RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: weemalla on Monday 16 January 17 04:32 GMT (UK)
-
I have a birth cert, dated 1894 and in the column 'when and where born' it gives the date and has the comment "dying in Hospital", Ballarat. There appears to be no other death registration. Is this unusual or were still born deaths or births that survived only a matter of hours not required to be registered back in 1894. Cert 23236 attached
-
Looks like born at Lying-in Hospital Ballarat
example http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jag/
-
Just about to say the same thing cup of life. Lying in hospitals were set up as a safe place for poor or destitute women to have their babies.
-
Vic Death: place of birth Majorca matches although age does not quite match
1987 #17417 DEED, Eric
Father's name: DEED Percival
Mother's name Ellen (Salegary)
Place of birth Majorca
Place of death Heidelberg West
Age 76
Adding
Above is another birth
1910 #28741 DEED, Eric; Father's Walt Percival; Mother's maiden name Ellen (Saligari)
-
Eric's mother would certainly have met the criteria of "poor or destitute" She had a previous birth in 1893 to a Sydney Smith and he had presumably disserted her before Eric was born. The details of Eric given by cupoflife are definitely a different family.
Any comments about deaths not registered for deaths in the first few hours??
Also if Eric was adopted out where/how could I get information please.
-
Hi there,
I am not convinced that Eric's birth registration makes any mention of his death.
JM
-
Agree with MAJM,and informant is Superintendent of Lying In Hospital.
-
Agree with MAJM & Warncoort. I don't see any mention of dying, and why would there be, on a birth certificate, anyhow?
Interesting that the mother is from Majorca :)
Dawn M
-
Some 'wiki' notes on the Victorian goldfields town of Majorca for those interested.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Majorca,_Victoria
Sue
-
Re Adoption. The following is from Victoria's Dept of Human Services website:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01jar/
A brief history
Although an informal type of fostering or 'boarding out' was common during the late 1800s, it was not possible to legally adopt a child in Victoria until the proclamation of the first Adoption Act in 1928. ..... .
See also : http://prov.vic.gov.au/provguide-60
JM
-
team
Did Ellen DEED go on to marry William Campbell DUNCAN?! Ellen DUNCAN died in 1914 at Cobden aged 38 making the early children possible but tight! A write up on her at her death notes 'four little children'! I can only see 2 children to her and DUNCAN, so maybe the other 2 are the earlier kids although they wouldn't be little!
Interesting that the write up states that prior to her going to Cobden she had spent 10 years with the South Melbourne Mission?! Especially given her experiences in early life..... Might not be her though!
bitzar.
EDIT: father: Benjamin DEED, mother: Elizabeth Jane EAD
-
You could try the Ballarat Orphanage:
https://www.findandconnect.gov.au/guide/vic/E000695
Sydney Royal SMITH died in 1894, this death cert may show whether he was also in care at the time.
Debra :)
-
Re Reply 11. Where did death of Sydney Royal Smith in 1894 come from? I haven't previously had no date.
-
Burial at Ballarat Cemetery
SMITH Sydney aged 7 months 14 Feb 1894
Cando
-
Re Reply 11. Where did death of Sydney Royal Smith in 1894 come from? I haven't previously had no date.
It is found at the online index for Vic BDM.
1894 Death # 401 SMITH, Sydney
Mother's name Ellen (Deed)
Place of death Ballt E
Age 7 (JM assumes this is 7 months)
https://online.justice.vic.gov.au/bdm/indexsearch.doj
JM
-
Thanks for death info. I will get copy of death cert and see where that leads.
-
Death reg from my resource
SMITH Sydney
Father Sydney Mother Ellen DEED
Age 7 Age Code M = months
At Ballarat East 1894 Reg#401
Weemalla there are a number of public online trees for Ellen/Helen with certificates attached on Ancestry.com. I haven't looked them other than to view her marriage cert.
So many people just view ancestry trees and post their 'research' here without bothering to inform their sources.
Cando
-
In reply #10 there is the comment "Interesting that the write up states that prior to her going to Cobden she had spent 10 years with the South Melbourne Mission?!" Where can I find the write up please?
-
Found it on Trove. I just typed in Ellen Duncan and it was the first article. I'd say definitely her. The death of Ellen Duncan in 1914 at Cobden has father Benjamin DEED. She married William Campbell DUNCAN in 1907.
I could only find 1 child born but 2 deaths.
bitzar.
EDIT: Vic BDM. birth of Helen DEED, 1874 at Craigie. Now a locale near Majorca.
-
Here is the live link to the newspaper article that bitzar may have located.
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/154176195 16 Oct 1914
JM
-
Thank JM... I cant do it from work :o :o :o
bitzar
-
Re Reply 19 Thanks. I found it. Appreciate the lead.
-
When Benjamin died in 1916, Mrs Duncan is described as "the late"
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/2102992
Sue
ADDING.
The couple Benjamin and Elizabeth Jane (nee EADE) had a large family in and around Majorca.
-
Account of Ellen's funeral in Cobden
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/122875836
I'm wondering whether there are two Ellen DEEDs - or just the one with two lives ???
There is definitely Ellen who married William DUNCAN in 1907. Some of the on-line trees show a wedding photo of her in full bridal white, with William, their best man and a bridesmaid. The on-line trees also give the dates for the 4 children of William and Ellen, 1908, 1909, 1911, and 1912. One tree does mention Eric DEED b 1894 as a sibling of the 4 younger children. I couldn't see the marriage certificate that Cando mentioned.
Seems as though she has changed her life-style between Eric's birth and her marriage to William.
I'm 99% sure this is a red herring, espcially as I was looking to see if Eric DEED may have served in WW1 and I came across a WW2 record for an Eric DEED, supposedly born 11.11.1910, at "Cotswold", Victoria with a mother Helen, father's name unknown. There is only one part of this record which has been digitised, unfortunately. This man enlisted in Caulfield with NoK Eileen DEED, and was a POW. Cotswold is reasonably close to Majorca. However, putting his age down by 16 years is probably unfeasible.
Sorry - probably just muddying the waters :-[
Judith
-
Found it on Trove. I just typed in Ellen Duncan and it was the first article. I'd say definitely her. The death of Ellen Duncan in 1914 at Cobden has father Benjamin DEED. She married William Campbell DUNCAN in 1907.
I could only find 1 child born but 2 deaths.
bitzar.
EDIT: Vic BDM. birth of Helen DEED, 1874 at Craigie. Now a locale near Majorca.
Helen/Ellen was born at Garden Flat, Borough of Craigie, County of Talbot. Father was the informant and declared his residence was Majorca. From the birth certificate attached to an online tree on Ancestry.
Cando
-
The Eric Deed that served in WW1 is definitely a different family - he married Eileen Radcliffe 1936 and Eric's parents were Walter Percival Deed & Ellen Salagari.
I have it that the Eric Deed born 1894 to Ellen Deed with father unknown Birth Cert 26326, then Ellen had Sydney Royal Smith with Sydney Smith - birth cert #25816 says Sydney & Ellen married 24 July 1892 (but cant find marriage registration) and then Ellen married William Campbell Duncan in 1907 Cert #770 and had 4 children, Kenneth, Clifford, Roland & Alice.
-
judb....
Judith, remember the 'other' Eric DEED was born in 1910 at Majorca and his mother was also Ellen. Ellen SALIGARI, sounds European... possibly Ellen = Helen / Helena / Helenia as Euro version?!
bitzar.
-
Thanks weemalla and bitzar. I didn't think he could be the 'right' Eric DEED, really.
Judith