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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: elouise dorothy on Wednesday 22 January 25 18:15 GMT (UK)
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Hi i was wondering if anyone could help me look for my grandmas real family , i do still have her however she has dementia, i cant ask her now . so i cant access any records through matlock . she was born 5Th may 1939 , adopted from ilkest on hospital , i believe her adoptive parents were Walter Radford and a Nellie .Ive researched all of my mums paternal side n Ive got so far , i just find nothing., no records its really hard , i have been told her name was not the same one on her birth certificate . her adoptive name was Dorothy Valerie radford . thanks , Ive only got her DOB to go on .
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Duplicate post-
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=888837.new#new
I'm not sure how this might work but if there's someone looking after her affairs (power of attorney or such) perhaps they might be able to apply for information from her records.
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PoW was my first thought too. Have you considered DNA?
Some additional info for you but it doesn't help determine your grandmothers origins
Walter & Nellie are on the 1939 register & had a son b 1920 - he was their only child. George Eugene Radford b 5.12.1920 died 1969
Walter & Nellie (nee Watkinson) married 1919 Derbyshire
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Carole thats still amazing thankyou , thats correct it was Nellie and Walter , i believe they adopted 3 children ,
i simply cant cant access the records its very complicated , we lost my grandad a year ago , he alway said no to accessing records , i will look into it however ,thankyou , her surname could of been moorley . ive researched for the last couple of years its so difficult with adoption and may 1939 .
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She was not with the Radfords in September 1939 when the 1939 register was compiled as there are no redacted entries for the Radford household
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Thanks so much for that , its confirms what i thought as i believe my grandma was born in a house on canal street , in ilkeston , n that her bilological mum gave up more than just my grandma .
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Is the name Moorley one that came down from family stories? I can pick up a possible trail worth looking into...
Fanny Walker married John Pritchard 1934, Basford district (at this stage, Ilkeston was in Basford)
John may have died 1935, aged just 22, Derby
Fanny Pritchard married Thomas H Moorley, 1937, Shardlow district (at this stage, Ilkeston was in Shardlow).
In 1939, Thomas H Moorley and Fanny (Elizabeth) Moorley live at No 1 Bungalow Canalside, Ilkeston.
These two children registered as Moorley with mother's name Walker. Two I'm fairly sure are theirs.
A daughter, 1938, in Shardlow district (Ilkeston was still in Shardlow at this time)
A daughter, 1939, in Ilkeston district (could be your grandma; it is a later quarter than expected but possible if her registration was delayed slightly).
A copy of the 1939 birth certificate would show the birth date of this child and may be annotated "adopted" (there will not be any direct note on the certificate of the adopted name).
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Given your grandmothers christian names & the name on the 1939 birth I would think the info posted by Jorose is well worth investigating
If the birthdate on that 1939 birth cert matches your grandmothers - search over😀
Fanny Elizabeth Moorley died in Derbyshire 1996 aged 81. Death reg shows birthdate 18.2.1915
Thomas Henry Moorley b 14.10.1911 died 1972 Derbyshire
EDIT
Looking at one of the redacted entries on the 1939 Moorley entry shows the married name of that child. It matches your grans married name. She married CH in 1961.
👏👏👏 Jorose
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Jorose that's amazing as I actually was given the surname Pritchard as well ! I just couldn't figure out why , if you could look I to that for me that would absolutely fantastic thank you so much
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Yes my grandma married my grandad Colin hicklin
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Blimey I can't believe it , the name Danny Elizabeth is also a possible name of the mother !
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Ment fanny Elizabeth
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I so grateful to both of you!
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Dorothy valerie Radford is who she was known as before she married my grandad , her date of birth is 5th may , moorley was a possible birth dine me but there was so many surnames mentioned so my mum gave.the surname moorley, Pritchard, Radford and possible name for mum was fanny of mother
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Fanny Elizabeth Walker was b March qtr 1915 Basford 7b 538 - mothers maiden name was Draycott
Fanny Draycott married Thomas Walker June qtr 1908 Basford 7b 493
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Fanny Elizabeth Walker is on the 1921 aged 6 with parents Fanny & Thomas. No others in household
Fanny & Thomas had 2 other children born & died Basford RD
Daughter Mary Ellen Walker born & died March qtr 1909 or 1910. The 1909 reg shows age 0 & the 1910 age 1. No other birth for that name in Basford
Son William Henry b 1912 died 1914 aged 2yrs
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Her date of birth is 2/5/1939 , apologise for that, she was given up I was told and there was more than 1 given up of her children , it was ilkeston hospital she was adopted from ? I really appreciate your help , obviously it's everything to me after losing my grandad, be be couldn't of been more than a year old when she was adopted or she was defintaley a baby
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So fanny was the only.surviving child of her mum and dad then
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Yes - very sad really
As your gran is not with the Radfords on the 1939 register something must have happened after September 1939 to cause the adoption.
