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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Flintshire => Wales => Flintshire Lookup Requests => Topic started by: Ninian on Monday 14 January 08 14:54 GMT (UK)
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I'm looking for 3 brothers: Francis (b abt 1811), George (b abt 1808) and William Tattum (b abt 1813). All were married with families and lived in Bagillt, Holywell. In 1841 and 1851 they lived next door to each other at Morfa, Bagillt.
As far as I can tell they continued to live in Bagillt after this - there are BMDs recorded for the familes and lots of the family are on the 1871 census. BUT I can't find any of them at all in 1861 ....... where can they be??
Is part of the Bagillt census missing in 1861 or am I just useless at finding them?
Would be very gratefiul for any help please
Ninian
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Hi
or am I just useless at finding them?
Then so am I as I can't find them on the 1861 either. Unless you have them on the 1871 - thereby proving they were alive in 1861 - these deaths may possibly be theirs. Unfortunately the GRO index does not show ages for this period
Freebmd death
George Tattum June qtr 1861 Holywell Volume: 11b Page: 216
The 1861 census was taken on the night of 7th April so if he died between the 31st March-6th April ..............
William Tattum March qtr 1852 Holywell Volume: 11b Page: 207 IGNORE - still alive in 1871
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Just found William on the 1871 so have edited above death
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Hi Carole
Ah well I suppose its gratifying in a way that you can't find them either. I think that is probably George's death - but I think it is after the census date so he should have made it onto the census. Even if the brothers had died before the 1861 census there were the 3 wives and endless children ......... where can they have all gone?
Ninian
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there is a Phoebe TattAm in 1861 born 1839 if that helps
Peter
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Hi Ninian
According to this link http://www.findmypast.com/resources/census/missingpieces.jsp (scroll down to the last two lines) two areas of Holywell are missing or incomplete from the 1861.
There is a death for a Francis TATHAM registered Holywell Q4 1865 vol 11b, page 193 who might be yours?
Heather
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Many thank everyone - all very helpful. The Morfa area of Bagilt (where the 3 families all lived) must be the part of Holywell missing from the 61 census - annoying but at least i know not to waste any more time searching for them. Phoebe was William's daughter so at least there is one of them on the 1861 census. The death for Francis looks about right too.
Many thanks, Ninian
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Do you have marriages and baptisms for any of them or their children?
Paul.
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Hello Paul
Yes I do have some bapts and marraiges - just the odd one or two - all from Holywell Parish Church records. I'm not absolutely certain Francis, George and William are brother - but it's an unusual name and the families of Francis (b 1810), George (b 1808) and William Tattum (b 1813) lived next door to each other at Bagillt Marsh/Morfa on both the censuses of 1841 & 1851. The Margaret Tattum (born c. 1776) who was living with George Tattum in 1841 was probably their mother:
1841 Bagillt Marsh, Bagillt Fechan, Flintshire, Wales - HO107/1413/1/22/2
George TATTUM 30 Collier Yes
Elizabeth TATTUM 30 Yes
Margaret TATTUM 8 Yes
Mary TATTUM 6 Yes
Ann TATTUM 4 Yes
John TATTUM 2 (6!) Yes
Margaret TATTUM 65 Ind. Yes
Frances is the brother I'm most closely related to but I can't find his bapt or marraige but I have some info on some of his children:
John was baptised in Holywell Parish Church on 19 July 1835
Robert was baptised in Holywell Parish Church on 19 March 1837
Elizabeth & Anne Tatham daughters of Francis & Elizabeth were baptised in Holywell Parish Church on 2 April 1843 - Anne died in ?1845 & Elizabeth was buried in 1850. (they aren't on the census as they were born and died between 1841 and 51.
George Tattum married Elizabeth Hughes on 21 April 1832, (Francis Tattum was a witness).
William Tattum married Catherine Conway 1 April 1837.
I'm sure there is more info in the Holywell records but I haven't been able to track it down yet.
Ninian
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Hello Ninian. Holywell marriage. May 16 1801.
John Tattom(X). Bachelor. O.T.P.
Margaret Edwards(X). Spinster. O.T.P.
Witnesses. Thomas Rowlands. and Catherine Hughes(X).
Born. April 9. baptised April 23. 1808. George Tatum. S/O John & Margaret (Nee Edwards). Bagillt.
