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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Topic started by: al b on Thursday 22 February 07 22:47 GMT (UK)
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Looking for any information on a John Thomas Roberts Married Marry Ann Gollop 1899 Dorset Born Ireland any help appreciated al b
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sorry - this is not help but just wondering - would they be in 1901 census= have looked but can't find them?
Do you have an approximate year of birth for him?
Any clues at all?
best wishes
heywood
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Hello Heywood John Thomas Roberts was married to my great grandma Mary Ann Gollop 1899. he was said to have been born 1850 ish Ireland His father was William about all I have on the old boy. Alan
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Apologies for more questions but it is too common a name at the moment to trace him.
Were they not in England in 1901?
Was Mary Ann a widow - just thinking that he would be on the old side or much older than her.
Have you seen the certificate- are there any other clues there - witnesses who could help to trace him.
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Hello Again No apologies necessary I should apologise for not having more info I appreciate it. Here goes they were in Lym Regis 1901 Mary Ann was a widow William Gollop was killed while fishing 1893-5 John Thomas Roberts was also a widower Trying to find his people mother father etc. My Grandmother was Mary Ann and William Gollops daughter. She died 1973 and never mentioned This Roberts fellow. There is a lady in Axminster that is related to the Roberts that is trying to find him Thought I would try to help. Thanks Again Alan
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Well as often happens lots of other questions are answered but not the one you want!
I take it that Mary Ann was a widow when she married William, then widowed again and married John Thomas Roberts.
The question is where was John Thomas when all this was happening - intriguing,
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No I can't find him in 1881 or 1891 - or even 1901. Mary A is married but no husband there - wonder if he was a seaman or in the army or similar.
There is a child - Jessie Roberts aged 2 months-your friend could try to the certificates re his job.
sorry and good luck to you both
kath
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We found them 1901 they had a child Silvia that started the Roberts They only had one as they were both pretty old Would really like to see her find out about him He was a fisherman Alan
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Hello again,
that would account for his not being there.
The child however is Jessie if I have the right one. I can't find a Silvia.
Mary A has 3 Gollop children, a Hodder son and Jessie. What do you think?
Ref: RG13; Piece: 2015; Folio: 35; Page: 20
I am searching 1850 +/- 5 yrs for John Roberts (which would bring up T) born Ireland and looking at those few that may be around the coast! (there are paupers/ vagrants and prisoners but no fishermen).
The nearest I can find which is a long shot is:
1871 RG10; Piece: 3742; Folio: 129
John Roberts aged 15 yrs born Wexford a pupil aboard a training ship - the Akbar which belongs to Liverpool Port.
Just looked that up and it was for the reform of Protestant boys.
It is difficult to trace Irish records as early as 1850s. I have looked on Family Search but there is nothing.
My last shot would be to check the witnesses to the wedding - and perhaps even the godparents to the Roberts child to see if any of them can turn anything up. He may have had children from an earlier marriage but Roberts is too common a name to try to sift out without other details.
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thank you very much everyone i am the lady that is trying to research her family. Sylvia was jessie's daughter, my grandma. I know that John was a widower and a labourer. his dad was called william and a butcher. the witnesses to the marriage were a james and susan perry.
thank you once again for all your help
From
Amber
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Hello Amber,
1901 - found James and Susan Perry
RG13; Piece: 2015; Folio: 35; Page: 19
James Perry 39 yrs stone boatman (barge) b Lyme Regis
Susan 42 yrs b Charmouth
James 2 yrs b Lyme Regis
there is a marriage on free BMD for 1897.
Susan Hannah Gordge
James Perry
William James Perry
living next door to a Frank and Elizabeth Gollop who is also a stone boatman.
now I recall I think that that Mary Ann is possibly a Goodge or Googe before she becomes a Hodder.
Sadly though no help for John Thomas!
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in fact there's another Gollop and a Hodder on the page!
Yes the connection between the couples does seem to be between Mary Ann and Susan!
Lastly Amber do you know definitely that John was Irish?
I'm afraid the search doesn't look too good.
