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General => Technical Help => Topic started by: Nick29 on Tuesday 08 July 08 12:46 BST (UK)
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If you have Windows XP, and your PC is set to download and install updates automatically, you will very soon be downloading Service Pack 3, which has caused major problems on many computers, including mine, where it caused the monitor to go into power-down mode when Windows was starting, and never came back on again. I've been working with PC's since the early 1980's, and it took me 6 hours to resolve it !
Please note that if you don't want Service Pack 3 to install automatically, and your PC is set to receive Windows updates automatically, it is up to you to stop it. There are some notes on this site (http://blogs.msdn.com/nickmac/archive/2008/07/07/windows-xp-service-pack-3-release-to-automatic-updates.aspx) which tell you how to do this. Please note that this is not my site (it's a different "Nick"), so I can't answer any queries raised about this site.
If you don't want Service Pack 3, at the very least you need to change your settings, so that you can review updates before installing them.
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My SP3 was downloaded at the beginning of May. Some people have had problems, but I and many others have not. I suspect most people who have automatic updates already have SP3 by now.
It caused problems with some processors (AMD athlone, I think).
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My SP3 was downloaded at the beginning of May. Some people have had problems, but I and many others have not. I suspect most people who have automatic updates already have SP3 by now.
It caused problems with some processors (AMD athlone, I think).
This is coincidentally the time when my son and his pal tried to "rescusitate" my XP which was a black screen when I turned the machine on. Unbeknown to me the 2 macho twentysomethings tried to "Restore to Former Date" but then they lost control. By the time the professional technician examined my machine there was nothing he could save. One day I might mourn the loss of years of research but for now I'm living each day safely cacooned in "automatic" mode.
Rena
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Normally I have automatic updates turned off since resources are constantly being wasted looking for updates which do not exist. I did download and install SP3 successfully some time ago.
Today though I read about a major concern that was spotted about 6 months ago concerning DNS and that there was a security update released by Microsoft to fix the problem. I switched Automatic Updates on and shortly after 1/8 updates started downloading. Once they had all been installed and the PC rebooted I was no longer able to access webpages using IE7. It said I was connected to the Internet but I could not display any webpages or download mail using Outlook. I tried Firefox with the same result.
Fortunately I have a Linux partition so I booted to that and managed to connect to the Internet as normal.
I then rebooted to my Windows partition and did a System Restore and everything is back to normal. I've no idea what is wrong with these latest updates but they have obviously screwed my system up.
Password authentication seems OK as it says that I'm connected - except I can't access my mail.
I now have Automatic Updates switched off until I can find out more about this recent batch of updates.
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I have got a yellow shield shape with a ! in it sitting in my task bar. What do I do?
mouse over it, tells me 'update are ready, click here to install' :o
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I have got a yellow shield shape with a ! in it sitting in my task bar. What do I do?
mouse over it, tells me 'update are ready, click here to install' :o
Well.....I clicked on it this morning and loaded the (unspecified) update.
I immediately lost all connection to the internet, although I had a 'connected' signal from the wireless router. Despite many re-bootings of the computer and the router, and checking all my settings were correct I was unable to regain a connection.
I also started to have problems with Microsoft Word.
I decided to do a 'system restore', backdating to yesterday, when everything was fine.
Bingo! Connection restored, Word working fine.
I have temporarily switched off automatic updates ;D
Jennifer
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I had one today, and updated as normal, before reading this thread.
All seems to be ok, no change in the comp at all....although don't know if it had to do with SP3
Cas
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I have looked at my settings (and I have sp2) with automatic updates set to be installed every day at 1900 hrs. I have just changed that to 'notify me but let me install updates' so I hope this will do the trick, for now, until someone can tell me what else I should do.......here's hoping
Will I be able to switch off or go into hibernate without them installing?
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Downside, do you use the Zone Alarm firewall?
According to some comments at the end of The Register (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/07/09/dns_fix_alliance/)'s article about the DNS Security update, "the MS update (KB951748) for this problem brought its own issues to users who employ the popular Zone Alarm Firewall. A conflict between the two stops all internet access unless ZA is reset or a further update comes along."
K.
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someone can tell me what else I should do.......here's hoping.
If you feel lucky then you can install and keep your fingers crossed.
Don't forget you can always use System Restore to back-out the updates and put yourself back to pre-update normality.
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[Downside, do you use the Zone Alarm firewall?
Yes I do.
When I attempted to connect to the Internet after the updates a Zone Alarm balloon appeared in the System Tray asking me if I wantered to let Internet Explorer have access to to the Internet and I ticked a checkbox to allow it this privelege without asking me again.
I also went into Zone Alarm control panel and checked the program access section and it seemed OK to me.
The thing is, Firefox also has the same problem.
It's got me stumped.
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Don't forget you can always use System Restore to back-out the updates and put yourself back to pre-update normality.
Only if the computer will start!
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Oh eck! Now I'm scared, very scared, :o I just downloaded the update but not rebooted my computer yet.
Elin ???