Dec 9 1810 - Jan 2 1811. FRANCIS Tatham. S/O John & Margaret. Bagillt
Baptised July 9 1813. William Tatum. S/O John & Margaret. Fathers Occ, Collier. Bagillt.
Baptised Oct 29 1815. Thomas Tattum. S/O John & Margaret. Collier. Bagillt
Burial. Aug 2 1826. Thomas Tatum. Bagillt. age 10 years.
Burial. July 30 1816. John Tatham. Bagillt. age 43 years.
Sep 7 1833.
Francis Tathum(X) Bachelor. O.T.P.
Elizabeth Hughes(X) Spinster. O.T.P.
Witnesses. William Tathum(X) and Sarah Evans(X).
Francis's son Robert?
Burial. Oct 21 1841. Robert Tathum. Bagillt age 4 years.
(X)= did not sign made mark. O.T.P.= Of This Parish.
I'm sure it's all the same Family :)
Not sure what you already have. Let me know if you want any look up's
Paul
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Hello and thank you Paul
Profuse apologies for not replying sooner. I'd been hoping to hear from you but I must have unclicked the 'notification of new messages' button so I didn't get an email saying you'd replied .... so I've only just found it!
Oh yes it's the right lot ..... and with John T and Marg. EDWARDS you've got me back a whole generation. I didn't have any of the info on Births/Bapts/Deaths either ... so thank you so much.
I'll get it all into my database to check that it all fits in - but it looks as if it will. When I've got it in, may I come back to you re your offer of lookups - or have I missed the boat cos of my tardy reply?? Is the info from Holywell Parish Church records? I really need to try and get to see them myself sometime as my Jones line is Bagillt/Holywell too and I bet they could help there too. Are the records only available from the Flintshire Record Office, do you know? I'm at the other end of Wales so it's a bit of a trek up there.
Many thanks
Ninian
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Hi Ninian.
The info is from Holywell Parish Church Registers. Baptisms, Marriages and Burials.
I hope all of the Tattum's were yours.
You haven't missed the boat ::) let me know what you want and I'll have a look :)
Paul
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Hello Paul
I've remembered to press the notify button - so I got you message.
Many thanks for your offer, I'll have a look for a couple of things which might be on the Registers (just a few!) and will be back shortly.
Yes ALL the info you sent was the right Tattums - they fitted beautifully with the odd bits and pieces I had. I had no record of Thomas the son who died (at all).
Your info added a couple of new spellings for them, I now have: Tattum/Tatham/Tattam/Tattom/Tatum. It sounds like a drum rhythm!!
Thanks, Back soon(ish)
Ninian
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Hello again Paul (probably sooner than you expected!)
I've picked a few of what I hope might be 'findable' records for the Holywell church:
Marriage of Robert Ellis and Margaret (don't know her surname) c 1826
Baptism of their daughter Rebecca Ellis c. 1838
Baptism of Margaret Jones c 1834 (parents Hugh & Margaret Jones)
Do the records go back far enough to see if there is a Baptism for Margaret Edwards in c. 1776 and John Tattum I don't know his birthdate but as he married Margaret he was probably roughly the same age(?)
I've just checked when the Bagillt church was consecrated - 1839. So I've concentrated on dates before then as the Tattums might have transferred from the Holywell to the Bagillt church after 1839.
Even so, it would be good to know if the following are recorded in Holywell (if you could bear to look any more up!):
John Tattum Baptism c. 1898
Rebecca Ellis Baptism c. 1904
Their marriage c. 1859
One last query. Do any Tattums appear in the earlier records, say before c 1800, if the records go back that far. How far back do the Holywell Records go?
Many thanks for offering to look these up (you don't have to do them all!)
Regards
Ninian
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Well, I did ask ::) ;D ;D
Paul
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Oh dear - I've over done it! Sorry. Pick one, any one an' I'd be more than happy with that.
Please don't try and look for them all.
Ninian
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Hello Ninian.
The only marriage I could see for a Robert Ellis to a Margaret was in Flint.
April 4 1825.
Robert Ellis(X). of Hawarden. Bachelor & Labourer.
Marg't Jones(X). Spinster. of this parish.
Witnesses. Lathem? Ellis(X), Sarah Hughes(X) and John Jones.
I couldn't see baptisms for any of their children in Flint, Bagillt or Holywell.
( No Rebecca 1838)
Holywell Baptisms.
Nov 20 1768. John Tatum S/O. John & Mary.
Aug 14 1786. Margaret Edwards. D/O John & Mary.
