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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Gloucestershire => England => Gloucestershire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: kelzies on Friday 09 September 22 07:51 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I'm hoping someone could please look up the details of a marriage for me?
Joseph Hollan (should be Holland) married Priscilla Brooker
3rd Quarter 1870
Cheltenham
Vol: 6a
Page: 907
I'm really hoping Joseph's father's name might be a major help.
DNA matches seem to suggest that he's possibly the brother or cousin of my 4x great-grandmother, Rachel Holland (baptised around 1786). She married my 4x great-grandfather in London and I haven't found any traces of her pre-marriage. Their marriage record was destroyed in WWII, and she died before the 1851 census, so I don't know any potential relatives or where she was born.
Thank you for any help anyone can provide!
Kellie
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Not on FindMyPast or Ancestry.
Not found on Marriage Locator
So probably a registry office wedding. You would have to buy the certificate unless someone has already and posited it to their tree.
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I'd agree with mckha489 - the high page number would indicate a probable Register Office marriage.
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Hi
The 1851 census gives his birthplace as Bagworth Gloucestershire 1795.
Baptism Badgeworth
Joseph Hollons s of John and Mary Hollons 30 Oct 1796
Siblings Mary 13 July 1795 Hollons
Charles 10 Feb 1793 s of john and Mary Holland
Hannah 2 Oct 1791 s of John and Mary Hollands
Thomas 9.8.1789 s of John and Mary Holland
Mary 5 Aug 1787 d of John and Mary Holland
Sarah 7.7.1799 d of John and Mary Hollans
At Cowley
Absolom Holland 31.7.1785
Rachel is the eldest 28.2.1780 d of John and Mary Holland
There is a possible marriage at Cowley
John Holland of Horn?hampton and Mary Browne otp 30 May 1779
wit Peter Horbor and Thomas Browne
It looks like John Hollands was buried 3.12.1802 at Bageworth
Looks like Rachel may have had a child Richard bapt 19.3.1797 at Rendcomb
Ciderdrinker
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GloucestershireBMD
Joseph Hollan
Married
Pricilla Brooker
Cheltenham Register Office
1870
Etc.
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mckha489, BumbleB & Capetown - Thanks! Damn. I was hoping to get away without that, considering how long it takes international post to get here in Oz these days (and the cost!). Because of his circumstances I'm not surprised it's a register office marriage.
ciderdrinker - thank you for all that info! I didn't think that some might have chased him up so didn't add anything about them. I'm surprised you found that 1851 census since I sure can't. Other census returns put his birth in Cheltenham? Looking at the map I suppose you could say it is, heh.
Just to make sure we're looking at the same Joseph Holland, I better put more of what I know of him -
Joseph Holland married Sarah Fossett in Cheltenham in 1834. Both are listed as widows, but I can't find another marriage for him (her maiden name is Bowles). They had three/four children: George (b 1840), Louisa (b 1846), Emma (b 1846 in the 1861 census but nowhere else... possibly Louisa?) and Sarah (b 1854).
Joseph is a bit of a bad boy because he's had two children with Pricilla Brooker while married. Joseph George Holland (b 1846) and Frederick Holland (b 1848) but both go by Brooker in census records. Priscilla lists herself as married.
Joseph's wife Sarah dies in 1869 and he marries Priscilla the next year. Joseph dies in 1880 and Priscilla in 1889.
It's exciting that you found a Rachel! At least the name runs in the family, if that's not mine. My Rachel married Robert Hoskin in Newgate in 1807 and had her last baby in 1826. Not impossible, but for the 1780 baptism it doesn't seem likely ??? Might be a cousin then.
I only found this through four DNA matches (two from Louisa Holland, two from Joseph George Brooker) who are close enough matches to my mother and aunt. They match with known Hoskin & Holland cousins.
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Hi again
Here's the 1851 at 63 Regent St Cheltenham -indexed as Hollan on Ancestry
Joseph Hollan 58 married turn cock to water company Badgworth Glouces
Sarah 47 wife Cheltenham
Emily 11 Cheltenham
George 10
Louisa 5 daughter at School
William Baldwin servant 20 unmarried turn cock to company Cheltenham
Baptisms for the kids
Abel Jessy Hollon 26.6.1826 s of Joseph and Sarah Cheltenham labourer
John 31.12.1834 Cheltenham labourer
Emily 31.7.1836 d of Joseph and Sarah Cheltenham labourer
George 19.1.1840 Rose and Crown Passage Cheltenham labourer
Louisa 5.7.1846 same address and occupation
Joseph George s of Joseph and Priscilla 55 Sun St labourer 28 Dec 1845
Not sure if Abel's mother was the first wife or once again Joseph was being a little bit naughty.
His brother Absolomof hamlet of Littleworth married an Elizabeth Bridge 19.10.1812 at Hempstead.
Then a Sarah Boulton widow at Cheltenham 17.7.1826 wit Charles Hollond and Jane White
no sign of Rachel born 1780 ,brother Charles
Charles married Ann Franking 17.6.1821 at Prestbury.He died at Chelteham 13.1.1829.
Hannah of Litterworth married Hampstead 27.12.1813 to Aleander Beard -Daughter Jane bapt 26.2.1815 Cheltenham.Father carpenter.
Struggling to see Thomas and Mary
Ciderdrinker
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My Mother was 46 when I was born :)
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If you Google:
GloucestershireBMD
This website - Births/Marriages/Deaths in Gloucestershire - does (if noted) given the mother's maiden name.
e.g.
HOLLAND, George, mother's maiden name: BOWLES, 1839, Cheltenham, Cheltenham etc.
HOLLANDS, (with a S) - Louisa - 1846, Cheltenham, Cheltenham
There is a
HOLLAND, Ellen, 1854 Cheltenham - no mother's maiden name given
HOLLAND, Sarah Ann, 1854 Cheltenham - ditto
etc.
I have ages ago, asked for a look-up (at that time you could have one free look-up), both at Cheltenham and at the Gloucestershire Archives.
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Out of interest, the surname HOLLAND is listed is a known GYPSEY name and there are special sights for people researching ancestors, who did travel quite widely round the country.
I've also help a friend with the surname ALLA/e/N with his Gloucestershire/Wiltshire routes who moved North., originally called HOLLAND 'til them came up North of the Country,
In Wiltshire/Gloucestershire dialect the H is silent, and the D is as well. I was born in Wiltshire and would pronounce OLLAN for Holland.
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Hi ciderdrinker - thank you for posting the census and all the extra info!! Maybe Abel is from the first marriage? While I said I haven't found his first marriage... I haven't (in Cheltenham)... there are a couple of possibilities. Gloucester 1830 to Margaret Bishop or Bristol 1824 to Sarah Newton Maggs.
Wonder where Rachel disappears to. There's an overseer document relating to a Rachel Holland in 1802 in Cowley on Ancestry.
trish1120 - hence while I'm not ruling it out completely! :) He's born four years after their 2nd last child so he may have been a surprise! Wouldn't be the first time someone brought down their age to make it more in line with their partner either.
Capetown: I had no idea they could offer that. Much more used to not having that option, I'll definitely look into that. Thanks for the tip and the added info! And very interesting that the name is a known gypsey name in the area. I had no idea! Might have to look up these sites. And the different pronunciations can make life difficult.
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If you Google
Turn cock to water company Cheltenham
There is a very old interesting website headed
The Cheltenham Water Works Company.
Has maps and old photographs.
On page 11, The third reservoir was completed in 1847 and actually held 14.8 million gallons. It talks about the Company did not have the key to the main turncock etc.