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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Devon => England => Devon Lookup Requests => Topic started by: insidecentre on Saturday 20 August 22 12:55 BST (UK)
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Hi am looking for any information on William Willis born 1874 Cullompton Devon.i know he had a son William Willis born 1896 in Tiverton,but I can't seem to find any info on a marriage for him or a spouse.any info would be great thanks.
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Is this Willis, jnr's. birth entry
William John Willis Q4 1896, Tiverton MMN - Lane
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See www.freebmd.org.uk
There is an 1896 marriage between Ellen Lane & Sydney Richard Willis in Tiverton
All censuses are free at www.familysearch.org. Here’s the link
https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/list?cqs=England+census
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On the 1901 census in Tiverton,
Sydney, 27, Carpenter, b.Brandinch,Tiverton
Ellen, 28, b. same
RG13/2132/13/17
No son William but 1 child recorded dead on later census.
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Death of William John Willis Q4 1896 , 0 yrs, Tiverrton
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Is this the father and son in 1911?
www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XW9G-7V3
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Is this William in 1901.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XSWK-HCD
John
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John
That suggests, on the full entry, that his father is a James Willis, 28, widower, b. America
???
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insidecentre - could you give us as much information as you have on both William's please?
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This may link William senior and James
1881
www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:Q27X-CS8Q
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Farms servant to a Charles Potter in 1891
RG12/1763/57/4
Add - I saw that one earlier but couldn't find him after this
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Just adding this in as a possible:
Death
William Willis, Q2 1912, Tiverton, aged 39 (b.c 1873)
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The reason I posted the 1901 census was to try and link William jnr to a family. Whilst it records that he is a grandson does not indicate he is the son of James.
It would appear that William senior was born
WILLIS, WILLIAM HAWKINS
GRO Reference: 1875 J Quarter in TIVERTON Volume 05B Page 417.
His mother Jane remarries twice, 1st to James King in 1886 and 2nd to Thomas Fouracre in 1896.
John
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It would appear that William senior was born
WILLIS, WILLIAM HAWKINS
GRO Reference: 1875 J Quarter in TIVERTON Volume 05B Page 417.
But we're trying to find who he married??
PS - and is this one, William, jnr's father
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I asked the OP earlier if he could give us more information on the two Williams that might help find a mother for the younger, but so far he's not replied.
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It would appear that William senior was born
WILLIS, WILLIAM HAWKINS
GRO Reference: 1875 J Quarter in TIVERTON Volume 05B Page 417.
His mother Jane remarries twice, 1st to James King in 1886 and 2nd to Thomas Fouracre in 1896.
He was christened at Cullompton 23 May 1875. Son of Mark and Jane Williss, Cullompton, Labourer.
They also christened son James 25 Mar 1874, Sarah Ann 12 Apr 1868 and Tom 24 Feb 1878, same details.
David
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For the backburner until op gets back.
Marriages Mar 1900
Sully Mary Hannah Tiverton 5b 611
Willis William Tiverton 5b 611
SULLY, WILLIAM -
GRO Reference: 1896 D Quarter in TIVERTON Volume 05B Page 410
Births Dec 1876
SULLY Mary Ann Clifton 6a 71
Deaths Mar 1900
Willis Mary Ann aged 24 Tiverton 5b 359
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Hi thanks for all your reply.i have William Willis sons marriage certificate.he married Ella jane jenkinson in Garstang 1923,father William Willis deceased, small holder.Thats all I have sorry.
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Marriage
1st January 1900 Tiverton
William Willis 24 bachelor labourer Leat Street Mark Willis labourer
Mary Hannah Sully 24 spinster Leat Street James Sully labourer
witnesses William Sully and Lucy Veals
Tiverton Gazette (Mid-Devon Gazette) 6th March 1900 has a report of the inquest into her sudden death.
1921 census Fanny Willis (widowed) is in Tiverton with several children. William Willis is in Garstang with Frank and Kate Fisher.
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So have I got this correct - his father is Mark?
I recall dismissing a Mark earlier.
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I think Mark was the father of William b 1874
Was William born 1896 the child of Mary Hannah Sully re 1900 marriage ??
SULLY, WILLIAM -
GRO Ref: 1896 D Quarter in TIVERTON Volume 05B Page 410
Kay
Sorry - I missed that John already posted this ::)
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Definitely says Mark on MC
(https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=370538.0;attach=541929;image)
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Deaths of William Willis & Ella his wife
William Willis
22 Aug 1896 Apr 1977 Apr-May-Jun Watford Hertfordshire
as perdob in 1939.
Ella J Willis
abt 1896 Oct 1962 Oct-Nov-Dec Watford Hertfordshire
John
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Summing up everyone's contributions:
The William Willis who married Ella Jenkinson in 1923 was born 22 Aug 1896 in Tiverton and gave his father as William Willis.
The William John Willis who was registered in Tiverton in 1896 died shortly after and so cannot be him.
In the 1901 census William junior is with Thomas Fouracre and his wife Jane, described as grandson. in 1911 he is with his father William (born Cullompton about 1875) who has a wife Fanny but they've only been married 4 years so she is not his mother. In 1821 he is in Garstang.
