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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Somerset => Topic started by: weberpa on Wednesday 09 February 22 17:22 GMT (UK)

Title: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: weberpa on Wednesday 09 February 22 17:22 GMT (UK)
I am looking to find some information on a family that once lived (and died) in Taunton—they are not my family.  This is part of a Remembrance Day project I have been working on for several years. My goal has been to find any surviving family members of the crew on my uncle’s (Wilfred Weber) Lancaster plane, which crashed just before the end of the war. To date I have found 5 of the 6 families, but have been unable to locate any family members for one particular family, that of Edward Thornton.  You can see my project here: https://www.paulweber.ca/wilfred/

I do know that his father, Edward Charles Thornton, died in Taunton, aged 81 in December 1977. Mother, Doris May Thornton, died in Taunton, aged 72 in September 1964.  Edward (son)  enlisted in the RAF at Oxford in November of 1940. His original NCO number was 1314543. He was commissioned from Sgt. to Pilot Officer 1 November 1941.  He died on the same day as my uncle, March 5, 1945.   I have found online military sites that provide limited into on F/Lt Thornton, but not much more than that.

So in sum I'm looking for any family photos, info about the family like obits and any information on living family members.  thanks!
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: CaroleW on Wednesday 09 February 22 17:58 GMT (UK)
Welcome to Rootschat

What a wonderful project.  However - Rootschat has a very strict "no living persons" policy so we are unable to give you any specific info about living relatives.  We can try in other ways though.

To use the Personal Message system you have to make 3 posts (replies) and then more sensitive info can be sent direct to you.  Under your name on the left hand side you will see a little symbol that looks like a sheet of paper - that's what you use to send a pm
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: CaroleW on Wednesday 09 February 22 18:36 GMT (UK)
He was born 10.4.1922 but there is no birth registration nor is there a marriage for an Edward C Thornton to a Doris M
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: arthurk on Wednesday 09 February 22 19:47 GMT (UK)
I do know that his father, Edward Charles Thornton, died in Taunton, aged 81 in December 1977....

So in sum I'm looking for any family photos, info about the family like obits and any information on living family members.  thanks!

Edward Charles Thornton left a will, which was proved on 8 Feb 1978. Incidentally, the probate index gives his date of death as 23 Nov 1977.

The will is likely to be helpful in tracing his next of kin etc, though with the will ordering site going through a major "upgrade" (experienced by most as upheaval and chaos) it's uncertain whether you'd actually be able to order a copy at present, or how soon you might get it.
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: glenclare on Wednesday 09 February 22 22:13 GMT (UK)
The fathers date of birth, according to the death index is 24 April 1895.
Also Doris May’s probate entry says he was a retired petroleum engineer in 1964.
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: glenclare on Wednesday 09 February 22 22:31 GMT (UK)
I may have found a huge coincidence or be totally wrong.

There is a passenger list for April 1925, listing as follows.
Name:   Doris May Thornton
Arrival Age:   33
Birth Date:   abt 1892
Port of Departure:   Bombay, India
Arrival Date:   9 Apr 1925
Port of Arrival:   London, England
Ports of Voyage:   Singapore; Gibraltar; Shanghai; Colombo; Hong Kong; Kobe; Port Said Marseilles; Penang
Ship Name:   Malwa
Shipping Line:   Peninsula and Orient Steam Navigation Company Ltd

According to the full view she is travelling with Edward Thornton an engineer, and Edward Ross Thornton age 2 1/2.
They were resident in Sarawak, but intending to live in England. Address given, 24 Ellesmere road, Sheffield.
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: glenclare on Wednesday 09 February 22 23:14 GMT (UK)
Another passenger list. This time outward for the three of them.
July 31st 1925.
London to Singapore and then travelling to Borneo
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: glenclare on Wednesday 09 February 22 23:44 GMT (UK)
Another passenger list
9th October1937
All three travelling on the Orcades, from London to Sydney Australia (intending to remain there)
Previously at 116 whirlowdale road, Sheffield 

Added:
Quite a few voyages to and from Melbourne, and tourist trip to New York.

Still not totally convinced it is the right family but it would explain why no obvious birth or marriage record in uk.
And why do they keep returning to Sheffield, and then why Taunton  ??????
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Ladyhawk on Thursday 10 February 22 08:32 GMT (UK)
Another passenger list
9th October1937
All three travelling on the Orcades, from London to Sydney Australia (intending to remain there)
Previously at 116 whirlowdale road, Sheffield 

Added:
Quite a few voyages to and from Melbourne, and tourist trip to New York.

Still not totally convinced it is the right family but it would explain why no obvious birth or marriage record in uk.

And why do they keep returning to Sheffield, and then why Taunton  ??????