It's ok! I stopped flapping and used system restore. :)
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Hmmmm. From the same comments section on The Register, "ZoneAlarm was broken by the update, and their forums are now filled with people reporting that they can't connect." It would appear that it's ZA's problem rather than IE/Firefox.
:-\
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I do not use zone alarm.
But have just lost lots of messages from yahoo...
Anothr post coming on!
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Hi
Just had the yellow shield appeared in the "Notification Area" saying updates were ready to be installed.
Having Zone Alarm installed but feeling a bit reckless, I decided to hit the shield and see what happened...but first created a new System Restore point.
Having hit the shield the two updates were KB890830 Malicious Software Removal Tool July 2008 and (the dreaded) KB951748.
Result of recklessness, after restart.....as predicted.....no Internet connection although all indicators showed it to be working.
Immediate action.....Applied System Restore to the point created immediately before the automatic update installation.... everything now working OK again.
DS
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Hi!
Now that you have made me a nervous wreck :o :o - can you tell me how to turn off automatic updates please??
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Hi
Go into Control Panel and select Automatic Updates. Then check one of the bottom three options (in place of the top one).
I hope that makes sense
DS
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Hi DS
Thank you very much!!
Judy
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I've reinstalled the MS updates from this morning (no need to download again as they were still on the hard drive). After the reboot I went into Zone Alarm Program Control and removed the IE7 and Firefox entries.
I then tried to connect to the Internet and it authenticated my user name and password but could not display my home page.
I then shutdown Zone Alarm and hit the refresh button on IE7 and my homepage was displayed. I then opened Outlook and managed to download mail as usual.
So it is definitely a Zone Alarm problem.
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Now that I have settled my nerves, can you tell me what Zone Alarm is and would I know if I have it? ::)
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Just checked my system and it still says I have SP2. Put in the info on search that DS supplied...it states update KB951748 was downloaded onto my comp on 21 June, the one download today was the KB890830 Malicious Software Removal Tool July 2008.
Is the KB951748... SP3? if so, why is it only stating SP2 on the system info. I do not have zone alarm, and have had no problems as mentioned, just curious to know if I have passed it by...
Have also changed my updates to not download or install without notifing me first.
DS how do you create a manual system restore point ? I am just interested.
Cas
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Zone alarm is a firewall program available as a free download or you can upgrade.
What protection do you have?
Cas
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can you tell me what Zone Alarm is and would I know if I have it?
It is a firewall. It's a bit like a bouncer outside a night club deciding who should enter and leave the night club. If you have a Z icon in your System Tray area, next to the clock in the bottom right hand side of your screen, then - yes you have it.
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It doesn't matter whether you have SP3 or not, as long as Automatic Updates are switched on you will still get security updates.
I did not have to create a System Restore point, it was done automatically by the Windows update process.
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Is the KB951748... SP3?
DS how do you create a manual system restore point ? I am just interested.
Hi Cas
KB951748 is not SP3. It is what Koromo said it was earlier (a fix for a specific problem....which has created as many, if not more problems than it was trying to fix ::)).
In System Restore you are given three options on the "Welcome" page. The second option is to "Create a restore point”.
DS ;)
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Hi
Can you tell me please where to find system restore please? (For future reference!!) ;D
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One route to finding System Restore is....
Start >
All Programs >
Accessories >
System Tools >
System Restore.
DS
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Well it does not look as if I have SP3 but have installed 'the fix' KB951748 from auto updates ???. Have not had any probs thou' Think I will stick with SP2...and vet the updates beforehand.
Thanks for the info DS, Downside
Cas
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Thank you DS
I shall keep that for future reference!!!
Judy ;)
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The problem is definitely a conflict between the latest Microsoft update and Zone Alarm.
See http://www.rootschat.com/links/03sr/
and other associated threads on the Zone Alarm User Forum.
Remove the update and the problem goes away.
Can you tell me please where to find system restore please? (For future reference!!) ;D
Go to
All Programs
Accessories
System tools
System restore.
Jennifer
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Sorry, the link didn't work properly
2nd try
http://www.rootschat.com/links/03st/
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[quote If you have a Z icon in your System Tray area, next to the clock in the bottom right hand side of your screen, then - yes you have it.
Ah! Thank you DS. A good explanation and thankfully I have no Z!
Cas, I have been busily trying to work out what protection I do have now. I had a protection programme with my Virgin connection but it kept stopping me doing what I wanted and turned everything RED!! I turned it off but thought that I had some protection from windows, now I am not sure.
I have found system restore a real blessing. It has saved me on several occasions when I have been in desperate need. ::)
Elin
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Thank you Jen!! ;)
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trying to work out what protection I do have now
Double click Security Center in Control Panel and it will tell you which security programs you have installed.
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I do feel a bit behind the times here, but I had terrible problems with SP2, never mind trying SP3 :(
As a result, I'm very choosy about what updates I download. In most cases (apart from the occasional security issue) I find my computer is working perfectly well without mucking about with it.
