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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Sussex => Topic started by: fatfish on Wednesday 22 June 16 15:00 BST (UK)
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Hi all
I am trying to confirm a father and discover a mother of my great Grandmother Elizabeth Herrington.
Elizabeth Herrington born abt 1873 in Petworth (according to their marriage cert to Henry Fisher
1 May 1897 was 23 years old). Cert also shows her father as James Herrington a Coachman (domestic), witnesses were Caroline May & C Frankling.
1891 census shows her aged 20 as born in Petworth RG12/552/12/17.
1901 census (now Elizabeth Fisher) shows her aged 27 as born in Teignmouth, Devon RG13/663/19/20. I did consider that this was the wrong person but the address is the same as the address on my grandfather's birth cert.
1911 census shown as Elizabeth May Fisher shows her aged 38 as born in Petworth in Kingston Union Workhouse/Infirmary as a former Laundress with her one month old daughter Jessie Irene.
I cannot find an 1881 census for her.
I am trying to confirm a father James Herrington and a mother.
My most obvious candidate is James Dummer Herrington who married Elizabeth Purser in Petworth in 1872 Q2 2b 460 but seemingly also Harriet Annie Grevatt in the same marriage index.
There is a James Herrington on the 1881 census RG11/791/67/9 in Chiddingfold, with a Caroline shown as his wife & a 10 year old Elizabeth born in Chiddingfold.
Please can anyone help confirm the correct James Herrington & daughter Elizabeth that I am searching for please?
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My most obvious candidate is James Dummer Herrington who married Elizabeth Purser in Petworth in 1872 Q2 2b 460 but seemingly also Harriet Annie Grevatt in the same marriage index.
No, the actual record for marriages from Freebmd is
Marriages Jun 1872
GREVATT Harriett Annie
HERRINGTON James Dummer
PURSER Elizabeth
STONER James
So two brides and two grooms - therefore if James Herrington married Elizabeth, James Stoner married Harriett. The way to eliminate it would be to find Harriett in 1881.
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Yes - Harriett married James Stoner, obviously her as her mother is with them
1881 Petworth
James Stoner 34
Harriett A. Stoner 35
Alice M. Stoner 7
Richard Wither 60
Harriet Grevatt 63
Edward J. Grevatt 10
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I can't find a birth for Elizabeth in Petworth.
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Thanks Groom.
I've been struggling to prove which James Herrington is her father for some time.
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The James Dummer may not be correct! He was baptised 6th Oct 1844, no father but mother was Harriet.
We have his marriage but from Sussex Online Parish Clerks he and his wife Elizabeth baptised a daughter Harriett Emily on the 26th December 1873 in Petworth. So unless your great grandmother changed her name it can't have been her. Unfortunately the records seem to stop in 1873.
http://www.sussex-opc.org/index.php?p=437&n=Herrington&t=baptism&k=369605&l=102
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Hi I see indeed you have been struggling for some time, a thread in 2009 for an Elizabeth Herrington b 1874 Teignmouth. Devon, in 1901 as Elizabeth Fisher, same father/occupation?
Keyboard86
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I wonder how much of a coincidence is the presence of a James Herrington bn Petworth c1845 living in
Cobham, Surrey in 1891 and Chertsey in 1901 (where Elizabeth was in 1891) His occupation was Boot maker though ::) He was still Still in the same area on the last census.
Have you traced this one back :-\
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Hi all just get off my mind the Elizabeth Henly aged 7 b 1874 Petworth with parents Jeffrey/Elizabeth in 1881 RG11/1112/176/5 marriage December qtr 1874 Petworth, in 1891 Jeffrey is a Coachman Domestic?
Just cannot sort this Elizabeth out!
Keyboard86
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James Dummer Herrington married Elizabeth Purser, 20 June 1872, at Petworth
He was 28, a Boot maker, father not named
She was 33, father Edward Purser, deceased
both residing Petworth, one of the witnesses was Joseph Purser
Looks like mother and daughter may have died at the same time
June 1880, Westhampnett 2b 230
Herrington, Elizabeth (age 42)
Herrington, Harriett Emily (age 6)
Elizabeth was probably baptized at Egdean, 26 Sep 1835.
So perhaps James should have been recorded as widowed in 1881? Seems to be the man in Cobham in 1891.
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Hi searching for a James b c 1845 Petworth gives a James Herrington occ Bootmaker in 1881, 1851/71 a James Dummer/Dammer
Keyboard86
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The problem is I think that Flatfish says Elizabeth was born 1873 , therefore she can't be the daughter of James Dummer Herrington and his wife Elizabeth, especially as their daughter Harriett who was baptised in December 1873, died. So I think is the wrong family. There doesn't seem to be the birth of an Elizabeth born in Petworth in 1873 registered.
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Hi Groom, totally agree, but on the other requests/threads we have Elizabeth born as far back as 1871 I think, including Teignmouth, Devon?
It is that Elizabeth Henly in 1881 that puzzles me?
Keyboard86
PS and where does the May come from in 1911?