They may have married in Sarawak

On one the passenger lists I saw gives birth place of

Edward Charles born London,
Doris May born Sheffield &
Edward Ross born N(M?)iri, Sarawak
California, San Francisco Passenger Lists, 1893-1953

added for info. Sarawak births and deaths 1921 - 1923 are held The National Archives, Kew https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C6529734 this is available to download from The Genealogist. Partner websites are free to search but there may be a charge to view full transcriptions and download documents

On 1939 Register in Somerset Taunton there is
Edward C b1893, Doris M b1892  & Edward R Thornton b1922

Edit to add

The 1947 probate record Administration Wakefield for
Edward Ross Taunton died 5 Mar 1945, father Edward Charles Thornton,
Hotel Proprietor
address Winchester Hotel Castle Green Taunton matches address 1939 register
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Ladyhawk on Thursday 10 February 22 09:43 GMT (UK)
I'm wondering if this might be Edward Charles Thornton born London

Edward C Thornton nephew to Andrew and Esther Nichols on 1911c but he's born c 1895 North Kensington, London

There is a Nichols/Thornton marriage 19 Sep 1909 Barnet, Esther's father Daniel dec’d

Esther Thornton with her parents Daniel, cab driver, Isabella,
Brothers Edward & John and an adopted child in 1881.

Daniel Thornton married Isabella Regelous 20 Sep 1860, his father John Pinnnick Thornton

Esther THORNTON mmn REGELOUS
GRO Reference: 1879  J Quarter in LAMBETH  Volume 01D  Page 365   

Edward THORNTON, mn   REGELOUS 
GRO Reference: 1869  S Quarter in LAMBETH  Volume 01D  Page 344Possible birth entries for Edward

possible birth entry for

Edward Charles THORNTON mmn SIMMONS
GRO Reference: 1895  J Quarter in PADDINGTON  Volume 01A  Page 56   

and possible parents marriage

Marriage 7 Sep 1892 Christ Church, Notting Hill, Kensington and Chelsea

Edward Thornton age 23, carman
father Daniel Thornton dec'd, cab driver

Ada Simmons age 20
father Rueben, painter

Not found Edward, Ada & Edward Charles Thornton yet on 1901 census

EDIT to add see John's reply below you would need to see if you can get details for the 1921 marriage certificate to confirm the father's name of Edward Charles Thornton and Doris


Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: softly softly on Thursday 10 February 22 09:47 GMT (UK)
Marriage of Edward C Thornton to Doris May Holleley

Registration NumberGroom's Family NameGroom's Given Name(s)Bride's Family Name(s)Bride's Given Name(s)District
Unavailable
13148/1921 THORNTON EDWARD C   HOLLELEY  DORIS M    ST LEONARDS   Sydney NSW

Birth of Doris

HOLLELEY, DORIS  MAY     mmn FRITH
 
GRO Reference: 1892  S Quarter in SHEFFIELD  Volume 09C  Page 496

John
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Ladyhawk on Thursday 10 February 22 09:54 GMT (UK)
Marriage of Edward C Thornton to Doris May Holleley

Registration NumberGroom's Family NameGroom's Given Name(s)Bride's Family Name(s)Bride's Given Name(s)District
Unavailable

13148/1921 THORNTON EDWARD C   HOLLELEY  DORIS M    ST LEONARDS   Sydney NSW

Birth of Doris

HOLLELEY, DORIS  MAY     mmn FRITH
 
GRO Reference: 1892  S Quarter in SHEFFIELD  Volume 09C  Page 496

John

Great find John -  possible baptism and 1901 census

Doris May Holleley
Mother's first name(s) Sarah Ann
Father's first name(s) William Alfred
Bapt. 15 Jun 1892 Sheffield, St Stephen

131, Fawcett Street, Sheffield, Yorkshire & Yorkshire (West Riding), England
Sarah A   Holleley   Head   Widow   1860   Butcher Sheffield, Yorkshire
Amy   Holleley   Daughter   Single   1881   Sheffield, Yorkshire
Gertrude   Holleley   Daughter   1885   Printer   Sheffield, Yorkshire
Ethel   Holleley   Daughter   Single 1887   Sheffield, Yorkshire
Ernest   Holleley   Son   Single   1889   Sheffield, Yorkshire
Doris   Holleley   Daughter   Single   1892   Sheffield, Yorkshire
Percy   Holleley   Son   Single   1895   Sheffield, Yorkshire
Tom   Holleley   Son   Single   1897   Sheffield, Yorkshire

Edit to add transcript of marriage

William Alfred HOLLELEY age 22, Barber
father George, Butcher

Sarah Ann FRITH age 21
father William, Tripe Dresser

Marriage 27 Jul 1879 Sheffield, Wicker, Holy Trinity
Denomination Anglican
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: softly softly on Thursday 10 February 22 10:06 GMT (UK)
Info only.

Wlliam Alfred Holleley died aged 37 in 1898 Sheffield

Sarah Ann Holleley died aged 41 in 1902 Sheffield.

Doris does appear on 1911 census in Sheffield.

So any migration to Australia between 1911-21.

