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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Flintshire => Topic started by: frankieb on Friday 29 June 07 19:55 BST (UK)
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Can anyone help me with my bennett and ramsden searches in bistre. ?? I have a benjamin bennett who was a miner born in connaghs quay who married a catherine jones . When catherine died in bistre in the 1880's i think benjamin married again to a mary -not 100% certain on that. Benjamin died in 1906 but i just wondered if there werte any relatives of his still out there in wales. ONe of his sons-my relative-william -married martha ramsden in 1910 in hawarden parish-but think it was the bistre church-and she was the daughter of james fletcher ramsden and frances davies. James was the son -i think only child-of william ramsden amd maria nee fletcher. William and maria were in bistre area on the 1851 census. William died in holywell area in the 1880's i think. I would love to beable to get more information on the bennetts especially-as i am in contact with lots of ramsden cousins but know nothing of the bennetts. please please help. thankyou
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Benjamin is given consistently as born in c 1835.even though he is difficult to find before 1871.However there is a Benjamin Bennett in 1841,showing as born in c 1835,and living in Wepre Northop,and apparently the son of William and Mary Bennett.As you will see from the Genuki page for Connahs Quay Parish,the Township of Wepre was added to Connahs Quay from Northop in 1844.
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/wal/FLN/ConnahsQuay/index.html
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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thanks william-so do you think that benjamins father could be william then??? it would make sense as his son -oldest maybe was william. I have not access to ancestry till i go to work on monday-work in a library-dont think ive found him on there anyway-never trust it. Have you got the details then i will maybe try to search monday-maybe area and page and folio and all that stuff?? Did youm search ancestry?? Was that the only benjamin showing up for thst time period born in connaghs quay-or wepre??/He ended up marrying a catherine jones i think-but its confusing because there is an earlier benjamin marrying a catherine jones-he is born around 1896 i think and its on family search so people think i am getting mixed up when i am more or less certain mine is the benjamin born 1835
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Apologies for not giving the details from 1841.They are;
HO 107,Piece 1407,Folio 12,Page 14.I think you are mistaken about him marrying again to a Mary,as he is shown in 1891 and 1901 as a Widower.Unless of course,he marries the Mary between the Census years,and of course Mary dies,also between the Census years!
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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Looking again at the possible Marriage of Benjamin Bennett to Catherine Jones.Looking at the ages of there children,I think it is almost certain that you are looking at the Marriage which took place at Bistre Emmanuel in 1853.
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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There is a Benjamin Bennett born on the 5th of August 1834,and Baptised on the 24th of August 1834,to Parents William Bennett and Mary Jones at Northop.This is from an extracted record of the local Parish.,on www. familysearch.org.If you are familiar with using the IGI,enter this Batch Number;C061741.
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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Benjamin Bennett bn 5 Aug 1834, bp 24 Aug 1834 Northop, son of William and Mary Bennett nee Jones.
Benjamin married Catherine Jones 1853 Bistre Emmanuel NWBMD. Gro reference 2nd Qtr 1853 Holywell RA 11B 469.
Children Peter, Martha, William, Henry, Catherine and Benjamin. In the 1881 census they had a g'son James Bennett living with them. Not all confirmed so may be others.
Benjamin bn 1834 was the son of William and Mary Bennett nee Jones. William was the son of Henry and Eleanor Bennett nee Coppack. Again not all confirmed. I was following the wrong line.
HTH,
Megran
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thanks for all your info-i have tried to search the familysearch but did not come up with any of this-must be doing something wrong. thanks again. What did you mean-you were following wrong line.??? I know its not confirmed but it sounds correct. I have will details of benjamin so i may order the will and then it may confirm some family relationships for me. You have been extremely helpful . kind regards
frankie
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thanks william and megran-this site is brilliant. i am going to follow up those leads-thanks again.
frankie
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Hello Frankie,
On your first post you say Benjamins son William married Martha Ramsden in 1910. Are you sure it wasn't his grandson William?
On the 1881 Census. Brick Lane, Bistre, Benjamins Son William is 19.
By 1891. Nant Mawr, Bistre, William has gone. If it was William, Benjamins Son he would have been about 49 when he Married Martha.
If I can get in the Archives next week I'll have a look.
Paul.