The nearest ones I could see to 1776.
Thats what I couldn't find I'll be back soon with what I did :P
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Hello Paul
Many thanks. Well what you "haven't found" was jolly useful!!
I think the Robert Ellis v Margaret could be the right one. Although she was born in Holywell and he is Halkyn, the earliest address I have for them is Coleshill bach, Holywell ... and Coleshill is, I think, the western end of Flint - so probably there is a good chance it is them ... even though there is no record of their kids being baptised arounds and about. However, there were nonconformists in that side of the family (later in the 19th C), so its certainly worth me following it up to see if I can try and find them in chapel records.
Re the John Tattum and Margaret Edwards bapts - either could be right ... but there would be a big difference in their ages. He would have been 40 when their 1st child was born and she would have been 22 - not impossible by any means.
Looking forward to the next instalment!!
Ninian
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Not sure if you have thes ( I'm a little confused - nothing new)
Mary Tattum born 8/4/1834 and baptised 20/4/1834 Chester Road Wesleyan Chapel, Holywell- parents George (collier) & Elizabeth (nee Hughes)
parent's residence is Bagillt but father's residence before marriage Holywell.
and
Isaac and Uble Tatum (twins) born 22/5/1836 and baptised 26/5/1836 Mold Bethel Independent Chapel- mother Caroline (spinster) of Wrexham Street (Mold?)
Peter
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Hello again,
Sorry to say I didn't understand the baptisms of John Tattum c 1898. and Rebecca Ellis c. 1904. Their marriage c. 1859.
Bagillt marriage. April 9 1859.
John Tattum(X) full age. bachelor. Labourer. Bagillt. Father, Francis. Collier.
Rebecca Ellis(X). full age. spinster. Bagillt. Father, Robert. Labourer.
Witnesses. Llewlyn Hughes & Hannah Jones
Baptisms of the children of John & Rebecca Tattum.
Aug 15 1859. Francis. (close call ::))
Aug 29 1867. Selina Ann.
July 22 1868. Rebecca.
June 10 1871. John.
Aug 28 1878. George.
Is this Rebecca b 1868.
Marriage Jan 30 1895.
John Davies.26 bachelor. Mariner. Bagillt. Father John (Deceased. )
Rebecca Tattum. 26. Spinster. Bagillt. Father John. Lab.
Witnesses. Stephen Davies. and Mary Ashford Tattum.
Baptism. Sep 29 1895. Mary Edith Davies D/O John & Rebecca. Bagillt. Sailor.
Bagillt marriage June 8 1878.
Robert Tattum(X) full age. bachelor. Collier. Bagillt. Father, Francis. Collier
Elizabeth Williams(X). full age. spinster. Bagillt. Father, John. Shoemaker.
Witnesses. John Tattum(X) & Elizabeth Jane Tattum.
Baptisms of the children of Robert & Elizabeth Tattum.
Aug 21 1878. Sarah Ann.( :P)
Nov 21 1881. Francis.
May 1 1885. John William.
May 29 1889. Emrys.
There are marriages for Margaret 1854, Ann 1862 and Mary 1864. D/O George Tattum.
Ben 1863 & Elizabeth 1864 children of William Tattum.
Let me know if you want them
Holywell P.Rs start 1677.
Paul
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Hello Peter
Mary Tattum - yes she's one of George's brood (he's the eldset of my 3 Tattum brothers) - I have her (dau of George & Eliz.) on the 41 and 51 censuses. She was recorded as 6 in 1841 so the age is spot on. It's her alright. So at least some of them had gone nonconformist by the 1830s.
Now, Isaac and Ubel (Ubel!?!? - could they mean Able??), - they are a different matter. I've not come across them before. Have just had a quick look and can't immediately find them - but I have got 2 links with Tattums in the Mold area (one just says 'Mold', the other is Gwenaffield - though that link is later than 1830s). I shall investigate further ..........
Many thanks Peter
Ninian
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Hello Paul
Gosh!! I was just going to look for Peter's find of the Tattum twins from Mold ...... And now all this. Looks brilliant stuff.
I shall be going to ground for a while to digest it all .............
Back not so shortly!
Ninian
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there is a death recorded of an Isaac Tatum in 1838 on freebmd and a marriage of a Caroline Tatham in June 1839 on Freebmd. No sign of the twin.
