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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Essex => Topic started by: S.J Detective on Friday 18 April 08 22:14 BST (UK)
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Hello Everyone,
I am seeking information about Samuel Andrews, his sidlings and parents. All I know is that he was born in Hatfield Broad Oak abt 1804.
Please could someone help me trace this family, it's proving difficult to work out, and information seems sparse on the web.
I would also be interested in any Essex family history websites which might include Hatfield Broad Oak.
Also keen to hear from any other local researchers working on the Andrews family from this area.
Thanks for looking
S.J Detective
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You probably already have this IGI entry but it gives Samuel jnrs middle name and also mothers maiden name
SAMUEL_GERSHOM ANDREWS Birth: 27 JAN 1837
Christening: 25 JUN 1837 Downing Street Or Church Of Christ-Independent, Cambridge
Father: SAMUEL ANDREWS Mother: MARY BOWER
SAMUEL ANDREWS Spouse: MARY BOWERS
Marriage: 17 MAY 1835 Barnwell, Cambridge
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Purely because Samuel jnr was christened in an Independent Church - this is on the IGI but there is no way of knowing if it's the right entry
SAMUEL ANDREWS Birth: 10 JUL 1802 Christening: 24 FEB 1803 Independent, Bocking, Essex,
Father: MORDECAI ANDREWS Mother: HANNAH LITCHFIELD
The family in 1841 has an 18 yr old Thomas Andrews apprentice living with them - shown as not born in county
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I've pasted below part of a message I sent in July 2007 to someone else about the Hatfield Broad Oak records:
Hatfield Broad Oak - No registers have been deposited at Essex RO. The parish guide at Essex RO gives a contact point as :
Mrs Carol Toogood, Bickmere Cottage, Dunmow Road, Bishops Stortford, CM22 7JJ
There are some transcripts for HBO available at Essex RO but they do not cover the period/type you are interested in except possibly the marriages viz:
Bishop's Transcripts of Baptisms 1800 1877 D/CR 177 Many gaps in years. Original
Bishop's Transcripts of Burials 1800 1877 D/CR 177 Many gaps in years. Original
Bishop's Transcripts of Marriages 1800 1852 D/CR 177 Many gaps in years. Original
Census 1811 1811 D/P 4/18/2 Original
Census 1821 1821 D/P 4/18/9 Original
Transcript of marriages 1662 1753 T/R 25/1 Original
That info seems to be relevant to your request except that the baptism of Samuel Andrews may be found in D/CR 177 at Essex RO
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Hello CaroleW and Clincher,
Many thanks for your posts, help and advice.
I was aware of Samuel jnrs christening details, but the street info is new :) I'll have to look up Downing Street next time I visit Cambridge. The marriage date and location are new, great many thanks for finding these, I just had the year. :) :)
I am inclined to believe, until I can prove otherwise that Mordecai and Hannah Litchfield were Samuels parents. I have a child of Samuels with the middle name Mordecai, it's not an everyday name so that's a bit of a coincidence. :)
CaroleW could you please supply the census ref for 1841 that you mention I cannot find the family in that year, I have the rest though.
Thanks again, very useful information.
S.J Detective
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CaroleW could you please supply the census ref for 1841 that you mention I cannot find the family in that year, I have the rest though.
They were in Cambridge and the ref is HO107 Piece 85/ Book3 Folio 7 Page 8
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Thanks CaroleW, for the 1841 census link.
S.J Detective
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I have no particular knowledge of Samuel but have done some research on several generations of Mordecai Andrews.
Mordecai I c1715-49 Brought into revive moribund independent church in Petticoat St, London as a 'young man', presumably from Bocking. Expanded congregation so much they took over bigger premises in Artillery Row. Wife Sarah, children Mordecai II, Mary and Hannah.
Mordecai II 22/12/1738 - before 1820. Became independent minister of Great Coggeshall in immediate succession to Henry Peyto (can anyone tell me more about him?), perhaps around 1770. Married Elizabeth (probably Rutt) as children were Mordecai III, George Rutt, John Rutt, Edward, Charlotte, Charles, Eliza, Harriet, Frederick.
