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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) => Topic started by: xpq194z on Tuesday 30 July 13 13:38 BST (UK)
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Hello
Have Thomas Gray named Smith when his mother Sarah gray married in 1834.selby yorkshire.
when thomas died he reverted back to the name gray.on form says J.W.DAWSON .Nephew
who this is no idea. today found 1911 access free. just put in name dawson .lived in selby.up came JOHN WILLIAM DAWSON.Lodger bord 1889 bradford.wife mabel dawson from pateley bridge.
Thomas gray or smith as he liked to call himself.was always in selby. so trying to see if this could be my elusive dawson.what do you think
mike
ps thomas died 26th nov brooke street selby. 1910
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Hi Mike
Sorry I'm a bit confused, what information is it you are looking for?
best wishes
Maria :)
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.on form says J.W.DAWSON .Nephew
who this is no idea. today found 1911 access free. just put in name dawson .lived in selby.up came JOHN WILLIAM DAWSON
On what form was this?
Did Thomas Gray/Smith have any siblings?
Did he marry and if so did his wife have any siblings?
John Dawson, if a nephew, should be a child of either Thomas or his wifes sibling.
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Hello Lizdb
Thank you for a prompt reply.this Nephew J.W.DAWSON was on thomas grays death certificate on the 16th nov 1910.thomas never had children with is wife ARABELLA GRAY.WAS
Bulmer divorced when married thomas.arabella father was wright.assuming must be some-one on arabella side.but for the life oof me.cannot find
mike
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What aboutThomas?
Did he have siblings? Did Sarah havechildren with Mr Smith?
There are more than one John W Dawson bnBradford of right age on previois censuses. So it would take a while to look closely at each and see if either parent for each could be a siblng of Thomas or Arabella. But quite possible to do. But would help to know what siblings they had!
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Is this Sarah & family on the 1841 census in Selby: -
James Smith, 40, ag lab
Sarah Smith, 30
Thomas Smith 12
James Smith 10
William Smith 7
all born in county
Ref: HO107 piece 1281 folio 13/25 page 6
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Hi Lizdb
that is the correct family.in the 1841 census
mike
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Do you know if Thomas's brothers kept to Smith or went back to Gray?
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Think they kept to Smith: -
1851 census in Selby
Sarah Smith, 44 widow
James Smith, 19 farm labourer
William Smith, 15 farm labourer both born Selby
Ref: HO107 piece 2351 folio 322 page 20
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Death for Arabella Gray Dec qtr 1885 Selby vol 9c page 423 aged 48
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Hi Lizdb
Yes thats correct.thomas gray is buried with her when he died.so selby cementry informed me.when enquired. there is a smashing headstone.in front of the cementry.must have cost quite a bit of money
mike
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Its not me giving you this info!
It's miriamkinga.
It shows that Thomas seemed to have only brothers . so any nephews via that route would have Smith surname.
So maybe Arabella had a sister who married a Dawson.
Lizdb
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You say her dad was Wright - have you got a Christian name for him? There are more Arabella Wrights around that I would have thought!
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Another, perhaps more distant, possibility is that John William Dawson was a nephew by marriage - i.e. he married Thomas' niece.
John W Dawson married Mabel Baines at Pateley Bridge, Dec qtr 1910 9A 116. (Obviously one cannot tell from this whether the marriage was before or after Thomas' death in November 1910).
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Hello Lizdb
Arabella father was william wright.but not reseach this line as yet.just been bugging me cannot find.but am sure your right.must be from arabella side.
mike
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Do you know when and where she was born?
Failing that, when and where she married 1st husband, Bulmer?
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Hello Lizdb
This is what have on arabella wright. christening 24th feb 1837.WRESSELL.Yorkshire
father William Wright in 1841 living in bondgate selby.
mike
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Hi Lizdb
On the marriage cert of arabella bulmer says widow age 42.living at selby st james.new lane
thomas is at 6 bondgate.father of arabella is william wright a brick moulder.thomas is blank where father is.but know who it was .
mike
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When was that marriage?