Peter
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Hello Paul and Peter
Peter - Poor Isaac didn't last long then and Caroline couldn't have been too old either when she died. So far I've failed to find any connection with the Tattum twins from Mold - but as Ubel/Able might have lasted longer than his twin and his mother I shall have a further look for him. Many thanks
Paul - First of all a profuse apology re my original reference to:
"John Tattum Baptism c. 1898
Rebecca Ellis Baptism c. 1904"
I'd cut n pasted in their death dates not their birth dates which should have read 1835 for both of them. I have a baptism date of John of 19 July 1835 but as it was, I think, from IGI so might not be right. I have nothing other than an approx date of birth for Rebecca of 1835. So not surprising you didn't understand what I meant - it took me a while to work out what I'd done!
Everything else fits pretty well perfectly.
I had Francis' birth as 1861; your bapt record gave 1859 - but I'd worked his dob out from the 71 census but when I used the the 81 census his dob comes out as 1859 - spot on! The other kids worked out just right ... and I just had Selina not Selina Ann.
Rebecca's marriage of 1895 worked out neatly too - she was still living at home in '91 but had gone in 1901 and I have her eldest sister (from the census) as Mary A Tattum - so she must be the witness Mary Ashford Tattum.
I've just found John Davies (who married Rebecca) on the census so I should be able to track him back now.
I was a bit dubious about the marriage of Robert to Eliz Williams - as you had given me a burial for Robert Tattum (Burial: 21 October 1841, Holywell aged 4 which fitted well with his bapt in 1837) but Robert clearly made it past 1841 and as everything else seems to fit well with my other info, I think perhaps the Robert who died either wasn't one of my Tattums or Francis and Elizabeth had another Robert who died and the next son that came along (they were pretty prolific) they named Robert too. Curious that the register records that the 2 Tattum brothers Robert and John had to make a mark but the daughter Eliz Jane could write.
I hadn't got a thing on Robert and Elizabeth's kids - so that info was good too especially as I had noticed Francis on the census and thought he must be related to my Tattums somewhere as Francis is something of the family name - but I couldn't find out how he fitted in.
Are all the baptisms and marriage from Holywell unless you stated otherwise?
It would be really good to have the marriages of George's daughters and William's 2 children please (well, as you said before, you did offer!!)
This has all been brilliant
Ninian
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Hi Ninian
It is a possible marriage for Caroline not a death so you haven't got rid of her yet!!
Peter
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Hello Peter
I was so excited with all this Tattum info I got flustered (happens all the time!)
I'll have a hunt on BMD to see if I can find the husband ......
Thanks
Ninian
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Hi Ninian. Bagillt marriages.
Dec 23 1854.
William Hughes(X). 21. Ba. Collier. Bagillt. Father, Edward. Lab.
Margaret Tattum(X). 22. Sp. Bagillt. Father, George. Collier
Witnesses. John Griffiths. & Mary Tattum(X)
June 2 1862.
Thomas Hughes(X) full age. Ba. Collier. Bagillt. Father, Joseph. Smelter.
Anne Tattum(X) full age. Sp. Bagillt. Father, George. Collier.
Witnesses. William Hughes(X) & Mary Tattum(X) (always the bridesmaid)
Feb 23 1863.
Benjamin Tattum(X) full age. Ba. Collier. The Marsh, Bagillt.
Father, William. Collier.
Elizabeth Jones. full age. Sp. The Marsh, Bagillt. Father, John. Collier.
Witnesses. Humphrey Jones(X) & Phoebe Tattum(X)
July 2 1864.
Joseph Wilson. full age. Ba. Joiner. Bagillt. Father, Thomas. Smelter.
Elizabeth Tattum(X) full age. Sp. Bagillt. Father, William. Collier.
Witnesses. Thomas Wilson & Margaret Tattum(X)
There are two marriages on each page, the next marriage on the page.
July 10 1864.
Edward Morris. of age. Widower. Collier. Flint. Father, John. Collier.
Mary Tattum ;)(X) of age. Sp. Bagillt. Father, George. Collier.
Witnesses. John Tattum & Ann Tattum(X)
Bagillt burials.
John Tattum. Bagillt. Feb 2 1898. age 63 years.
Rebecca Tattum. Bagillt. Jan 19 1904. age 68 years.
I had a look at the Holywell Town Cemetery Memorial Inscriptions Book.
Several Tattums, the earliest one Albert Ashford Tattum 1897-1980 age 83 :-\
I found his marriage July 14 1923. Holywell.