Mordecai III 1780-1820. wife Hannah Litchfield, son Samuel who might be yours, though born Bocking. Record of death says son of late Rev Mordecai Andrews. Which of Samuel's sons had Mordecai as second name?
Hope this helps
Mike
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Hello Mike,
Welcome and many thanks for posting your research on the Mordecai Andrews, very much appreciated. The furthest back I can confirm is Mordecai III who I have married to Hannah Litchfield as well, see CaroleW earlier posting. Very interesting to read that Mordecai I & II were Independent church Ministers.
Samuel's son Cornelius born Dec 1839 in Cambridge, St Andrew the Less had the second name Mordecai. I have two more children that I know of born to Samuel at present they were, Samuel Gershom Andrews b.27/01/1837 and Ebenezer b.1842 both Cambridge. I have no idea yet where the name 'Gershom' came from, but guessing a grandparent possibly from the female side of the family.
Thanks again Mike, these leads have given me a lot more to research about the interesting Andrews family.
S.J Detective
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Thanks for the children's names. It looks pretty certain that your Samuel married Mary Bowers and had the children you mention but far less certain that he was the son of Mordecai A and Hannah L, unless I am missing something.
For example there is another Samuel Andrews who married Sarah Cade and gave his birthplace as Colchester. Now Hatfield Broad Oak and Colchester are about equidistant from Bocking (Braintree) where Mordecai III and Hannah L's son was presumably born, so the only reason to prefer one to the other is the use of Mordecai as a second name.
But IGI gives the births of ten Mordecai Andrews as follows, so the name doesn't necessarily come from Mordecai III.
Year Place Father Mother Possible Identity
1669 Mordecai I's father
1715 Mordecai I
1740 Bocking Mordecai II
1762 C'geshall John
1774 Stepney Mordecai Hannah
1780 C'geshall Mordecai Elizabeth Mordecai III
1786 Terling Mordecai Hannah
1786 Bocking John Martha
1795 Bocking Mordecai Hannah
1823 B Stortf'd Richard Sarah
Sorry for the alignment - it's fine on what I pasted in but not on the preview but I hope it's intelligible. Only the last of these Hannahs seems likely to be Hannah Litchfield. What do you think?
Mike
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Marriages at Braintree, St Michael the Archangel D/P 264/1/8
1784, Jan 15
Mordecai Andrews, Bachelor, of this Parish, and
Hannah Litchfield, Spinster, of this Parish also.
by Banns Mordecai and Hannah both signed
Wit: Thomas Litchfield, Martha Bush both signed
1785, Jul 7
Mordecai Andrews, Bachelor, of this Parish, and
Hannah May, Spinster, of this Parish also
by Licence Mordecai and Hannah both signed
Wit: Mary May, Thomas Tunbridge both signed
IGI Batch C067101 Independent, Bocking, Essex
Hannah Andrews b. 3 Mar 1785 bap. 23 May 1785
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
Joseph Andrews b. 30 Dec 1786 bap. 14 May 1787
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
James Andrews b. 19 Mar 1789 bap. 17 Sep 1789
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
William Andrews b. 26 Mar 1791 bap. 2 Jan 1792
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
Thomas Andrews b. 13 Apr 1793 bap. 10 Dec 1795
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
Mordecai Andrews b. 10 Oct 1795 bap. 10 Dec 1795
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
Rebecca Andrews b. 24 Feb 1798 bap. 25 Jul 1798
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah Litchfield
Charles Andrews b. 13 Aug 1799 bap. 28 May 1800
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah Litchfield
Samuel Andrews b. 10 Jul 1802 bap. 24 Feb 1803