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Hello Lizdb
This marriage took place on september 18th 1879.in the parish church of selby.
in the presence of ALICE BRIGGS and WILLIAM RAWLINGS
mike
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Im still working towards finding Arabella as a child to ascertain siblings, first needing her yr and place of birth
Have you got Thomas amd Arabella in 1881, just after the marriage?
The only Thomas and Arabella Gray couple I can see are in Lincolnshire, and it isnt a common combination of names!
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Hello Lizdb
Thomas and arabella are living in bondgate selby 1881. Arabella married william bulmer in selby 1867. afraid have no cert for this marriage.assumed he must of died shortly before marriage to thomas.as they tended to do in them days.
mike
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... And Arabella was born ...? (From 1881)
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Hello Lizdb
Thought had already stated when born.he it is again just in case.1837 born wressell.
died 1o/10/1885.thanks for your help
mike
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So, in 1841 she is aged 4 and the only child at home with parents William and Elizabeth
1851 she is a servant
And I cant pinpoint her parents to see if they had more children - several William/Elizabeth Wright couples in Yorkshire!
So I havent made any progress as to whether Arabella had a sister who could have married a Dawson!
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Hello Lizdb
Thank you ever so much for your time and effort on this querry.some you win some stay hidden. guess mine is hidden.but you tried your hardest for me.what a young age for a servant.
parents were both born around 1816.but life was hard in them days.
thanks again
mike
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The National Probate Calender has Thomas Gray address at death as 16 Brook St., Selby.
We aren't allowed to do 1911 census look ups, but if you look up that address using the free search facilities on 1911census you might be pleased to see who lives there.
This will be your chap in 1901.
John W. Dawson, 46, Machine Labourer, b. Farsley,
Ann Dawson, wife, 39, Draper, b. Selby,
Herbert Dawson, son, 16, Gen Labourer, b. Farsley,
Edward Dawson, son 11, b. Stanningley,
RG13/4186/134/30
I'm wondering whether Ann Dawson is formerly a Smith, and Thomas Gray/Smiths niece. There is a possible John William Dawson and Ann Smith marriage in Bradford district 1883 that would fit the bill. Do you have Thomas Gray/Smith brothers in census, any of them got a daughter Ann, b approx 1861/2 in Selby?
Alan.
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Hello Alan
Its raining heavy outside thought would cheer myself up .nothing on the tv as such.and lo and behold .a smashing message awaited me.William smith and Elizabeth smith(lazenby) had two daughters been trying to trace for ages,Mary Smith born 1863 and Ann Smith. born 1862.assumed were working as servants in some house .as to why not found.am hoping you have hit the nail on the head.by a strange quirk of fate.the son of william and elizabeth called james smith born 1865 selby.married in stanningley sadly died young in leeds. married into the illingworth family.
now have to try and find a marriage for Ann as not on ancestry.maybe free bmd might tell me
thanks very much Alan
mike
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Hello ALAN
Sorry forgot to ask is there a ref number of the marriage
mike
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Hello Mike,
Two worth checking further, both in March qtr 1883 :
John William Dawson and Annie Maria Smith. Leeds 9b 658. (Yorks BMD site confirms this pair married).
John William Dawson and Ann Smith or Annie Jane Raper (one of two). Bradford 9b 269.
Second one is most likely if Ann Smith is the right bride.
Alan.
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Hello Alan
Thank you very much.would be welcome news indeed if correct.fingers crossed .will send away for a copy of marriage when able.cost £7.oo when last brought a cert.suppect price has gone up since then
mike
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£9-25 now!
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Hello Lizdb
Thank very much.for the information.and for the excellant help.not forgetting Alan also
now only have two more smiths to find.mary 1863.and emma she has vanished after being a wittness at charles smith wedding in 1900 doncaster.once again thanks all
mike