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Yes paul -thanks for that-i am getting confused with all the williams-the william that married martha in 1910 is the one born around 1886 to william and mary-think she was nee roberts. Think they got married in chester-as i said earlier-i have packed up my stuff in boxes ready to move so i am relying on memory for most of my stuff-bad i know-so my dates and facts could be a bit unreliable-sorry. And i have william and marthas marriage cert.-and as yet have not got the william and mary one from chester . So his father was the benjamin-then his father was the william-then someone has said that the father of that william is henry. But i do have the will index entry for benjamin for 1906 in bistre-so maybe it will give me a bit more and i may beable to confirm a little bit the relationships where there are no civil registration certificates to proove it.
thanks for that-any help is most welcome-i have struggled with the bennetts for ages due to the many similar bennett names and families in that area.
kind regards everyone
frankie-burnley lancashire
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back again paul and everyone-think i checked the cheshire bmd for the william and mary roberts marriage-as i could find nothing on the north wales one-and i thought it was correct if i am reme3mbering properly because i saw that in a later census william and mary had some williams and roberts nephews and neices living with them-but i cannott remember which census. i cannot check either because i dont have ancestry at home.
i have yet to find any connections to my bennetts -i seem to come accross a lot of the earlier benjamin and catherine nee jones bennetts-the ones who went to utah-but with mine i have drawn a blank. I know one of the families -sons of benjamin-went to treeton in yorkshire but as yet have not found anyone researching that line. The thing i would love to see the most to be honest is an actual photograph of a bennett family member. Its my husbands family and he never met his grandparents william and martha or any other bennett family members -so he has absolutely no information about that side of his family -and to see a picture or gain some personal information about anyone in the bennett clan would make his day.
So anyone out there with connections to these bennetts please feel free to contact us with any information however small because it helps to build up a picture of the family he has not known.
We have done very well with the ramsden side-we have found cousins all over but the bennett side has drawn a blank as yet. So all your input is brilliant -thankyou and much appreciated.
regards
frankie
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Hello Frankie.
Bistre marrage June 19 1853.
Benjamin Bennett(X) 23. Bachelor. Bistre. Labourer. Father William. Labourer.March 2 1856. Peter.
Catherine Jones. (X). 22. Spinster. Bistre. Father Peter. Collier.
Witnesses. Rees Lewis(X) & Anne Lewis(X)
(X)=Did not sign made mark.
Baptisms of the children of Benjamin & Catherine Bennett. Bistre.
Oct 30 1853. Mary.
March 2 1856. Peter.
July 15 1858. Martha.
Sep 24 1861. William.
May 18 1864. Henry.
June 16 1867. Catherine.
Sep 21 1871. Benjamin.
Up to William Benjamin's Occ. was Labourer. For the last three he is a collier.
Northop marriage. Sep 26 1822.
William Bennett(X) of Wepre, Northop. bachelor & Labourer.
Mary Jones(X) of Wepre Northop. Spinster. Both being of age.
Witnesses. John Conway of Flint. Collier & Catherine Jones of Flint Spinster.
Hope this helps.
Paul.
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The Witnesses to the Marriage of William Bennett are of great interest to me.In fact there is a possibility I have the both of them on my Tree!I have a John Conway born in Flint in 1801 in my Tree.I also have a Catherine Jones born in Flint Common in 1796 in my Tree.This Catherine among other siblings,had two sisters a Mary Jones born in 1795 in Flint Common,and an Elizabeth Jones born in 1801 in Flint Common.The Elizabeth Jones is my Greatx3-Grandmoother and she married Edward Conway at Northop in 1821.Is the other sister Mary the one that married William Bennett?
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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How are you W R J. The other sister Mary could be the one who married William Bennett,
I forgot to post these Frankie.
Baptisms of the children of William and Mary Bennett (nee Jones)
Born March 14. Baptised, March 21 1823. Hannah. Abode, Flint Common.
Sep 2 Sep 25. 1825. Henry. Wepre.
Feb 23 March 21. 1828. Ellen. Wepre.
July 1. July 18 1830. Mary. ""
June 23. July 15 1832. Henry. "
Aug 5. Aug 24 1834. BENJAMIN. ""
April 23. May 14. 1837. William. ""
Paul.
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I'm fine thanks Paul,the only drawback to this being the Census Entries for Mary Bennett.The Census years give her Birthyear as no earlier than 1803.There could be another connection with the Conway/Jones, for John Conway's Grandmother was a Mary Jones born in Flint in c 1750.There was always a Jones as Witness to the Conway Marriages.
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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thankyou so much paul and william-you've been brilliant. Yes it looks promising that mary is the other jones sister-i would say yes anyway with no proof. I am amazed-thanks for your efforts in looking these parish records up paul-i am happy and i have found out so much more in just a few days.
