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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Nottinghamshire => Topic started by: martin mosley on Monday 01 October 07 18:54 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I am looking for information regarding William Nicholson and his wife, who apparently ran the Beehive public house for many years through the middle of the 19th century. If anyone is able to find info regarding him or his family it would be greatfully received.
Does anyone know where the Beehive was, and if it still exists?
Thank you all in advance
Martin
www.mosleyfamilies.net (http://www.mosleyfamilies.net)
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Hi Martin,
were you wanting personal info or census information perhaps?
1871 RG10; Piece: 3459; Folio: 89; Page: 5 has him as a farmer and publican living at East Gate Worksop with employees and family.
I can post if you want this kind of stuff.
best wishes
heywood
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Thanks Heywood,
The answer is that I'm looking for everything I might be lucky enough to find, I have no census info, and I know very little of William and his family, though I believe he was married to Mary HINDS.
If you have access to census images, they would at least give me a start. Indeed I did not know he had gone to Worksop before your posting.
Thanks again
Martin
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I think this is your man- 1891 names The Beehive but it is Worksop. (note that the street number changes)
I'll work backwards:
Free BMD death June quarter 1898 Worksop 7b pg 16 William Nicholson aged 68 yrs
can't see a death for Mary nor can I see her in 1901.
1891 RG12; Piece: 2644; Folio 4; Page 2
22 Eastgate (Beehive) Worksop
William Nicholson 60 yrs farmer and publican b Blyth
Mary 61 yrs b Kneesall
Amy daur 18 yrs b Worksop
John Flower servant 46 yrs farm servant b Worksop
1881 RG11; Piece: 3306; Folio: 18; Page: 2
13 Eastgate (Beehive)
William Nicholson 51 yrs farmer and innkeeper 240 acres employing 8 labourers 1 boy b Blyth
Mary 51 yrs b Kneesall
James son 12 yrs
John son 10 yrs
Amy son 7 yrs
John Flower servant 38 yrs
Fanny Grafton servant 18 yrs
children and servant born Worksop
1871 RG10; Piece: 3459; Folio: 89; Page: 5
13 Eastgate Worksop
William Nicholson 41 yrs farmer and publican b Blyth
Mary 40 yrs b Kneesall
Anne daur 18 yrs barmaid b Babworth
Elizabeth daur 16 yrs milliner
Fanny daur 13 yrs
George son 11 yrs
Sarah daur 8 yrs
William son 6 yrs
Edward son 4 yrs
James son 2 yrs
John son 3 months
Ann Bartrop visitor widowed 73 yrs b Ordsall
Harriet Bell niece 13 yrs
Geroge Harris servant 23 yrs
John Flower servant 25 yrs
everyone else born Worksop
1861 RG9; Piece: 2419; Folio: 26; Page: 9
13 Eastgate Beehive Inn Worksop
William 31 yrs publican and farmer
Mary 30
Ann 7
Elizabeth 5
John Flower servant 16 farm servant
William Kelk servant 36 ditto
james Davy boarder 70 farm labourer
Ann Hinde sister unm 21 b Kneesall
Fanny and George at RG9; Piece: 2419; Folio: 33; Page: 23
32 Gateford Rd Worksop
Eliza Cartwright unm 40 yrs school mistress
Fanny Nicholson nurse child 3 yrs
George -do- nurse child 1 yrs
in these censuses there have been 2 Williams b 1829/30 Blyth but the one above is yours.
1851 and 1841 not coming up so will look again.
phew!
best wishes
heywood
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Heywood,
How can I thank you. You have found 40 years of this families life in one morning!
I have been struggling to understand the Nicholsons for some time, and you have helped enormously with regard to this particular branch. Many thanks for the efforts you have made, they are greatly appreciated.
Martin
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I'd say this is him
1851 HO107; Piece: 2122; Folio: 159; Page: 24
Church Rd Worksop Mill Radford
William Nicholson 21 yrs carrier or carter b Barnby Moor
in the home of Francis Skelton miller.
Mary Hind is a servant in Worksop in the employ of a school mistress.
strong possibility
1841 HO107; Piece 849; Book: 2 Folio: 6; Page: 6
Barnby
Edward Nichlnson (as written) 45 yrs M S
Fanney 30 yrs
James 15 yrs
William 10 yrs
Mary 3 yrs
Fanney 1 yr
Fanney snr not born in county- rest were.
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back again - sorry
just thought I would look on Family Search and note that William's parents are listed as Edward and Elizabeth. (even though 1841 ages are rounded down - wondered about Fanney's age)
Free BMD has a marriage December 1837 quarter possible spouses Edward Nicholson and Frances Fisher.
Checked and young Fanney is on Family search - Edward and Fanny.
that's it I think
best wishes again
heywood
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Hi Martin,
I had part finished this but did not have time to post earlier…..hope it helps
From NFHS Baptism & Marriage Cd index;
Marriage:
William Nicholson & Mary HIND – 3rd April 1853, Worksop Priory (St Mary & St Cuthbert)
Following Children = Parents William & Mary Nicholson
Baptised Babworth
Ann, born 2nd July 1853, baptised 14th Aug 1853 – fathers occupation, Labourer. Abode Forest Lock.
