RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Staffordshire => Topic started by: angel~eyes on Sunday 05 June 11 15:14 BST (UK)
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I have been trying for sometime to locate information on the following people without much success. I have the parents John Lounds and Mary Ann Walker who were married in 1848 in Lichfield soon after their eldest son was born also John in 1849. John and Mary Ann then took young John to Willenhall where some of Johns brothers were locksmiths its then 7 years before John and Mary Ann have children again so would appreciate any info anyone has on the following children : Elizabeth b 1856, William b 1857, Benjamin b 1867 and Harry b 1870 all in Willenhall or if any other children are known to have been born to these parents I already know enough about James b 1862 and his descendents. Also moving forward any info on the following two persons would be much valued : Henry Lowndes-Taylor b 1873 and George Lowndes-Taylor b 1877 both in Willenhall and both sons of John Lounds b 1849 in Lichfield and Harriet Taylor b 1851 in Lichfield. Thank you in advance this whole family is a nightmare. M x
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From the Wolverhampton Archives site:
Elizabeth LOUNDS (20), daughter of John LOUNDS, locksmith, married George HOUGH (28, furnaceman), son of George HOUGH, carpenter, 22 Mar 1875, Heath Town, Staffs.
Henry LOWNDES (24, locksmith), son of John LOWNDES, locksmith, married Elizabeth BRYCE (22), daughter of Isaac BRYCE, collier, 16 Apr 1900, Heath Town, Staffs.
(FamilySearch has the groom's name as Harry, but the Archives site has Henry.)
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wow ty this is great I have been to Wolverhamton many times and found nothing so ty ty ty x
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FamilySearch has two baptisms in Lichfield for children of John and Mary Ann:
John - 15 Jul 1849 (St Chad)
Mary Anne - 30 May 1852 (St Michael) (possible death Jun Q 1854, Wolverhampton 6b 307)
A possible death for George (son of John and Harriet):
Deaths Sep 1899
LOWNDES George
Aged 21
Wolverhampton 6b 370
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wow ty Sarah this is brill stuff x
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Another one? William's age is iffy, but he's the only one with birthplace Willenhall...
William LOUNDES (22, locksmith), son of John LOUNDES (locksmith), married Elizabeth RICHARDS (21), daughter of Enoch RICHARDS (locksmith), 28 Aug 1882, St Anne, Willenhall.
They're possibly listed on the same page as John and family on the 1891 census, with William aged 35 and Elizabeth aged 27 - ???
William may be in Stafford Prison in 1881 and in Parkhurst in 1901... :-\
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yes William is my g g grandfather he was a norty man I think he was transported too
ah no it was my g g grandfather in prison but not son of John n Elizabeth but they defo mine ty
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William b in 1851 was son of Stephen and Jane. Stephen was John Sr's brother I have no william m to Elizabeth richards so this is new info I have a William m to Annie Richards so its getting v intersting ty
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Deaths Mar 1908
LOUNDES Ben
Aged 41
Wolverhampton 6b 439
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ty Sarah another death so young its very saddening x
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Hiya, I also have Loundes in my tree. I have been successful with all my other branches, except the Loundes bunch ::). I haven't worked on them for a while.
Maybe we are connected to the same family, I will give you what little I have to compare with your Loundes.
My grandmother was Ellen Elizabeth Loundes 1919-1969 Dudley, Staffs.
Her parents:
William Loundes b. abt. 1885 Willenhall, Locksmith. Died 1952 Dudley.
Ellen Elizabeth Darlow b. 1885 Dudley. Died 1957 Dudley.
They married in 1914 in Dudley.
The information on William Loundes came from the 1911 census, I am having difficulty finding a definate match for him prior to that. A possible in 1901 - William Lounds b. 1882 Willenhall, Locksmith, son of James & Sarah
I really need to get the marriage cert for William & Ellen to go back further.
Jool
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hi Jool, great to hear from you. I can confidently say I'm 99.9% sure we are related maybe in more ways than one. Firstly, I think you are right re Williams parentage considering dates can ba out give or take 5 years, Secondly, everyone I have found in Dudley/ Wolves/ Willenhall areas with any of the Loundes spellings as been connected (Mum spells hers Loundes) and 3rdly because my great grandfather had a sister Elizabeth who married someone with the surname Darlow (which is also unusual and seems indiunous to the area).
I have to go to work now but as soon as I get home we will take a look. I was born in Dudley, but now live in Walsall. Whereabouts are you? Are you local? look forward to hearing from you soon
Mel x
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couldnt rest have to look! lol seems your Ellen Elizabeth is my Albert Edward's sister according to 1901 Census grrrrr hate going to work but better go tc x
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Hi Jool, I have had a good look and its seems you may be rite about William being the son of James and Sarah and there is a birth for Wolves in 1883 which could be him the only way I guess it to get old of their mc. Her father is George so that should clarify thinhs a bit. I hope we can find a Loundes link as well as a Darlow link. it is a very complicated tree M x
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Ah now Im NOT so sure James and Sarahs son was Stephen William b 1882 in Willenhall he was a locksmith have him married already BUT and its a big but I have another Stephen William b 1883 in Sedgley apprenticed locksmith and its his sister Mary Ann Lounds who married Samuel Taylor-Loundes and his sister married Albert Darlow the brother of your Ellen Elizabeth but there is one problem he was supposed to have died in 1915 in Flanders so I will order both Marriage certs and take it from there M x
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Hello Mel, it's great to be in touch with you, maybe between us we can sort out this complicated Loundes family.
I am going to read through your posts again and try to get my head around it all, and have closer look at my tree. I have some notes somewhere of Loundes who I could not connect at the time to my family.
A while ago I found some Darlow births with the mother's maiden name Loundes - I was quite confused as to me the names were the wrong way around, now it's beginning to fall into place.
I am going to order the marriage cert for William Loundes & Ellen Elizabeth Darlow, see where that takes us.
I was born in Wolverhampton, now living between Coseley/Sedgley.
Be back soon....
Jool
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Hi Jool I sent off fro the marriage cert earlier its silly us both paying out so yu can get a copy of mine. My mum lives in Church Rd Sedgley and her sis at Hurst Hill. I was born on Wrens Nest in Dudley but now live in Walsall. Its amazing how it all fits together I hope Ive caught yu before yu send for cert Mel x
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Hi Mel, no not sent for cert yet, thanks so much for offering me a copy. I live Hurst Hill area too, wasn't very precise in earlier post in case you weren't familiar with this area.
The Loundes family are on my mom's side, whe was born Brierley Hill, daughter of William Edward Warner and Ellen Elizabeth Loundes.
Family story has it that my grandmother Ellen was the only one of 9 children to survive infancy, although I have no records of any other children, maybe stillborn. My grandfather William was a twin, his twin brother died age 18 months, so the pair of them were lucky to survive long enough to meet each other.
Jool
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Mel, I notice you have Kendrick in your list of names. I have Kendricks from Codsall in my other half's tree. Any connection?
Jool
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hi Jool, sorry my phone died and I was too lazy to go on computer. Yes my Grandad George Loundes son of Samuel Taylor-Loundes and Mary Ann Lounds he married my Nan Violet Kendrick as far as Im aware I havent got out of Dudley with them yet. I put a few pics of Loundes onto facebook if you are on there Mel x
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would also be worth getting in touch w the lock museum in Willenhall (hmmm or is it walsall? fairly sure it is willenhall tho lo l) they might have more info on particular companies or know who will :)
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Thank you its efinatly worth a shot x
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Hi Jool,
I recieve an MC I sent for today Stephen William and Diana Shepherd he was the son of James and Sarah so still waiting to find out whose son your William who married Ellen Elizabeth was M x
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The lock museum is in willenhall. It's in the town centre. I went in a few years ago on halloween night. It was an interesting evening. I don't know whether it is still open or not. Opposite side of the road to somerfields. Not far from it. There may be a website if you search. The library may be able to help you also and walsall archives in essex streeet or wolverhampton archives.
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ty Weste, I have had a good look. It looks great now I have a few more Locksmith names in Willenhall I want to look for so will visit soon. LEDSUM and SIMMONS they may be more well know as Rim Lock makers. M x
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ahh ty Weste, it slipped my mind where it was, tho Ive been past it countless times (im in wolverhampton) lol
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Hiya Mel,
So that rules out my first thought that my William could be son of James & Sarah. Quite excited to hear what the other MC tells us, we should then be able to work out if we are connected on the Loundes side - hopefully!
