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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Surrey Lookup Requests => Surrey => England => Surrey Completed Look up Requests => Topic started by: ceriloujo on Sunday 17 August 08 18:15 BST (UK)
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Hi,
I am trying to find out the history of this house. I believe it was demolished to make way for more room at gatwick airport.
If anyone knows anything about the date it was built, who lived there, anything really. I would loved to hear from you and would appreciate anything you can share with me.
Thanks,
Ceri
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Hi Ceri,
Charlwood Park was in existence by 1881 when it was the home of Edward and Frances Habershom (Habersham?). 1881 census RG11 0801 51 8
1891 and 1901 census have a William Henry White living there. This thread - www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,194456.0.html
A Herbert Musker was the owner in 1911 (according to British History Online) and in 1931 the house was sold by auctioneers Smith, Son and Oakley, described as follows:
Charlwood Park, Horley
11 bedroom house with outbuildings, farm buildings, cottage, 2 bedroom cottage, 3 room cottage known as Keepers Cottage, land of 106 acres
As you say the whole site of Charlwood Park is now occupied by Gatwick Airport, building of which commenced in 1956.
This book might be useful to get hold of if your near Surrey Local History Centre 'Lowfield Heath Remembered -Jean Shelley'. It covers the area demolished to make way for the airport.
Regards,
Claire
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Hello Claire,
Thankyou for taking the time to give me them details. That's great and something for me to go on.
I did manage to find the sale particulars you mentioned and have emailed Surrey history centre to see if I could buy copies as I don't live anywhere near Surrey - I live in the wilds of Wales.
Such a shame it was demolished and I would love to read the book you suggested, but unfortunately there's no chance of me getting down there to see it. Maybe I could buy it somewhere?.
I will do a search for it.
Thanks again I appreciate it. :)
Kerrie
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Hi again Kerrie,
I can make Charlwood Park a bit older for you - it appears on the 1841 census with the occupiers being Michael Clayton 45 Attorny N(ot born in county) and his wife Eliza 40 N. They appear to have no children but a number of male and female servants.
Looking at maps from planning records for Gatwick airport, the name Charlwood Park appears on a map from 1970, albeit very close to the airport boundary, the house could have possibly survived until either the 1970 or 1973 enlargement.
Regards,
Claire
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I also have Charlwood Park on the 1851 census, but this is a bit confusing. The reference I have is HO 107/1599/2. It shows Charlwood Park Lodge and Charlwood Park Garden House normally, then inbetween is Charlwood Park Mansion, this is only one line and no names are listed. There is something written above the word 'mansion' but I can't make it out, if someone could help?
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Sadly it looks as if this is what is now where Charlwood Park Farm was:
http://www.parkbcp.co.uk/gatwick/holiday-parking.html
I remember going on walks around Charlwood in the 1960/70's ( I lived at Horley then) when it was still a village and had not been eaten up by the expansion of the airport later in the 1970/80's.
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Thankyou for your replies, I didn't think Charlwood park went back as early as 1841, that was a surprise.
Do you know where I might look to find the actual date it was demolished?
I know it was there in 1975/76 because I lived there, but I will check the dates with my mother as I was very young (born 1973)
I have a lot of recurring memories of this house and that is why I have an interest in researching the house
It such a shame that listed buildings can just be demolished because of influence and money.
I also have a photo in my possession of a family that I believe lived there, looks like a wedding photo, so if anybody is related to any of the names mentioned and has any photo's of them
get in touch, if they match any of the people in the photo I will pass it on to you.
Thanks again,
Ceri
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Hi
I just happened to google Charlwood Park and came across this thread.
My Great grandfather (George Massey Saunders) was a gardener at Charlwood park from c1870 to c1902 when he moved to Bushey, Herts.
His address in 1891 is "Gardener's cottage", Charlwood Park.
His father (John Saunders) was the Head gardener there before him.
I know that somewhere there was a photo of him with a shotgun outside a big house. My parents told me he used to be the Head gardener at a big park, but until a few years ago when I started researching the tree I did not know where it was. Sadly I do not know if the photo still exists or not.
If I ever find it I will post it.
Any other info about the place would be most welcome here as well!