Albert Ashford Tattum. 26. Ba. Pump Tester. Whitefield House, Bagillt. Father, Francis. couldn't make out his Occ.
Ethel Littler. 27. Sp. 15, Bagillt St, Holywell. Father, Thomas. Brewer.
Witnesses. I think there were four signatures the only one I could make out was Mary Garland, I think there were two Tattums :-\
What do you think?
Paul.
I just had a look up the thread and Peter's post of the Twins reminded me of what I just happend to come across Today.
Bagillt baptisms
April 2 1843. Elizabeth. D/O Francis & Elizabeth Tattum. Morfa, Bagillt. Fathers Occ, Collier.
April 2 1843. Anne. D/O Francis & Elizabeth Tattum. Morfa, Bagillt. Fathers Occ, Collier.
It didn't say Twins but....
Sorry I should have done this before I posted, had a look on North Wales bmd. Holywell Births 1843 Elizabeth & Ann Tattum HOL/05/37 Twins 8)
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Hello again and thank you again Paul
Bear with me - much checking to be done to see how they fit in. As Capt Oates said "I might be gone some time"!
Off the top of my head though Albert Ashford T looks just right - I have him as the eldest child of Francis T (from the 1901 census) - but that was all I had on him. His younger sisters (too young for the census but I know of them anyway) are:
Dorcas Mary Garland 1902
Gertrude Rebecca 1903
May 1905
Ivy 1909
So yes you were right with the Mary Garland. All 4 daughters are buried in New Brighton Cemy in Bagillt - but none of the sons of Francis, so I've found one of them now (well you found him).
The brothers of Albert Ashford were:
Albert Ashford 1896
John Henry 1897
Francis Ewart Gladstone 1898 (Francis senior must have been a fan of the Prime Minister of the time!)
Daniel Ernest P 1900
So one of them was probably the unreadable Tattum witness.
P.S. Poor Mary Tattum - as you say 'always the bridesmaid' I have her on the 1991 census - still single (I shall look to see if her luck changed by 1901!!) - her full name was Mary Ashford Tattum - so Ashford must be a family name as Albert has it too.
Twins run in families - that must strengthen the likelyhood of a connection with Caroline T from Mold and her twins (but I'm d***** if I can find it! - I haven't given up though).
Progress report will follow......
Ninian
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Hello Paul
They were all mine - every last Tattum. All fitted in well. Only 2 tricky bits -
i) trying to find who the Tattum witnesses to the marraiges were. The complication being: of the 3 Tattum brothers, Frances and George both had kids called Margaret and Mary and Ann and William also had a Margaret. All 3 had a John. So the Witnesses weren't always the bro. or sister of the bride/groom they were sometimes a cousin. However I'm pleased to report that it looks like Mary the bridesmaid was lucky in the end as Mary the bridesmaid was probably the Mary who married in 1864 - but the other Mary remained unmarried. Ann the witness to John's marraige was not Ann the sister (she was Ann Hughes by then) so the witness Ann must have been John's cousin.
ii) trying to find out which of my 5 John's was the one buried in 1898 - there were 2 strong possibilities. It turns out to be John, the son of Francis who married Rebecca - the Rebecca buried in 1904. I understand St Mary's still has a cemy - so it'll be worth my having a trip there when I next get up to N Wales - John and Rebecca will be buried together. Before I got your info I had nothing to link the Tattums to St Mary's Bagillt - I only knew of the 4 Tattum sisters of Albert Ashford who are all buried in New Brighton Bagillt (the non conformist cemy)
I've now got a really good pattern to my Tattums and I've started to get census info together on the new ones you've found, I'm also getting it for the Tattum girls where I now know their married names . All building to a pretty comprehensive picture of "The Tattums of Bagillt". I wouldn't be surprised if all the Tattums in and around Bagillt today might descend from those 3 brothers ( I doubt if I can prove it but it'll be fun trying).
My particular line of interest (brother Francis) now has an almost complete set of dates of BMD (or burials) right back to Francis - which is amazing. I've been working on my only gap (curiously the most recent part of the line) the wife of Francis (b.1859). She was known as Emily - but the 1901 census (which took me ages to find as Tattum was transcribed as 'Laham' on Ancestry) records Francis's wife as Mary E - so she's Mary Emily, I s'pose. It was worth finding the 'Lahams' on the 1901 census though, as the Alfred Ashford T that you found the marriage for, is on the census - so every is fitting beautifully. I'm getting there with Mary Emily she's a Williams (.... or a Probert ............. or a Cheney ............... or poss. an Adams!!) - I'm definitely getting there!