Jool
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Marriage cert arrived for William Loundes and Ellen Elizabeth Darlow her father was indeed George same as Alberts yeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy. His father was John and I cant find him on census returns except 1911 3 years before his marriage and Ellen is his wife and they living with a William Harper one of their witnesses.
I cant find a William b 1887 in Dudley or Willenhall who is a locksmith and his father is John also a locksmith
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William Loundes m Ellen Elizabeth Darlow in 1914 - on 1911 they are down as being married
Williams father on mc is John both are Locksmiths
Williams age is given as 27
They married in Dudley
The only possible Father is John b 1849 in Lichfield m to Harriet b 1850 in Willenhall as these were the only Locksmiths from Willenhall to come to Wolves and Dudley and settle
John is also the Father of Elizabeth Loundes who married Albert Darlow - Ellen Elizabeths brother
I have found a possible birth for William Loundes in 1888 Wolves so if push comes to shove I will risk sending for this
I have NOT found William Loundes b 1887/1888 in Willenhall on the 1891 or 1901 but have the 1901 for John and Harriet
the family has various spellings for the surname and endless Williams and Johns lol and they did switch their kids about amongst themselves and grandparents at times
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Got this one angel:
Name: William James Lowndes
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1888
Registration district: Wolverhampton
Inferred County: Shropshire, Staffordshire, West Midlands
Volume: 6b
Page: 632
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thanks History gunna order that now hes defo one of ars lol so a new mystery or answer to this one ty M x
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William James Lowndes' christening is on the Wolverhampton archives site - he's the son of James Lowndes (a miner) and Harriet.
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Ah Sarah found him son of James and Harriet :o bk to drawing board M x
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Hiya Mel,
Great news, now we can confirm that my Ellen and your Albert were bro and sis! What relation is Albert to you, Ellen being my great grandmother, I wondered how we were related.
I'm on the hunt now for William and father John.
As you pointed out, on the 1911 Ellen Elizabeth is shown as married to William Loundes - 3 years before their marriage. The other couple living at the same address, Mary Jane & William Harper, weren't married either. Mary Jane was a Darlow - Ellen Elizabeth's sister. Both couples married 3rd Q 1914 Dudley and their marriage refs are 1 digit apart so they must have married at the same time. Maybe they told the enumerator they were married to appear "decent" ;D
I found out recently that my aunt was still in touch with the Harper family until a few years ago, but now the older members of the Harpers have passed away she has lost touch. It was a bit frustrating as she told me they had traced their family tree and they could have been of help ::)
Jool
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John is also the Father of Elizabeth Loundes who married Albert Darlow - Ellen Elizabeths brother
Mel, are we saying that Elizabeth Loundes & William Loundes were brother and sister (children of John), and they married another brother and sister, Albert Darlow & Ellen Elizabeth Darlow? (children of George & Elizabeth Ann)?
If so this tree is going to get messy ;D
Jool
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On the Dudley MBC site... Lots of Loundes & Darlows on here.
Buried in the same grave, Dudley Cemetery, Section F Grave 1033
John Loundes, burial 19/02/1919, age 69
Harriet Loundes, burial 09/03/1911, age 60
John Loundes, burial 18/04/1929, age 56 (John & Harriet's son?)
Susannah Loundes, burial 04/04/1950, age 74 (John Jnr's wife?)
Marriage:
John Loundes & Susannah Spittle 1st Q 1900 Wolverhampton
Jool
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This looks very much like the Loundes family in 1891 living in Darlaston - but for some reason they are shown as TAYLOR - Harriet's maiden name? Maybe hiding from someone after John's spell in prison. Harriet & kids were in Wolverhampton Workhouse in 1881 whilst hubby John was in Stafford Prison, she possibly gave birth to Samuel in the workhouse.
John Taylor, head, b. 1851 Lichfield
Harriet Taylor, wife, b. 1852 Willenhall
Alfred Taylor, son, b. 1871 Willenhall
Maria Taylor, daur, b. 1880 Willenhall
Samuel Taylor, son, b. 1882 Wolverhampton
William Taylor, son, b. 1884 Willenhall
Harriet Taylor, daur, b. 1887 Darlaston
Elizabeth Taylor, daur, b. 1889 Darlaston
Wow this is fuddling my brain now, lol
Jool
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lol your families traits are mirroring mine, I have one who was in wolverhampton workhouse and another who was in stafford prison lol (for stealing a jacket lol )
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1871 census, Willenhall
Harriet Taylor b. 1852 Willenhall, living with parents Henry & Louisa, siblings John, George, Annie, Joseph & William and a lodger - John Lownds, Locksmith, b. 1849 Willenhall? Maybe the family weren't sure where John was born.
Next door...
John Lownds, b. 1827 Lichfield, Locksmith
Mary Ann Lownds, wife b. 1829 Lichfield
Children Elizabeth, William, James, Benjamin, Henry - all b. Willenhall, and grandfather John Walker, widow b. Lichfield.
Then, next door to them a bunch of Walkers, b. Lichfield & Willenhall.
Now my brain is mush, think it's time for bed :D
Jool
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truebritmega, I can't believe the things people were sent to prison for, if the same laws applied today there would be more of us inside than outside, lol.
Jool
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Marriage Dec Q 1879 Wolverhampton
John Lowndes & Harriet Taylor
Looks like their son Alfred b. 1871 was the result of John Loundes the lodger sneaking into Harriets's room :o All the other kids were born 1880 onwards.
Ooh no, there was John 1872, Henry 1873 & George 1877 born before the marriage too.
Mel, looking back at your original post, this is probably all old news to you ;D
Jool
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From Wolverhampton Archives website.
Marriage St. Stephen's Willenhall, 27 Oct 1879
John Lowndes, bachelor, age 30, Locksmith abode Willenhall, son of John Lowndes, Locksmith.
Harriet Taylor, spinster, age 29 abode Willenhall, daur of Henry Taylor, Jobbing Smith
Jool
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Hi Jool,
Don’t you ever sleep LOL! WOW! 1stly I’m am the great granddaughter of Elizabeth’s brother Samuel Taylor-Loundes and he married his second cousin Mary Anne Loundes so out mutual ancestors would be John Lowndes and Harriet Taylor and George Darlow.
So, William Harper married another of the Darlows interestingly enough he was one of the witnesses at the marriage of William and Ellen Elizabeth – the other witness being Lilian Bill – wonder who she married? I wonder also if William and Ellen Elizabeth were their witnesses.
I assuming at the moment they were brother and sister as it’s the only John eligible to be “the Daddy” unless of course John is the “Grandaddy” and William was reared by him.
I have been to the grave strangely enough my Samuel is also buried near them yet his wife is in Gornal Wood under a tree nr “the Catholics” and he is in with her parents and I think her brother lol she is in an unmarked grave with paupers.
NO WONDER I couldn’t find them in 1891 most of the kids were born pre-marriage so it fits! And there is a William – yeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy LOL. Samuel was “the one known as Taylor-Loundes” as he was the first of the males to be born inside wedlock. Wondering how I could have missed William lol no to find him on 1901.
John b 1849 was born in Lichfield this may have confused him living with the in-laws lol. They live next door to his parents the family gets weirder lol. Isn’t life just grand lol.
By the way John was in Stafford gaol with an unknown William in 1901 perhaps this is ar chap aye! The whole family were criminals they worked mainly for the police – making handcuffs, safes, Gaol locks etc and we even have one in Parkhurst who was later transported for 7 years and was put into solitary confinement for 3 months. The John in question was a “loveable rogue” and the story goes he was “ordered to marry Harriet” after his stint in gaol and Samuel came along soon after the magistrate then “ordered him out of Willenhall him and his descendents were TOLD never to return again” hence the split from the family.
M x
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DARLOWS ... so far
George Darlow m Elizabeth ? not found a marriage
George b 1849 Bedford? And Elizabeth 1857 Banbury
Children:
1. Alice b 1876 Walsall 1909 Dudley
2. Roseannah b 1877 Walsall
3. George b 1879 Dudley
4. William b 1881 Dudley
5. Ellen Elizabeth b 1885 Dudley m William Loundes 1914 Dudley
6. Albert Edward b 1888 Dudley m Elizabeth Loundes 1907 Dudley
7. Mary Jane b 1889 Dudley m William Harper 1914 Dudley
8. Aquilla b 1892 Dudley
9. Joseph b 1895 Dudley m Gertrude Lester * 1916 Dudley
Alice married either Arthur EDWARDS or Wilson John FRANCE
*Gertrude is the daughter of George Donlan Lester and Mariah Lowndes. Mariah is the sister to Elizabeth Lowndes and William Loundes and My Samuel Taylor- Loundes. Gertrude m Arthur L Williams in 1915 – so what is going on there. Found a death for Arthur Edward Williams in Mar Q 1916 by Sep Q she was remarried how sad.
