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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Denbighshire => Topic started by: valerie1 on Thursday 23 February 23 11:19 GMT (UK)

Title: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Thursday 23 February 23 11:19 GMT (UK)
I’m looking for the death of my great aunt Ellen Davies born 30/4/1898 in Abergele
Parents Daniel and Emma
I don’t think she ever married or so I'm told
I have ignored any deaths that show actual day and month or state married or widow
I can find a 1939 entry for an Ellen Davies in Abergele it states she was born 4/4/ 1899 so I’m guess this could be her
There is a death for ED 1959 but when I looked the age it states she was 79 this would not work as she would have been 60
In 1921 there is ED working in Manchester in a laundry the age fits and her place of birth but I think she moved back to Abergele 
I know in later life she was with her sister Gwen who lived In Gronant but Gwen is buried in Colwyn
I don’t really know how to move forward,  she would have come from humble beginning so wills are out of the question
Any guidance would be appreciated
Thank you
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: CaroleW on Thursday 23 February 23 20:24 GMT (UK)
Where did you get her actual birthdate from?  Is it confirmed from her birth cert?

Death registrations prior to 1969 do not give a full birthdate & the age at death is not always reliable as it depends on the informants knowledge of the deceased.

I cannot understand why you think the birthdate of 4.4.1899 could be her.  It's not that unusual for the year to be "out" but you invariably find the day is correct.  If you look at freebmd there are 2 possible birth matches in the June qtr 1899 for that entry.

In 1911 - your Ellen is shown as b 1899 which is correct.  Born 30 April 1898 so still only 12yrs old on 2nd April when the 1911 was taken.

The 1911 has 2 ED's b Abergele.  Yours & another aged 13 so born before 2nd April. 

The 1921 was taken in June so your ED would have been 23 - but so may the other ED






Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 13:28 GMT (UK)
Hello CaroleW
Thanks for the reply
Her DOB is from a birth certificate
I guess I was clutching at straws re 4/4/1899
The 1921 census  in Manchester states 22 years and 7 months so I guess it’s not her either
So I’m no further forward lol the Kat sighting is in 1911 officially
I know sh3 used to be with her sister a lot in the 30s but that’s family chat and no  evidence
The 1911 census she is with her parents, Daniel and Emma, but has been transcribed as Eden, and it says that she is 12 years old
I’m stuck
Regards Val
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: Cas (stallc) on Friday 24 February 23 13:52 GMT (UK)
1921 free index, only person in household

Ellen Davies born 1899, Abergele, Denbighshire, Wales living Abergele Rural, registration district St Asaph, Denbighshire.

Has this one been mentioned? The one you stated was in Manchester in 1921

Cas
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 14:26 GMT (UK)
Hi Cas
I have missed this where did you find it
I’m thinking the one in Manchester is wrong
 Regards Val
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: Cas (stallc) on Friday 24 February 23 14:34 GMT (UK)
https://www.findmypast.co.uk/1921-census
free index, have not viewed full record

Cas
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 14:54 GMT (UK)
Cas  I must be missing something sorry
I can see ED  birth year 1896 which is not here
Then the next one is1899 when I look at it she was born in Abergele but all the people  are working at a Manchester
Laundry
I wish I could post the image
But I can’t see this Abergele rural one
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 15:02 GMT (UK)
Cas
Although it says Abergele rural
When you open it says birthplace
Occupation and employment states Manchester corporation sanatorium
It also states she is 22 years old and 7 months
It’s also interesting that 8 out of 23 people come from Abergele
Maybe there’s a link
I will do some digging
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: Cas (stallc) on Friday 24 February 23 15:05 GMT (UK)
There is only one result for Ellen Davies born 1898 +/- 2yrs living Abergele born Abergele living alone, or icon only states her. As said not seen full record.

https://www.findmypast.co.uk/search/results?datasetname=1921+census+of+england+%26+wales&sid=103&firstname=ellen&firstname_variants=true&lastname=davies&lastname_variants=true&yearofbirth=1899&yearofbirth_offset=2&keywordsplace=abergele&whereborntext=abergele&keywordsplace_proximity=5

