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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Essex => Topic started by: dicko99 on Wednesday 24 July 19 16:25 BST (UK)
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The only surname I have for my 3XGreat grandmother is Jay.
I recently obtained her marriage certificate for 12 Sep 1847 when she married William Jay in Upminster. On the certificate her name is listed as Eliza Jay alias Hicks and her Father is listed as Edward Jay and she's a spinster.
Checking the births of William and Eliza's children on the GRO I can see that she registers her maiden as Hicks.
After her husband dies in 1849, she remarries to a William Savill in Cranham on 14 May 1854. On this certificate she's a widow as expected and again her Father is listed as Edward Jay.
The children this couple have including one called Charles Higgs Savill b. 1854 are listed on the GRO with a Mother's maiden name of Higgs.
The problem I have is I cannot find any records for Eliza Higgs/Hicks born in Rainham/Romford in 1826
Can anybody work this out??
R.
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Looks like the family is in Rainham (Horton Cottages) in 1841:
Edward Jay 60 labourer
Elizabeth Jay 50
Jonas (?) Jay 15
Eliza Jay 15
All born in-county.
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Shaun,
I had found that record myself but it does really help with explaining the Higgs/Hicks connection. The other odd things is that there doesn't seem to be any other record for Jonas apart from that one census.
I've also found the 1851 Census that shows the widowed Eliza living back at home with her Dad Edward and two children from her first marriage.
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The first child, Emma,may not have been William Jay’s, as she was born two years before they married.
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Eliza’s sibling: James? In the hornchurch baptisms, there is a James Jay baptised 3 June 1821 to Edward and Elisabeth Jay. Born 5 Feb.
Jonas 6/12/1823 baptised 2/11.
Didn’t find a baptism for Eliza in hornchurch or rainham.
Did find William jay’s baptism: 6/12/1811 to John and Elisabeth.
You might already have all of the above.
I wonder whether Eliza was with someone of surname hicks as common law wife, as Emma might not have been Williams?
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Emma Elizabeth Jay born 13 Feb 1845 and baptised 11 Mar. No name of father on baptism record.
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Baptism at Romford, 16 July 1826
Eliza
Dr. of Edward + Elisabeth Jay
abode Romford
father a Labourer
BT here
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9Q97-YSLF-Y3D?i=853&cat=515938
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Were Eliza's parents Edward + Elizabeth actually married?
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What made you think they weren’t?
I didn’t look for their marriage, but I did find William Jay’s parents marriage in cranham. 1807. John and Elisabeth salmon. She was a widow.
I didn’t find any children earlier than 1821 for Edward and Elisabeth btw.
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Were Eliza's parents Edward + Elizabeth actually married?
Nothing on PRs in hornchurch, Upminster, Dagenham, barking, Romford, wennington, aveley or rainham from 1813 to 1822.
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Hi
I haven't found a marriage for Edward Jay and Elizabeth either. The one in 1810 in Ovington doesn't look like being them.
But I don't know if Elizabeth was originally Hicks! If she was, it possibly might be an explanation.
John
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Thanks for all the info everyone.
On William Jay's side I have his parents as John Jay B. 1783 and Elizabeth Moore B. 1782. She married John Salmon on 17th Oct 1802 in Upminster and then John Jay on 12 Oct 1807 in Cranham.
I have her parents as Thomas Moore and Mary Nichols but no dates for either.
It's Eliza Jay's side that's still a bit of a mystery. Like yourselves, I have failed to find a marriage between Edward Jay and Elizabeth ?. From the 1841 census, I have Elizabeth as being born in 1791. If she was a Hicks then there are a few possible baptisms but they are all a long way from Cranham/Romford.
Also, if Eliza was born out of wedlock it might be possible that she was known as Eliza Hicks for a while but then where is that baptism? Everyone was baptised in those days, weren't they?
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But you have Eliza jay’s baptism and her siblings. James and jonas in 1821 and 1823 both Hornchurch. Eliza’s in Romford 1826. All three to Edward and Elisabeth jay (albeit that they may not actually have been married).
My bet is on Eliza living with a hicks when Emma Elizabeth was born in 1845. Hence the alias hicks.
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But you have Eliza jay’s baptism and her siblings. James and jonas in 1821 and 1823 both Hornchurch. Eliza’s in Romford 1826. All three to Edward and Elisabeth jay (albeit that they may not actually have been married).
My bet is on Eliza living with a hicks when Emma Elizabeth was born in 1845. Hence the alias hicks.
But that doesn't explain why all her subsequent children are registered with Hicks/Higgs as their mother's maiden name does it?