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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: Gillg on Monday 17 September 07 08:39 BST (UK)
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I'm searching for information about Joseph Voss, born c1836, probably in Huntingdonshire or Bedfordshire or even Northamptonshire, England. ::) Joseph was described on the ship's passenger list as a 21 year old "Farrier" or "Furrier" (unclear). He sailed for Australia on the "Shooting Star", arriving in Victoria in 1857. Travelling with him was 27 year old Joseph Fairy of Conington, Hunts. I do not know the relationship between these two, but both names occur in my tree.
The surname Voss has been mistranscribed as Vass on the Victoria unassisted passengers site. I have searched various records under both names, but haven't so far been able to find his marriage or death. Would welcome additional information or suggestions as to where to look further.
Thanks
Gillg
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Hi Gillg
I have found a Joseph Voss marrying a Mary Ann Fuller in Victoria in 1857 Reg. number 3830 and as his ship arrived in Feb 1857 this could be a possibility. unfortunately place of birth is not recorded in the index for this record.
If this is him I have also found 9 children all born to that couple in Melbourne from 1858 to 1878.
Then I have found a death for a Joseph Voss in 1891 In Melbourne East at the age of 55 Reg.No. 7241 showing parents as Thomas Voss and Ann Mitford. This would be about the correct age for your Joseph.
If you think this is your man, would you like me to list the children for you?
Noells
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Hi Noells
Thank you very much for this. Joseph must have been a fast worker to find a wife so quickly! I've found two Mary Ann Fullers arriving in Victoria in Jan 1857 - one age 20 on the "Stuart Wortley" along with Charles 13 and Matilda 24 and the other age 24 on the "Escort" with other Fullers Amos 33, Jane 34 and assorted children, ages between 2 and 15, so they may not all belong to Amos and Jane, unless they married very young. A couple of mixed bags, really, and difficult to work out who belonged to whom.
It's very useful to have Joseph's parents' names. I've been searching in the IGI and Ancestry census indexes (I'm not a member) and have found a few possibilities. And yes, please, I would like to have the names of the children.
Thanks again
Gillg :)
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Hi Gillg
Joseph appears to have had a brother who died in Victoria.
Thomas VOSS died 1869 aged 44 Born: Dorset
Parents listed as Thomas VOSS & Ann MUTFORD Reg: 1221
Mary Ann VOSS (born: London) married Edward GIDLEY in 1891 Reg: 5697
Mary Ann GIDLEY died 1910 aged 74 in Collingwood Reg: 12297
Parents listed as James FUTTER (i'd say this would be FULLER) & Elizabeth HAYNE
Regards
Genni
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Thanks very much for this, Genni
The pieces are beginning to fall into place now, but I'm intrigued at Thomas's birthplace. Much more work to be done obviously......
Regards,
Gillg
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Hi Gillg
these are the 9 children I found so far. There may be others after 1888 I will have a look for you and let you know.
Noells
Births
VOSS
Louise Mary Ann
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Place: RICHMOND
Year: 1858
Reg Number: 16158
VOSS
Florence Emily
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Place: RICH
Year: 1860
Reg Number: 12644
VOSS
Names: Alice Caroline
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Birth Place: RICH
Year: 1862
Reg Number: 17095
VOSS
Annie Elizabeth
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Place: RICH
Year: 1864
Reg Number: 24277
Names: Isabella Matilda
Father: Jos Fuller
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Birth Place: CWOOD
Year: 1868
Reg Number: 15537
Ada Contance
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Place: FITZ
Year: 1870
Reg Number: 15050
VOSS
Emmiline Rosa
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Birth Place: CWOOD
Year: 1873
Reg Number: 15627
VOSS
Frederick Charles
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Birth Place: FITZ
Year: 1875
Reg Number: 2407
VOSS
Herbert George B
Father: Joseph
Mother: Mary Ann FULLER
Birth Place: CO LL
Year: 1878
Reg Number: 8170
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Hi Gillg
I would suggest if you think the Joseph Voss who married Mary Ann Fuller is your ancestor that you order their marriage certificate online. As far as I know the cost is still $17.50 Aus. for an uncertified copy.