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Looking at 1891 Census this is the interim between him leaving Willenhall and going to Wolves and looks like hes taken a job so they look very much out of favour with the rest of the family at this point but William is with them so yeyyyyyyyyyyyyyy. And yes there is a birth for William in 1883 in Wolves.
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ok this may be William with a diff wife on 1901 its all I can find maybe yu will have more luck
LOUNES, William 1882 Locksmith Repairer Wolverhampton
LOUNES, Dorothy Maria 1883 Wolverhampton
LOUNES, John William 1901 Wolverhampton
MURRAY, Lucy 1845 Albrighton
Living at: 7, Court, Great Brickkiln Street, Wolverhampton
Theres a marriage to a Dorothy Maria Griffin in Sep Q 1900 in Wolves
there is also a birth for for John William Loundes in Dec Q 1900 in Wolves
I can't find either Dorothy or John on the next census
... there is a death for Dorothy Maria Loundes in Dec Q 1901 in Wolves a year after her son was born
and a death for John Lowndes in Wolves in Mar Q 1908 - very sad
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Lucy Murray appears to be Dorothy's 2nd step-mum (confused.com) 0n 1891 Dorothy Murray is listed as Emma and Alfreds stepdaughter herJohn brother has surname Griffin. Lucy appears to be her Step-fathers wife.
Dorothy Maria Griffin was born in Wolves Dec Q 1882 and John Griffin married Emma Lloyd in Wolves Dec Q 1880 and Emma and John appear on 1881 Census with son John also.
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Children of Ellen Elizabeth (DARLOW) and William LOUNDES ONLY one registered Ellen Elizabeth LOUNDES
Children of Elizabeth LOUNDES and Albert Edward DARLOW (all Dudley)
Harriet Elizabeth DARLOW b 1908
Edith Mariah DARLOW b 1911
Joseph H DARLOW b 1913
Albert E DARLOW b 1915
I have a John but cant find a yr poss 1917
and a query query Joseph E DARLOW b 1915 (mothers Maiden is Loundes)
Children of Mary Jane DARLOW and William HARPER (all born Dudley)
Clifford HARPER b 1914
Albert E HARPER b 1917
Joseph G HARPER b 1919
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Now I need to find out who William James Loundes b 1888 in Wolves son of James and Harriet is x
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There is an interesting family story Jool which you may be able to shed some light on. Some time ago when my Mother was a girl a newspaper asked for "the one known as Taylor-Loundes" to step forward for some kind of inheritance (probably bad debts knowing this lot). They asked for him or his next or kin - Samuel was the one known as Taylor-Lounder being the first male to be born after the marriage so in the eyes of the law the heir. The others going as Taylor as we have seen even though they registered under Loundes they became Loundes-Taylor only after the marriage. But Samuel and the girls ... and now William would be legally Loundes. Anyway, Samuel had long gone by then and his father being the black sheep of the family meant most (I say most cos Samuel married his second Cousin Mary Anne Lounds the grandaughter of Johns brother Stephen) ties had been severed at this point with the rest of the clan as none were allowed in willenhall since the magistrate had ordered John out. Anyway My Mother's Father George being the eldest male was by law next of kin so when he saw the article he destroyed it and wouldn't let it be spoken about. George was a proud man and that was the end of it till "someone connected to the Darlow side" put him self forward as Taylor-Loundes. This was what at first seemed a simple enough claim but was rejected. The family didn't understand it, but I guess we see it differently as law is law and George was next of kin. We assummed it to be Albie Darlow as he was the only one we knew to be connected until now, but William is a more likely candidate as Samuel's brother and next in line in the family. Sounds ok to me ...
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truebritmega, I can't believe the things people were sent to prison for, if the same laws applied today there would be more of us inside than outside, lol.
Jool
yup, and when I found that out about him stealing the jacket.. turns out his brother was fined to... for playing some gambling game in the street LOL
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My theory on doing the research is that William was the claimant. Believe me till you found him to be John and Harriet's son the 1891 Census (surname Taylor) not only had he been overlooked by all the geneologists connected to this tree ... and I've searched and searched to no avail no-one seems to have him, but also no-one in ar side of the family ever knew he existed and we have plenty of stories about the others. So you have found us a completely new "uncle".
His story seems so sad he ends up in Cannock in Walsall in 1900 working in a different occupation to everyone else to me it seems hes fallen out of favour with the others and unable "by law" to go to Willenhall because of his Father John he would have drifted into Walsall alone, homeless and Jobless (there has always been talk of Walsall connections but none found). In 1900 he marries hes about 17 - possibly to the step-daughter of a woman Lucy who gives him work and a shelter. It would halp her out as well having a wage earner. Maybe to make things more respectable he marries the daughter or more likely looking at timescales the daughter Dorothy finds herself pregnant with his child and he has to marry her. a child is born soon after the wedding (I estimate William was still 16 when the child concieved). A year after baby John was born Dorothy dies. Baby John followed 7 years later in 1908. William is all alone and grieving so heads back to his family and his sister Elizabeth has not long got married and has a young baby but Albies two sisters are living locally with a man called William Harper - one has his wife so they take William in. And thus someone connected to the Darlows can stake a claim in the inheritance. Its a shame the law is the law or he may have got it too - poor man!
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Hi Mel, wow you've been busy too, fascinating stuff - a bunch of criminals eh! Mom will be horrified lol. There's a lot of info here to work on, probably won't get a chance to have a good look this weekend but I'll be back on it. I do sleep (eventually lol), my other half works nights so that's when I get time to have a good mooch, sometimes I get carried away...
... there is a death for Dorothy Maria Loundes in Dec Q 1901 in Wolves a year after her son was born
Wolves Archives site have this:
Merridale Cemetery Burials
Dorothy Maria Lowndes, age 19, Great Brickkiln Street, St. Pauls,
Buried 5 Jan 1902
Daughter of William, hawker. (shouldn't that be wife of William if she was married to William Loundes??)
Strangely enough, all my family on dad's side (Robbins) were from that area.
I have never been able to find a marriage of George Darlow & Elizabeth Ann, looked at both their home towns and Walsall - nothing.
Must go, need to go food shopping.
Jool
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I can't actually Find George Darlow b c1849 Bedford anywhere in the country on any census before 1881
nor can I find a birth registered in Bedford
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George Darlow
Census 1861
Male 15 years Son
Born Sandy, Bedfordshire
Little Staughton
Huntingdonshire
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In a 1861 they were living at Top Hill, Little Staughton ,Huntingdonshire
DARLOW, Joseph 1816 Labourer Garford, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Sophia Riseley, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Charles 1844 Garford, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, George Son Sandy, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Fred Son Sandy, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Mary Ann 1852 Sandy, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, James Sandy, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Edward Sandy, Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Isabella 1861 Little Staughton
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Like the rest of them Better late than never
Name: DARLOW, Joseph
St. Neots
County: Huntingdonshire
Year : 1850
Qr : Mar 14 267
Name: BASS, Sophia
County: Huntingdonshire
Year: 1850
Q Mar 14 267
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In 1871 they were living at Sholder Multon, Little Staughton, Huntingdonshire
DARLOW, Joseph 1818 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Sophia 1820 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Frederic 1851 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Mary 1852 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, James 1855 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Edward 1858 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Isabella 1861 Bedfordshire
DARLOW, Ellen 1863 Bedfordshire
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The 1911 states that George Darlow & Elizabeth Ann had been married 36 years (1875) which is a year before first child Alice was born. Alice was born in Walsall, that's why I thought they may have married there.
Jool
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In 1871 I have George Darlow mistranscribed as George BARLOW b. 1847 Sandy, Beds, living in Barrington, Cambridgeshire. He's a lodger with the Neaves family.
Jool
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Ar thats why George isnt home with his parent on the 71. I wonder where he got to on the 51 and where his parents where in 41.
Did this Neaves family have an Elizabeth there?
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Did this Neaves family have an Elizabeth there?
That's the first thing I looked for. They have a daughter Eliza but she's only 8 so too young.
