  Lincolnshire, England Wife  Litherland  Lancashire   
 James breakspear  40  Oxfordshire, England Head  Litherland  Lancashire

No address recorded. His occupation is a labourer preceded by a word I can't decipher

Tricia 
 
 
 
 
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Friday 04 February 05 09:22 GMT (UK)
Send for it under Selina's name in case there is a problem with his first name.

It may be quicker at the moment to apply direct to Oxford enclosing a self addressed stamped envelope, a cheque for £7 payable to Superintendant Registrar and the marriage request.
Or you could give them a ring first to check they are willing to provide it. They don't need the reference numbers - this is just for the GRO Office in Southport.(which is unindated with requests at the moment.
 
Bridgwater, Selina 
Quarter ending June 1902
 Oxford   
Volume:    3a
Page: 1555

Register Office
Tidmarsh Lane, Oxford, OX1 1NS.
Tel: 0845 129 5900.

Sorry if you know all this ;D ;D

Tricia
 
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Friday 04 February 05 16:35 GMT (UK)
Can I order the certifcate online somewhere?

James had children from the years 1902 - 1920 as far as I know they were all with Selina.

I will order the marriage certificate as it is the only thing to do next.

Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Friday 04 February 05 17:11 GMT (UK)
You can order it on line at www.1837online.com but as I said it will get a couple of weeks or longer as they are so busy.

It's up to you ;)

Tricia
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Friday 04 February 05 17:14 GMT (UK)
I may go to Oxford Records Office tomorrow can I order one there?

Can you view the information on the certificate at Oxford records Office?

Will i find out his fathers names etc from the Oxford records Office?
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Friday 04 February 05 19:12 GMT (UK)
Don't think they let you view certificates - you have to purchase for £7 - no cheap way round this, I'm afraid.
You can only get his name from birth/marriage cert.

Tricia
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Sunday 06 February 05 14:23 GMT (UK)
I was not worried about paying the money it was just the time it takes to get the certificate that i was concerned about.

Cheers Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Sunday 06 February 05 15:18 GMT (UK)
Sorry, didn't mean it like that. :-\

Good luck :D

Tricia
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Sunday 06 February 05 15:22 GMT (UK)
Sorry i did not mean it like that either, did not want people to think i was tight thats all :-)
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Monday 07 February 05 12:25 GMT (UK)
I have been ringing 0845 129 5900 and press 5 for certificates for the last 25 mins but an answerphone keeps answers saying there is noone available to take your call at the moment and you can not leave a message.

The first time I rang someone answered but the answer phone cut in and they put the phone down, what is going on at the Oxford Registry Office???

How annoying.
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Monday 07 February 05 13:44 GMT (UK)
Don't give up now - wait til after 2pm - probably a bit like Post Offices and Banks - they all go to lunch at the same time.

Everyone has been researching over the weekend,I expect. Hang in there - you're to close to quit

Tricia :-[
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Monday 07 February 05 15:15 GMT (UK)
I just got through to the Oxford Registy Office but they can not help me until I know which church the marriage took place in, does anyone have copies of the registers or know how I can find this information out?

Cheers Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: 'Tricia on Monday 07 February 05 15:36 GMT (UK)
Have sent you a message
Tricia
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Friday 11 February 05 18:39 GMT (UK)
I have found my gt gt gran on the www.1837online.co.uk website but I am unable to find her birth.

Her death is registered as Annie Breakspear, Headington 1892 age 52, I have found a Mary Ann Breakspear born Chipping Norton in 1839 but I am unsure if this could be her.

Could anyone take a look on the 1841, 1851 and 1861 census’s for me and see if you can find the Mary Ann Breakspear and may be she will have a connection to Hardwick, Stanton Harcourt or even the Clack family.

Cheers Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Friday 11 February 05 18:53 GMT (UK)
Guess I jumped in to quickly with Mary Ann I have found my gt gt gran on the 1838 page on www.1837online.co.uk

She was born in Jul-Aug-Sep 1838.

Registered as Ann Breakspear, Witney
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: DebbieG on Friday 11 February 05 19:53 GMT (UK)
So this would tie in with the 13 yr old found in the 1851 census


From 1851 census
172 - Stanton Harcourt
Rebecca Breakspear H W 45 Frock Maker NK
Ann Breakspear d 13 Frock Maker SH
Eliza D 6 SH


did some digging on Rebecca

Marriage from Southleigh Oxfordshire
1822 5th February Thomas Breakspear = Rebecca Ayres

Registers for Hanborough Oxfordshire

baptisms
1828 Jan 27 Ann d/o Thomas & Rebecca Breakspear lab
1829 Mar 12th Ann d/o Thomas & Rebecca Breakspear lab
1832 Mar 25th Elizabeth d/o Thomas & Rebecca lab

burials
1828 Jul 6 Ann Breakspear aged 6m
1834 Jun 6th Thomas Breakspeare aged 30

marriage 1835 September 8th - Handborough Oxfordshire
William Stockford bach = Rebecca Breakspear widow

This is the only Rebecca Breakspear I can find in the area at the time - the plot thickens!!

Debbie
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: lisauk on Wednesday 16 February 05 17:35 GMT (UK)
I would like to find out more information about the Soldier James Breakspear who was 20 he was in the 1st Battalion Oxfordshire Light Infantry, Alverstoke, Hampshire on the 1891 cenus.

Can someone tell me exactly what information i need to find to get a copy of his records and where I can obtain them from.

Kind regards Lisa
Title: Re: Breakspear - Breakspeare
Post by: antykazza on Sunday 06 March 05 13:28 GMT (UK)
I have just been looking at all this information - I wondered if anyone would know the father of this Thomas Breakspear?  I have my family tree through Handborough,Eynsham, Freeland. 

I have traced my direct family back to 1760 and am trying to get back a bit further with great difficulty. In my direct line I have a few children born to an Ann Breakspear (1824) - Augustine Breakspear, James Lay Breakspear, Mary Ann Breakspear and Sarah Ann Breakspear - all out of wedlock.  Ann went on to marry a John Jarrett and have another 3 - 4 children.  Ann Breakspear's father was Richard Breakspear (1783)married to Mary Coombes.  They had 8 children between them. 

Anyone with any links to any of these people would be fantastic.  I have lots of information too on individuals, but I would love to link some of them to others family trees.

Karen Breakspear ;D