Baptised Worksop Priory (St Mary & St Cuthbert)
Elizabeth, 23rd Sep 1855 - fathers occupation,Publican - Abode Common
George, 31st Aug 1859 - fathers occupation,Publican - Abode Common
Mary, 4th Oct 1863 - fathers occupation,Publican - Abode Eastgate
Sarah, 30th Dec 1863 - fathers occupation,Publican - Abode Worksop
Fanny, 4th Nov 1865 - fathers occupation,Farmer - abode Worksop
William, 11th April 1866 - fathers occupation,Publican - Abode Eastgate
Baptised - Worksop St John
Edward, 25th Dec 1869 - fathers occupation,Farmer - Abode Eastgate
James, 25th Dec 1869 - fathers occupation,Farmer - Abode Eastgate
John Abraham, 12th March 1871 - fathers occupation,Publican - Abode Eastgate
Edith Amy, 28th May 1894 - fathers occupation,Farmer. - Abode Eastgate
At first I did wonder if Edith Amy did belong to the above family but my guess is she was baptised for her impending wedding……..
William Henry Redfearn & Edith Amy Nicholson 11th August 1894 at Worksop St John
She is on the 1901 with William Redfearn and her age and birthplace match and also from the freeBMD
Births Dec 1873
Nicholson Edith Amy Worksop 7b 30
This is possibly your William and his parents in Blyth ?
Marriage at Blyth
Edward Nicholson & Elizabeth BATTERSBY – 22nd May 1820
Baptisms all children of Edward & Elizabeth at Blyth, fathers occupation Labourer;
George, 17th Dec 1820
Sarah, 1st June 1823
John, 7th Aug 1825
James, 30th March 1828
William, 21st Nov 1830
Best Wishes
Sheila.
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Hi Martin,
These may be your William & Mary?
Burial at Worksop Priory (St Mary & St Cuthbert) – abode Worksop.
Mary – 24th Sept 1897, aged 67 yrs.
William – 25th May 1898, age 68 yrs – abode Worksop.
Regards
Sheila.
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What can I say?
To go from knowing absolutely nothing about this family, to seeing each important stage of their lives, and all in the space of one day!
Heywood and Dizzifish, you are stars and I only wish I could be of help to you at some stage.
Am now in the process of updating my databases.
Many thanks
Martin
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Hi Martin,
You are welcome…..
Just to add to Heywoods find of Edward’s marriage to Frances Fisher,
Marriage at Clarborough;
Edward Nicholson & Frances Fisher – 30th Nov 1837
The Worksop & Clarborough marriages I could double check the detail’s for at my local library, possibly sometime next week if that helps?
Sheila.
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...Everything helps, without wishing to overload your no doubt already busy schedules.
Thanks again
Martin
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Looks like Elizabeth Battersby was Williams mother, another colleague has come to the same conclusion. It would appear we are all on the same track!
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Hi Martin,
Yes.......
That what I was implying on reply 7,
Marriage at Blyth
Edward Nicholson & Elizabeth BATTERSBY – 22nd May 1820
I also found this baptism, the only one for parents Edward & Frances but I haven't seen the census to help confirm it.
Baptism at Blyth - 10th March 1847
George Nicholson, parents Edward & Frances, fathers occupation - Farming Man, Abode, Barnby Moor.
Regards
Sheila.
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Ok, now getting into the detail!
I am sorry if I'm becoming a pain, but I notice that there are two baptisms in 1863, Oct for Mary, and Dec for Sarah. There are also two on Christmas day 1869 (that could be logical, either twins or a 'bulk' baptism)
However it seems strange to baptise two children within three months of each other... or does it?
Were they twins? Was one ill and baptised in a hurry?
This game always results in more questions than answers.
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Hi Martin,
Here is an update…
As well as the above George, these were the other children of Edward & Frances, my fault for not checking for other name variations of Frances.
Parents Edward & Fanny Nicholson – Abode Barnby Moor.
Baptised at Blyth
Mary, 4th Feb 1838 – fathers occupation, Farmer.
Fanny, 19th Jan 1840 - fathers occupation, Labourer.
Abraham, 13th Nov 1842 - fathers occupation, Labourer.
Georgiana, 31st July 1853 - fathers occupation, Labourer.
Looked at the 1851;
HO107; Piece: 2121; Folio: 127; Page: 1 = Barnby Moor, Nottinghamshire.
Edward Nicholson,Head, M, aged 56, Farm Bailiff, born Ordsall, Notts
Frances Nicholson, wife, aged 38, born Lincoln.
Mary, daug, age 13, scholar, born Barnby Moor
Fanny, daug, age 11, scholar, born Barnby Moor
Abraham, son, age 8, born Barnby Moor
George, son, age 4, born Barnby Moor
William Andrews & Thomas Olivant , Ag Labs
The NFHS index doesn’t cover Ordsall, but the IGI does C060531
EDWARD NICKOLSON born 02 NOV 1794 Ordsall, Nottingham parents John & Sarah.
