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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => East Lothian (Haddingtonshire) => Topic started by: andy14 on Sunday 14 September 08 21:12 BST (UK)
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Dear all,
I'd value for opinions, I'm new to all of this, with some luck and info from other family members, I've got back realitively smoothly back to my 4xggf. Peter Black born 20/3/1802 in Dunbar. I know his parents areCharles Black & Janet Watson and that they where married 12/7/1799. However when I search SP for Chrles Black birth I get 19 born in scotland between 1770-1789 (a range I think would cover the likely birth given marriage date). 13 I can dismiss as born way out of range. The most likely is one born 19/2/1777 in Queensferry to Charles Black & Katharine Blackwood. Looking at the children of charles and janet, they have 5, the first born male being a charles black the first born female being a catharine. Does this look like a good bet? I can't find Charleson 1841 census or a death record on sp.
Thanks
Andy
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If you ever do connect to the Charles Black in Queensferry, you might be interested in his Will & Testament entry showing on SP:
Charles Black, 16/04/1779, baker in Queensferry, TD, Edinburgh Commissary Court, Ref: CC8/8/124
Monica :)
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Hi Andy,
Unfortunately it's looking likely Charles died before the 1841 census. :( I've found his wife Janet staying in Dunbar.
Address: Castle Street, Dunbar
Janet Black, f, 65, - b. Haddingtonshire
Charles ", m, 35, ag lab
Alexander ", m, 30, rabbit catcher
Janet was buried 23rd August 1846 at Dunbar, described as the widow of Charles. There's a possible burial for Charles, "labourer", on the 11th May 1823 also at Dunbar.
Have you looked at the original marriage entry for Charles and Janet on SP? It might reveal what parish Charles was from.
hume24
PS. I do have a Charles Black right time, same area, but I'm not sure if this is the same person. I'll have a check with what I've collected.
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hi Hume24
Wow!! thanks for that. Yes I've got their marraige on SP as 12/7/1799 in Dunbar, I've also got alexander as their 4th child born 18/7/1805. Intresting she's back in dunbar as I have them in Spott (just outside dunbar) in 1808.
Still not certain through that I've got the right charles black marrying Janet. As the wedding cert says both of this parish. but no Charles Black between 1770 and 1789 in east lothian. The best fitting is a charles black from Queens ferry. This is based on names of charles and janets children and the parents of the charles from Queensferry
andy
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I have been looking again, Andy, at the Charles Black I know of. He married Jean Hogg in 1778 and had six children: Margaret, James, Thomas, Archibald (died young), another Archibald, and lastly John in 1790. I'm wondering if his second marriage was to your Janet Watson, and he had another 5 children with her? Certainly possible enough.
Do you have his occupation from marriage/death certificates?
hume24
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The charles black I have, or think I have. Ie seems the best fit. is born 19/2/1777 marries janet 12/7/1799. (this is based on probably flawed thinking that he marries I know in 1777, he is the most likely charles black born in scotland between 1760 and 1785 according to SP) His occupation at marriage is hind at Tynnfield at time of marriage moves to Hallhill in 1804 then to spott by 1808. He and janet have 5 children Charles, Peter, Catharine,Alexander and george.
Where is your charles born and when?
andy
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Hi Andy,
I know you have an approximate date of 1777 for your Charles' birth, but I think the occupation has confirmed it. :) On his son's death certificate, Charles was described as a hind.
I have two possible births for Charles: one in Prestonkirk 1752, son of James Black and Isabel Hogg and the other in Innerwick 1756, son of Francis Black and Margaret Craik. That would make him about 52 - 56 at the birth of his last son, George - not too old, especially if Janet was younger. Providing the death I found in Dunbar earlier is correct (1823), it would make him 67 - 71 when he died.
I'm leaning towards the first birth being correct as James was Charles' first son's name.
hume24
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hume24
Thank you. I think your right and that I've been barking up the wrong tree :'( It did seem strange connection between queens ferry and east lothian. Of intrest possibly to you Is I've got a marriage of a Margaret black daughter of a charles black labourer tinefield to aThomas spencer (tailor) at connongate edinburgh on 24 aug 1799. Does this fit in with your research?
Where does Charles fit in to your history
andy
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Dear Andy,
Margaret did indeed marry Thomas Spence[r], although I didn't have the exact marriage date so thank you for that. She was b. 1779 in Spott.
The Blacks aren't blood relations to myself, but I thought I should add some detailed information for them. Robert Black, grandson of Charles (through son Archibald), married my 4x great-grandmother in 1859. Quite distant! ;) He died 1896 in Dunbar.
hume24
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hume24
If it's not a rude question ( If so please excuse my ignorance, I'm new to all this), how far back and want info have you got on charles and his ancestors.
andy
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It's not rude at all! I'm happy to share any information I find. :) I'm afraid I haven't done extensive searching for the Blacks, but I have made some progress.
If we take the 1752 birth to be correct, here's the original details from SP:
"Charles son to Jas Black & Isabel Hogg was born Nov 18 & baptized Nov 26. Witnesses Jas Hogg & Jas Grieve"
James and Isabel married in 1747, with banns being read at both Prestonkirk and Dunbar.
I'm afraid this is the end of the "confirmed" data. I did pencil in a Charles Black and Isabel Durrie as James' parents, but it is difficult to say whether they are correct.
Hope this helps.
hume24 :)
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hume24
I'm deeply grateful for all your help and assistance this evening.
many many thanks
andy :)
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Just wondering if you ever resolved the Charles Black mystery as I have recently begun researching this side of my family .I have Charles and Janet nee Watson son Peter b.1802. Witnesses at his baptism were James Black and George Watson --do you think they would be their brothers rather than fathers? Janet Watson's parentage and birth is also a stumbling block for me. Any thoughts ?