The link is
http://online.justice.vic.gov.au/bdm/home
Then scroll down the page to Historical Index and then click on Purchase & download an image. As you have all the details including the Registered Number, you should get notification almost immediately that the certificate is ready to download. It will be in PDF format, so I usually save it to Acrobat Reader and then print a copy from the web site. Having it saved in Acrobat means you can enlarge it to make reading the handwriting easier.
The information usually contained in the State of Victoria marriage certs is - When & where married; Name and Surname of the parties; Condition of parties: if widowed etc,children by each former marriage living & dead, and Birth place of parties; Rank & profession; Ages;Residence - present and usual; parents names and rank or profession.
So, as you see you should get the age,birthplace and parents names of the couple, plus you will also have the names of the witnesses to the marriage.
All invaluable when you want to look for them in the Uk census etc.
Noells
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Me again Gillg
I can't help myself - I had a look in the IGI on the LDS web site and found a marriage
Thomas Voss to Ann Milford 15th May 1819 in Portland, Dorset, England. ;D
I don't have a subscription to Ancestry.com but in the 1851 census there is a Joseph Voss born about the right time and a Thomas Voss born about the right time, both in Dorset. I might be able to go to the library tomorrow and have a look at the others in the house .
Noells
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Hi There,
To add to Geni's information in reply#3, if you look on Rootsweb worldconnect, you will see some more information about one Thomas Voss who died in 1869 and his wife Mary Ann and their children.
http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi
I do think though, as with many contributor based websites, you need to be cautious about material published on them. Only as good as the contributor and therefore prone to error.
However, always of interest as a base for your own further research.
Sue
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Noells
Thank you so much for all your help. It's much appreciated. I'm still trying to work out why a Dorset lad should team up with one from Hunts to emigrate, unless they met in the militia.
Another mystery is the arrival of Thomas Voss in Australia. I haven't found him on the assisted or unassisted passenger lists yet, unless like his brother Joseph his surname was mistranscribed.
Australian marriage certs are so much more helpful than British ones!
Gillg
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Sue
Thanks for your helpful hint. I know what you mean about information recorded by family researchers, and there seem to be rather a lot of question marks on this entry. Still, some of the information tallies with what we have discovered so far.
Gillg
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Hi Gillg
I have found a Charles FULLER dying in Williamstown 1904 aged: 62 Reg: 10965
parents James FULLER & Elizabeth HAYNE
Also Matilda Anne CHRISTIE dying 1866 aged 33 Born: London Reg: 3520
parents: James FULLER & Elizabeth HAYNE
So, that would make the Mary Ann arriving "Stuart Wortley" the likely candidate.
Checking the British Census - Thomas VOSS doesn't appear with the family in 1841, so he may have come out then.
Port Phillip was a part NSW then so the records would be with them.
If you want the info from the census, I can transcribe it for you.
Regards
Genni
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Hi,
Just noticed this thread. It's probably not directly connected, but my Foss ancestors appeared in the 1841 census in Beaulieu, Hampshire, mis-transcribed as Voss. Might be worth checking if the reverse has happened for your Thomas Voss.
I also found them transcribed as "Fofs", where the old long "s" had been misinterpreted, so "Vofs" might also be worth a look.
I'll go through my own research notes later to see if there's anything that might help. :)
Mike.
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A side-line ... there's a really good novel by Patrick White set in 19th C. Australia, caled 'Voss' ...
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Genni
This is great information! I can't see Thomas in the NSW arrivals so far, but will keep checking. He would be an early pioneer indeed if he left before 1841.
Yes please for the census information.
Mike
That's a thought - Joseph's surname was mistranscibed as Vass, so anything goes. There are quite a few German Vosses emigrating to Oz, too, which is confusing.
Lydart
The book sounds interesting. I'm off to the library to order a copy. Just Googled Patrick White and see that in his early life he attended Cheltenham College, just down the road from me.