Its good too that i have found a distant connection with you william-its hard with the names being so common in that part of wales to find a relation-however distant. :D
If anyone ever wants anything lancashire looking up i will do my best-and i have the will index's at my work from 1850's until 1943 for chester if anyone needs a look-up.
william-have you got any pics or family or friends photos of your jones's at all??? We-me and my bennett husband-are desperate for pics -he never knew any grandparents on any side of the family-and i have an idea he looks like the bennett side of the family as he is not a t all like a ramsden. He is tall with dark hair -well -black really and i feel sure he may have a likeness to the bennetts . The ramsdens appear to be mostly small with black hair and slim noses. And small heads. And his mum's side are small and have red hair. (they are williams surname.)
I would dearly love a pic of william his grandfather-the one born in 1886 (son of william and mary) and i am sure someone out there will have one-or one of any of the family.
thanks very much again for all your help-you dont know how much it means.
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Hi william and everyone
Just a funny thing-those jones's get everywhere. Later in the 20th century-one of william 4 's (the one qwho married martha ramsden in 1910) daughters ada bennett married a josiah jones in ashton under lyne-think she was trying to keep up the family tradition of marrying a jones-wonder if her family set up the marriage?? They were living in audenshaw by then and i know nothing of josiah jones-but he sounds definately welsh does'nt he??!!!!!
frankie
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Hi paul and william and megran
Just wondering if you can help again with the same bennett family. ?? I am contacting a man called john on another site and he has a tree similar to mine but he has the william bennett marrying a mary but not jones -duckworth. So its the william bennett who we say is born 1801 to henry and elaeanor coppack(not confirmed megran said). I feel that with your help i have found the correct william and mary nee jones for my bennetts line-but not sure about wether william from 1801 in wepre/northop etc who marries mary jones has a father named henry and mother eleanor nee coppack. Althouggh i printed out a copy of the 1841 census for william and mary nee jones and it looked like they lived more or less next door to a henry aged 65 years -a farmer butr cannott read wifes name-is it eleanor?? So surely william is related to this henry if not his son. This is where i go off instinct william instead of proof. What do you all reckon?? Hope im not being a pest.??? Maybe there are two williams born in 1801 in that area who have fahers named henry???? I hope i am connected to the cppack side-because that is listed a bit on family search and i know people on other sites who are connected to that line-so maybe i can keep my fingers crossed.
thanks.
frankie
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Just a few notes for you.
Henry Bennett and Eleanor, sometimes Elinor or Ellen.
William Bennett bp 6 June 1801 married Mary Jones 26 Sept 1822 Northop Mary bp 1803 dau of George and Mary Jones. Details re Mary need checking.
A book which could be helpful to you, "A Lifetime of Ships" by Tom Coppack, also "Schooner Captain" by Capt Hugh Shaw".
HTH,
Megran.
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thanks megran
willorder those books today from work-thanks. hope william has spotted the parents of mary jones cos maybe that will help him with his.
thankyou
frankie
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Yes I did take note of the Parents of Mary Jones Frankie,I am left wondering as to why my John Conway was a witness to William and Mary's Marriage?
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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Hi william
So is it the correct mary jones for you now you know her parents?? Were they not neighbors or same church goers or distant relatives or something???
regards
frankie
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Unfortunately Frankie,you can rule out any connection with the Jones Family of mine.The Parents of the Jones sisters I mentioned,were a Thomas Jones and Mary Davies,who were both born in Caerfallwch Flintshire.
Regards
William Russell Jones
Cefn Mawr
Wrexham.
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Hi Frankie,
Somemore bits and pieces for you.
Found a note to say Henry Bennett bc 1865 son of Benjamin and Catherine possibly dies in the Urmston area, sorry no other reference or source, from the 'early days' of my research.
William Bennett bp 1792 Hawarden son of John and Catherine Bennett nee Connah married Mary Duckworth 1817 Hawarden.
Their children Anne, Catherine, William, John, a second John, Thomas and Peter Duckworth Bennett, there maybe others.
There is a Henry bp 1773 Northop son of William and Anne Bennett and a Henry bp 1768 Northop son of John amd Catherine Bennett. William and John are the sons of Henry and Mary Bennett, making the two Henry's (1773 and 1768) cousins.
Seems to be two large branches of the Bennetts, popular names being William, Benjamin, Thomas then Henry, Samuel, John, Jonathan, James then later Nathanial and Frederick.