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah Litchfield
Rebekah Andrews b. 19 Oct 1808 bap. 20 Sep 1810
Parents: Mordecai Andrews & Hannah
Marriage at Bocking, St Mary D/P 268/1/11
1816, Jan 25
Thomas Litchfield Andrews, Bachelor, of this Parish, and
Susanna Clapham, Spinster, of this Parish
by Banns Thomas & Susanna(h) both signed
Wit: Joseph Clapham, Sarah Clapham both signed
Burials at Braintree, St Michael the Archangel D/P 264/1/6
1798, Aug 12 Rebecca Andrews, Infant
1812, Jan 27 Mordicai Andrews
[No other details]
1851 Census, Braintree HO107 1785 469 p22
High Street
Hannah Andrews, head, wid, 85, Retired Tailor's Widow, b. Braintree
Rebecca Andrews, dau, unm, 42, Dress Maker, b. Braintree
2 doors down:
Joseph E Andrews, head, unm, 25, Cooper (Master employing 2? assist?), b. London
Hannah Andrews, aunt, wid, 60, Proprietor of Houses, b. Braintree, Essex
Sarah Andrews, aunt, wid, 61, Housekeeper, b. Bocking, Essex
1821 Census, Braintree D/DU 65/83
High Street
Andrews, Hannah & Linton, Mrs Employed in Trade 4 females
1 age 16-20 1 age 31-40 1 age 51-60 1 age 71-80
It is possible (probable?) that this Hannah, with daughter Rebecca,
is Hannah Litchfield.
And that she has been a Widow since 1812.
Regards CP
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Hi CP,
Many thanks for all the Andrews info that you have kindly posted onto this topic. It's going to take a while to work through it all but I am sure it will prove invaluable and help greatly in my research.
Thanks for your time and help much appreciated.
SJ Detective
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Hi, I am the Australian end of the Mordecai Andrews family tree. Rev. Mordecai 1st, 1717-1750 m. Sarah Fann . I have no other siblings except Rev. Mordecai 11. 1749-1799,m. Elizabeth Rutt. Her parents were George Rutt and Elizabeth Towill,her brother was John Towill Rutt. Mordecai 2nd children were , Mordecai 3rd , George died young, John, Eliza em. to America, Edward, Charles a farmer, Alfred died baby , Harriet m. G.Wray stonemason, Charlotte m. T Wood Solicitor in Walworth, Emily m. Rev William Temple, Frederick em. to America . Edward 1787-1841,m Elizabeth Honor Symons,and became the independent minister for the Beresford Chapel in Romford, they had 12 children. Edward William 1812 -1877 em. to Australia, Frederic George 1814-1890 em. to Australia, Eliza 1816 m. Charles Orme ,distiller, Charlotte 1817 died unmarried, Louisa 1819 , Marianne 1820 died unmarried, Adolphus, Emily Augusta 1824 -1862 m Coventry Patmore (poet), Georgiana 1825, m. George Patmore, Augustus 1827 , Lionel 1829 died baby, Clarence 1831 died baby. The family say they are connected to Bishop Lancelot Andrews family, I would love to find this connection . Hope someone can help.
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Hi Janet, thanks for a fascinating post. A few scattered comments on it that you may be able to help with.
A link to Lancelot Andrew(e)s would be great, though it's perhaps a bit unlikely that a great High Churchman would have so many dissenters among his descendants and their spouses.
Similarly, Emily Andrews marrying Rev William Temple might suggest a link to the two Archbishops Temple but again I doubt it. Do you know anything about William - I have found him in West Ham in 1841 but not thereafter?
Mordecai I is show in IGI to be buried on 16/2/1649 at Bunhill Fields Cemetery, London.
"Mrs Mordecai Andrews" (who we have as Elizabeth Rutt) is stated to be the granddaughter of Rev John Mason 1677-1723 in a contemporary book, which doesn't stack up with your Elizabeth Towill as her mother. Any thoughts?
Do you realise that Emily Augusta was the model for Coventry Patmore's most famous poem, "Angel in the house"? There is a picture of her by Millais on the Wikipedia entry for Coventry.