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I've looked for Elizabeth Ann's b. 1854 Banbury, I know the birth year may not be exact, but here's some possibles
Ariss
Gascoigne
Smith (please not this one)
Walden
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LOL it would have to be the Smith he he x
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I have a sidney j lounds marring phyllis smith. I think the ref is cannock oct-dec 1940. Phllis had a sister called marie, her parents john frederick smith and elizabeth westwood.
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hi Jool,
Im still struggling to find the Darlows on the 1841/51 Census and still no marriage for George sorry. Maybe we should pursue the Neaves and find where they are at before ad after George lived with them
M x
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Hi Weste,
give me a mo and will see if I can see anything on Sidney
M x
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Weste
Birth Sydney J LOUNDS Walsall 1914 Mar Q (mother’s Maiden FOSTER) 6b 1348
Birth Edna W LOUNDES Walsall 1913 Mar Q (mother’s Maiden FOSTER) 6b 1315
Marriage Sidney J LOUNDS and Phyllis M Smith Cannock 1940 Dec 6b 1432
Marriage Edna W LOUNDS and Leslie G MASON Walsall 1935 Dec Q 6b 1680
Marriage Joseph J LOWNDES and Annie W FOSTER Walsall 1911 Dec Q 6b 1290
including yur confirmed m for Sidney/Phyllis
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Oh my goodness I've done this Lounds tree before for my best friend let me text her
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Birth Joseph John LOUNDS Walsall 1889 Jun Q 6b 701
Birth Joseph John LOWNDS Walsall 1859 Mar Q 6b 540
Marriage Joseph John LOUNDS and Charlotte NOCK Walsall 1880 Jun Q 6b 772
Children of Charlotte and Joseph John LOUNDs (all born Bloxwich, Walsall, Staffs)
Joseph is a furnace Labourer
Thomas Edward 1881
Ann M 1885
Charlotte 1887
Joseph John 1889
Mary A 1891
Lily 1894
George 1898
Samuel 1900
1891 they live 17 Provedence Street, Walsall, Staffs
1901 they live 108 Leamore Lane, Walsall, Staffs
I had labourered long and hard toi link these to ars and failed then lost the whole tree when my computer went blue screen I cant believe I found someone else with these people lol M x
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The elizabeth westwood my granddads sister i believed lived in landywood married to john frederick smith, they lived in jacobs hall lane great wyrley. When i went to senior school we lived in blakenall and moved near to goscote. Dad said he thought his cousin had moved in down the road, in the steel houses which were new built houses at the time in perhaps early sixties. They had stainless steel sinks when people had still got the old sinks in. I was thinking it was marie but it may have been phyllis. I think phyllis had a child called carl and one called caroline. I think lizzie smith was living well into her nineties in norton canes and was going blind. I may have met lizzie but i don't think i met any of the others. That is good that you've got the connections thank you.
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Hi Weste,
its a fascinating family to research particularly as both yur branches and Jool and my branch originated in close proximaty in Warwickshire will keep digging
M x
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Birth Edward LOUNDS 1829 Kingsley, Warwickshire
Birth Fanny 1828 Alton, Staffs
Marriage Edward LOWNDS and Frances WORTHINGTON Stoke on Trent 1851 Sep Q 17 217
Children of Fanny and Edward LOUNDS
Ann 1850 Alton, Staffs
Selina 1852 Stoke on Trent
Maria 1854 Stoke on Trent
Fanny 1857 Stoke on Trent
Mary Ann 1858 Stoke on Trent
Joseph 1859 Bloxwich
Thomas 1861 Bloxwich
George 1864 Bloxwich
1851 living Bath Street, Stoke on Trent, Staffs
1861 living Station Street, Walsall, Staffs
1871 living Hatherton Furnaces, Walsall, Staffs
ha I have links to my Lounds in Kingsbury laughing here x
I have Lounds in Alton too x
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Well i think you're on a roll here! Brilliant when things fall together! I've just had a chuckle about warwickshire , we may be closing in on another of my lines, i.e. in the fazeley area, maternal line and paternal have links in the area. My dads lot came from great wyrley and cheslyn hay and i'm finding that many connections between the lines(little villages, small gene pool), i like it when it broadens out. I've been dealing with big families and not very imaginative with names. I already have one mason(alexander s) from wolvo in mytree, i know there's some over great wyrley, i wonder whether they will link up.I'm alternating between laughing and groaning! I meant to mention in my email about the lock museum but i needed to look back over the marriage. I'm from walsalloriginally stafford street till i was 18 months, then blakenall, river estate by goscote and now west brom but mom lives at bloxwich.
jean
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Nice to meet yu Jean Im a Dudley wench myself, but been in Walsall over 15 years now Im on West Bromwich border and work in Wednesbury so very much local myself. Its great when it all comes together
Mel x
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ok I cannot find a birth for Edward anywhere and I cant find him on the 1841 census either :-(
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What do you make of this for a possible for the Darlows in 1851 living in Sandy, Beds. Surname is wrong but other details fit. Transcribed as Daniell but original image reads Darnill. They have kids Charles, George & Frederick.
Joseph, head, 1818 Sandy, Beds. Ag Lab.
Sophia, wife, 1820 Riseley, beds
William, son, 1837 Sandy
Eliza, daur, 1842 Sandy
Charles, son 1844 Sandy
George, son 1846 Sandy
Frederick, son, 1850 Sandy
Elizabeth Bays, daughter in law, 1842, Riseley
Maybe Bays should be BASS, as in Sophia's maiden name. She was born same place as Sophia. I've seen step daughters described as daughter in law.
Jool
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On phone so bear with me that's them n is it possible Elizabeth daughter in law is Georges wife? M x
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Familysearch.
Baptism 14 Nov 1819. Riseley, Beds
Sophia Bass
Parents William Bass & Elizabeth
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Oh no, here we go again with the jail birds.
In 1861 Elizabeth Bass b 1842 Riseley is in prison, Bedfordshire County Gaol ::)
She was convicted on 8 Mar 1861 for Burglary (and whipped). No mis-read the image, not whipped but imprisoned for 15 months.
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There's 2 christenings on family search when looking for edward.
edward lounds birth 10 nov 1815 parents john lownds and mary bap 30 th july 1825 which is too early.
edward lowndes alton staffs 22/2/1829 parents joseph lownds and elizabeth. There may be more in the parish records. Where would the parish records for edward be? Birmingham?
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LOL Jool seems we cant escape the Gaols lol M x
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so ... we have a wife Sophia Bass for Joseph but still no maiden for Georges Elizabeth Ann x
who is Elizaberh Bass b 1842?
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Hi Jean,
Its hard to call this really as on all census it says Edward b in Warwickshire which means a trip to Warwick - however they were defo in Alton at some point as she is from there and eldest child is born there so maybe a trip to Stafford either way its gunna be a long hard slog finding him M x
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Just found Joseph & Sophia Darlow & kids in 1881 - recorded as DARNEL again ?? same as 1851. Living in St. Cuthbert, Bedford.
Joseph 1818 Sandy
Sophia 1819 Riseley
Edward 1858 Sandy
Isabel 1861 Staughton
Ellen 1863 Staughton
It's a bit of a coincidence for the enumerator to mis-hear Darlow for Darnel/Darnill on 2 occasions 30 years apart, hmmm baffled.
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So that's all census except 1841 its v inerestin yu art great at findin them
Censuses I haven't been able to find out who Elizlabeth Bass was soz M x
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It's all beginning to fall into place - or getting more confusing, not sure which.
I had a sneaking suspicion that Joseph may have been married before and the younger kids on the 1851 weren't Sophia's, especially as they didn't marry until 1850. Maybe Elizabeth Bays/Bass was Sophia's from a previous relationship.
Anyway, found these baptisms on Famlysearch, they match the younger kids on the 1851
All with parents Joseph Darnell & MARY
William Darnell bapt 14 Aug 1836 Sandy
Eliza Darnell bapt 28 Sept 1841 Sandy
Ann Darnell bapt 10 Sept 1838 (she wasn't on the 1851)
Then there's this
Mary Ann Darnell bapt 10 July 1853 Wesleyan, Biggleswade Circuit, Bedford.
Parents Joseph Darnell and SOPHIA
Either there is a parallel family out there with a similiar surname or our Darlows didn't know what to call themselves.
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Also found:
Charles Darnell bapt 21 Apr 1844 Sandy
Parents Joseph Darnell & MARY
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FreeBMD birth
George Darnel 2nd Q 1848 Bedford
???
