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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Glamorganshire Lookup Requests => Glamorganshire => Wales => Glamorganshire Completed Lookups => Topic started by: Vasquez109 on Friday 06 July 12 21:07 BST (UK)
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I've been very fortunate and been able to get my hands on a family bible (which I no longer possess but thats another story).
In it, ive been lucky to get information I never knew. Most of my mothers side of the family has been horrendous, only been able to get back to the 1860's on one side of her tree due to the nature of the surnames. Dreaded Thomas and Williams!
Even armed with this new information im still really struggling and not getting anywhere. Is anyone able to help as doing Welsh FH is much harder than English FH!
This is the info I have:
Margaret Griffiths born 1865 in Pentrechwyth, Swansea. Father = Samuel Griffiths born 1829. Mother = Margaret Howells born 1839. Don't know where Samuel and Margaret were born. Maybe Swansea?
Margaret Griffiths married Thomas Williams who was born on 30 Sep 1865. And he died 25 Apr 1928.
Nothing else is known! Can anyone help please?
Thank you!
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There is a possible marriage on FreeBMD:
Neath Dec qtr 1857 vol 11a p747 - on the same page are Samuel Griffiths and Margaret Howell
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do you have the family in the census?
1871 9 Cae Pistill, Llansamlet RG10/5441 folio 11 pgs 14&15
Saml Griffiths head mar 42 copper works labourer
Marg wife 30
David son 8
Marg dau 6
John son 2
all born Llansamlet
The marriage found by philipsearching looks likely as Samuel & Margaret are married on the 1861 census with a one year old daughter Elizabeth.
1851 Upper Bank, Llansamlet HO107/2464 folio 621 pg 17
Elizabeth Griffiths head widow 56
Samuel son 21 copper smelter
both born Llansamlet.
They're at the same address in 1841, when Elizabeth is 37. She didn't age well.....
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possible baptism for Margaret
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/X111-TGZ
1851 Hamlet of Gwindy, Llansamlet HO107/2464 foio 700 pg 52
Ann Howells head mar 39 domestic business b. Morriston
William son 18 copper smelter
John son 14 copper labourer
Margaret dau 12 general servant b. Swansea
David son 8
Robert son 6
Hannah dau 3
all born Llansamlet except where noted
1841 Greenhill, Swansea HO107/1426/9 folio 11 pg 14
Davd Howell 30 labourer
Ann 25
Wilm 9
Ann 7
John 4
Margaret 1
all born in county
possible marriage for parents
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/VF8M-8T8
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Which of the children of Margaret & Thomas are you related to? I can see a few possibles on the census, so any names of children would help.
There's a possible marriage
Thomas Williams june qtr 1889 Swansea vol 11a pg 1192 with Margaret Griffiths on the same page
1891 Clyndu Road, Clase RG12/4473 folio 44 pg 82
Thomas Williams head mar 25 tin furnaceman b. Llangyfelach
Margaret wife 24 b. Llansamlet
Ann dau 1 b. Llangyfelach
Ann Rees grandmother widow 78 retired dressmaker b. Gower
:-\
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Hi Osprey. Thank you for your replies!!!!
My maternal great grandmother is Mary Williams born 19 Sep 1894, location unknown. She married Thomas Thomas in 1919.
Marys parents are Thomas Williams and Margaret Griffiths (dates supplied in earlier message). Mary had a few other siblings:
Ann 1890-1891
Catherine 1892-1897
Elizabeth 1897-?
David John 1900-?
Sorry I have no other info! Help!
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1901 (RG13, piece 5070, folio 75, page 21) has
Thomas 35 b Morriston
Margaret 33 b Llansamlet
Mary 7
Lizzie 3
David J 3 Months
All children listed as Morriston
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this looks like Thomas in 1881, listed as a boarder but presumably with relatives, as he is with his grandmother as per 1891. all b Llangyfelach unless stated
David Lewis 31
Hanah Lewis 28
John Lewis 8
Anne Lewis 6
Thomas Lewis 3
Ann Rees 64 - mother in law, b Gower
Thomas Williams 16
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the 1901 listed by Mabel Bagshawe is one I had noted as well. Address looks like Tanylan Road, Clase & occupation for Thomas is tinplate doubler. Think it's the same family as I gave you in 1891. You mention Ann died in 1891. Was the date she died after that of the census?