Regards
Phil How
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If anyone has a map with the site of Charlwood house on it I would love to take a look.
I lived in Farmfield Cottages (part of what was then Farmfield Hospital) in 1959-1962 ish. I see from Google Earth that the hospital is now a Priory Clinic and the cottages have gone, but I remember a large house on the other side of the road, and recall walking about in there a few times, I wonder if that was Charlwood house?
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Hi
I have not yet found a map, but I do recall finding more info about it a few years ago during my research, but sadly I was very green and did not understand the impoprtance of recording sources!
There is a lot of info here:
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=42953#s1
I am not certain whether my SAUNDERS family are related to the SANDERS family of Charlwood or not. If they are it is probably in the distant past, as mine were in Lyndhurst for several generations, and Christchurch before that.
I have reopened my investigations into Charlwood now, as I am at a temporary standstill with my direct tree!!
I will see what else I can discover from my armchair here in Croxley Green, Herts.
Regards
Phil How
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If you go here:
http://www.francisfrith.com/search/england/surrey/charlwood/photos/charlwood_photos.htm
you will find some old photos of Charlwood, but long after the old house went.
Phil
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I have just been looking at Google Earth again, and the previous post which points out that the site of the house is now car park fits in exactly with where I thought the big house was in my childhood.
If anyone is interested, I lived in a cottage which is now a patch of green trees at the corner of Farmfield Rd and Charlwood road. On the opposite side of Charlwood road is the possibly long-stay car park wher I remember the big house.
I must stress though that I don't know if this would have been one of the Charlwood Park/House/Manor about which this post was started.
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I lived in a cottage which is now a patch of green trees at the corner of Farmfield Rd and Charlwood road. On the opposite side of Charlwood road is the possibly long-stay car park wher I remember the big house.
I must stress though that I don't know if this would have been one of the Charlwood Park/House/Manor about which this post was started.
Hi BuddysMummy,
Yes, the area alongside Charlwood road, opposite Farmfield Road was part of the Charlwood Park estate. As well as the carparks, which are on the site of Charlwood Park Farm, the World Cargo Centre and North Terminal are also built on the area that was the estate. Have a look at the map on www.visionofbritain.org.uk/maps/index.jsp which shows how large the estate was, it is just south of Povey Cross.
Charlwood House is not the same as Charlwood Park. Charlwood House lies to the South of the airport and still exists.
Regards
Claire
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There is a nice map on the Surrey County Council website here: www.surreycc.gov.uk/sccwebsite/sccwspages.nsf/LookupWebPagesByTITLE_RTF/Surrey+Interactive+Map
You can zoom in to see details like footpaths and house names. BuddysMummy, if you zoom in to where you know the junction of Charlwood Road and Farmfield Road to be, you should see Charlwood Park Farm (TQ261415).Just north of this, where Charlwood Road turns almost 90degrees right, is Charlwood Park Cottage (TQ262418)
Regards
Claire
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Hello to all with an interest in the area around "Charlwood Park Farm". Just for interest I think I remember the house in question. Big white house at the end of the lane? In the 70's I was a young lad and my family worked on what at that time was left of the much declined charlwood park farm. Just a few dairy cows are about all I remember. I do remember walking around the fields and down the lane to see the old house once or twice, from a distance. My familly moved out and it was all demolished to make way for car parks, water courses and taxi ways. Looking at goodle earth it would have probably been at the end of the lane right where the car park starts? Off of the Horley/Charlwood road that is ...
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Just to add to my last post ... my dad tells me he remembers that the old house "now under the car park" was owned by the "Welch" family? These were the people that he says owned the house probably post WW2. They employed my family who worked/lived on the Charlwood Park Farm until it was demolished for the expansion of the airport. Going on what was said before about the size of the estate, the Welch family had two farm sites I think. The one my family worked at off the Charlwood/Horley Road and another some distance away off of the Lowfield Heath road. I think the Lowfield Heath site was taken even earlier for the airport expansion. Sadly I think that all the history my family has in this area is post WW2, and may be too late to help on this post. If you think I can help let me know, I'll ask any questions to my dad. I'm sure he'll remember because the family live/lived around Charlwood, Horsham, Horley, Capel for many years ...
