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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Devon => Topic started by: overlandermatt on Tuesday 03 December 24 23:08 GMT (UK)
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I'm struggling with some ancestors from Exeter. I ve not previously investigated anyone from the area so don't know how available the parish records are. I see a few Ancestry trees with names but without supporting records...
The ancestors I am primarily interested in are William Henry Saunders b1832 and Harriet Adelaide Brand b1835. They married in 1854 in Exeter.
Just interested to know if these parish records are available online rather than just transcriptions. I have Ancestry and FindMyPast subscriptions but I'm not coming up with much.
I could order the wedding certificate from the GRO but if the parish records are available that would save a little cash...
Thanks for any pointers.
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Have you looked for them on the 1841 & 1851 censuses?
Were they both born in Exeter?
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Previously, I have found FindMyPast has better coverage of Devon records.
I suspect the marriage was a civil one, so you may need to order it.
It looks quite straightforward to trace your William Henry Saunders and Harriett Brand through census records, and see who their parents were - this in turn leads to their marriages and baptisms of children.
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FreeReg has some parishes but none of Exeter.
Harriet Adelaide Brand's father was William Brand, mother Elizabeth she was baptised St George Exeter 25 December 1833.
Her father listed as a Broker address St Swithin's Street, Exeter.
William had died before 1841 census as Elizabeth is now Elizabeth Endacott
John Endacott 45 Broker Not born in County
Elizabeth 35 born in County
William 25
Elizabeth Brand 16
Catherine Brand 12
Susan Brand 9
Harriett Brand* 7
John Endacott 1 year 6 months (18months)
Mary Endacott 3
Matilda Endacott 5 weeks -- Matilda Victoria reg 1841 Exeter mother's maiden name Brand.
ADDED this would be her previous married name and not her maiden name (Brand)
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There is another family Endacott / Brand registering children
Mary Jane 1838 (June quarter) who could be Mary age 3 on the 1841 census
William 1839
Joses 1841
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Harriet Adelaide Brand's father was William Brand, mother Elizabeth she was baptised St George Exeter 25 December 1833.
Her father listed as a Broker address St Swithin's Street, Exeter.
William had died before 1841 census as Elizabeth is now Elizabeth Endacott
William Brand married Elizabeth White in 1822 in Exeter.
Elizabeth (White) Brand married John Endecott in 1837 Exeter.
A small window of time for the death of William Brand, but I could not see one.
Elizabeth Endecott died in 1844.
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From the marriage in 1822 we get a glimpse of other family members.
The marriage was with consent of Elizabeth's father, so she was under 21 at the time.
Witnesses Charles White, Charles White Jr., Eliza White and Sarah Brand.
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Charles WHITE and wife Elizabeth are still alive in the 1851 census in Exeter.
Charles White 79 born Exeter, pauper weaver
Elizabeth White 77 (wife) born Exeter
Harriett White 29 (daughter) born Exeter
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Wow. There's a lot of detail there to look at. Thank you for your efforts on this.
I have also found FindMyPast was more helpful on the Devon records (lots of Plymouth family) - I had just renewed in the hope of tracking a few records down. I can certainly go through the census returns but the parish records are always a bit of a mystery.
Thanks again.
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I've found GENUKI useful in detailing what parish records are held:
https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/indexpars#C
Unfortunately the records for one of the parishes where some of my ancestors lived were held in the local church, which was bombed in WW2 and the records were destroyed. The Bishop's transcripts are available but they tend to have a limited amount of information.
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Thanks Roobarb. I have also found Genuki to be a helpful resource.
In this case, I really don't know the Exeter area and its parishes at all well. Interestingly, I have found another tree with some common ancestors and these have included quite a few images from different parish records rather than just the transcriptions.
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Thanks Roobarb. I have also found Genuki to be a helpful resource.
In this case, I really don't know the Exeter area and its parishes at all well. Interestingly, I have found another tree with some common ancestors and these have included quite a few images from different parish records rather than just the transcriptions.
There are/were 24 parishes in Exeter!
That's a lot to trawl through.
List here: https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DEV/Exeter
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Hi
Not a lot of help but online trees give a marriage date of 12 Feb 1854 but no idea of parish.
Harriet Adelaide Brad was the subject of a child neglect case in 1845 when her step father was accused and convicted of assaulting her .The three younger half siblings were found in rags and filth.
He looks to have lost the plot after the death of Harriet's mother.
The obvious candidate for the groom
William Henry Sanders bapt 30.9.1832 at Holy Trinity to Thomas and Maria maltster of Magsalen St.