The 1881 census has the family in Heol Ddu, Clase, David being a coal miner & Thomas a tin man. Ref is RG11/5354 folio 117 pg 36.
I have a candidate for Ann & Hannah in 1861, but will have another search before posting just in case.
;)
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ok, think this is Thomas & his family
1871 Clase, Llangyfelach RG10/5448 folio 4 pg 3
Thomas Rees head mar farmer 54
Ann wife 55 b. Pillstone
John son 20
Hannah dau 19
Thomas Williams grandson 5
all born Llangyfelach except Ann
1861 Cwmrhydyceirw, Llangyfelach RG9/4099 folio 24 pg 8
Thomas Rees head mar 43 quarryman
Ann S(?) wife 44 b. Ilston
John son 10
Catherine dau 16
Hannah dau 6
all born Llangyfelach except Ann
1851 Cwmrhydycwrw, Llangyfelach HO107/2468 folio 410 pg 45
Thomas Rees head mar 33 labourer b. Llangyfelach
Ann wife 34 b. Ilston
Cathrine dau 6 b. Llangyfelach
John son 10 months b. Llangyfelach
Lucy Jenkins mother-in-law widow 57 pauper b. St Mary Swansea
Elenor Bottin 12 house servant b. Nicholaston Gower
William Rees lodger 48 labourer b. Llangyfelach
I've not had much luck so far finding the family in the parish records on FamilySearch. Were they non-conformist? At least they have mother-in-laws living with them to help going backwards.
;)
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Ann's baptism - found by the old way by searching batches....
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FMML-4M9
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bit more on the Howells family
1861 Pentrewyth, Llansamlet RG9/4094 folio 39 pg 21
David Howell head mar 49 copper smelter b. Llansamlet
Ann wife 49 b. Morriston
John son 24 copper smelter b. Llansamlet
David son 19 copper smelter b. Llansamlet
Robert son 15 labourer b. Llansamlet
Hannah dau 14 b. Llansamlet
Mary dau 7 b. Holland
Elizabeth Henicott grand dau 5 b. Llansamlet
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Thanks everyone!
Sorry im late getting back to this thread (which im still finding confusing!) but ive just come back from a weekend away in the Cotswolds for my anniversary.
Think i need a bit of time to digest all this, not sure if im understanding this properly.
David.
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just ask if you're not sure.
;)
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Thanks everyone! I thought id try and start with just the Williams first. Id rather do everything systematically and not do it all at the same time!
I cant find Mary Williams and her family in 1911. Or Thomas in 1891 or 1881. Is it just me using ancestry wrongly?!? If I can find Thomas in 1911, it will show how many kids from his marriage and how long he's been married. But nothing!!!!
Sorry to be a PITA!
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Its ok now. Found them in 1911!
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ok, think this is Thomas & his family
1871 Clase, Llangyfelach RG10/5448 folio 4 pg 3
Thomas Rees head mar farmer 54
Ann wife 55 b. Pillstone
John son 20
Hannah dau 19
Thomas Williams grandson 5
all born Llangyfelach except Ann
Hi Osprey. Ive had a look at this, and the census image says Thomas William. Do you think that would be a Thomas William Rees and not my Thomas Williams?
Really struggling to find Thomas and am dubious about the 1851 and 61 census you posted if the child is in fact Thomas William Rees.
This is getting so confusing! :(
Thank you for all your help!
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The image says Williams, there's a squiggle after the m and the surnames haven't been dittoed in this entry. All the Reeses are shown as Rees and Thomas as Williams, so I'd say there's no reason to think this boy is called anything other than Thomas Williams. Grandmother Ann Rees ties him in to other census entries. And her place of birth helps with earlier ones. There isn't a Pillstone in Gower, Pilton, Pitton and Ilston do exist.