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Hi Ceri
As I am really stuck with my Family Tree I often check the county boards. My father was born in Charlwood so just had a look at the Surrey board and was amazed to see your Charlwood Park thread.
My grandfather, George Cullen, was a Domestic Coachman and the address on my father's Birth certificate, he was born in 1903, is Stables, The Park, Charlwood. Do you think that would have been Charlwood Park?
I have been trying to find out who my grandfather's employers were and also where my father was baptised, they were a Catholic family.
I haven't had time to follow the links on you thread but am looking forward to doing so. Unfortunately I don't have any photographs from that period.
RBC.
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Please excuse my ignorance but is Charlwood Park the same as Charlwood Manor which is mentioned in the British History Online:
http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=42953&strquery=charlwood
which is a quote from A History of the County of Surrey: Volume 3
I'm fortunate in having family postcards and letters from about 1900 onwards but nothing from this earlier period in Surrey. I can remember being taken to visit relatives in the area when I was a child, but I can't remember any details; so the descriptions in these posts are of real interest to me. My mother, who now has dementia, only talks of the big (white) house with iron gates. Of course this may be a random memory of somewhere else entirely. However, I do have evidence of the family in Capel, Charlwood, Holmwood and Horley so if anyone does have more details about Charlwood I will be very interested to hear more and in particular the location of the manor if it is different to Charlwood Park.
thanks,
AE
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I am now able to answer my own question about Charlwood Manor and Charlwood Park.
The DOMESTIC BUILDINGS RESEARCH GROUP (SURREY) has a list of Charlwood buildings with dates.
http://www.dbrg.org.uk/SURREY/charlwood.html
However, I am uncertain where these sites are in the village and I would be grateful for any help in locating any remaining building, or evidence of a building. I would like to mount an expedition to Charlwood and Capel in the spring or summer (depending on funds) in order to photograph the area and I am quite happy to share the results with anyone on this list.
Happy New Year
AE
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Hello AE,
As the Domestic Buildings list you have contains grid references for each property, I would suggest the easiest thing to do would be to use the ordnance survey website and enter the grid references in the search field.
http://getamap.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/getamap/frames.htm
Local history information for Charlwood (books, maps, parish registers, etc.) is held at Horley Local History Centre.
www.surreycc.gov.uk/horleylocalhistory
Regards,
Claire
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Brilliant - an excellent link for the map - many thanks.
AE
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:) 8) Hi hope you all had a nice xmas and the new year will be better than the last,I am chasing "Sharp " ancesters,from Charlwood,Has anyone got any info,details,photos,on "Nutley Dean" farm,hopefully yours Brian
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Hi Folks
I used to live at Charlwood Park from 1954 to around 1966. It was the big white house as someone has described here. During my time there the owner (not sure if he might of rented) the property was a Mr Ashpool who ran a clothing business from the house with the brand name Ashpool and Twiddy. My father used to work for him in the business as well as being gardner and chauffer. Mr Ashpool had two sons named Jonathan and Jeremy.
We lived in one end of the house (say the west wing) and another person also working for Mr Ashpool lived in the other end (say the east wing). My mother used to cater for the family when they had dinner parties etc. Mr Ashpool was an ardent cricket fan and used to follow England religiously. We used to have famous cricketers visit and as a young lad I was taught to play cricket by, I recall, Colin Cowdrey and David Sheppard who became the Bishop of Liverpool.
The house was approached by two driveways, one from the Povey Cross end and the other from Horley Road near Farmfield drive. Keepers Cottage was on the driveay from Povey Cross and there was another smaller cottage just at that entrance. I think not long before we moved there there was still a racecourse or greyhound track in the road from Povey Cross. That was soon closed down as the airport was developed.
The house itelf was surrounded by woods except for the rear where there was an open outlook over fields to the airport and I remember standing on the balcony to see the first jet airliner coming in to land. The other buildings within the site were greenhouses, a barn and garaging for 8 or 9 cars. I recall well the kitchen garden my farther looked after along with orchard of apple and pear trees - yum yum!
At one time the local hunt used to meet at the house and we would be invaded by riders in all their finery with dogs yapping at their heels.