I can't thank you enough for all the info - it's been amazing.
Ninian
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Hi Ninian,
Fellow Tattum-Researcher. I too am connected to the Tattum's of Mold and Gwernaffield - My G.Grandmother was a Tattum. I saw that post and notice you say you're connected to every last one. How exciting.
Kind Regards,
Lisa
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hello Lisa
Ah, what I said (or meant to say) was every last one of the Bagillt Tattums! But I'm trying (not entirely successfully) to establish a firm link with the Mold/Gwernaffield Tattums (of various spellings Tatum Tattom etc).
Further back in this string is info from Peter re a Caroline T and her 2 twins Isaac (who died) and Ubel/Abel. I haven't got a link with them yet ...... but I have got a later Gwernaffield connection with my Tattums, which is:
1891 1 Coetia Gwyn, Bagillt, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - RG12/4606/49/8
John* TATTUM H 57 M Chemical Labourer Bagillt, Flintshire
Rebecca** TATTUM W 56 M Bagillt, Flintshire
Francis TATTUM S 30 S Chemical Labourer Bagillt, Flintshire
Mary A TATTUM D 29 “ Bagillt, Flintshire
Rebecca TATTUM D 22 “ Dressmaker Bagillt, Flintshire
George TATTUM S 11 “ Scholar Bagillt, Flintshire
Thomas ELLIS BinLaw 59 “ Colliery Labourer Bagillt, Flintshire
* all speak English & Welsh except Thomas Ellis who speaks Welsh only
1901 Waen-Rwyddfyd Village, Gwernaffield, Holywell, Flintshire, Wales - RG13/5213/135/6
George TATTUM H 22 M General Labourer Holywell, Flintshire
Mary J TATTUM W 23 M Gwernafield, Flintshire
Mabel TATTUM D 8m Gwernafield, Flintshire
*all speak both English & Welsh
I don't s'pose George and Mary and little Mabel are yours?
Do you have Bagillt Tattums too?
Regards
Ninian
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Hello it looks like one of your Tatum's married my Great - Grandfather Joseph Wilson (Elizabeth Tattum) their son Joseph Wilson was my grandfather and their first son William Wilson was my Great uncle, he was killed in a mining accident on the 30th Jan 1913. Have you any other info please on the Wilson family?
Many thanks
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Hello
I'm sorry I'm afraid I don't have anything on your ggrandfather and family other than his marriage to my Elizabeth Tattum:
MARRIAGE:
July 2 1864.
Joseph Wilson. full age. Ba. Joiner. Bagillt. Father, Thomas. Smelter.
Elizabeth Tattum(X) full age. Sp. Bagillt. Father, William. Collier.
Witnesses. Thomas Wilson & Margaret Tattum(X)
I suspect the Thomas Wilson who was a witness was probably Joseph's brother or perhaps father but I 'm afraid that's all the info I have on the Wilsons.
I've got plenty of info on Elizabeth and her brothers and sisters, parents etc though. I'd be happy to send it if you are interested.
Do you know if Joseph and Elizabeth and family stayed in Bagillt or did they move elsewhere?
Regards
Ninian
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Hi,
Surprised I haven't been on roots before. I have been tracing the Tattums of Holywell/Bagillt for years. I grew up in Holywell and still have relatives there.My grandmother was a Tattum.
Just a brief outline.
John Tattum married Margaret Edwards 1801
Children
Phoebe 1803 married John Thomas 1824
Harriet 1806 married Robert Griffths
George 1808 married Elizabeth Hughes 1832
Francis 1809
William 1813 married Catherine Conway
Thomas 1815
A Mary Tattum infant was buried 1800 Holywell and an Ann Tattum dau of John Tattum and wife Mary was christened June 20th 1802 , I believe she later married Edward Jones 1824 in Holywell.
Margaret Tattum 1833
Mary christened 20th April 1834 born 8th April 1834, baptism took place at Chester Rd, Wesleyan Chapel, Holywell1834
Anne Nov1836 married thomas Hughes
John Nov1839 married Elizabeth Evans
George 19th November 1841married Mary Ann Griffths., 6 September 1862 Holywell Parish Church.