If you're wondering about Mary Howells showing with her birthplace as Holland, the Cambrian index has adverts for copper refiners to work in Holland. The adverts are from the 1870s, but show that it was possible that David Howells went there to work which could explain his absence in 1851.
http://www.swansea.gov.uk/index.cfm?articleid=6197
;)
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b
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Just a tip for everyone, if you're using RC on a public computer such as a library or internet cafe, then please remember to log out!
I hopped on a machine and checked my emails. As i clicked the link about the thread that RC sends you in an email notification I began typing!
Unbeknown to me, somehow as I posted my reply I noticed I was signed in as someone else!! I know it was my fault for not checking who was signed in, but other users should sign out of RC (or any other program for that matter).
What annoyed me more is that 'captainarseconkers' deleted my post and put 'b'.
Not a happy bunny!
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oh...and to top off all the good news.
My parents have cut the 'family' bits out of the family bible, binned them. And put the bible in a carrier bag and took it over the dump.
130 year old bible senselessly destroyed :( all because they didnt want it anymore.
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I work in the book trade - may need to lie down for a while.......
are you sure you're related to them?
;D
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No. I was brought up by dolphins! ;D
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;D ;D ;D
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Hi Osprey.
Just been trying to digest the Williams side. By looking at it, would you say that Thomas's mother was Hannah? And ive found it strange that no father seems to be around!
David.
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I think Catherine is more likely to be the mother of Thomas, Hannah would have been rather young. Do you have Thomas' marriage cert to confirm his father's name? june qtr 1889 Swansea vol 11a pg 1192 looks a possible.
There's more than one possible Catherine Rees marriage to a Williams registered Swansea. One that I'm sure married a Williams is
Catherine Rees march qtr 1865 Swansea vol 11a pg 694 with David Williams on the same page. I haven't found the other 2 people on the same page - Charles Gage and Mary Hanney, but there is a young Mary Gage as granddaughter in a Hanney household on the 1871 census in Llangyfelach, so right sort of area.
Scrub that I've just found A David & Catherine in 1871 and she was born Llanelli.
Another marriage reg sept qtr 1861 Swansea has John Harrington & Catherine Rees on the same page. I've found them in 1871, and she's too old & born in Ireland to be Catherine Rees.
Marriage cert for Thomas & Margaret needed I'm afraid. Doesn't look like it's a parish marriage as it's not in the ones available online, so likely non-conformist/registrar attended.
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Hi Osprey.
Im not sure if this is relevant, but I was looking at the Cambrian Index and saw this from the Daily Post in 1912. I cant find any mention of Tan-y-lan Terrace or Clyndu Street before 1891.
Surely this cant be a coincidence? Date is a little bit out but what do you think?
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Er....There's no option to add the photo.
When I click attach photo, the bit where you select the photo has gone. :(
The button that normally comes up saying BROWSE has gone. :(
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http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/824/01may1912southwalesdail.jpg/
Sorry. Have to to it this way! You'll have to press the rotate left button when you move the mouse over the image.
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is that the death notice of Margaret Williams that you're trying to attach?
Ties in with this death reg
Margaret Williams 36 june qtr 1912 Swansea vol 11a pg 1028
& matches age from Bible.
;)
had typed this anyway!
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have you checked the 1911 for the Margaret Davies born 1808ish?
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must be too late for me. The age in 1912 does not tie up with birth around 1865, Margaret is shown as 33 in 1901, so would be rather more than 36 in 1912.
:-[
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is that the death notice of Margaret Williams that you're trying to attach?
Ties in with this death reg
Margaret Williams 36 june qtr 1912 Swansea vol 11a pg 1028
& matches age from Bible.
;)
had typed this anyway!
Im confused. I thought this might have been Margaret Howells. :( and yes it is late! ;) I was up at 4.25am this morning!
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have you checked the 1911 for the Margaret Davies born 1808ish?
Your Search for Margaret Davies returned zero good matches.
Go Ancestry! >:(
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Just an update here, got the marriage cert for Thomas Williams and Margaret Griffiths from 1889. They married in Swansea registry office, and Thomas's father is stated as David Williams. But it's not really helping at all!