John

Added

Name   
Miss D Holleley
Other   
G Berry
Birth   
abt 1891
Departure   
23 Sep 1911 England
Arrival   
Sydney, Australia

Probably went with her brother Percy Holleley as his name appears above hers on migration record.
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: glenclare on Thursday 10 February 22 12:52 GMT (UK)
Percy is a witness to Doris’  marriage.
Marriage Register is on Ancestry.

It confirms parents names, but has Ada as Adelaide (?)
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Ladyhawk on Thursday 10 February 22 13:14 GMT (UK)
Percy is a witness to Doris’  marriage.
Register on Ancestry.

It confirms parents names, but has Ada as Adelaide (?)

Great find glenclare - looks as if she is Adelaide on 1901 census

Piece:   29
Folio:   133
Page Number:   45

Edward Thornton   31
Adelaide Thornton   28
May Thornton   8
Charles E Thornton   6 Kensington

Edit to add birth registration for May and baptism

Margaret May THORNTON mmn   SIMMONDS 
GRO Reference: 1893  M Quarter in KENSINGTON  Volume 01A  Page 148

Margaret May Thornton born 11th Feb
Baptism    5 Apr 1893 Christ Church, Notting Hill, Kensington and Chelsea
Father:   Edward Thornton, carman Mother:    Adelaide

Added

I think she was known as Ada but born as Adelaide

1891 c Piece:   27 Folio:   120
Reuben Simmons 51   Head, Widower, Painter
Ada Simmons   18   Daughter
Edith Simmons 13   Daughter
Frank Simmons 11   Son
Alice Simmons 7   Daughter
Annie Simmons 5   Daughter
Kate Simmons 3   Daughter

Her baptism

Adelaide Louisa Susan Simmons
Baptism 7 Jun 1874 St James Norlands, Kensington, Kensington and Chelsea,
Father:   Reuben Simmons, painter Mother:   Susan Margaret

Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: softly softly on Thursday 10 February 22 13:30 GMT (UK)
Whist it does not matter at all Percy Holleley both married and died in Sydney.

John
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: weberpa on Thursday 10 February 22 14:10 GMT (UK)
Wow! What amazing information to sift through.  I obviously could learn a lot in this group. Thank you so much everyone who took the time to reply and apologies if my ask was a outside of what is permitted.

all the best,
Paul Weber
Ottawa, Canada
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Ladyhawk on Thursday 10 February 22 15:44 GMT (UK)
I haven't come across any public trees on Anc*y for Edward Ross Thornton which might have included a picture

Question

Do we think that Edward Ross Thornton was the only child of Edward Charles Thornton & Doris May Holleley? If so, difficult to go further forward ???

Edward Ross Thornton died 1945
Doris May Thornton     died 1964
Edward Charles Thornton died 1977 see Reply 3 ArthurK , obtaining his Will may be helpful going forward
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: softly softly on Thursday 10 February 22 15:52 GMT (UK)
I wondered the same Ladyhawk. If they did I suspect the child may have died at an early stage as there is never a reference to one with all the immigration records so far uncovered.

John
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: glenclare on Thursday 10 February 22 16:29 GMT (UK)
Another thing we will probably not find out is why did they all come to Somerset?
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Ladyhawk on Thursday 10 February 22 17:10 GMT (UK)
for info.....

It looks as if Adelaide Thornton died 1902 and that could be why her son Edward Charles Thornton is with Uncle & Aunt Esther Nichols (nee Thornton)

Her burial

Adelaide Thornton age 29
Burial    24 Mar 1902 Ealing, Greater London, England
Cemetery:   Acton Cemetery
Grave Number:   H58/I
Interment Number:   28551

It appears Edward may have remarried

Edward Thornton, carman with dau. May born 1893, his wife Ellen and 3 step children
their surname Tomlinson in 1911

Mar 1911 Kensington
Edward THORNTON
Name on same page
Ellen Tomlinson
Can't find the marriage online to confirm his father's name

George Thornton Birth  20 Jan 1913
Baptism    5 Feb 1913 St Mark, Harlesden, Brent,
Father:   Edward Charles Thornton, carman Mother: Ellen

Ivy Thornton
Baptism    10 May 1914 St Andrew and St Philip, Kensal Green, Kensington and Chelsea,
Father:   Edward Thornton, carman Mother: Ellen abode 5 Adela St Kensal Rd

GRO indexes mmn WAGER, same mmn for the 3 Tomlinson children


Another thing we will probably not find out is why did they all come to Somerset?


Perhaps there's a family connection somewhere  :-\

Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: weberpa on Monday 30 May 22 00:13 BST (UK)
I am finally getting around to following up on some of the great information that was provided. Is there a place that outlines how to obtain a will in the UK? Thanks :)
Title: Re: Taunton: Searching for info on Flight Lieutenant Edward Ross Thornton
Post by: Talacharn on Monday 30 May 22 00:46 BST (UK)
If you have name, death year and address:
https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/#wills (https://probatesearch.service.gov.uk/#wills)
The last I bought was £3.50 a few years ago.

Added: There could be several years from death to the Will being finalised. The one I bought was 4 years after. For someone who has served in the forces, you will need his number.