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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: donskie on Saturday 02 June 12 15:12 BST (UK)

Title: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: donskie on Saturday 02 June 12 15:12 BST (UK)
Hi
I recently found out my grandfather Robert John Allen was jailed for the murder of his boss Charles Lowes in Durham in July of 1904.  He was given 20 years penial servitude and was sent to Maidestone prison.  My Grandfather immigrated to Australia in Dec of 1923, with is wife and daughter who was 2, therefore he can't have served his full sentence.  I have tried searching but can't find when he was released, can anyone help me?  I have sent a letter by mail to the Maidestone Prison in Kent England but don't hold alot of hope of receiving an answer.
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: RJ_Paton on Saturday 02 June 12 15:38 BST (UK)
The Criminals calendars (1868-1971)  HO 140 held at the National Archives may be a better bet for further information.

On a side note and it is probably being pedantic  ::) ,  but if he had been found guilty of Murder in 1904 the normal sentence was death by hanging rather than Penal servitude no matter how long a period.
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: stanmapstone on Saturday 02 June 12 15:47 BST (UK)
Unless commuted to life imprisonment

Stan
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: RJ_Paton on Saturday 02 June 12 16:01 BST (UK)
Unless commuted to life imprisonment

Stan


True, although the original poster referred to 20 years penal servitude as the sentence handed down this may have been the result of a clemency plea or circumstances which resulted in a lesser charge being presented.
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: stanmapstone on Saturday 02 June 12 16:08 BST (UK)
What I meant to say was that a Death Sentence would be commuted to life imprisonment, but as you say, it would not be for 20 years,
If he was born in 1884 then he was in an Institution in the 1911 Census in Maidstone (Prison?)

Stan
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: stanmapstone on Saturday 02 June 12 16:25 BST (UK)
For one murderer, convicted in 1909, the death sentence was commuted to life imprisonment, he was released in 1928, so only served 19 years in prison, but I assume would be released on licence. In a report in The Times of Feb 08, 1932, there were a total of 65 prisoners serving life sentences commuted from the death sentence.

Stan
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: RJ_Paton on Saturday 02 June 12 17:26 BST (UK)
Linked previous thread by a different poster ....

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=iu11ai83ud26uqk4bodknt5i47&topic=599470;prev_next=next

The sentence was for manslaughter rather than Murder which although making sense in one respect does not answer the original question .... when did he get out.
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: stanmapstone on Saturday 02 June 12 18:53 BST (UK)
As it was for manslaughter instead of murder as was stated, then that makes the previous answers irrelevant

Stan
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: donskie on Sunday 03 June 12 12:41 BST (UK)
Hi

My mistake, he was originally charged with Murder but it was then dropped to Manslaughter, which your right, saved his life. 

I went to the National Achives but it just boggles me.... seems unless i am over in England and go to where the info is kept i can't see it.  Of course i could be completely wrong so if someone can find any info i would really appreciated it.  His name was Robert John Allen, sentenced in the Durham Assize July 1904. 
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: RJ_Paton on Sunday 03 June 12 20:05 BST (UK)
Unfortunately without a visit to Kew I don't think the records are available online (yet) but in those days the minimum served for such a sentence was roughly two thirds of the period handed down or in this case about 14 years which could give a release period from about 1918 onwards. Certainly, if assuming the 2 yr old child was his, then the release would have been no later than March 1921.

Combining these two "theories" would give a release date between 1918 and the beginning of 1921 - although my own instinct would be towards the latter part of this perhaps around 1920..
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: delboyinasia on Monday 04 June 12 07:39 BST (UK)
Hi, I'm new to this site. Just wondered if I might put my question in this section.
I am tracing Meadmores. I have managed to trace 2 names, both James, from around 1867/8. Having gone through the census' one name was absent from the 1881 records. The lad would have 14 at the time.
How can I check institutions?
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: stanmapstone on Monday 04 June 12 09:42 BST (UK)
Welcome to RootsChat
All the people in prisons and workhouses, as well as other institutions, are enumerated in the censuses. People in Asylums are usually only shown by initials.

Stan
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: stanmapstone on Monday 04 June 12 09:45 BST (UK)
When searching the 1881 census put 'prisoner', 'inmate', patient' or 'institutional' in the 'Relationship to Head' box.

Stan
Title: Re: how to find when someone was released from Prison
Post by: delboyinasia on Monday 11 June 12 04:52 BST (UK)
Stan,
Thank you very much for that. Hopefully it will open a few doors.

David