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Hi, I have a lot of info on Emily Augusta and Coventry Patmores family, his brother Gurney lived in Australia for some years and their children were born here. Emily`s older brother Frederic George was my G.G.grandfather, I have some photos. Emily (Mord .2nd & Elizabeth `s ) is a mystery to me,all I know is the married name,no dates or family connections. I can`t explain the Towill name except George Rutts son was called John Towill Rutt. Perhaps we have an unexplained father ? The link to Lancelot is possible , he was the oldest of 13 children and although he was a professional churchman he had a lot of puritan influences around him. I have his mothers will and in it she leaves a third share of the Mayflower to her brother in law William Andrews. Another Uncle (I think) financed the puritan colony to America. The gap between Mordecai 1st and lancelots brothers is a big one but what a chalenge!!!
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Hi I have just got some info from
surman.english.qmul.ac.uk
about Samuel Douglas
it states that he married the widow of Mordecai Andrews who died in 1801
Argentina x
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Try this link from the Seax Catalogue put in search for Hatfield Broad Oak and Andrews and it came up with 10 occurances
http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/all_results.asp?intSearchType=12
might be something of interest
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Hi, Samual Douglass must have married Mordecai 2nds widow Elizabeth Rutt ,Mordecai 2nd died ( according to my records)1799. I wonder if this is my Mordecai, I have found others. I will need to do some more research. Thanks for the lead. janet
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I have Rev Samuel Douglas' Will, and in 1802 I think it is, his wife is called Elizabeth.....and he also mentions his son-in-law Charles Andrews..................I dont know the children of Samuel but there may have been a double joined family here.....what does anyone else think?
Argentina x
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Hi, I have the children of Mordecai 2nd and Elizabeth Gamiel Rutt as Mordecai 3rd,George, John, Edward (my ancestor) Charlotte ,Eliza, Charles, Harriet,Frederick, Alfred and Emily. I have to look a bit more before I can say either way, thanks for the info .Janet.
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if you would like me to e-mail you the Will send me a private note with your e-mail
Argentina x
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Marriages at Braintree, St Michael the Archangel D/P 264/1/8
........
Regards CP
Hi. I was interested to see the Andrews information on the chat string especially CP's input.
I am attempting to track Issac ANDREWS who married Sarah BRENTHALL in Braintree Sept 13, 1769. Children John b1770 and Issac (2)b1774.
Issac (2) m (date not known) Ann UNKNOWN b abt 1770 d 1832. Has children Issac (3) b1800, John b1802, James b1804, George b1806, Martha Hannah b25.11.1807 in Braintree dDec1848, Caroline b1811.
Martha m George LAVERb 18 Dec,1798 Braintree d1879 and had 8 children in Braintree.
Any connections to ANDREWS or other information would be welcome.
Regards
Warwick
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Marriage at Braintree, St Michael the Archangel D/P 264/1/8 1 of 3
1769, Sep 13?
Isaac Andrews, of this Parish, Bachelor, and
Sarah Benthall, of the Parish of Stistead (Fairstead?), Spinster
Married in this Church by Licence & with consent of Parents
by me, William Jones
Isaac & Sarah both signed
Wit: Nathan? Summers?, Robt Collis both signed
[Robert Collis signs most marriages at this time]
Regards CP
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CP
Thank you for that information.
Regarding the query on Sarah's parish I believe she is from Stisted which is slightly NE of Braintree. That gives me a good lead on her Parish...
