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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Dublin => Topic started by: bykerlads on Friday 05 September 14 18:40 BST (UK)
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I'm novice as regards Ireland but wonder if anyone can help.
I'm trying to find traces of the Spatchetts who seem to have been briefly in the Dublin area around 1870.
I've just found the marriage of Eliza Mary Spatchett nee Palmer to James Hammond in 1873 in Dublin South. She was the wife, presumably widow, of Thomas SPatchett, coachman b.1833 Baldock, Herts. They had previously lived in London, with a short stay in Aldershot.
No idea how Eliza came to be in Ireland- perhaps Thomas's work took him there and he died there.
By 1881 Eliza and James Hammond are back in London with their large family, mainly Spatchetts.
By 1891 they are all in Newcastle on Tyne.
There may be a record of E&J's daughter Ellen L Hammond born abt.1876 poss. In Ireland.
Any info gratefully received.
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The church record of the marriage
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/d606430550331
That's County Kildare, not Kildone
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Not having any luck with Ellen.
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Thanks, Sinann.
That's really useful.
Is there any way of finding out if Eliza's first husband Thomas Spatchett died in Ireland? I'm rather wondering if his employer in London had land in Ireland. I can't think of any other reason for the Spatchetts being able to go to Ireland.
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I had a look on the same site as the marriage but no luck, the name is a difficult one for Ireland and easly mis transcribed as you can see. So I tried all the Thomas burials in the same church as the wedding from 1869 to 1873. I guess FamilySearch is next.
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Tried FamilySearch and back to Irish Genealogy and Calendars of Wills on National Archives but nothing looks possible.
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Thanks for trying Sinann.
Do I deduce that records of deaths at that time in Ireland are not available?
I don't know anything about the place in Kildare where Eliza and James wed but - a total shot in the dark, this - I have a record of Eliza's father James Palmer in 1851 as a servant in the household in Eaton Place, London, of the Hon. Robert Daley b. Ireland. Could the Daleys' Irish estate have been in Kildare?
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PS-whoops it looks as if I've already looked into R.Daley , some time ago.
Must have another look, in view of the marriage.
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They married in Dublin, her address is Dublin.
James' address is Kildare.
Both James and his father are listed as a servant, quite possibly in Parlmerstown House, which I believe was owned by the Earl of Mayo.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_of_Mayo
As James went on to work for Hon. Robert Daley clearly he was seen as capable of working for the higher ranking persons of the times.
If Thomas died in Ireland he should be in the Civil Registration, also non Catholic Churches kept faintly good records of deaths, but of course people can slip through the cracks. When was Thomas' last child born? To narrow down the date of death.
Is a birth place listed for Ellen in the English Census?
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The marriage of Elizabeth and james in 1873 is at St. Mark's Church which is near Lombard Street ...given as Elizabeth's address. 12 Lombard Street was probably a tenement house and she was probably just staying there as a temporary measure. Her father James Palmer is listed as a Hotel Keeper...did he have a hotel in England?? or was he working as a keeper at someone elses's hotel ???
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For Ellen Hammond, dghtr of James and Eliza, (their only child together) I've not found a birth record, although she is recorded on 1881 census as age 5 b. LOndon, Middlesex. I just wondered if she was born whilst they were still in Ireland.
AS regards Thomas Spatchett first husband of Eliza nee Palmer, the last of their 6 children, FRederick George was born in Kensington, LOndon circa 1870. In the census 1871, Eliza is at Rutland ST Chelsea, wife, not widow, with all the children. I had not been able to find Thomas (coachman) on that census nor hie death and so had rather assumed the couple had split up and then Eliza had taken up with Hammond, claiming inaccurately that they were married. Clearly I had assumed wrong!
Maybe Thomas was already in Ireland in[1871 and she joined him later and then he died?
Or perhaps she went to Ireland because her father James Palmer was working there?
I'm always amazed at how working class folk, with their huge broods, moved around in pursuit of work in those days.
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Or perhaps Thomas isn't dead by 1873, if Eliza travelled to Dublin with just the children or on her own who would know if she was a widow or not. It happens.
What year was Thomas born?
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Birth registration: Ellen Louise Hammond July/Sept.1875 Chelsea volume 1a page 271
An online tree gives Ellen L. Hammond born 19 June 1875 at 41 Lower Sloane St., London
Added- both 1881 & 1891 census show Ellen's birthplace as Chelsea.
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THanks, Aghadowey. I'd not managed to find Emma's birth, Useful to know she was indeed b. London.
Sinann- Thomas Spatchett was born in Baldock, Herts. abt. 1834.
JUst as a point of interest, the Hammonds ( Spatchett, Palmer) continued their travels. After being in London 1881, they are settled by 1891 in Newcastle upon TYne. They are doing well, it seems. James H. is a certified bailiff. All his Spatchett step-sons are in the carting business. Intriguing why they all upped sticks and moved to N/C...