That type of info will probably be in her adoption papers. If either you or another family member have Power of Attorney you can apply to Social Services for access to her adoption records
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all i was ever told was she was mistreated ,n this roots chat is just amazing , iam aware alot of my family on my grandmas side ,the ones ones iam talking about probably arnt with us now , its the fact ive found so many on my grandads side i just had to try anything , theres half a family out there , i not far from ilkeston either ,i can walk there , it makes it so much harder just not knowing , thanks again , gave me so much more already
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If you are still in the area, it looks like Ilkeston Library has a useful local studies section including some newspapers for the period:
https://www.derbyshire.gov.uk/leisure/local-studies/local-studies-libraries/local-libraries/ilkeston/local-studies-at-ilkeston-library.aspx
A lot could have happened between 1939 register and the end of WWII, it's hard to say. Injury, sickness, her father being away at war and her mother having not enough financial support, etc.
While Ilkeston itself was not a major target of the Blitz, there was a bombing of some houses during an attack on Stanton Ironworks.
https://www.ilkestonhistory.org.uk/2024/03/01/wartime-childhood-memories/
Based on birthdate, these records are probably for her father. A bit unusual of a move to go into merchant marine from Ilkeston I would think, but it's possible he had some technical skills (from working in the ironworks or other local industries) that he was recruited on, rather than as a sailor.
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C9631256
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D4318315
There are some later children in Basford district who I wasn't sure are theirs or not because in 1946 another Moorley/Walker couple marry in Basford
Doris Moorley, born 1942, died 1943.
A girl born 1947, in Basford district (probably the daughter of the 1946 marriage)
There is also a child born 1940, Moorley mother's maiden name Pritchard, who might be part of the family.
I think Thomas's family are the couple Moorley/Glenn (there are two Thomas Henrys of a very similar age!)
They are indexed as "Moodey" in 1921.
He had siblings, but only one appears to have left descendants, so if you do DNA you might find "Hollands" but not Moorleys.
Annie May, born 1910, married a Holland and had four children, of whom three survived to marry.
George William, born 1914 died 1929
Frederick Arthur, born 1917 and died 1946
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Hi,
You can only see part of the redacted entry on the 1939 Register on Ancestry, it does not show on Findmypast.
You can also see a birth date 2? May 39, so does look as if it may be your G. Mother.
Also living at the same address is a Thomas Walker born 22 Feb 1878, a widow could this possibly be your Mothers Grandfather?
Thomas is on the 1891 Census Ilkeston with his Parents William & Lucy Walker living at 21 Stanton Road. Also on 1881 census Ilkeston, but William is not at home.
If you do not have access to Ancestry, try your local library.
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Hi,
You can only see part of the redacted entry on the 1939 Register on Ancestry,
My ancestry image is completely redacted.
Would you please link to what you are looking at.
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On second page of entry there is a redacted entry. it doesn’t show the child's name but it does show her subsequent married name which is that of the posters grandmother
See my edit on my reply 7
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Yes, i read that, and am frustrated I cannot see that. So wanted the link so I could see how I was going wrong
I looked at book 2 age 7 as per the red writing. It is equally solidly redacted on my view,
Not a glimpse of anything round the edges at all
It’s OK, found it, had assumed both children were on the first page.
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Thanks for the replies again yes I do have ancestry it's where I've done my gran weather tree f9r the last 2 years so I will look at the newspaper links as well n see what I can find , this is very exciting for me n my family ,
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My name is Kelly Louise hicklin by the way , my grandma is my mother's mum
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At least you now have confirmation of her birth name & parents.
I hope you have some luck with Social Services as to why she was adopted by the Radfords & at what age as that's the final piece in the puzzle.
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The help I've received from all of you is life changing, I struggled with ancestry simply because I couldn't know for sure the surname and connection , I've added my grandmas really parents to ancestry n I getting hints , I've also found that yes Thomas Henry did go in the army 1939 n that sort of makes sense as to possibly why fanny Elizabeth gave my grandma up ,
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N her really father Thomas worked in ironworks as well I believe the railway from what I've found , Ian hoping I can trace any brothers or sisters of grandma now as the fact it's so close to where I live , it's possible I probably know one or two ,
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Iam struggking to find much on waters wife nellie so I will look Into that as well , maybe she worked in the hospital or was maybe a midwife or something
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If you go back to reply 2 - Nellie was previously Watkinson & her birth is on freebmd in the June qtr 1898.
GRO online shows she was illegitimate so you would need to download a digital copy of her birthcert for £3 to find her mothers name
I can’t find a 1901 or 1911 under Watkinson but there are a lot of female Watkinson marriages in Derbyshire between 1898-1901 so her mother may have married & Nellie is under her married name
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from looing at walters family if iam right , and fanny elzabeth walkers mum and family they both go back to crich ? i think , i am wondering if maybe the families knew each other