There was a large cellar and again I remember there were often many rabbits and pheasants or partridges hanging just being readied for the pot.
The farm, approached from the Horley Road drive entrance, was run by a Mr Orial (not the right spelling perhaps but phonetically correct) and he would often be out in the field with his 12 bore, shooting game. There was a small pond in one of his fields were I used to spend most of my school holidays and weekends fishing for carp or tench. I had friends that lived at Farmfield cottages but sadly cannot remember names.
I was a wonderful place to live at the time and it is a real shame it was demolished to make way for the airport expansion.
Well thta's my trip down memory lane - I might have some pictures tucked away if anyone would be interested - let me know - hope this might have been of interest
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That's a wonderful vision of Charlwood, thank you very much. If you do have any photographs of the building I would be very interested.
Thank you,
AEJordan
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You mention 2 cottages at the entrance. Would you recall if one of them would have been known as the Gardeners Cottage?
My great grandfather George Massey Saunders was the gardener at Charlwood Park from at least 1881 to c1893.
His address is given in 1871 as "Road leading to Red Hill, Horley", and his occupation is Gardener, as was his father John Saunders at the same address.
In 1881 George is "gardener domestic" at "Park Gardens, Charlwood", and in 1891 he is at "Gardener's cottage, Charlwood Park", though by 1901 he has moved to Bushey, Herts, near where I live.
John and his two younger sons are all gardeners (one unemployed) at Horley Lodge a little way up the road from Horley. By 1891 John is still a gardener at "Ellmers Land, Horley Lodge, Horley" and by 1901 he is a retired gardener at Cheshunt Rd, Horley.
I am sorry to go into so much detail, but I just wonder whether you know anything of Horley Lodge, and of the Gardeners Cottage at Charlwood Park. My Great Grandad was obviously there over half a century before you were there, but I would definitely be interested in any photos you may have.
Regards
Phil How
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Well I have a picture of the house and also a fudged googlemap of where I think it would have been but unfortunately I don't get the option to attach images so need to work out how
Sorry but I can not recall the name Gardners Cottage but if you try this link and then scan down for Charlwood Park there is a lot of detail regarding a sale of the estate
http://www5.surreycc.gov.uk/dtcgi/nph-dtweb.exe?DTx=d&DTnp=4&DTnd=39&DTDB=DB03&DTHD=SurreyNoOrderBasicDisplay.htm&DTHE=Error.htm&DTHL=SurreyNoOrderBasicList.htm&DTHS=Search.htm&DTNT=10&DTRANK=Enable&DTQB1=springfield&DTQI1=main&DTQO1=and
Much more information seems to be on record at Surrey History Centre in Woking which, is near were I now live - when I get a day off next I will see if I can get in there and see what I can dig up
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Sorry for dragging this old topic up but i stumbled on it while doing some nostalgia searches
I grew up in this building and lived here from 1969 to 1980. My grandfather owned both houses Charlwood Park Farm House and Meadow Cottage (which was given to my parents
and has since been demolished for some idiot to park cars on Peter somebody or other)
When I lived here the big white house at the back was already in disrepair and when your a kid was ofcourse the scariest haunted house you could imagine but the dog disappeared up there for hour on end chasing rabbits
The farmer next doors name was Ivor and had an assistant called John Farthing who turfed me out of enough haystacks
They have totatlly ruined the countryside here by diverting the river mole and building huge fuel container type structures on the site of the demolished White House
Regarding the gardners cottage at the Povey Cross end , There was a guy that used to live there that had his own private plane that he sued to store in his garage
My grandfathers house is now a childrens nursery called The Farmhouse, Ive been there recently and have some vids and pictures but I guess you have to be careful nowadays walking around with a camera near to a school
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having just searched for charlwood park house i see there is some interest in the building.I do have a picture of the front,rather grainy i'm afraid but from about 1970 when we lived in the building.
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My father worked in Charlwood Park around 1950~1970. He was one half of the company Ashpool & Twiddy, a womens knitwear company, which was based there and as a young boy, I visited on a number of occasions. Here are some of my recollections:
1) It was quite a grand house and particulalry impressive inside with a large sweeping staircase that swept up inside the oval hall.