A William Sully was born in 1896 in Tiverton to an unmarried Mary Hannah Sully, who later (1900) married a William Willis who gave his father as Mark. Mary died soon after the wedding. There was a William Willis born in Cullompton in 1875, parents Mark and Jane (nee Hawkins). This seems to be the same Jane who was married to Thomas Fouracre by 1901. So it seems very likely that William Sully took his stepfather's name and became the William Willis we're looking for. Who his biological father was is a different matter.
Mark and Jane Willis also had children Annie, James and Tom all baptised at Cullompton, though somehow James was born in America. Jane's maiden name was Hawkins. She married Mark Willis in the Tiverton district in 1867. I cannot see them in 1871, presumably they were in America. By 1881 she was widowed, living with her children in Cullumpton. . Next door were a William and Mary Willis and in 1861 William and Mary had a son Mark, aged 20, with them, so they are probably her in-laws. She later married a James King but by 1891 was widowed again, Several Willis and King children are with her in that census but not William (1875). He appears to be working on the farm of a Charles Potter. She then married Thomas Fouracre. In the 1901 census her son James (born America) and grandson William are with Thomas and her, described as son-in-law and grandson. Son-in-law presumably means stepson (although James is a widower so perhaps he married a Fouracre daughter who died).
To check the William Sully theory I would suggest getting that birth certificate. If the birth date is 22 Aug 1896 that would confirm he became William Willis (who has that date on the 1939 register).
David
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To check the William Sully theory I would suggest getting that birth certificate. If the birth date is 22 Aug 1896 that would confirm he became William Willis (who has that date on the 1939 register).
David
I completely agree - would suggest that William Willis senior was indeed the natural father as I doubt very much that his mother - now Jane Fouracres - would claim young William (born Sully) as her grandson and with surname as Willis, if his father had been someone else as he'd not have been related to the Willis family at all.
Annette
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Summed up exactly :)
John
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Being devil's advocate ~
The only way to confirm/deny the theory that William jnr is the son of William snr, is for one of the descendants of William jnr to get a DNA test and see if there is a match to the Willis family.
Relationships on Census forms are not always accurate.
Gadget
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I would think it quite possible that Jane should end up looking after her widowed son's stepson, even if he was not her natural grandson. And anyway he may have been just visiting her and mostly living with stepfather or with someone from his mother's family.
There is at least one tree showing a living descendant of William snr's son Herbert, so a DNA test may be doable. https://www.ancestry.co.uk/family-tree/person/tree/12079029/person/290005380305/facts (It's a small world, I appear to be "step"-related to the Beedell family in that tree.)
If we're very lucky, the father may even be acknowledged on William Sully's birth certificate. I don't know if that would be shown in the indexes. There's also the chance of a Bastardy Order.
David
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It seems that the Willis family were his 'social ' family, which I believe is the most important, but it might be worth seeing if a DNA test would confirm a genetic relationship as well.
add- not sure if this was mentioned earlier ~ the Luton children are described by William, snr as stepsons but William jnr is described as son.
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Hi once again thank you for all you replys.i have just sent away for William Sully 1896 birth certificate, fingers crossed William Willis is down as the father.cheers
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Please do let us know the outcome of details. Even if his father is not named his mother will be and his date of birth.
John
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No problem will do,Many thanks
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Births Dec 1876
SULLY Mary Ann Clifton 6a 71
But, sadly
Death
Dec 1876 Clifton 6a 49
Sully, Mary Ann
Age 0
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Possible?
Baptism at Hockworthy, 5 Feb 1871
Mary Anna Sully
Parents James and Elizabeth
1891, Tiverton
Mary H Sulley, 19, Servant (Cook), born Devon Hockworthy
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Report in the Taunton Courier and Western Advertiser, 3 Feb 1892
I think it's to do with a maintenance claim.
Charles Stevens, labourer, Tiverton, who recently enlisted in the Devonshire Regiment Exeter, was summoned before the Cullompton magistrates Monday by Mary Hannah Sully, of Sampford Peverell.
Superintendent Collins announced the receipt of an anonymous telegram from Tiverton asking for an adjournment of the case. The request, however, was not acceded to, and the defendant was ordered to contribute 2s 6d weekly for 13 years.
Baptism at Sampford Peverell, 14 Feb 1892
Frederick Charles Sully
Parent Mary Anna
Born 30 Nov 1891
Is it the same Mary Hannah?
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Possible?
Yes, I was about to post the same.
She is with James and Elizabeth in Hockworthy in the 1871 Census (as Mary, aged 3 mo.) and the 1881 census (as Mary Hannah, aged 10).
David
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Death
Deaths Mar 1893
Sully Frederick Charles aged 1 Tiverton 5b 326
john
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William Sully 1896 birth certificate, fingers crossed William Willis is down as the father.
Highly unlikely (if not impossible, judging by the GRO index)
Cullompton School record for William Willis.
Admitted 23.4.1900
Willis, William
Parent or Guardian/Address - Thomas Fouracre, Growen.
Born 22.8.96
Last School Attended - None
Last Attendance 28.10.03
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Several newspaper articles I believe re William born 1875 being the victim of a nasty stabbing in cullumpton in 1890
John
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Hi so I've got the birth certificate and jonw65 was right.Fathers name missing and this William was born 14th September 1896 Tiverton mother Mary Hannah Sully.cheers