Cas
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 15:10 GMT (UK)
It appears the sanatorium was in Abergele for  for children with TB  who came from Manchester which now makes more sense
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Friday 24 February 23 18:33 GMT (UK)
Hi Valerie, was she the daughter of William?
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 18:50 GMT (UK)
Hello LeeW
No her father was Daniel Davies
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Friday 24 February 23 18:56 GMT (UK)
oh yes I see now, William was her brother I think, if they were from Jenkins Street?
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Friday 24 February 23 19:02 GMT (UK)
this might be of interest, also confirms that John moved to Lancaster (from your other post about his marriage)
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 20:33 GMT (UK)
LeeW
That is amazing I have just danced around my lounge
I have Williams death certificate and to be honest, it says that he died on the road to Llanifair by an out building and to tell the truth I knew he enjoyed a drink and I thought him to be a vagrant
I can’t tell you what it means to have this info ,I also heard he had special needs but does the army rule that out
He died in 1950 from memory
And it shows  Ellen still alive in 1950
This is a fantastic piece of family history and I do t know how too thank you
Thanks so much
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Friday 24 February 23 20:53 GMT (UK)
no problem Valerie, the Visitor and North Wales Weekly news are a great source of research, for some reason obituaries in these papers very often list the entire family and where they are living. oh and the Ellen Davies you found that died  in 1959 was a spinster who died in Llys Onnen, Abergele (it was a home for the blind but not sure how far back).
If you have any specific date of other deaths in Abergele let me know (post 1945).
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 February 23 21:29 GMT (UK)
LeeW I’m in your debt
I’m still smiling at the information you found is blown me away the newspaper cutting
Now I’m very interested in that death, because I now know she didn’t Marry . I didn’t think she did and I’m pretty certain that when they were all young the girls  wore milk bottle, Glasses that’s how it was described to me so I now wonder if this is her
I will have to go back through my notes to find the details
It’s so interesting because it also confirmed lots I knew  about them it’s so lovely to have it in black and white
Thank you for the offer once I find Ellen’s death this family is put to bed
Honestly when items like this are found it’s like a win on the lottery
Val x
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Friday 24 February 23 21:52 GMT (UK)
some more snippets for you
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Saturday 25 February 23 07:47 GMT (UK)
This is so sad poor William

Daniel Davies was know to be a heavy drinker
He was my mothers grandfather and when my mother was 3 months old her own mother died and she was put in Dr Barnardos
I think she had a lucky escape one of her cousins was in his care and he was put in Dr B as he was running wild a bit like William and that was 1925 so Daniel was not a very nice guy
Thank you for this
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Saturday 25 February 23 07:49 GMT (UK)
LeeW
I think I might have to get a subscription to these papers
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Wednesday 15 March 23 14:57 GMT (UK)
Sadly I’m back
I can’t find a death ref for Ellen all I can find is Billion Grave photo
I went on the GRO but 1959 is missing
Ancestry don’t appear to have Ellen’s death and FindMyPast only have a photo of the grave in St Michael's
Can anyone help with a ref please
 
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Wednesday 15 March 23 15:16 GMT (UK)
First name(s)    Ellen
District    Aled
Last name    Davies
County    Denbighshire
Gender    Female
Volume    8A
Birth day    -
Page    337
Birth month    -
Country    Wales
Birth year    1880
Record set    England & Wales Deaths 1837-2007
Age    79
Category    Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Death quarter    4
Subcategory    Civil Deaths & Burials
Death year    1959
Collections from    Great Britain, Wales
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Wednesday 15 March 23 15:18 GMT (UK)
Once again Lee I thank you
I’m going to order this afternoon
Thank you
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Wednesday 15 March 23 15:19 GMT (UK)
I saw that but it was the Aled district that threw me
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Wednesday 15 March 23 15:25 GMT (UK)
This Ellen Davies left a Will
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 March 23 13:53 GMT (UK)
Lee W I missed this posting
That’s interesting i guess I can get a copy of this
I received the death certificate to day for Ellen Davies death 3 November 1959
It hasn’t helped at all lol
Says spinster Fathers name and occupation not know
The occupier recorded her death
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 March 23 13:54 GMT (UK)
Does this mean she left the Money  to a solicitor ?
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: LeeW on Friday 24 March 23 17:35 GMT (UK)
Because it states "Probate" than means she left a Will, if it says "Administration" then it means there is no Will.

The name(s) are the executors of the Will, and this being a solicitor they will probably take a percentage of the estate in fees and distribute whats left to whoever was in the Will.
Title: Re: Ellen Davies
Post by: valerie1 on Friday 24 March 23 17:45 GMT (UK)
Thank you