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According to Freebmd these are the only ones born during that period of time
Births Sep 1871
HERRINGTON Elizabeth Hambledon
Births Dec 1872
Herrington Elizabeth Hannah Driffield
Births Sep 1873
Herrington Elizabeth Anne Carlisle
Births Mar 1874
Herrington Elizabeth Westhampnett
Although Westhampnett is Sussex, it's not her as she was the daughter of Abraham and Esther. Maybe Flatfish's Elizabeth was illegitimate and never registered and the name added to the marriage certificate for respectability?
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It is that Elizabeth Henly in 1881 that puzzles me?
Keyboard86
That Elizabeth's mother was Elizabeth Habbin. This looks like the child's birth before the marriage
Births Sep 1873
Habbin Elizabeth Wakeford
Petworth 2b 295
I'd guess her father may have been a Wakeford? So maybe not her either.
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Per BMD the only Elizabeth Herrington born in Petworth in the 1870's was registered in 1878 (mistranscription on the certificate ?). 1878 matches her age:33 on the 1911 census.
Family Search has no record of a christening for this person.
I think you'll have to get a birth certificate to straighten this out.
Jann
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Thank you all for your effort and help on this one.
I have looked using the witnesses on the marriage certificate for Elizabeth to Henry Fisher. (Copied below from my initial post for information.) I was wondering if either could be a sister or brother in law. There is a Caroline Herrington married to a James Herrington on 1881 census in Chiddingfold (not too far from Petworth?) with a 10 year old daughter Elizabeth and an 8 month old daughter Caroline. RG11/791/67/9.
Elizabeth Herrington born abt 1873 in Petworth (according to their marriage cert to Henry Fisher
1 May 1897 was 23 years old). Cert also shows her father as James Herrington a Coachman (domestic), witnesses were Caroline May & C Frankling.
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Where in the Kingston registration district did the marriage take place, the witnesses could be local to there.
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They also may just be people connected to the church and no relation at all.
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Hi,
On the Marriage Certificate:
Elizabeth's age is 23. Therefore born in 1873
Her Father is: James Herrington (coachman)
Despite much searching, neither of these pieces of information has been proven by any official document. Conclusion: one or the other or both are incorrect.
I suspect the Elizabeth registered in Petworth in 1878 is the one. Probably illegitimate. You'd need to get the registration certificate to prove it.
Jann
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The 1878 Elizabeth is possibly with her parents William & Mary in 1891 Born Barlavington RG12/832 f72 p15 :-\
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The Elizabeth Herrington from Chiddingfold is interesting. It's about eight miles from Petworth, over the county border, and both parents were from Kirdford, also very near.
The sister Caroline was unmarried in 1901, as I think has been pointed out to you before.
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I assume that I am allowed to upload the marriage certificate? If so, it is hopefully below. If not, I apologise to the mods. Please delete. File is too big to upload as an attachment.
http://imgur.com/c03NKJD (http://imgur.com/c03NKJD)
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Interesting they were married by certificate not banns or licence. Although it says Queens Road Chapel, it looks as if it might have been a sort of register office wedding. According to that as well, neither father is deceased.
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Henry Fisher's residence on that marriage cert is Rowtown, Ottershaw near Chertsey
And Elizabeth Herrington born Petworth was a servant in Chertsey in 1891
Row Town is I think in Addlestone
Baptism in Addlestone, 9th June 1896
(private)
Harry
parent Elizabeth Herrington (single woman)
abode New Haw
Could that be your Elizabeth? Is a death in Chertsey district, June 1896, of a Harry Herrington, age 0
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That does look very possible and would explain how she met Henry. Her address on the marriage is Wimbledon, I wonder if that is where her father was working? Also possible that Henry was the father of the baby as Harry is a version of Henry and they married 11 months later.
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Thank you all for your help.
I shall now look for a birth of Harry Herrington in that area and order the birth cert.
Just a quick look, I can only see a Harry Wilfred Herrington Jan - Mar 1896 Camberwell 1d 997. Not him as mother is shown as Emma Maud Barnard.
The baptism for Harry on 9 Jun 1896 shows Elizabeth Herrington as a single woman abode New Haw.
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I can't see one either, it looks as if she didn't register his birth doesn't it? I see the baptism was private, which usually means that the baby wasn't expected to live, so perhaps he only lived a few hours and she thought as he was baptised she didn't need to register his birth, just his death.
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I can see a death registered, but I don't think that a death cert would show anything other thyan Elizabeth as person reporting death and the cause.
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I have ordered what I believe is Elizabeth's death cert in Jan - Mar 1936 Surrey North Western 2a 491. Having checked back on 1911 census, that shows that she had had 6 children, 3 living, 3 had died. I know the 3 children living at the time of the 1911 census; Reginald Albert Fisher, May Rosetta Alexandra Fisher and Jessie Irene Fisher (who died a few months after the census).
I haven't traced any of the 3 that had died prior to 1911 census, so the Harry that was found earlier looks an even likelier candidate to be her son and that that Elizabeth Herrington is her.
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Harry was buried at Addlestone 15 Jun 1896 age 6 months.