Regards
Warwick
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Hi, I have just recieved a book written by Eliza Julia Andrews,Mordecai 2nds daughter, in the family tree that appears in this book she has her father married twice, first to Hannah (no surname ) and then to Elizabeth Gamiel Rutt.Elizabeth remarried to Rev Samuel Douglas,Independent Minister at Chelmsford, she had a stroke about this time and was parylised down one side .Mr Douglas died 1821-2 and Elizabeth lived at Springfield and then at King Johns Castle where Frederick and Emily lived with her when Emily married Elizabeth moved to Stanford Rivers where she died about 1828. I have a lot more details ,I will post them as I can sort them. hope this info helps you Janet
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Hi, The info I have on Emily Andrews daughter of Mordecai 2nd and Elizabeth Rutt ,she married Rev William Temple independent minister at Stanford Rivers ,then at Manningtree and Plaistow ,all in Essex their children were Albert ,Douglas ,William, Emily and Geraldine, I don`t know yet if there were more. William jnr, died about 1839-40 and Emily never recovered and died shortly after. Rev Temple moved to Cheltenham where he died about 1851-2 I have no dates or confirmation as yet this info again comes from my family stories (Eliza Julia Flower nee Andrews and Edward William Andrews ) I don`t know anything about Rev Temples family , Janet
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Hi, I don`t think the Mordecai Andrews married to Hannah Litchfield is correct for my family tree. My info has his birth in 1780, so being married in 1784 is not right. According to my family he died unmarried in 1820 at the age of 40. This has to be another Mordecai belonging to another branch of the famly I can`t make this fit.!!! any thoughts please.
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Hi ,I have been going back over the chats about Mordecai Andrews. There are a few facts I can add. Hope they clear up the family connections. The Mordecai 111 that belongs to Mord 2nd and 1st, died unmarried and childless. He lived a gay life of a gentleman and spent a lot of time in Italy. His mother Elizabeth Rutt spoilt him . He is buried at Stanford Rivers. Mord 2nd married Hannah May 9.9.1773, they had 1 child Anne Hannah Andrews . He married Elizabeth Rutt 8.2.1780 they had 11 children. Mord 1st married Sarah Maydman abt 1738 ,they had 3 children Mordecai 2nd, Mary m. Rev. William Kingsbury, Sarah m. Walter Taylor ( circular saw inventor), Hannah m. Rev. William Jameson. Hannah was born after her father died. Her mother was Mordecai 1st second wife Sarah Fann. The Mordecai Andrews who married Hannah Litchfield is probably a different family branch. I have never found parents for Mord 1st . Hope this helps out Janet
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Hi, it has been a while since I have looked at this family but I have found this will/deed that I thought may relate to the 3 Mordecais in my tree (they were all dead before 1843) it may help someone else. Ref Code D/DHtT37/5 Deeds of Braintree created 25.11.1843 Braintree. Sarah Bowtell of Braintree bequests to her brother Thomas Clark and her nieces Susanna Andrews and Sarah wife of Mordecai Andrews proved 14.2.1844 I hope this helps someone Janet
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Hi Everyone, it has been a while since I up dated my info. If you are still interested I have sorted out the Mordecai Andrews families. I have found the parents of my Rev. Mordecai Andrews 1st, F- John Andrews b. 1685 M- Elizabeth Clarke. b. 1688. Children Elisabeth b.1711, Gamaliel b. 1715 d. 1770 and the rev Mordecai 1st. Elizabeth Clarkes parents were Gamaliel Clarke b. 1658 d.1697 and Ann Mannering b.1660 their children were Ann b.1679, Sarah b. 1684, Gamaliel b. 1685 d. 1721, and Elizabeth b 1688. Gamaliel Clarke s father was Thomas Clarke b. 1635 d. 1686. Getting back to the Andrews family, Gamaliel Andrews b1715-1770 married Ruth Reeve /Beckworth ( 2 marriages ) b.1716 d. 1767 married 23.8.1744 children Sarah b.1746 d.1803 m Samuel Forsaith, Gamaliel b.1750 d. 1789 m Eleanor Almsworthy Mordecai b.1761 d. 1789 m Hannah Litchfield and Elizabeth b.1763. Hope this helps. Janet
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Hi Janet,
Thank you very much for your interesting research on the Andrews family. I am a descendant of Mordecai Andrews II through his daughter Eliza Julia Andrews and George Flower. I am very interested in anything else you have on the Andrews, Clarke and Maydman Families and would be happy to help with research. My email is (*)
Thanks, Brent
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