Hope this is useful and doesn't confuse things too much.
Regards,
Megran.
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Hi william, megran and paul and everyone else who has helped me
On another site i have somone again asking me if my william bennett born 1801 (we think to henry and eleanor)-is the william who married mary duckworth. Does this mean that there are two possiblities for my william bennett then??? These tow people on the other site have asked me about mary duckworth-so i wondered if anyone can spot that marriage for me -and maybe compare witnesses and parents and area of living??? The thing that i found was that there is a william and mary bennett which i thought was mine-think it is with the kids being correct-benajim etc-living next door almost to henry and elaeanor-when henry was a farmer aged 65. I am wondering who is the one getting mixed up-or could it be a coincidence that my william and mary are living next to henry and that there is anothe rwilliam and mary bennett nee duckworth living in the same place with different kids?? What do you think-can anyone help with this-i know its a difficult one pre civil registration ???
yours hopefully
frankie
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Hi Frankie,
Hope this helps to sort out the two (for now) William and Mary's.
Hawarden Marriage. 7 April 1817 By Lic.
William Bennett Sadler (Full) H (Hawarden) Ba
Mary Duckworth Sp
Wits Thos Bennett Catherine Duckworth.
1851 census Hawarden Village
William Bennett 59 bc1792 Sadler, Parish Clerk & Organist
Mary Bennett 55 bc1796
Anne Bennett 32
Catherine Bennett 30
William Bennett 27
Northop Marriage 26 Sept 1822 By Banns both of full age
WilliamBennett of Wepre Bac Lab
Mary Jones of Wepre Sp
WB X MJ X
Wits X John Conway of Flint Collier
Wits X Catherine Jones of Flint Mountan Sp.
1851 census Wepre
William Bennett 48 bc1803
Mary Bennett 47 bc1804
Henry Bennett 17
William Bennett 13
Leticia Bennett 6
James Bennett 4
Martha Bennett 2
William and Mary both buried Connah's Quay
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1851 census Wepre
Henry Bennett 79
Ellen Bennett 79
Samuel Harden G/s 11
James Hughes G/s 11
Lavinia Hughes G/d 14
Henry and Ellen both buried Connah's Quay
William Harding/Harwarden/Harden married Elizabeth Bennett dau of Henry and Ellen.
Humphrey Hughes married Martha Bennett dau of Henry and Ellen.
Regards,
Megran.
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Hi megran
Youve been very very helpful but i am still confused i think . From the details i just read of the 1851 census for william and mary nee jones-there is no benjamin on there who would have been around 17 like henry is. So maybe that northop family are not mine-and maybe the william and mary duckworth are mine. I think i need to check the kids on the 1841 census for william and mary living next to henry and eleanor-i printed it out from ancestry at work biut it was very small and i could hardly see the entry. But i am sure it has the william and mary with the son benjamin and they are next to henry and elaeanor on same street so to speak. So maybe they are cousins or something if william is not henry's son-maybe he is a nephew. ?? I just dont know-i am confused . Maybe i will never know the truth???
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I have just thought. Is there definate proof somewhere that the henry and eleanor are the definate parents of the william that married mary duckworth??? Cos some people on the other site have it as a definate. ???
regrds yet again
confused frankie.
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Hi again
Just noticed that you have just told me william bennett who married mary duckworth has parents called john and ann. Not henry and eleanor. So is there proof somewhere that william whommarried mary jones is the son of henry??? I just thought mine were them because of benjamin being born in connaghs quay and being a miner and not born in hawarden. My brain does not compute today for some reason. I need to really concentrate and write it all down-but not look at the trees on the other site which may be wrong and confusing me.
thanks.
frankie
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Hi megran, william and paul.
Having written it all down it looks like my benjamin Was the child of william and mary jones definately. And to be honest-my family of bennetts dont sound like they would be sadlers and church organists and parish clerks etc-not being mean but i think mine were not very well off.
So now all i need is the definate written down proof somewhere that william and mary nee jones is the son of henry and eleanor-tho on that 1851 census for wepre that megran posted-there is no sign of benjamin who would be around 17 like that henry. Has anyone spotted benjamin living somewhere in 1851??? I think i once on ancestry found one living somewhere in wales aged 20 as a lodger. ??
frankie
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Hi megran
sorry for bombarding you with messages. Just a thought-have you got dates of william and mary burials from connaghs quay-the mary jones one??? Maybe if i get dates of deaths of them i can get will information from somewhere which may help.???
thanks
frankie :-*