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a-ha so Sophia was also married twice wonce to Joseph and once to Mr Bass lol
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sorry been neglectful of this I have been busy with work so not done any more need to get back in to it and see what else we can find out x
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sorry been neglectful of this I have been busy with work so not done any more need to get back in to it and see what else we can find out x
Hi Mel, me too. I've been back from hols for over a week and been too busy to get stuck in (holiday washing didn't help ::)) I'm going to put all the latest info into my Ancestry tree to try to get my head around this family.
Jool
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Hi again Jool trust yu have a lovely holiday mine begins in two days from now lol and cant wait am shattered so its much needed will need to go through wat I have an look more at the Darlows. Maybe we could meet up and i can give yu all the info we have on Loundes and pics certs etc. get bk to yu soon M x
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Hiya
Found these baptisms on Wolves Archives website.
St. Stephen's, Willenhall
(same church as their parents John Loundes & Harriet Taylor married)
All with parents John & Harriet, father Locksmith.
William Lowndes, bapt 14 June 1883, Willenhall
Elizabeth Lowndes, bapt 10 May 1888, Brickiln Street, Portobello
Annie Lowndes, bapt 24 Dec 1890, Primrose Street, Portobello
Jool
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ok who is Annie now lol x
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News on Annie is she dont appear on any census there is a birth but no death :-(
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Had another good look for Annie no sign maybe will try Annie Taylor when I get a minute M x
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I've been looking for her too and can only find the birth as you did. Great minds think alike - I have looked for Annie Taylor too, no luck so far. This bunch don't like to make it easy for us do they.
My aunt is sending me some Loundes photos. I've no idea who they are of at the moment (I hope she does). I will let you know when I get them.
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they like to play us up lol. Yes plz I am v intersted plz let me know maybe we could meet for coffee x
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Hi Mel, yes we will have to arrange to meet up. I'll wait until I get the photos to show you and I can do you copies.
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sounds great n will give me time to do mine and some certs x
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we online together lol x
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Not happend for a while has it lol.
I think I mentioned that a member of the Harper family had popped in to my aunt's house asking about the Loundes family. I gave my aunt my email and I've been contacted by the G G G grandaughter of George Darlow (via Mary Jane Darlow & William Harper). It's her grandmother (wife of a now deceased Harper) who is tracing the family but she doesn't do email. I'm waiting to hear back from her.
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hi Jool yes I remember yu mentioning yur Auntie. I have to get over to Dudley archives at some point may be worth me carrying on to Wolves as well this family dont do things by halves do they lol. think Annie is going to grate on me for a few days M x
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Jool - a couple of Darlow Marriages:
Joseph Darlow/Gertrude Lester 1916 Sep Dudley 6b 1633 (possibly connected to Lesters who married Mariah Lounds)
William Darlow/ Lily E Cox 1913 Dec Dudley 6b 1812
and a few births :
Parents Joseph/Gertrude
Mary E Darlow b 1917 Dudley sep mothers maiden Lester 6b 1563
Joseph Darlow b 1920 Dudley sep mothers maiden Lester 6b 2073
George D Darlow b 1932 Dudley sep mothers maiden Lester 6b 1206
want to get bk further with these will look again soon M x
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Hi Mel
I've been googling Darlow in desperation and came across this.
There's a researcher looking for info on Aquillia Darlow, father George of Sandy. She says Aquillia's mother is Elizabeth BROOKES of Banbury, although she cannot find a marriage.
http://www.GenesReunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/darlow/thread/1264224
I'm not a member of GenesReunited, may have to join.
Not been able to have a mooch for a while, been busy ::)
Jool
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Good Morning Jool - I think I just missed yu last nite :(
I am a member of Genes so will make contact later
Have a few burials of Interest:
George David Darlow (we havent got this one but research may prove him ours) - Age 56 years - date of death 18/05/1989 - date of burial 24/05/1989 - Gornal Wood section A grave 112
Albert Edward Darlow - Age 74 years - date of burial 07/11/1961 - Gornal Wood section G grave 3183 (this is albert who took ellen elizabeth/william lowndes in)
Elizabeth Darlow (Nee Lowndes) - Age 73 years - date of burial 05/10/1960 - Gornal Wood section G grave 3183 (wife of the above)
Albert Edward Darlow (not sure who he is) - Age 46 years - date of burial 20/01/1962 - Gornal Wood section G grave 3202
Harriet Elizabeth Darlow (daughter of Albert and Elizabeth above) - Age 3 years - date of death 01/05/1911 - date of burial 07/05/1911 Dudley Cemetary section F grave - 454A
George Darlow (born in Sandy c 1849) - Age 63 years - date of death 05/03/1912 - date of burial 10/03/1912 - Dudley Cemetary section F grave 216
Elizabeth Ann Darlow (wife of above George) - Age 59 years - date of death 21/04/1914 - date of burial 26/04/1914 Dudley Cemetary section F grave 216
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A few Cremations:
Joseph Darlow date of burial 01/01/1965 - Gornal Wood (husband of Gertrude Lester)
Gertrude Darlow (Nee Lester) date of burial 22/11/1977 - Gornal Wood
no idea who these could be further investigation needed - all Gornal Wood
John Darlow - 05/09/1978
William Darlow - 24/08/1981
Emma Darlow - 24/04/1986
Shiela May Darlow - 22/04/1987
George David Darlow - 14/02/1995
Dorothy May Darlow - 14/06/1995
Ronald Darlow - 23/05/1995
Joseph Henry Darlow - 16/01/1997
Mrs Olive May Darlow - 17/03/2008 date of death 06/03/2008
Mr Joseph Darlow (husband of above and possibly Joseph b 1920 son of Joseph and Gertrude Lester) 15/02/2008 - date of death 05/02/2008
Joseph Edward Darlow - 03/12/1999
Hilda Jean Darlow - 22/07/1998
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A few for Stourbridge Cemetary:
Ethel Maud Darlow - Age 73 years - date of burial 06/02/1986 - section H grave 113
William Edward Darlow (poss husband for above) - Age 85 years - date of death 20/01/1996 - date of burial 02/02/1996 - section H grave 113
cremations at Stourbridge:
Ethel Maud Darlow - 31/01/1986 (this looks sad to me it may be a child born to above couple and given the date of possible mothers death - mother may have died in childbirth)
Norah Darlow - 22/12/1986 (another possible child maybe a baby who couldnt thrive without her mother)
William Edward Darlow - 29/01/1996 (another possible child also v sad given poss father passed away 9 days before)
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Ok these are closer to home
William Loundes - Age 68 years - date of death 18/03/1952 - date of burial 22/03/1952 - Dudley Cemetary section F grave 297 (this is William who married Ellen Elizabeth Darlow)
Ellen Elizabeth Loundes (Nee Darlow) - Age 72 years date of burial - 28/12/1957 Gornal Wood section A grave 381
(Not buried together)
William is buried with Hannah Bateman and Edward Bateman - he was buried last so on the top no idea who the batemans were
Ellen was buried 3rd with 4 others - William Price, Ethel Ruth Smith, Mary Heney, June Caroline Timmins - sounds like a paupers grave
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Here's a rather shabby photo of Ellen Elizabeth Loundes (nee Darlow). I believe this photo was taken in the year Ellen died, 1957 age 72, as the girl in the photo is her granddaughter who was born in 1941 and says she was about 16 in the photo.
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Jool plz put this on the photo restoration thread and let them get it bk its lovely x
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Hi Mel, I was just about to put it on the restoration thread.
Thanks for all the burials/cremations, I already have some of them, I'll have a look to see if I can work out who some of the "unknown" ones are.
Jool
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gunna have a good look at them all piece this tree together if I can upload it onto a new tree lol x
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Picture of all my Loundes
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my Grandfather, Great Grandmother and Great Great Grandmother
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My Great Grandfather and Great Great Grandmother
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hi Jool found these :(
Name: George DARLOW
Rank: PRIVATE
Birthplace: Dudley, Worcs
Enlisted: Dudley
Regiment:Worcestershire Regiment
Battalion:2nd Battalion.
Number: 27688
Date died: 22 August 1916
Died of wounds
Theatre of war: France & Flanders
Name: William DARLOW
Rank: RIFLEMAN
Birthplace: Dudley
Residence: Dudley
Enlisted: Wolverhampton
Regiment: King's Royal Rifle Corps
Battalion: 4th Battalion.
Number: 11348
Date died: 11 October 1918
Died of wounds
Theatre of war: France & Flanders
think they ar both Ellen Elizabeth and Albert Edward's brothers
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Fab photos Mel, great to see them. Harriet looks like a lady not to be messed with lol. Sadly I don't have many "old" photos of my family, but my other half's family have loads, even a couple of ambrotypes (photo on glass) dating back to early 1860's, I find them fascinating.