2) Douglas and Gladys Ashpool lived 'above the shop' using first floor rooms.
3) Ashpool & Twiddy used ground floor rooms for offices, stock and showrooms.
4) There were large cellars which seemed to be used for storing aircraft parts - mainly instruments obviously removed from planes and kept for some reason.
5) There was a large greenhouse between the house and the airport grounds which was in a state of disrepair.
6) The front door was mirrored by a dummy which makes me think it may have been a Lutyens building.
7) Ashpool & Twiddy was sold to Straven when my father moved the operation to Straven premises in Regent Street.
8) Doug Ashpool was a very keen cricket fan and knew many of the England players at the time and I believe he often met the Duke of Edinburgh who was also a keen follower of the game.
9) Doug suffered from a terminal respiratory illness from which he eventually died. In his later years he was bedridden in one of the bedrooms with an oxygen cylinder by his side. He was a very keen ham radio enthusiast and had a large motorised cuboid aerial on the roof which he could control from his bed.
10) Gladys went on to continue in the fashion industry and in ~1975 I met her (for the last time) in Paris at the George V hotel on the Champs Elysee where she had a small show in one of the ground floor rooms.
I would be very interested to see any pictures of the building, inside and out and grounds.
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I found a history of Outwood cricket club which amply reinforces my memory of Doug Ashpool's enthusiasm for cricket:
http://www.outwoodcricketclub.co.uk/OCC/history.html (http://www.outwoodcricketclub.co.uk/OCC/history.html)
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Here is a link to the UK Listed Buildings site: http://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk/en-363357-charlwood-park-crawley.
Apparently, Charlwood Park used to be called Hintersham Park and later Archery Grand House. By 1980 the house was derelict and boarded up.
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I also grew up on the Horley Road, In the Lodge House of Farmfield cottages. In the late seventies to mid eighties. My brothers and I used to visit the 'Haunted house' regularly.
I can remember it was boarded up, but not very well. We used to be able to get in through a downstairs window. I can still remember the beautiful staircases and some or the decoration although it was in a very sad state.
There was also the remnants of a formal garden, we could still see where the beds were laid out and many roses would still bloom. We would also go into what we believed was an old air - raid shelter to the side of the house, in the woods.
It was a wonderful place to have adventures as children and we were so sad when it was demolished to make way for the airport expansion.
I also clearly remember the farm, which was pretty derelict by the time we were these, but still had a wonderful hay barn to play in!
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Wow, can't believe I started this thread years ago.not sure if anyone that posted is still members?? ..thanks for all the insights regarding charlwood park. Parklife and mikepitt I would love to see some photos.
RDJ123, thanks for your info, I have a memory of a field and tree line and a bunker of sorts and playing in it, but wasn't sure if it was a real memory, as I was only 3 at the time. When I started this thread I was having 're occurring dreams of a large house and certain rooms. When i told my parents and was able to draw a rough layout of the rooms I kept dreaming about they were quite surprised and said it was charlwood park. Again now some years later I'm dreaming about it...weird aye!
I don't have any family ties to the house, just curious to know about it and see some pictures.
Thanks everyone for there comments :)
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The fields surrounding Farmfield Cottages, belonging to the hospital, had a bunker of sorts. (these fields were on the opposite side of The road to Charlwood house)
The lane going up to the hospital was tree-lined, as well as little white, metal fences.
Sheep were kept in the fields and several times we children “rescued” them from the ditches, whether they wanted to be or not!
There may have been cows in one of the fields.
We used to sometimes stay on the bus to get off at the roundabout near the airport to watch planes take off. Not so many of them in those days.
Walking slowly Home down the road, in and out of the ditches.
Being sent to bec with no tea for worrying dad by not being home on time.
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I just rediscovered a photo of Horley Lodge, sent to me some years ago by the son of the builder who was tasked with demolishing it.
My Grandmother and her elder siblings were born at Charlwood Park, where my great grandfather George Massey Saunders was the gardener, before they moved to Bushey, Herts. His address in the 1881 is given as Park Gardens, Charlwood.
Unfortunately there doesn't seem to be an easy way of attaching an image to this message.
If anyone is interested, please contact me
Regards
Phil How