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Hi Haywood You got the right bunch Frank Gollop was William Gollop s brother William was my Great Grandfather. Frank was said to have to been fishing with William when he was Killed in a rock slide Mary Ann lost 2 Husbands poor old gal had it Rough. Samual Hodder was from her first marriage to Hodder To bad we cant find more about John Roberts Thanks again Alan
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Haywood is there any other place a fellow might poke arround for this roberts fellow. I have three people that I can't seem to find out much about and I dont want to Quit on them yet. Alan
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i don't definitely know he was irish unfortunately. i have information that he could be from Sligo or from Antrim. But i can't be definitely sure he came from either of those places or from any where in Ireland for that matter. They were only married for two years before he died too. at a local sight in lyme. next time i visit i shall try and look for his gravestone.
i have heard that he was not in fact a widower but a bigamist as he had family in london but i don't know if this is true. i would certainly think something wrong happened because i get the feeling that Mary Ann never really mentioned him as none of her descendants really know anything about him.
from his marriage cert i believe he was born circa. 1849.
don't know if any of this helps. surely he can't pop up to get married and then never be heard of again?
Amber
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Hello Folks
Just reading through your thread...
The search engine for Irish parish records (incomplete baptisms & marriages for 9 counties only) shows a bunch of John Roberts, born around the country. The nearest matches to your John Roberts' date of birth would be...
John Roberts, born 1849, Wexford
John Roberts, born 1850, Armagh
You can take a look at the following web address (unfortunately it costs to get any additional information and I do not recommend the Wexford Heritage Centre!)...
https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/csi/all_counties/csi.cfm
Incidentally, there are also two John Roberts in the Sligo 1901 census.
Other than that, the only hint to where John might have come from is from trying to locate his father, William, in the Griffith Valuation. The Griffith Valuation is commonly used as a census substitute and, while is shows all heads of household, the on-line version is incomplete. It was taken in the mid 1800's. The on-line version shows 3 William Roberts in Armagh, none in Sligo.
http://www.failteromhat.com/post1845.php
Sorry, nothing conclusive.
By the way, what religion was John? I ask this as civil registration for Catholics in Ireland survives from 1864. For protestants, however, the civil registration dates from 1840 something. It is always easier to find a civil registration than a parish record!
Rachel
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By the way, what religion was John? I ask this as civil registration for Catholics in Ireland survives from 1864. For protestants, however, the civil registration dates from 1840 something. It is always easier to find a civil registration than a parish record!
Actually civil registration of Protestant marriages started in 1845 while for Catholic marriages it was 1864 so there were never any earlier Catholic records. For earlier dates you have to locate church records (if they still exist).
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either of the births might be right but i don't think the death is because he died in lyme regis in 1901.
i'm not sure what religion he was unfortunately. i don't really know anything. i think someone from the family has tried to wipe all trace of him.
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What denomination church did the 1899 marriage take place in? This would be a good indication of John Thomas' religion?
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Marriages usually, but not always, took place in the bride's church.
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the marriage was in the parish church whatever that means.
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Is the marriage in Ireland? or is it the 1899 one in Dorset you mentioned on 1st posting?
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Hi I know for a fact that Mary Ann was not a Catholic she was my Great Grandma and Her Daughter was Prod. wich was my grandma. As far as what church I dont no. Al b
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Is the marriage in Ireland? or is it the 1899 one in Dorset you mentioned on 1st posting?
Difficult to answer your question without knowing which country the marriage took place in. If it is Ireland, then a 'parish church' on a certificate would be Church of Ireland also called Established Church.
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Hi Marriage took place in Dorset Lyme Regis she never left there Al b
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either of the births might be right but i don't think the death is because he died in lyme regis in 1901.
i'm not sure what religion he was unfortunately. i don't really know anything. i think someone from the family has tried to wipe all trace of him.
I can't even see a death in 1901 for him! It is difficult to trace someone who does everything between censuses especially when we don't know where they originate from.
There is no real evidence that he is Irish. We know he is a widower from the marriage certificate - we don't have a wife's name to check a death. He has a very common name. There's not much hope really is there?
best wishes
heywood
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Grand ma never mentioned Roberts dont no a thing about him! Wish i did but no one left to ask ??? ??? al b
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well if grandma was the daughter of someone whose father died when she were a few months old- she's not going to know much is she?
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my grandma was Gollop who Mary Ann was married to before Roberts
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no there's not really much hope. :'( it says he was a widower but i've heard he was a bigamist. the whole thing could be a load of codswallop. there is no-one left to ask and its especially hard because Roberts only had one daughter so we can't ask the other side of the family. >:(