Here a link to the restoration post, they've done a great job on Ellen Elizabeth.
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,551813.0.html
Jool
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hi Jool they did a lovely job on Ellen Elizabeth bet yur v happy - will take a look at those burials when I get a mo may need to work backwards M x
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George David Darlow (we havent got this one but research may prove him ours) - Age 56 years - date of death 18/05/1989 - date of burial 24/05/1989 - Gornal Wood section A grave 112 – yeyyyy researched proved him ars - this is the son of Joseph Darlow and Gertrude Lester b Dec q 1932 Dudley 6B 1206 (13 Nov 1932) d May q 1989 Dudley 33 522 589 Married Hilda J Roovers m Dec q 1955 Dudley 9d 157 + his wife Hilda Jean Darlow - 22/07/1998 b (10 Oct 1914) d Jul q 1998 Dudley 0651B B43F 245 798
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Albert Edward Darlow (not sure who he is) - Age 46 years - date of burial 20/01/1962 - Gornal Wood section G grave 3202 – this is the son of Albert Edward Darlow and Elizabeth Loundes b Jun q Dudley 1915 6b 1982 d Mar q Dudley 1962 9d 109
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John Darlow - 05/09/1978 x can’t even find a death that fits age 0 at burial no birth or death????
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William Darlow - 24/08/1981 d Sep q Dudley 1981 33 0437 b (26 Feb 1908) Mar q Dudley 1908 6c 131 – no idea who he is still as cannot find him on census - Emma Darlow - 24/04/1986 birth 16 April 1904 d Apr q Dudley 1986 33 481 486 maiden name SKELDING m Dec q 1938 Dudley 6c 25 – Emma seems to be the wife of our missing William above + 1 child – Ronald W Darlow b Sep q 1939 Dudley 6c 21 (22 Jun 1939) Ronald Darlow - 23/05/1995 d May q 1995 Dudley 0651B B31F 197 595
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Sheila May Darlow - 22/04/1987 birth 3 Jun 1923 d Apr q 1987 Dudley 33 447 487 maiden name KING m Sep q 1945 Dudley 6c 31 – wife of Joseph H Darlow son of Albert Edward Darlow and Elizabeth Loundes Joseph Henry Darlow (her husband) b (24 Mar 1913) Jun q 1913 Dudley 6b 2099 (Joseph Henry Darlow - 16/01/1997) d Jan q 1997 Dudley 0651A 118 197 one child found for this marriage – Donald D Darlow b Dec q 1946 Dudley 9d 102
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Dorothy May Darlow - 14/06/1995 b (23 Dec 1921) d Jun q 1995 Stourbridge 0661A SA9F 039 695 – wife of john Darlow son of Albert Edward Darlow and Elizabeth Loundes m Jun q 1946 Dudley 6c 1
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Mrs Olive May Darlow - 17/03/2008 date of death 06/03/2008 wife of Joseph Darlow son of Joseph Darlow and Gertrude Lester m Dec q 1941 6c 66 maiden name WESTWOOD + 1 child Josephine O Mar q 1946 Dudley 6c 21 - her husband Mr Joseph Darlow (husband of above and possibly Joseph b 1920 son of Joseph and Gertrude Lester) 15/02/2008 - date of death 05/02/2008
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Joseph Edward Darlow - 03/12/1999 b (23 Jul 1915) d Nov q 1999 Dudley 0651A A51F 281 1199 son of Albert Edward Darlow and Elizabeth Loundes
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am confused.com ??? by this one as he was also George David Darlow DoB 22 Mar 1913 burial George David Darlow - 14/02/1995 d Feb q 1995 Dudley 0651A A32F 146 295 can't find a birth but possible son of George from Sandy, Bedfordshire
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Hi Mel
I've been googling Darlow in desperation and came across this.
There's a researcher looking for info on Aquillia Darlow, father George of Sandy. She says Aquillia's mother is Elizabeth BROOKES of Banbury, although she cannot find a marriage.
http://www.GenesReunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/darlow/thread/1264224
I'm not a member of GenesReunited, may have to join.
Not been able to have a mooch for a while, been busy ::)
Jool
Hi Mel, been away on hols but back at it again now. You have been busy again, will have a good look at these burials. Did you have any luck contacting the lady on genes?
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hi Jool not the Aquila one but today spoke to another lady on there awaiting a reply - I want to look for death and burials of others we have when I get a mo hope yu had a good holiday tc M x
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Death of George Darlow b 1849 in Sandy, Beds
Name: DARLOW, George
Registration District: Dudley
County: Staffs
Year of Reg: 1912
Q: Mar
Age: 63
Vol: 6C
Page: 154
Register Number 2095
Name George Darlow
Age 63
Date of Death 05/03/1912
Date of Burial 10/03/1912
Dudley Cemetery Section F Grave 216
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Name: HARPER, Jane
Registration District: Dudley
County: Staffs
Year of Reg: 1968
Q: Jun
Age: 89
Vol: 6C
Page: 169
nee Darlow
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Hey Jool yu never guess what - daughter in law of a living relie has been in touch. She is the Grandaughter of Albert Darlow and Elizabeth Lounds
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That's great Mel, is she going to join us on this thread, the more the merrier. Three heads are better than two lol.
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Hiya Jool I sent her the link gunna send it to another cuz too she may want to have a look M x
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angel~eyes - You mentioned earlier that you knew of a grave of William and Hannah Bateman. Long shot, but they are the names of my great-great-great grandparents. Cant find any date on the post. Dya got any more info?
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Hi Matt, Welcome to Rootschat :)
Great to hear from another Loundes/Darlow descendant, wow they are a complicated bunch aren't they. I have not concentrated on this tree for a while and I have to refresh my memory with them, they nearly blew my mind and I had to have a break from them, lol. I also need to organise my tree, as you say it ends up like spaghetti with all these Loundes/Darlow marriages.
On no, not another complicated family arrangement - mother and daughter Loundes marrying Darlow bothers, aaaaggghhh! This tree will never look right lol.
If I have understood correctly, both photos are of Harriet Taylor b. abt. 1852, wife of John Loundes. The lady who posted these photos has not been online for a while, she has a lot of information which I'm sure she will share when she can get back to us. I think she has some info on the imprisonments too.
My great grandfather was William Loundes (1883-1952), brother to your Ann Maria Loundes.
William Loundes (1883-1952) married Ellen Elizabeth Darlow (1885-1957).
Their daughter (my grandmother) was Ellen Elizabeth Loundes (1919-1969), she married William Edward Warner (1913-1983).
As you can probably see from the posts, we have had problems tracing the Darlows back in Bedfordshire - nightmare! Very interesting to see that you have George Darlow's wife as Elizabeth ADAMS, we couldn't find her maiden name, where did you find this info?
If I can be of help with anything, just shout.
Jool
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Hi again Matt,
There is a record of a John Loundes imprisoned in Stafford Gaol on 5th April 1881. "Our" John Loundes was shown as being in Stafford Gaol on the 1881 census, the census was taken on 3rd April 1881 so I assume he must have been detained before his actual conviction. He was imprisoned for receiving stolen goods, and was sentenced to 9 months in prison.
Also on the same record is a William Loundes who was convicted of Larceny, 6 months. On the 1881 census for Stafford Prison William Loundes is listed as b. 1860 Willenhall, Locksmith. Off to have a look which William he is...
Found him.... William Loundes is John's brother
Jool
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Hiya Jool, yes you have all of the right except the Granny Loundes I mention is Mary Anne (Nee Lounds) who was the daughter of William Lounds and (Granny) Annie Carter (formerly Evans and Nee Richards - though there is no evidence of her marriage to William. Mary Anne married Samuel Taylor-Loundes son of John Loundes and (Granny) Harriet Nee Taylor. Mary Annes father William was the son of Stephen and Stephen was the brother of John. LOL no to complicated things further Hello Matt and yep spaghetti is a good way to describe it welcome to roots and welcome to the worst family to research in the whole world. Your branch of the tree has answered a few questions I actually thought I was going a bit loopy as Gertrude and Anna Maria (who I thought was a sis of Gertrude I'd missed had sons called Joseph 5 years apart in Dudley. NOT thinking Anna was her mother!