And yes, Voss is also a town in Norway (been there).
Thanks everyone for your help.
Gillg
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Census 1841
HO107/282/12 page 5
Winterborne Came, Dorset
Thomas Voss 46 Blacksmith
Ann Voss 44
George Voss18
Mary Voss 13
Cornelious Voss 11
Caroline Voss 8
Joseph Voss 6
Susan Voss 4
All born in County
1851 Census
H107/1858/229 Page 8
Came, Winterborne Came Dorset
Thomas Voss Head 56 Came Dorset Blacksmith employing 1 man
Ann Voss Wife 52 Fordington Dorset
Mary Ann Voss Daughter 22 Came Dorset
Susan Voss Daughter 13 Came Dorset
James Voss Son 8 Came Dorset
Henry ?elsley Lodger 28 Manninglee Essex Game keeper
William H Chapman Lodger 16 New Lakenham Norwich Gardener
HO107/1858/230 Page 9 & 10
Came House, Winterborne Came, Dorset
Bosville Durrant Head Land proprietor
Joseph Voss Servant 17 Came Winterborne Dorset Servant
The household takes up the whole of page 9 and part of page 10 Joseph is listed on page 10
1861 Census
RG9/1353 Folio: 9 Page: 12
Winterborne Came, Dorset
Thomas Voss Head 66 Came Dorset Blacksmith employing 2 men
Mary Ann Voss Wife 62 Fordington Dorset Laundress
Susan Voss Daughter 23 Came Dorset Laundress
James Voss Son 18 Came Dorset Blacksmith
Cheers
Genni
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Genni
You're a star! ;D ;D ;D
Thanks so much. Now I just have to work out how Joseph Voss palled up with Joseph Fairy in Hunts.
Gillg
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Hi,
Some burials
Sharing location the - CE 124 002- on Altona/Williamstown cemetery deceased search facility...
http://www.altonamemorialpark.com.au/VirtualMemorial/VirtualPark.asp
Charles FULLER d.1904 "remains not at Altona Memorial Parkor not at marked location".
Edith FULLER d. 1875
Jane FULLER d. 1893
Sue
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Thanks again, Sue. I'm going to have to invest in a map of Australia, my geography is so bad.
Gillg
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Genni
Just a thought.... if Joseph's father was a blacksmith, he could very well have the learned the skills himself and become a "Farrier", not "Furrier", as described on the handwritten ship's passenger list which I have.
Gillg
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Hi Gillg
The only Fairey/Voss connection I found in the Victorian Indexes is as follows:-
Naomi BODGER who died in Victoria in 1880 Aged 45 Reg: 3675 She was born in Huntingdon
Parents: John FAIREY & Thomasine VOSS
She came to Victoria with her husband James in January 1865 on "Forest Rights".
Regards
Genni
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Hi Genni
Naomi Bodger nee Fairey was the older sister of my gt-grandfather Amos Fairey. I have quite bit of information about her from a Bodger family member, including that sailing date. Her mother Thomasin's surname is sometimes given as Voss, though she was actually born illegitimately to Elizabeth Lawson, suspected father John Dixey. A few years after Thomasin's birth Elizabeth married Richard Voss or Vause, and had lots of children, so I guess it was easier for Thomasin to be known as Voss, too. However, on her marriage record her name is correctly given as Lawson.
More confusion was caused by the death certificate of Naomi's brother James Fairey, who emigrated to NZ. His parents' names were given on the cert as John Fairey and Mary Voss, so you can guess what confusion that has caused among the researchers in the family. It has taken several years to sort that one out! His grandmother was called Mary, and I guess he spoke about his mother as Voss, don't know....
You can see why I might be interested in the two Josephs, Fair(e)y and Voss now.
Cheers,
Gillg
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Kia Ora
Rather belatedly I am joining this very helpful scenario !
JOSEPH FAIRY was one of my ancestors! As far as we know the earliest to arrive in Australia in Feb 1857 on the Shooting Star.
Joseph is "at home" with his parents in 1851 & doesn't appear as a witness nor any other papers I have to link him to Connington after that.
