RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => London and Middlesex => Topic started by: hazelmoore on Sunday 27 April 08 15:40 BST (UK)
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Hello All!
I have a Dearing (first name) married to a brother (Thomas) of my Gt.Gt.Grandfather William Moore b.1812. I have them on the 1861 Census living in St Luke, Finsbury. Thomas and William were born in Coventry and Dearing in St Lukes.
I have been unable to find a Marriage for them or indeed a Birth (c1820 - too early!) or Death for her - I entered 'Dearing' on FreeBMD and there were only a handful of entries from 1837 to 1910 and most of those were male!
I have tried Ancestry and Family Research with similar results - does anyone have any ideas where I go from here? I even tried Dearing on Google but most results are for the surname.
I would be extremely grateful for any ideas...!
Thanks, Hazel
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Hi Hazel,
Have you seen the actual 1861 census image? It's very unclear so I'd say 'Dearing' is just as good a guess as anything else! :-\
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I agree with Tati - the image is awful! I don't see her in 1871 either.
Have you managed to identify the birth of one of the children? The cert would give the mother's name.
Kind regards, Arranroots ;)
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A possible birth for Sarah Moore 1856 JFM St Luke, 1b 593
and for Thomas Moore 1860 JFM st Luke, 1b 623
Roy
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Hi Tati and Arranroots
Yes I do have the image and I do agree with you to a certain extent. I must admit I have leant on the transcription - Dearing!! Any other ideas about what it could be?!! Yes they did have children, Sarah and Thomas and I do have their Reg.Nos. but they are not such close family that I had considered getting a Birth Cert.!!! Looks like it may be the only way to find out what her name is!
Hazel
P.S. You're too fast for me!! I have Dec 1855 Moore Sarah Elizabeth St.Luke 1b 515 and the same as you for Thomas
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I agree with Tati - the image is awful! I don't see her in 1871 either.
I believe Thomas is a widower in 1871.
Have looked at deaths 1861-1871 in the St Luke and Holborn districts but couldn't see anything that looked remotely like it! :P
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Hi Tati
I think Thomas is in the 'Holborn Union' Workhouse in 1871, widower, even though the age is wrong.
I couldn't find a Moore Death that fitted Dearing either! :(
Hazel
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I've tried to find this family on the 1861 on FindMyPast - can't find them at all
Think Thomas Junior is at an Indstrial School in 1871....
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Agree about Thomas Jr.
There is a marriage of a Diana HARRISON which I have tried to make fit!
Marriage
Dec 1855 St Luke 1b 747
Cotton Hannah
Harrison Diana
Moore Thomas
Rowland Henry
Mentioning it here in case anyone else thinks it is likely?
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Hi Mum44
Is that the Mitcham school? Pity there's no address even on Page 1. I think his cousins were at the same place in 1881.
Going back to look at the image I can see Dearing in what's written where I can't see Diana...maybe Dearing was a nickname!!
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Hi Arran - yes, I looked at Diana Harrison - only because it began with D and seemed to be at the right time!
There are also Dearings on the 1851, but as Hazel said - males.
I like the nickname theory - although .... what ? I did wonder whether it was darling ?
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further to Diane Harrison - the only Diana Rowland I could see on the 1861 (other male Henry Rowland) was married to Charles Rowland, and I coudn't see a Diana Moore.....
Probably only proves I can't see straight !
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Can't find Sarah on 1871, but there are several Sarah Moore Deaths between 1861 & 71 around St Lukes, Clerkenwell and Bethnal Green so I reckon she may have passed on with her Mother - if we only knew what her Mother's name was really!!
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There's a Sarah MOOR who looks promising in 1871 - visiting Robert W PARSONS & family in St Luke's - again I can't prove any kind of link with your family though!
RG10/402/28/50
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Arran - thanks for that. Unfortunately at the moment Ancestry images won't open for me - anyone else having trouble??? However, sounds a good possibility. :)
Hazel
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Ive been looking at it and I must say I thiught the first 5 letters were Diana then ig..but it could be owt..Why dont you cut the image and put in in the Common Room so that more people see it and can have a go..... :o
Jane
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Hi Jane,
Where should I put it? Technical help? Or what - I've never done it before!!
Cheers, Hazel
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Ive just PMd Hazel with instructions.. ???
Jane
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Jane - thank you, I managed to put it up! :D Now awaiting results!!!
Hazel
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LOL..Im sure they will all have fun with it and solve it for you..
It never ceases to suprise me what Rootchatters come up with with these sorts of things ;D
Jane
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I do agree! It's such fun posting on here - people are so helpful!
;) ;D
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Hi folks
Good idea Jane
Hazel, I have locked your new thread with a comment, in order to keep all contributions in the same place & to let people know about the discussions we have already had.
Kind regards, Arranroots ;)
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I guess it could be Diana- I haven't checked censuses for the other couple though.
Marriages Dec 1855
COTTON Hannah St Luke 1b 747
**HARRISON Diana St Luke 1b 747
**MOORE Thomas St Luke 1b 747
ROWLAND Henry St Luke 1b 747
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Hi Arranroots - how does the 'locking' work, I've never come accross it! Will replies to that come on to the Mddx thread?
Thanks anyway,
Hazel
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Hazel - the person who starts a thread (or a Moderator) can lock the topic by clicking on the little padlock symbol at the bottom.
It is "good practice" to add a link to topics which contain basically the same information & you can do this by copying the URL from your original thread & pasting it into the new one (I've done it for you).
Anyone reading the new thread will be directed to (and will answer on) this older thread.