Regarding the criminals yes Jool has all that correct too, though its only recently that I even knew about Jools William who was the brother to my Samuel and of course your Anna Maria - how much more complex could this tree get WOW! At this rate we will locate descendents of all of John and Harriets children. Have to go now but will look in when I can.
btw Matt are you still in the Midlands?
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Mum reckons Ann Maria was known to her as Mariah and she may have been blind not sure if this is right x
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AH HA I have spotted something else to complicate this further lol he he I spy that John Lounds b 1872 who married Susannah Spittle had a daughter called Mary Elizabeth Lester-Lounds born in Wolves in 1901 now whats that all about - John is also the son of John and Harriet making that 4 of their 10 children entwined in this spaghetti oh my word it was like a free for all but then their parents were hardly a good example were they! No make that 5 cos of Elizabeth marrying Albie x
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Hiya Mel, good to see you back in action, but will you please stop spotting more things to complicate this tree, lol ;D I'm still trying to get my head around what we have already learned.
Sorry, I'm throwing up more questions than answers here...
Mary Elizabeth Lester-Lounds b. 1901 is with John Loundes & Susannah in 1911, listed as adopted daughter. Would she be the daughter of Ann Maria Loundes & George Donlan Lester? wonder why she was adopted.
I have Ann Maria as Maria in some census records too.
I am a bit confused with the 1901 census. It shows John & Susannah living with his brother and wife, Alfred & Edith. It lists Alfred & Edith then their children, then John & Susannah, and a "daughter" Harriet L Loundes b. 1899. Is young Harriet John & Susannah's daughter, or Alfred & Edith's? I had assumed she was John & Susannah's, but she is not with them in 1911, maybe she died or was she Alfred & Edith's.
Jool (Confused)
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It just gets worse....
Found Alfred & Edith Loundes in 1911 in Dudley, they're using the name TAYLOR ! Who are they hiding from this time!!
With children Louisa, Annie, May & Maud, and a married Aunt Annie Loundes b. 1853.
Young Harriet not here with them either.
I just don't know which knots in the spaghetti to try to untie first.
Jool
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Hi jool the Harriet L belongs to Alfred n Edith on the second census Harriet is listed as Louisa she is cousin Cazs grandmother. I think Ann Maria aka Mariah is Mary Elizabeth Lester-lownds mother as on the 1901census print out says child 8 days old child of Mary Lewis but original says Maria Lester Lownds. They in Wolves workhouse n George Donlan Lester has hotfooted it back to his father n their only child Gertrude is living with John n Harriet. Spells scandal. I found a contact email from before saying Mariah was indeed blind and also simple. I think she went to workhouse to have someone elses baby who John n Susannah later adopted. After she went bk to George Lester n had 3 or 4 more children. The 1901 census says she was 22. No wonder she left for George Darlow x
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Hi this is my first posting to roots web as I found this thread when researching Joseph Edward Darlow b. 25 Jul 1915 in Dudley. What stuck me from all the q&a is that the Loundes/Darlow families are a complex bunch. However, I wonder if you could help?
I have just received Joseph Edward Darlow's birth certificate which gives his mother's name as Maria Darlow (formerly Loundes) and the father as George Darlow. This throws my previous research completely out the window as I had considered Joseph Edward to be the son of Albert Edward Darlow (1887 - 1961) and Elizabeth Loundes (1885 - 1960). The B cert completely turns this on its head!
I now suspect that George Darlow is the one b. 1916 in Dudley and d. 22 Aug 1916 in France. That he was the son of George & Elizabeth Darlow and brother to the mysterious Aquila. Similarly, that Maria Darlow (formley Loundes) is none other than Ann Maria Loundes, wife of George Lester and mother to Gertrude Lester (who married George's brother Joseph!).
I recall from previous postings that you mention that Maria spent time in the workhouse while her husband was living with his father. You also implied that she left her husband to live with George Darlow and that their child had then been adopted.
So, can you confirm my suspicions about the complex relationships? Is there any documentation to confirm this (I can't find a marriage between George Darlow and Ann Maria Lester-Loundes). Was Joseph Edward raised by his mother or adopted by other relatives?
Regards
Stevo
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Its all very complex this Loundes/ Darlow/ Lester saga and a deeper web is being wove the deeper we probe. We only know through descendents accounts which we piece together with snippets of census etc till today when you have written documentation that there was indeed a son born of this union. Its all very sad finally when we think Mariah ( as my grandad used to call her) is finally free of George Donlan and seemingly happy with George he is taken away from her and she is forced to raise this child alone.
My Great-grandfather was Samuel Taylor-Loundes Maria/Mariah's sister - Jools ancestor was William Loundes though we didn't know about him to recently as the only census he was on the family were going as Taylor. We know Maria married George Donlan Lester and has 5 children including Gertrude who marries Joseph Darlow son of George Darlow sr and Brother to George jr who later has a child with Maria. Elizabeth Loundes married Alby (Alfred Edward) Darlow and then it gets more complicated because John Loundes an elder brother to Samuel, Maria and Elizabeth Census says adopted daughter) takes in Mary Elizabeth Lester-Loundes b in 1901 whose baptism states her mother as Mary Lewis - its also stated Mary Elizabeth is a pauper aged 8 days. If Mary Lewis is AKA Maria/Mariah Lester nee Loundes its not impossible for George to be the father of Mary Elizabeth but now I'm doubting if George D was actually Gertrude's father as she was born 5 years before they married. I cant see Mary Elizabeth being George D's either as why did she give her to John and Susannah then go back to George D and have 4 more children before leaving him to go to George her youngest would be about 5 or 6 very sad really. Maria would have been 14 when she got pregnant with Gertrude x
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Hi,
My name is Tina I am Alfred loundes great granddaughter, his one daughter is Florence May ( my nan) her some were Alf, john Thomas, Oliver and my dad Charles.
I know she had a sister louise ( married name Whitehouse).
I have photos of my nan and I think she had a sister called ada??
I have a photo of one of her sisters in the photo is a ww1 soldier he survived the war but she died at 21.
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Hi Tina, welcome to Rootschat ;D
You have probably seen my name on this thread already as I am related to the Loundes family on my mom's side. Do you have any more details of Alfred and Florence May, birth dates, marriage etc. so I can see if I have them in my tree
Jool
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Aaah, I have Alfred Loundes b. 1871 who was brother to my great grandfather William. Alfred married Edith Charlotte Roberts. One of their daughters I have only as May Loundes b. 1902, also another daughter Harriet Louisa Loundes b. 1897 who married Samuel Whitehouse in 1929. So it looks like we are connected to the same family ;D ;D
The other children I know of were Edith, Annie and Maud
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The sister who died aged 21 was Edith Elizabeth Loundes (1894-1915).
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Hi jools,
my nan Florence May was born 1901
died 1984, she married 1921 to john Thomas Poultney (my maiden name)
he was alcoholic nasty piece my dads brothers being older chucked him out, she remarried to a Horace stokes who passed on in 1968.
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Tina, have you gone very far back with your family history or are you just starting out? I am happy to share the information I have with you, or point you in the right direction if you want to research for yourself. They are a very complicated bunch ;D
I am sure angel~eyes, who is also part of to the Loundes family and has posted on this thread, will be happy to compare notes with you too when she comes online.
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Hi
started a yr ago searching, struggled at first because Alfred was in the workhouse with his mum Harriet and siblings i couldn't get the fathers name.
Now i have sorted that and found out in the last month he was in prison its all falling in place.
my father is the last son of Florence still alive he is facinated I've found so much out.
I wont answer any more tonight I have to be up at 5 for work but will answer any responses tomorrow
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OK Tina, no probs, hope to speak to you again soon :D
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Hello,
Have you been to the Dudley Archives,
I got my grandmothers wedding certificate from there, I found Wolverhampton archives unhelpful.
I also like you perhaps, got a lot from ancestry site.
I have a few photos.
But I found the name for the 21 year old sister very helpful, thank you for that..
Regards Tina
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Hi again Tina, I haven't been to Dudley Archives yet, it's something I have been wanting to do but working full time I haven't got around to it yet. Unfortunately I don't have many photos of the Loundes family, only a couple of my grandmother Ellen Elizabeth Loundes (1919-1969). Which family members do you have photos of?
If there is anything I can help you with please let me know. I have a private tree on Ancestry which I can let you see if you have a subscription.
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I am with ancestry , I did struggle till i saw you and angel eyes and found bits of the jigsaw, I would love to meet up with you and or angel eyes , the info would be good for my dad x
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Tina, check your message box, I have just sent you a p.m.