1851 Sun St
Thomas 64 malster Buckland B
Maria 46 boot binder Stewarton Devon
Caroline 20 dressmaker Exeter Trinity
WH 18 shoe maker Trinity
G Thomas 11 St Mary Major
Esther 9 same
F Richard 6 same
It does all seem to add up
Ciderdrinker
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Thanks Ciderdrinker.
I ordered the marriage certificate in the hope of a but more detail. I couldn't see a good match for the 1841 census but the 1851 onebprovides a good match.
I know that William Saunders went on to serve a full 21 years in the Royal Marines. I've ordered the attestation papers from the National Archives.
Harriet Brand looks to have been well researched. I'm amazed at the high standard of record keeping further back in her line.
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I'm trying to track down information relating to William Henry Saunders...
I received his Royal Marine attestation papers from the National Archives today which was great to read through. I'll have plenty to research from 1855 onwards.
I would still like to track down his baptism records from Holy Trinity in Exeter. The Devon Family History Society sells an index for these records and I just wondered what information might be included in such an index? Would there be any link to an actual record?
I have seen a baptism date of 30th September 1831 in a family tree on ancestry. The attestation pack from the Royal Marines suggests a dob in 1835 that I feel is incorrect. Has anyone any experience with the Devon FHS?
On a slightly different note, I am looking for William in the 1861 census - I think he was aboard HMS Leopard which was stationed in the West Indies at that time. How does one find census information for a ship?
Thanks in advance.
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1861
William Sanders 1830 Exeter on board Leopard in Rio De Janeiro
piece 4441 folio 256 page 17
Joseph Edye 1826 Devon takes you to the first page of names, go back 2 pages for the first page
4441/ 248/ 1
I used FindMyPast and just put in vessel name.
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William Henry Sanders bapt 30.9.1832 at Holy Trinity to Thomas and Maria maltster of Magsalen St.
Have you eliminated this baptism? Why?
From his marriage certificate, who is recorded as William Henry's father and occupation of father?
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In the 1861 census, Harriet Sanders (nee Brand) is living in the house of her mother-in-law, while her husband is away with the navy. Harriet is incorrectly recorded as Step-daughter, rather than daughter-in-law. She has with her 3 yrs old Ellen.
Also in the house are Henry William Sander’s siblings - George, Ellen and Richard.
Head of house is Maria Sanders widow age 56 born Staverton.
This agrees with the 1851 census posted in reply #11 by ciderdrinker
Therefore the 1832 baptism would look correct.
1841 census for the family (same address as in 1851)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:MQYM-FFG
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Thomas SANDERS and Maria LOWE - married 25 Dec 1828, Holy Trinity Church, Exeter
Children -
Caroline Sanders baptised 23 Jan 1831
William Henry Sanders baptised 30 Sept 1832
George Thomas Sanders bapt 25 Dec 1836 – died 3 Dec 1837
George Thomas Sanders bapt 3 May 1840
Ellen Saunders bapt 27 Mar 1842
Frederick Richard Saunders birth registered 1844
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1861
William Sanders 1830 Exeter on board Leopard in Rio De Janeiro
piece 4441 folio 256 page 17
Joseph Edye 1826 Devon takes you to the first page of names, go back 2 pages for the first page
4441/ 248/ 1
I used FindMyPast and just put in vessel name.
Thanks Comberton. That's really helpful.
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William Henry Sanders bapt 30.9.1832 at Holy Trinity to Thomas and Maria maltster of Magsalen St.
Have you eliminated this baptism? Why?
From his marriage certificate, who is recorded as William Henry's father and occupation of father?
Thanks Neale1961. This is definitely the one. I've subsequently found the parish records on FindMyPast. I've yet to get the marriage certificate but have no doubt now.
I think the Royal Marine record date of birth is unreliable. Probably completed on leaving the service. William might not have given his correct age too.
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I've been looking at the parents of William Saunders over the past couple of evenings. His father, Thomas Saunders looks to have been born in Buckland Brewer according to the 1851 census and the parish records available on FindMyPast show a Thomas Saunders born to John and Mary in 1784. I think he was their first born and there were other siblings born later on - George (1786), Elizabeth (1788), Susannah (1793) and Lewis (1796). Not taken the parents back any further but there do appear to be two John Saunders options born in the village...
Thomas next appears in 1828 marrying Maria Lowe in Exeter Holy Trinity. He is 44 at this point and Maria is around 23. I suspect that there was an earlier marriage but I'm struggling to find it. The only clue I have is a Louisa Saunders on the 1841 census aged 18. I don't know what happened to her - if there was a marriage then perhaps I could identify if Thomas was the father. Any help greatly appreciated on this one.