Joseph is on the 1899 Electoral Roll as a "gentleman" living at 21 Chusan Street and died in 1908 at St Kilda. He is buried at Springvale.
At some time we understand he "married' Harriet BRACE. Certainly Harriet who died August 1896 is buried in the same plot.
There is a Harriet BRACE who also travelled in October 1857 to Melbourne BUT I wonder if she married twice? I am unable to find a marriage and her surname was unknown by the Informant on Joseph's Death Certificate
Could anyone find a Harriet married to a Brace earlier? Joseph & Harriet Fair(e)y appear to have had no children as Joseph's Will thoughtfully covered several relations still in England!
Being another who is geographically challenged does anything above indicate Joseph Fairy & Joseph Voss lived nearby?
Many thanks for any advice/help!
Marlene
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Hi
Do you mean are the electoral roll address for Joseph Fairey... Cushan Street St Kilda
and
The death registration address for Joseph Voss ..East Melbourne
near each other in Melbourne?
The answer is.
Not very. Perhaps 5 kilometers.
However, there were then and are today some hospitals in East Melbourne so this may not have been his address.
Cushan street is srill there but is now in the suburb designated Balaclava .
I'm not sure if I have answered your question!
Sue
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Hi
I notice on Harriet FAIRY's death registration in 1896 her father is noted as John BRACE, mother UNKNOWN. Reg No 11530.
Cheers
Cando
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Hi Marlene
So glad you have joined me on this thread, since it was you who started me on this line of inquiry originally by sending me the ship's passenger list for the "Shooting Star". That Joseph Voss came not from our usual Hunts/Beds/Northants hunting ground but from Dorset just adds to the mystery of why these two were travelling together, doesn't it?
And aren't folks helpful on this board? ;D ;D ;D
Cheers
Gill
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Hi
I guess 5 km wasn't too far given Joseph F was a "gentleman" & probably had some form of transport?? Thanks for the info Sue.
I have no idea whether Joseph F went to somewhere near Dorset or Joseph V visited rellies in Hunts or whether they perhaps met at the docks & decided to travel together? There doesn't appear to be any likely connections does there?
Thanks Cando for Harriet's parentage - another mystery!? If Joseph didn't know Harriet's mother's name at Harriet's death in 1896 I doubt there would be any further clues on a marriage cert if one exists!
Might there be a Will for Joseph Voss? I think you need a number and I'm unsure how to get that- any advice?
Many thanks!
Cheers
Marlene
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Mike
Rather belatedly in reply to #12, someone has now kindly sent me the census images for 41, 51, & 61, where Thomas is consistently spelled Vofs, though his son William in another part of Dorset in 51 is spelled with the double s.
Cheers,
Gill
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Might there be a Will for Joseph Voss? I think you need a number and I'm unsure how to get that- any advice?
I can check if there is a will?
Also, do you have the actual dates of death for Joseph or Hannah Fairey. I can check death notices.
Regards
Genni
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Kia Ora Genni
I'm sure Gill would appreciate any advice of a Will!
As for me I'd love any "news" of
Joseph Fairy who died 6 August 1908 at St Kilda
Harriet Fairy who died/or was buried 13 August 1896 (also at Chusan St I presume - haven't got the Death Cert).
How easy is it to look up Wills ? I know there was a site somewhere but I got completely lost!
I would love to check on some of the later generations who arrived due to Joseph's generosity!
Very grateful for any advice ;D
Marlene
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Genni
If you are able to check for a will or advise me how to do so, I'd be very grateful.
Gill
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Lydart
I got Patrick White's "Voss" from the library, and am really enjoying it, though it's quite slow going because of the complicated language. I like his style - "...the whole stone house was booming with bronze" - a servant had struck the dinner gong! And this fictitious Voss (Johann Ulrich) is a German, as many Vosses are. I think it's quite unusual, though not altogether unkown, to find surnames that are the same in German as in English.
Thanks very much for drawing this book to my attention. :)
Gillg
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If you are able to check for a will or advise me how to do so, I'd be very grateful.
