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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Topic started by: kiwianna on Wednesday 15 May 19 08:41 BST (UK)

Title: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: kiwianna on Wednesday 15 May 19 08:41 BST (UK)
I am doing some research to try and discover the  DNA link between two people and run into brick walls in trying to trace one persons line. Maybe someone would like a challenge?
My known facts
John Charles Crane born 11 May 1912 Hammersmith - Mothers maiden name Schmid on births registration

Father known to be Arthur Crane and mother Annie Maria Schmid (b 1873). Married 2 July 1893 Hammersmith

Arthur's father listed on marriage Banns as Alfred - deceased.

I have Arthur and Annie on census 1901 and 1911 (he born approx 1870) listing birthplace as Canterbury on one and Whitstable Kent on the other.

I cannot find him on any other census. I cannot find a birth in Kent between 1868 and 1873.
Total mystery man
Any ideas?

Many thanks
Anna
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: jonwarrn on Wednesday 15 May 19 08:51 BST (UK)
Possibility in Hammersmith 1891 ?
Arthur Crane, 20, born Kent Canterbury
Mother Sarah
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QQ6B-QMM
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: jonwarrn on Wednesday 15 May 19 08:59 BST (UK)
Arthur and Sarah in Hammersmith in 81? In index as Crand
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q273-Q3PS

Also Alfred, 22, Walter, 12
Piece 56 folio 128 page 12
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: jonwarrn on Wednesday 15 May 19 09:05 BST (UK)
School admissions, Saunders Road School, 16 January 1877
Arthur Crane, born 10 May 1869
Walter Crane, born 16 Jan 1867 (edit!)
Parent Sarah
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: jonwarrn on Wednesday 15 May 19 09:40 BST (UK)
May or may not be relevant :-\ 
Marriage in Gillingham, 3 July 1854
Alfred Crane + Sarah Ann Peatfield
Both of New Brompton
Alfred a Clerk, father Robert Crane, Clerk
Sarah's father was William Peatfield, Mariner.

Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 09:47 BST (UK)
Walter.Crane marries in 1896 Hammersmith, naming his father as William Crane, soldier, decd.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 09:56 BST (UK)
Arthur’s birthplace per 1881 “Wisterbul” looks like an attempt at Whitstable, so promising in light of the tie-in to later census.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: ShaunJ on Wednesday 15 May 19 09:58 BST (UK)
1871 - in Canterbury under the name Williams, apart from Alfred Crawford Crane: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:VF8G-W96
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: ShaunJ on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:02 BST (UK)
Alfred Crawford Crane was baptised at Kurrachee on 3 June 1859, born 23 September 1858. Father Alfred Crawford Crane, overseer sergeant in the Public Works Department, mother Sarah Anne.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:10 BST (UK)
Clara Crane, 15, a servant, was sent to prison (3 wks)  & reformatory (3 yrs) by Hammersmith Police Court on 8 March 1881 for stealing from her employer Jane Elizabeth Clark.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:17 BST (UK)
Alfred Crawford Crane died aged 28 on 30 October 1862 from dysentery.

He was buried 31 October 1862 at Kandalla, India.  Occupation: Conductor, P.W.D.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: ShaunJ on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:18 BST (UK)
Sarah Anne Crane, widow of Sergeant Alfred Crane,  was awarded a widow's pension from the Lord Clive fund from 1 August 1871. Aged 35, born Chatham, resident at 40 Winstanley Road, Clapham.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: jonwarrn on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:21 BST (UK)
Peatfield may still be in the mix! Re mother Sarah White in 1871 (found by Shaun)
Sarah Ann Peatfield, 48, widow, married Frederick White, 47, widower, 9 Nov 1857, Chatham.
Her father John Medhurst, Bricklayer
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:31 BST (UK)
Peatfield may still be in the mix! Re mother Sarah White in 1871 (found by Shaun)
Sarah Ann Peatfield, 48, widow, married Frederick White, 47, widower, 9 Nov 1857, Chatham.
Her father John Medhurst, Bricklayer

Clara Williams, mmn Medhurst, birth reg Dec qtr 1865 Lambeth 1b 297.

Would in fact be grandmother’s maiden name if so?
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:39 BST (UK)
Sarah Ann Peatfield was baptised at St Mary, Chatham 12 October 1834, daughter of William & Sarah Ann.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 10:51 BST (UK)
William Peatfield married Sarah Meadhurst, 8 Mar 1832 Queenborough, Kent.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 11:00 BST (UK)
William Walter Williams, mmn Peafield, birth reg Jun qtr 1867 Elham 2a 853.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: jonwarrn on Wednesday 15 May 19 11:17 BST (UK)
Excellent finds. Well done!
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: Annette7 on Wednesday 15 May 19 13:04 BST (UK)
If Alfred Crawford Chilton Crane died in India 1862 he couldn't have been the father of Arthur born in 1869??

Do we have the wrong Alfred?

Annette
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 13:13 BST (UK)
If Alfred Crawford Chilton Crane died in India 1862 he couldn't have been the father of Arthur born in 1869??

Do we have the wrong Alfred?

Annette

No I think we have the right Alfred, but of Sarah’s surviving children he was the father only of Alfred, and not the younger three - Clara, Walter and Arthur - who were under surname Williams in 1871 suggesting she had taken up with a Mr Williams after being widowed.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: ShaunJ on Wednesday 15 May 19 13:20 BST (UK)
Quote
No I think we have the right Alfred, but of Sarah’s surviving children he was the father only of Alfred, and not the younger three - Clara, Walter and Arthur - who were under surname Williams in 1871 suggesting she had taken up with a Mr Williams after being widowed.

That seems the likely scenario. I'm guessing that the widow's pension she was awarded shortly after the 1871 census would cease if she remarried - and so she reverted to the Crane name at that point.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 13:25 BST (UK)
An earlier child for the Cranes:

Walter Robert Crane born 15 Nov 1860, son of Albert and Sarah Anne.

Baptised 20 March 1861 at Poona, Bombay Presidency.

Died 22 April 1862 of cholera, aged 1yr 6mo. Buried 23 April 1862 at Malligaum.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: kiwianna on Wednesday 15 May 19 20:28 BST (UK)
Wow, great detective work!
The other party had mentioned a link with India so I think this is definitely on the right track.
 However I am left with more questions.

If Arthur was not the son of Alfred but rather a man named Williams then the Crane link thru Alfred is not a connection is to the Crane family DNA as there is no blood link.

So I am guessing I now need to turn my attention to Williams or to the mother Sarah's family to find the link. The interesting thing is the naming of Alfred on Arthur's marriage certificate
The Crane name a co incidental link to my own Maternal Crane lines.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: avm228 on Wednesday 15 May 19 20:30 BST (UK)
Who in particular have you found to be DNA-linked to whom?

NB Don’t read too much into the naming of a father on a marriage certificate - it’s frequently inaccurate, especially if the person marrying was illegitimate or estranged from their true father.
Title: Re: Mystery Cranes - Kent? London?
Post by: kiwianna on Wednesday 15 May 19 22:13 BST (UK)
This person shares DNA with my mother and myself. My mother's maiden name is Crane, this person is also Crane so they presumed that was the link. I've done a lot of work on my Crane tree but the connections to Alfred and Kent were not showing.
I'm thinking therefore the connection is thru another relation on my mother's side and the Crane is coincidental.
I checked shared DNA matches on sncestry with other confirmed Cranes on my line and none appear to share DNA with this person which appears to back it up.
He had little info on his family before Arthur so this is all new to him