Children of George and Mary Ann
Elizabeth Ann 1862
George 1864
Hannah 1866
David Thomas 1868
Llewellyn 1870
Edwin 1878
Louisa 1880
David Thomas married Elizabeth Ann Edwards and had 11 children, my grandmother was Lily their third child..
I have a lot of info on others members of the family if you are interested.
looking forward to making contact.
Suze
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Hello Suze
Good to hear more about the Tattums - including some new ones, I hadn't found Phoebe 1803 or Harriet 1806. I had an amazing response to my post on the Tattums, you'll have seen all the stuff I got -'twas brilliant.
I see you are descended from George 1808. The line I am most interested in is George's brother Francis 1810. George, Francis and the other brother, William, all lived next door to each other on Bagillt Marsh in 1841 and 1851 (I think the 4th brother Thomas died in infancy?).
I've got quite a bit of stuff on Francis' descendants (Francis seems to be a family name of the Tattums - it keeps reappearing again and again - in fact my cousin, whose mother was a Tattum is called Francis). My Tattums stayed in Bagillt - did yours?
I don't s'pose you have managed to get any further back than John and Margaret Tattum (m. 1801) - I'd love to but unfortunately I haven't but haven't given up on it ...... yet.
Hoping to hear from you. I'd be happy to post my email address to correspond off-list, if it's easier. Let me know if you want me to send it.
Regards Ninian
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Hi, I would love your email address as I like you have too much info to post on roots. So glad to get in touch with you.
Suze
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New members have to make at least 3 posts (anti-spam measure) before being able to use PM (personal message) system to exchange email addresses and other details which can't be posted on the threads.
http://www.rootschat.com/help/pms.php
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Hello Suze
Well you've got 2 posts already, so it's 2 down and 1 to go! It looks as though 1 more reply from you and we should be able to try the personal message.
Hear from you soon?!?!?
Regards Ninian
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Hi , I am in touch with quite a few Tattums, some still live around Bagillt/ Holywell. some on the Wirral and some in the Bournemouth area.
We don't appear to be connected to the Tattum's of Mold, but if we are I think it was before 1780. it would be great ti connect them. We were always told that they came originally from Cornwall, did you ever hear that?
Suze
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Hi again,
There doesn't seem to be a connection.
I'm up to 1740 with my Mold/Gwernaffield Tattums - Thomas Tattum b.Mold(1740) married Margaret Williams. His male children (to continue the Tattum line) were all born 1775-1780s so it would have to be even further back again ;D Perhaps one of his brothers, uncles, or even grandparents - who knows :)
There's a lot these days now in the Lancashire area. I don't know whether you mean your Tattums, or the Tattum families in general, but I've heard from originally (generally), it's Yorkshire. I only got that information about a year ago from looking at a family crest though, so it could be wrong.
Lisa.
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Hi, I know this continues a post from an age ago but I'm related to the Tattums of Bagillt too.
My Great Grandparents are Captain John Davies and Rebecca Tattum, I know that he died on his ship in Alexander Dock, Liverpool on 10 November 1903, does anyone know any more of this story??
With hopeful thank, Suzie
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Hello Suzie
That sounds interesting, I wonder what happened to John Davies, he must only have been about 35? Although I have John and Rebecca in my tree, I'm afraid I don't know anything about this story, sorry. However, I imagine there might have been a piece in the County Herald about this if you have access to old newspapers. This paper seems to have a lot of reports about Bagillt, and as Rebecca seemed to be living with her mother at Coetia Gwyn, Bagillt when John was at sea, there might be an obituary or something.
The only info I have about John and Rebecca is:
MARRIAGE: St Mary's, Bagillt
Jan 30 1895.
John Davies. 26 Bachelor. Mariner. Bagillt. Father John (Deceased. )
Rebecca Tattum. 26. Spinster. Bagillt. Father John. Lab.
Witnesses. Stephen Davies. and Mary Ashford Tattum.
Baptism. Sep 29 1895. Mary Edith Davies D/O John & Rebecca. Bagillt. Sailor.
Did they have 4 children: Mary, John, George and Catherine?
Sorry I can't help, but I hope someone else can.
Ninian
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Francis Ewart Gladstone Tattum (1898-1977) married Violet Mearns Unsworth, my grandmother's sister, in 1926. They had one child, Granville who married Beryl Bunce in 1952 and they had two children: David & Helen.