A ;)
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I guess it could be Diana- I haven't checked censuses for the other couple though. I have now.
Marriages Dec 1855
COTTON Hannah St Luke 1b 747
**HARRISON Diana St Luke 1b 747
**MOORE Thomas St Luke 1b 747
ROWLAND Henry St Luke 1b 747
Looking at 1861, I see a Henry and Hannah ROWLAND in St Mary Newington ... eldest child aged 5, born Middlesex
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Thank you GeoffE - I'll look into Diana!
Hazel
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Just checked FindMyPast 1861, their image is very clear, definitely Dearing
but - family all indexed with surname MEAN although again, quite clearly Moore (have told them about it)
(http://img257.imageshack.us/img257/4711/1861copyvs5.jpg)
Barbara :)
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Barbara - thanks for that - (wish Ancestry were that clear!!) that'll be why Mum44 couldn't find them on FindMyPast! I wonder what name she actually married under! I feel sure now that Dearing was her second name, but that she was known by it. I can't find a Death (assuming Thomas was a widower in 1871) that I could be sure about although there are Ann, Jane and Temperance (!) Moore in 1863!
Oh well, maybe I'll try sending for Thomas Jr.'s Birth Cert.
Thanks again to everyone for your help.
Hazel
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Hi Hazel,
Did you have Dearing/Diana in 1851?
This seems to be her:
H107/1522/65/24
2 Waterloo Place, St Luke, Middlesex
*Dina HARRISON, Head, widow, 29, Straw Bonnet Maker
*John HARRISON, Son, 6, Scholar
*Bridget TULLEY, Lodger, Unmarried, 16, Tailoress
All born Middlesex St Luke
JAP
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Hi Jap
This would seem to imply that she was a widow when she married Thomas Moore in 1855. In 1861 her son John Harrison is with the Jennings household as 'brother' - but it is not clear to who!
Hazel
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Whoo-hoo JAP!!
That could well be the missing piece of the jigsaw, well done!
:D 8)
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Well, I found this Marriage:
Jun 1841
HARRISON Samuel
ROGERS Diana St Martin 1 142
and there are plenty of Samuel Harrison Deaths including this one:
Sep 1843
HARRISON Samuel Holborn 2 91
Looking quite promising isn't it? ;)
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Well, well, well - see what I have found now!! I'm still not sure where it takes me!! Dearing was supposedly only 40 in 1861 and here 'she' is, 35 in 1841.......of course probably nearer 30, but still...!
Any comments/musings welcomed! I wondered if she'd been married before - to a Rogers? - or are they her brothers (no sign of other Rogers' in the vicinity)
Hazel
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Can't wait to see what she's called on Thomas Jnr's birth cert, hope you're going to send for it :)
Barbara
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Have sent for Thomas Jr.'s Birth Certificate - despatch date May 6th.
Watch this space!!!
Hazel ;D
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... In 1861 her son John Harrison is with the Jennings household as 'brother' - but it is not clear to who!
Hazel, what is the reference for this census entry please?
Incidentally, there are a couple of deaths which might be possible for "Dearing":
Dinah MOORE, death, Mar 1863, Stepney
Dinah MOORE, death, Dec 1864, Shoreditch.
JAP
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Here are some interesting entries from the IGI:
27 Apr 1841, St Martin in the Fields, Westminster, London
Samuel HARRISON married Diana ROGERS or WADLEY
Parents William ROGERS & Diana
Given the dates, these are probably/possibly two different sets of parents - but Richard ROGERS b 1836 certainly fits with Diana HARRISON in the 1841 ...
Unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be a George ...
St Mary-St Marylebone Road, Saint Marylebone, London
Elizabeth ROGERS b 18 Dec 1823, bap 14 Jan 1824
St Andrew, Holborn, London
William ROGERS b 29 Jun, bap 30 Aug 1826
All Souls, Saint Marylebone, London
John ROGERS, b 28 Mar, bap 12 May 1833
Richard ROGERS, b 2 Feb, bap 28 Feb 1836
JAP
PS (added later after thinking about it!): The IGI has a Diana WADLEY born 1799 in Middlesex but she would be too old for "Dearing" as, in the 1861 (age given as 40), "Dearing" has a 5yo and a 1yo. Perhaps we are following up some red herrings?
Perhaps Diana WADLEY, b 1799, married William ROGERS and had various children with him. He died and Diana WADLEY/ROGERS married Samuel HARRISON. Her age (rounded down to the nearest 5) of 35 in 1841 fits quite well - OK, it should be 40 but perhaps she said it was 39 and that would be rounded down to 35.
Perhaps the Diana HARRISON who married Thomas MOORE is a completely different Diana HARRISON. Her age is given as 29 in 1851 and 40 in 1861; she has 5yo and a 1yo in 1861.
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Hi Jap
Wow, what a lot of 'ferretting' you've done! I have come to the conclusion that only Thomas' Birth will give us the answer, as Diana's ages are too different in the various Censuses to be logically the same person. Can't wait for it to arrive now!!
Thanks for your input.
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CONGRATULATIONS TO ALL MY HELPERS!!!!!
I have just got Thomas's Birth Cert. - 8th Jan.1860.
Mother: Dinah Moore formerly HARRISON!!! (Special thanks to ArranRoots for suggesting that Marriage!)
I am now busy collating all the information you put up on here - thank you all once again. I shall chase Dinah to her roots! I wonder where the Dearing came from?!!
Cheers, Hazel
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Hi Hazel,
Wow!
We'll be watching this space ...
JAP