Gareth
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I have just noticed in the tray that I,too, have the yellow shield. I am on SP2 and have automatic updates. Although I can get into the internet no AOL Homepage has appeared. Should I do a system restore and click the yellow shield or leave things as they are and hope.
After reading all the info I am still not sure what to do.
Gatacre
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Hi Gatacre
I am no techno buff...but it seems if you are on SP2 and not SP3 with no zone alarm firewall installed all updates should be ok, if you need them is another matter, like the fix for SP3.
The one I had today was KB890830 Malicious Software Removal Tool July 2008
If the icon is in your tray, you have not installed yet, possibly the prob is something else?
Cas
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Thank you, Cas. I think that leaving well alone at this point may be the best thing to do
Norah
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I had a look (by right clicking the yellow shield) and unticked KB951748. It sounds as though I don't need it anyway. I hope.
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How do you tell which service pack you have got please ???
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click start then control panel then click 'system'...it should state what the comp is running
cas
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Thanks Cas
The update hasnt got to me yet. I only have 2 running ::)
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I have have only just read this thread :-\
I clicked the download this morning, then had to go out, so left PC on so it could complete it.
I checked and do have SP3, PC has been working OK all night. Could anything nasty happen when I turn it off or would it have re-booted automatically ???
Bye the way RC people, many thanks for all the tips :-* as this none IT person needs all the help she can get if things go wrong. :-[
Ambers
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If you do have Zone Alarm and find your computer can no longer display webpages after the latest security update then a work around is as follows:-
Right click the Zone Alarm icon in your System Tray and select Restore Zone Alam Security Center.
Click on the Firewall option on the left hand column.
Click on the slider control on the Internet Zone Security and slide it down to medium.
Changing it to medium will allow your to access webpages but admittedly it will also reduce protection. It is only a temporary solution until some fix is developed by Zone Alarm.
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Thanks downside :)
If the problem is only to do with Zone Alarm, I willl be OK in that regard.
SP2 played havoc with my PC, so I was a little wary about SP3
Amber :)
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Hi
The method suggested by Downside does indeed work...but, personally, I would prefer to keep my Firewall protection set on "High" and remove update KB951748 (if it is installed and causing problems) for the time being.
This link explains....
http://forum.zonelabs.org/zonelabs/board/message?board.id=access&message.id=34028
DS ;)
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Thank you Thank you Thank you soooo much for this thread - I had the dreaded updates installed on me automatically this morning and yes as I have Zone alarm, all access to the internet ceased, but thanks to catching some of this disscussion yesterday I knew to do a system restore (my first ever) and change my preferences to inform me before downloading updates - and I am back with you all in less than 2 hours with only a few more hairs turned grey
;D
DebbieG
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Just a quick note - I don't think SP3 will be appearing in Windows Automatic Updates for a few more days yet.
If you do find that any Windows Update leaves you with a non-working or compromised computer, you can always get to System Restore by booting your computer in Safe Mode.
You do this by repeatedly jabbing the F8 key on your keyboard whilst the computer is booting up (don't hold the F8 key down). Once you have booted in Safe Mode (the screen may look a little weird), System Restore will be one of the options offered. If System Restore doesn't work, another alternative whilst in Safe Mode is the "Add/Remove Software" feature, where you can tick a box that says "Include Windows Updates", and then you can un-install them.
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For all Zone Alarm users, with the problem caused by the latest Microsoft update, there is an update for ZoneAlarm which my OH and I both downloaded this morning. Go to Zonelabs.com website and you'll see the solution given by Downside, which we had to do before we could even connect to the internet, but there is also a new download. Now we have that, we have moved the slider control back to high and everything works well.
Lizzie
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MickyP has, on another thread, posted the address you need to go to for the update:
http://download.zonealarm.com/bin/free/pressReleases/2008/LossOfInternetAccessIssue.html
Hope this helps.
Lizzie
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It's got into the newspapers ;D
http://www.rootschat.com/links/03tc/
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All over the media:-
http://news.google.co.uk/news?hl=en&q=zonealarm+and+windows+update&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&oi=news_result&resnum=1&ct=title
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It got me and for once it wasn't my ISP (Orange) fault ;D ;D
Kerry
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Has the previous conflict between SP3 and Norton has been resolved?
Gadget
PS - I don't update automatically but I do have 5 computers running XP with Norton (came free with BT Broadband :) )
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http://news.google.co.uk/news?hl=en&q=zonealarm+and+windows+update&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=X&oi=news_result&resnum=1&ct=title
I followed up this one and it is worth reading what the Washington Post has to say about the problem..Would I be correct in thinking that the trouble is not just with having Zone Alarm?
Oddly, I have not clicked the yellow shield but have found that the KB 951748 patch has already been installed thru automatic updates
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Another shocking discovery is on another thread.
I am no longer able to send email using Outlook because of KB951748 and have had to remove it again - except you can't just remove that one update because it has dependancies and therefore you have to remove several updates at once.
Having removed KB951748 I am now able to send email.
Windows Automatic Updates are now permanently switched off on this PC. ::)