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My two photos are of my grandmother Florence ( Alfreds daughter) and the 21 yr old who passed on. However my uncle ( dads brother ) left photos to another brother, hence my cousin and I sorting this web out.
I work full time so I visit archives in school hols or weekend if ur ancestors married in Dudley. U can get copy for 60 pence x
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Hope you got my reply in personal messages, me and technology don't gel!
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Hope you got my reply in personal messages, me and technology don't gel!
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Hi jool,
sorry to be a pain but what was the name of the loundes sister who died at 21?
on my ancestry tree I think its up as Poultney if you get chance to view prob because followed dads dad x
Hope things ok with you x
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The Loundes girl who died aged 21 was Edith Elizabeth Loundes b. abt. 1894, died 2 May 1915, she was the daughter of Alfred Loundes and Edith Charlotte Roberts. The three of them are buried together in Dudley Cemetery, Section F , grave 1019.
If you have any questions, don't worry about asking, I am happy to help if I can :)
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Thank you for that.
Was telling my parents.
my cousin and I are trying to sort out the loundes web, on my nans marriage certificate it spelt as lowndes think registrars got it wrong, the archives have said if you get a diseprency on yrs of birth it is because if a child died parents would name the next one the same and not reregister.
if you are happy to give me your e.mail
or live near lye would love to catch up more info and show you photos of my nan and the sister who died x
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I. Am led to believe she died of a head problem, the photo I have is of her and a WW1 soldier by her side and my uncle had said she was engaged to him and she died after the photo was taken , dad has given a name for the soldier but not 100% x
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Hi Jools,
sorry to bother you late, If you wish to Facebook me I am Tina Hill type it in and lye or Stourbridge I am in photo with my husband and his mum on settee I am behind them.
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Hi Tina, I have spellings of the name as Loundes/Lounds/Lowndes/Lownds and a few others on various records. Often the registrar wrote down what he heard and spelled it as he thought correct, so we have to make allowances for these variations and it is not an indication of a change in the family name.
Unfortunately I am not on Facebook, but I will send you an email.
If you can give us the name your dad remembers for the soldier and any clue to the regiment from the photo (or even scan and post the photo here), we may be able to track him down.
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Have you received my message and photo x
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Hi Tina, no I haven't received a message with photo, how did you send it?
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Hi jool still don't know if this message gets to you, if you can e.mail me and I get back to you.
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Still cant attach the photo.
frustrating me now
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Hi Tina how lovely to see you on here. I am the great grandaughter of Samuel, your Alfred and Jools' Williams younger brother. Please inbox me your details and we can chat further. This thread is all we have of this branch but the tree goes further back x
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Hello,
nice to hear from you.
Alfred loundes is my gt grandad Florence may his daughter and my dad is the last brother alive.
we went to the cemetery today to try and find Alfred plot but they have moved the grave, so next mission is get the plans from gornal.
jool has helped me so much and grateful for the help.
regards
tina
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Hi Tina, I have emailed you, you may now wish to amend your post so your email address is not visible. I have sent a pic of Harriet plus one of my Grandfather, his siblings and his mother (also a Lounds - Grandaughter of John's brother Stephen). Please email me a picture of your side so we can look for resemblances. Speak again soon x
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As yet i haven't received an email from you, perhaps it will come later
regards tina
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hi also to Jool, our world is getting smaller, I believe Tina and Caroline are both from Alfred. I am so glad this thread keeps giving x
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possible candidate for the brother:
John George Lounds
England and Wales, Birth Registration Index
Name: John George Lounds
Event Type: Birth Registration
Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec
Registration Year: 1902
Registration District: Wolverhampton
County: Staffordshire
Event Place: Wolverhampton, Staffordshire, England
Volume: 6B
Page: 647
Line Number: 260
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John G Lounds
England and Wales, Death Registration Index 1837-2007
Name: John G Lounds
Event Type: Death
Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun
Registration Year: 1966
Registration District: Wolverhampton
County: Staffordshire
Event Place: Wolverhampton, Staffordshire, England
Age (available after 1866): 63
Birth Year (Estimated): 1903
Volume: 9B
Page: 831
Line Number: 117
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not our missing boy I am afraid x
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I cannot find Alfred on the 1911
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I cannot find Alfred on the 1911
Hiya M, good to see you on here again, the clan in growing ;D. Alfred is on the 1911, guess what - hiding under the name of Taylor in Dudley ::)
J x
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I should have known lol x
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it sure is Jool I hope more people see this thread and get in touch we still have a few more siblings to find - I may go back a generation and ask for help locating John's siblings and see who turns up next x
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Tina, if you have ancestors who may be buried in the following cemeteries
Stourbridge Cemetery, Lye/Wollescote Cemetery, Cradley Cemetery, Halesowen Cemetery, Gornal Cemetery, Dudley Cemetery, Brierley Hill Cemetery, Stourbridge Crematorium and Gornal Wood Crematorium
Look here, if gives the plot and the names of any others buried in the same plot.
http://www.dudley.gov.uk/resident/libraries-archives/local-history--heritage/genealogy-research-service/
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Hello, my grandfather was Clifford Harper born 25th August 1914. He was the son of William Harper b:1887 and Mary Jane darlow. B:1889
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hello and welcome to the family Joolz is more connected than myself but good to be in touch x
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Thank you, my gg grandfather is George darlow of sandy Bedfordshire born 1854.
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Hello John and welcome :). Your grandfather Clifford Harper is my 1st cousin 2x removed, your post has given me some information as I did not know his exact date of birth, just the year/qtr, so thank you for that.
Clifford's mother, Mary Jane Darlow is my 2nd Great Aunt, her sister Ellen Elizabeth Darlow is my Great Grandmother. There is a photo of Ellen on page 13 of this thread and some lovely restores by Rootschat members here http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,551813.0.html. You are welcome to copy the photos if you wish.
The girl in the photo with Ellen is my Aunt (still living) and I remember when she used to visit us mentioning seeing members of the Harper family in town, I seem to remember her talking about Billy Harper.
George Darlow of Sandy is my G G Grandfather too. Things get a little complicated going back to Bedfordshire and I think there may have been different spellings of the Darlow name which has complicated things - If you have had the time to read this long thread you will see what I mean ;D
I am happy to share information I have on the family, so if there is anything you need to know just ask.
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Thank you, The photos are brilliant, my dad is the one who does the family tree, and he does have a copy of the photo but not the cleaned up version, when i just phoned him he described the photo to me over the phone and he said he knew the the women as his aunt Nell and her granddaughter, and he remembers going to his aunt Nells and he remembers that she had two HANDGRENADES on the mantle
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My dad as also asked if you have a photo of william Lounds who married his aunt nell
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Hi John, Sadly I don't have a photo of William Loundes.
Wow, really! my Great Granny had hand grenades :o. I guess that was at her house in Corporation Road, Dudley.
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yes that was it , i remember hearing that story when i was little, my dad said that he as got a photo of Grandad with aunt Nell standing at the gate of her house or his Granny's house and he will sort it out and i will send it to you
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Brilliant, I would love to see any photos you have, thank you so much.
I have some photos of my grandparents, your Aunt Nell's daughter Ellen Loundes and her husband Bill Warner. Ellen Loundes would be Clifford Harper's 1st cousin. I'm not sure where they are at the moment, I will have to dig them out and scan them.
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Thank you we will have to keep in touch.
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Yes, please keep in touch. I pop onto Rootschat most days so you can contact me here.
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Hi again John,
You (or your dad) may be able to help me with something. When did William Harper die? there is a death reg. in Dec Q 1971 in Dudley 9b 407 with a birth date of 21.11.1886 - is that him?
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off the top of his head dad said he thinks he died in the 1920s because his granny married a skelding in the 1930s but he will check it out
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Thank you for checking that for me. I have a marriage of Mary Jane Harper to William Thomas Skelding in 1932 in Dudley, and a death of Mary Jane Skelding on 9 June 1970 in Dudley and her burial at Dudley Cemetery on 12 June 1970. I couldn't find an obvious death for William Harper prior to the Skelding marriage so I was doubting myself, thanks to your dad for confirming that for me.
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Hi all wow things have certainly got complicated strange reading this years later. Funnily enough John I hadnt realised we had spoken before this was a very constructive thread I will add the pic of Ellen to the Lounds group on fb. Now when this lockdown is over properly we must organise a meet up and I will bring along my mother. I have met Tina and Caroline but would love to meet the rest of you x
Ps am in Essex so will need a proper plan