Hi Gill
I checked the probate indexes and Joseph & Thomas Voss had their estates administered.
Thomas VOSS Late of S Melb Farrier died 27th Jan 1869 Estate was Administered 26th July 1889 (20years after death, must have been hard to find NOK) Ref: 39/823
Joseph VOSS of Collingwood Brewers Carter died 11th June 1891 Estate administered Nov 1891
Ref: 45/980
Also found that Joseph died due to a fall from a dray.
Inquest Indexes
Joseph Voss 53 Melbourne Fall from Dray Occupation: Watchman Ref: 1891/715
I can get copies of all these items, if you want. I'll check them out when I go to the PROV on the 13th.
I forgot to check Joseph Fairey - will endeavour to check him next week.
Regards
Genni
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Hi Gennig
You are a gem! With those reference numbers we can download the Wills free of charge- I have Joseph Fairy's through that means thank you!
It's unfortunate that they're all online but they don't give the ref no unless I've missed something!
Another kind soul found Joseph F's ref no for me sometime ago and I had no trouble downloading it.
This sounds awfully cheeky but could I trouble you to find ref nos for a couple of other Fairys of mine in place of Joseph? If it's Ok I'll send the names through for you but don't hesitate to tell me if it's not possible!
Thanks very much for the news about the Voss family.
Regards
Marlene
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Hi Gennig
This is really useful information. I've been struggling with the pro.vic.gov site trying to find them myself from these ref nos, but am clearly doing something wrong, or looking at the wrong site. It's very kind of you to offer to get copies for me, but if it's something I can do, that's easier than trying to find a way of paying you - always a problem in a different currency. On the other hand, if this is something you can do free at your end, I'd love to see the docs for Joseph and Thomas.
Thanks so much
Gill :)
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It must get the prize for difficulty in navigating!
Cheers
Marlene
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Hi ladies
Only wills are online. Neithr Joseph or Thomas Voss had wills, their estates were administered.
To download wills, you need to register as a user.
I'll hopefully have my sister with me when I go so we should be able to photograph them digitally.
Regards
Genni
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Ah, I'm beginning to understand, Genni. If you are able to take photos and attach them to an email, that would be brilliant. I'll send you a PM with my email address.
Many thanks,
Gill
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Agreed! ::) Joseph F did have a WILL! Wonder if he learned from his friend? :-\
How frustrating it is not to even have a rumour to dwell upon!
Cheers
Marlene
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Lydart
Just finished reading "Voss". What a fascinating book! I just couldn't put it down, though neither the native population nor the settlers came out of it very well. Still, that's probably how it was in the early days.
It's a tough read, but a good one. Now I'll have to check if the library has any other books by Patrick White...
Gill
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Hi,
If my research is correct Joseph Voss is my 2nd Great Grandfather.
From what I have researched he was a drunk and eventually died from falling of the back of a wagon owned by a brewery. He had many children who he could not care for and many of them became wards of the state. He moved residence nearly every year around Fitzroy and Collingwood.
He worked as a farrier, a carrier and a ash falter. He declared bankruptcy while operating his own transport business. Thank you all for your discussion. You have given me some more info to add to my tree.
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I am slightly confused about Joseph F - was he the brother of Naomi Bodger (parents John Fairey & Thomasin Lawson/Voss)? If he was then I really am confused as I have his birth in 1828, his death in 1851 St Neots and married to Rhoda Church!
Please confirm which Joseph F we are talking about as I am loosing the plot, thanks
Avril
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Hi Avril
I'm not surprised that you are confused - both Marlene and I have Fair(e)y families from Gt. Catworth, but we have never been able to discover how they are related! We both have a Joseph, too, and mine, and I think yours too, was indeed born in 1828 in Easton and married Rhoda Church. Marlene's Joseph is the one who emigrated to Australia, we believe, along with Joseph Voss. Hope this helps.
Gill
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Yes, that helps greatly. As long as I am not missing any Faireys then I am happy :)
Thanks
Avril