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I have Frances Ewart Gladstone Tattum in my tree but knew little about him. ' Francis' is very much a family name of the Tattums and 'Ewart Gladstone', I think suggests that the family were Liberals as Francis was clearly named after William Ewart Gladstone the Prime Minister who lived only about 10 miles from Bagillt
Ninian
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Uncle Ewart was a Conservative, whatever his parent's political views might have been when he was born! He was Alderman (Mayor) of Flint in 1960. I have a pic if interested?
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It would be good to have a pic of Ewart. I'm related to his sister May, she married into my Jones family. If you are interested, I have her wedding photo taken outside their family home, Coetia Gwyn. One of her brother's in on one of the photos but I don't know which brother. You might know?
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my wife is decended from Ann Tattum (Father George) who married Thomas Hughes in 1862. They moved across the dee to Ness and Jane their Daughter
Married William Sharps in 1887.
Their Son Thomas Married Frances Hare born in Saundersfoot Pembrokeshire.
Thomas met an unfortunate end in Ness Colliery in October1914 Thomas Hughes was hit by a full box of coal which was being pushed along a passage in the mine. He suffered severe facial injuries and died six days later
and he left a widow and six children.
I have Filled in Quite a lot due to your posts but i cannot find the death of
Elizabeth Hughes wife of George born 1808 as there are so many of them.
Gary.
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Hello chinapanga
I'm sorry but I haven't got a death or burial for Elizabeth wife of George, but I wonder if you have tried the parish records for St Mary's? Most of the Tattums seemed to use St Mary's Bagillt and the Flintshire archives has burial records for the church for 1839 - 1944 or p'haps someone else has access to these records and might be able to help. There could well be several Elizabeth Tattums, but the records might record Elizabeth, wife/widow of George and give an address which might narrow it down.
I wonder if you could clear up something for me? Mary, Ann's sister, was, I think, witness to the marriages of her sisters Margaret and Ann. I had originally thought that Ann was also a witness to Mary's marriage as an Ann Tattum was a witness - but Ann should have been Ann Hughes when Mary married in 1864, so it can't be your Ann. Have you come across another Ann Tattum who could have witnessed Mary's marriage?
Regards, Ninian
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Hello Ninian, Thankyou for replying so quick.
Ann Tattum isn't on the 1851 census with George but there is a Ann Tatum
aged 12 working as a servant in mold listed as being born there.
I think this is a different Ann (probably related in some way).
This is possibly the Ann Tattum that is listed on the 1861 census
in Bangor as a servant born in Mold.
This Ann Tattum goes on to Marry a Thomas Eardley at Bangor in 1862
and relocates to Brymbo.
so she couldn't have been the witness either.
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Hi just had some information on my Tatum's from bagillt John Tatum married Margaret Edwards there children are
Phoebe 1803
Harriet 1806
George 1808_1861
Francis1809_1865
William 1813_1872
Thomas 1815
John 1816_1826
Phoebe married john Thomas in 1824 there children are
Mary 1824
Margaret 1827
William 1831
Francis 1833
George 1836
Thomas 1839
Edward 1843
Sarah 1847
Phoebe's brother in 1841
George head age 30
Elizabeth age 30
Margaret age 8
Mary age 6
Anne age 4
John
Margaret Phoebe mum age 65
Phoebe's other brother William
William age 25
Catherine his wife
There children
Phoebe age 3
Benjamin age 1
And living next door is
Thomas Tatum age 30
Elizabeth age 30
John age 6
Robert age 4
Margaret age 2
Mary age 2 months or 2 weeks hard to tell this was in 1841
Phoebe and John Thomas there son Thomas Thomas married Sarah redfern these are my great great grandparents
Wendy
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The Ann Tattum(1837) married my relative Thomas Hughes at St Mary's Bagillt in 1862.
Regards
William Russell Jones.
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Has anyone managed to track the Tattum family any further back than John and Mary Tattum who had 4 children: Margaret 1762; Thomas 1764; Elizabeth 1766 and John 1768? Or the birth/baptism or marriage of John and Mary?
Ninian
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Regarding the use of the name Ashford I can help. My descent is through Selina Ann Tattum born 1868 the daughter of John Tattum and Rebecca Tattum nee Ellis. Rebecca's parents were Jos Ellis and Mary Anne Taylor Hughes. Her mother was Phoebe Ashford Hughes and she was born 1785/6. Mention is also made in the posts of John Henry Tattum. His name appears on the Bagillt War Memorial having been killed on 4 October 1917.