Sheila.
Ps
I don't know about the baptism being 3 months apart but I have had some odd things like that myself, in one parish they didn't have a vicar for a while and then you find dozens baptised at a time.
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my goodness - look what happens when you go out!
Isn't it amazing what can be found with friends and technology that would have taken months of visits etc! Superb work Sheila.
It's great to see it all taking shape for you Martin.
Re the two baptisms - Mary doesn't appear on the 1871 census.
There is a birth - December quarter 1861 and a death December quarter 1863.
There is a birth for Sarah - September quarter 1863.
So it may be that Mary was sick and baptised and then Sarah is born around the same time. It would be worth checking parish records if possible for baptism/ funeral Mary and baptism of Sarah. Although still odd why they didn't have both baptisms together.
The census ages and baptism ages don't always tie up for the other children- not baptised as infants perhaps.
best wishes
heywood
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just for the sheer heck of it (and I do like to account for 'visitors' - I have amended the 1871 entry re Ann Bartrop- she was born Ordsall. (Nicholsons?)
1861 RG9; Piece: 2416; Folio: 30; Page: 18
Forist Lock Babworth
Abram Barthorp 64 yrs canal lock tenter b Retford
Ann 63 yrs b Ordsall
William Nicholson visitor 73 yrs one of the Brethon of Trinity Hospital Notts
(that's what it looks like for William- first two words have been overwritten with 'Clergy')
Ancestry has him as Trinity Hosp. as place of birth but it is a continuation of his occupation.
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Abraham and Ann (various spellings0 are the same in 18851 and in 1841 have two elderly Barthorp gents with them.
Interestingly:
1841 HO107 piece 851 book 11 folio 7 pg 6
East St East Retford
William Nicholson 55 yrs labourer
Sarah Nicholson 85 yrs
wonder if this is Edward's mother Sarah and if Ann, William and Edward are siblings?
1851
William is in same place with daughter Charlotte Bell and her husband and family. (1871 has a young Harriet Bell as a niece)
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Ok…. Heywood,
Here you go…… just to verify your theory ;D
Marriage at East Retford
Abraham BARTHROP & Ann NICHOLSON – 24th Dec 1816
Sheila.
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what a team!!
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Hello Martin,
Just an update to confirm the previous info……
Marriage at Blyth – fiche 25, page 38
22nd May 1830
EDWARD NICHOLSON of the parish, Bachelor, labourer &
ELIZABETH BATTERSBY of the parish, spinster
By Banns, by Rudd A M, vicar.
Both signed their markX
In the presence of; Charles Battersby & Mary Wood.
Marriage at Clarborough – fiche 15, page 5, entry 9.
30th November 1837
EDWARD NICHOLSON,of the parish of Blyth, full age, Widower, Labourer.
Father John Nicholson, Labourer, deceased.
FRANCES FISHER, of Spittall Hill, Clarborough, full age, spinster, servant.
Father, William Fisher, Farmer.
Both signed their markX
In the presence of; John Coblett? & Elizabeth Fisher.
Best Wishes
Sheila.
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I have just joined Rootschat and noticed this conversation. I believe the William Nicholson you have been discussing is a distant relation of mine. I have not checked all of the detail in this conversation against my records but I have come to the same conclusion for a good deal of it.
My Great Great Great Grandfather was Edward Nicholson (b1794). My Great Great Grandfather was Abraham Nicholson (b1842) - Abraham was the offspring of Edward and Frances Fisher whilst William was the offspring of Edward and Elizabeth Battersby.
However I did not have any information for William Nicholson (b1830) other than his birth. Thanks you that.
By the way my tree is on Genes Reunited if you want to check it out. It may go a generation or two further back than detailed in this conversation.
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Hi Roy,
And welcome to Rootschat. I hope you find the community here as friendly and helpful as I have done.
You may want to check my web pages and search for Ernest Nicholson, my g grandfather, then follow back his ancestry. I would be delighted to help if I can, and of course, to hear if you have anything new to add.
Start by looking here www.mosleyfamilies.net (http://www.mosleyfamilies.net)
Happy new year
Martin
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I am related to Elizabeth Nicholson -b 1855 , daughter of William Nicholson.I have some information I can share with you and I have no doubt you have some I would benefit from.Have you a relationship to William ?
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Hi Cowleyi,
William Nicholson was my 3x G Grandfather, and I will be delighted to share information with you.
Much progress since 2007 when this thread began, but it's good to see it might help someone else too.
Will pm you Cowleyi
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William was my great , great grandfather on my mothers side.His daughter Elizabeth Nicholson b 1855 married Alfred Denham Oliver 20/1/1877.They moved to Leeds and Alfred seems to have been successful in the furniture trade ,retiring to Ruswarp outside whitby in his 50's.They had a daughter Maud Mary Oliver b 1888 who married John William Sutherland in 1916 in Hartlepool. They had a daughter Gladys Mary b1919 who was my mother.