RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Nottinghamshire => Topic started by: ToriaJane on Thursday 25 September 08 17:51 BST (UK)
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Hi ...looking for information on the following
Edwin Broomhead...b 1854
married 1878 to
Julia Annie Moss
Sons Gilbert b 1890
and Arthur
Need information on Gilbert
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Bingo, you've done it! ;D
I am busy cooking at the mimute but someone will be along to help, I'm sure.
back later,
Jen
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ok thanks Jen....phew...that was a long journey!lol
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1881 census (free to view on www.ancestry.co.uk or www.familysearch.org)
Edwin Broomhead 26 b Sneinton, Nottingham Caretaker of school
Annie Broomhead 26 b Bobbers Mill, Nottingham Caretaker's wife
Living at Alfreton Rd Board School Keepers House, Radford, Nottingham
Ref RG11 3345/83 37
Nanny Jan
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Phew
Can I tell you about Gilbert & co in 1891 at last?
1891
RG12 2688 125 27
1 Benbrook? ? Rd, Radford
Edwin 36 Caretaker of Alfreton? Rd Board School
Julia 36
Edith A 8
Dora E 3
Gilbert A 7 mths
Julia and kids bn Radford - I cant make out Edwin p-o-b
(modified - thanks Nanny Jan - 1881 helps there)
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thanks that's the right one...yes yu can tell me about Gilbert & co 1891
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what info can you find out about Gilbert?
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thanks that's the right one...yes yu can tell me about Gilbert & co 1891
I've just done it!!
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I know...sorry....little slow!lol
But what about Gilbert and marriage?
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Possible marriage for Gilbert:
Gilbert A Broomhead DecQ 1913 Nottingham 7b 780
Bride: Mary Fletcher
3 births Broomhead with mother Fletcher:
Harold G DecQ 1914 , Cyril H MarQ 1919 and Harry A SepQ 1921; all born Nottingham.
Nanny Jan
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and here they are in 1901:
RG13 3182 159 15
265 Wenham Rd Radford
Edwin 46 Caretaker Board School
Julia 46
Edith A 18 Office Clerk
Dora E 13
Gilbert 10
William Moss 51 brother in law Druggist porterbn London
all Broomheads bn Nottingham
cant see a brother Arthur in any of these censuses
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According to his birth reg in the index, Gilbert is Gilbert Arthur - is that what you meant? rather than Gilbert and Arthur?
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nice work!!!! now can we go to Mary Fletcher...it's the right one!?
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yes it was probably Gilbert Arthur....well done you folks....
I would really like to find out about Mary Fletcher....died very young I think
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It would be a good idea to get Gilbert and Mary's marriage cert - that will give Mary's father's name and occupation, and hopefully an age for Mary.
I have a feeling there will be rather more Mary Fletchers to choose from than Gilbert Broomheads with year of birth known and known father of Edwin Broomhead!
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can I get that online?
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I gave you the link for sending for certs on your other thread!
www.gro.gov.uk
remember to tick the box to say you have the ref, and only to complete boxes with stars
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got it liz...thanks
what about Edwin....can we go further back?
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also liz...I don;t have a ref, for Gilbert's death...
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Could brother Arthur have been born and died between a census?
There are a few on http://freebmd.rootsweb.com who could fit the bill.
Nanny Jan
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I don't think there was an arthur...Ithink that was Gilbert Arthur....
Can we go back further than Edwin, ???Please :)
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Need to get some certificates to confirm details!
Perhaps someone with access to Ancestry can have a look for Edwin on 1861/1871 censuses.
Birth:
Edwin Broomhead SepQ 1854 Radford 7b 163
Nanny Jan
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maybe I'll take a run into chat for a second?
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1861 Woodland Place, Sneinton, Nottingham
William Broomhead, 44, lacemaker, Leicestershire
Sarah " 45, Seamstress Nottingham
Christopher, son, 14, Joiner assistant, New Basford
Mary A dau, 10 Sneinton
Edwin, son 6 "
Arthur, son, 4 "
Frank, son, 1 "
Ann Harris, Lodger, 50
Elizabeth B Harris, Lodger, 21
Jen
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excellent Jen...can you get William's father???
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Jen
What do you think about 1851?
This family appear to be at HO107/2130 Folio 288 Page 37
Christopher and Mary Ann are correct,can't read where Sarah was born.
But the head is Thomas NOT William?
Mmmm different name same bloke,or different name different bloke?
What do we think guys?
Carol
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I saw that last night, Carol, and stopped looking because it confused me so much that my brain hurt. I think it makes it even more important for certificates to be bought. Maybe he was Thomas William or vice versa but only an official document will give us that information.
Sadly, sometimes we just have to spend the money! :o
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This doesnt add a lot - but here they are in1871
RG10 3525 9 12
2 Arthur Place Nott'm
Thomas 54 Lace Maker bn Leicestershire Waggonswold?
Sarah 55 bn Nott'm
Edwin 16 Machine fitter bn Sneiton
Arthur 14 Lace Warfrer bn N'ham
Frank 11 bn N'ham
Ann Harris 60 boarder - paralysed.
(I expect the Harrises are rellies!)
I'll have a squint at that 1851 one, Carol.
Yes - some certificates are needed to firm all this up.
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Just realised - THOMAS is dad in this one. So Thomas in 1851 and 1871, only 1861 has William, and the children/place of birth etc tie up perfectly on that one.
I am inclined to think that Thomas / William are the same guy. Either he uses either name, or the enumarator just had a bad day and wrote William instead of Thomas in 1861
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Here is the 1851 that Carol found:
Sneiton
Thomas 34 Lace maker bn Leics
Sarah 35 bn Nottm
Thomas 12 bn Iron Green? Nottm
Granville 10 bn Basford
Frederick 7 "
Christopher 4 "
MAry Ann 7 mths bn Sneiton
AND
next door ...... !!
Benjamin Harris 40 Lace maker bn Leics
Ann HArris 40 "to ill to do anything" bn Nottm
Elizabeth 11
John 8.
Looks like Benj must die or run off, and the Broomheads continue to care for Ann Harris - for a long time too - in 1871 she is 60 and described as paralysed.
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1841 brings it's own challenges!
HO107 856 3
George Street Basford
Thomas Broomhead 3
Granville 4mths
Ann 15
are the children on their own with this Ann?
or are they part of the h/h which starts on the page before -
Samuel Cutts 35
Hannah Cutts 30
either way they are not with their parents on census night!
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this is great!!thanks...I sent off for Mary Fletcher's and Gilbert Broomhead's marriage cert. cost me 23 punds but I will get more infor about mary, which I really want.
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Not to worry - Thomas and Sarah ae also in George Street on the double page before.
Interestingly they are at the bottom of the page - so I do wonder if the filmers just got these pages in the wrong order, and the Broomhead children should follow on from Thomas and Sarah Broomfield , not from the Cutts.
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cost me 23 punds but I will get more infor about mary,
ToriaJane - with the ref number it should only cost £7 !!!
Did you not follow our guidelines and tick the box saying you had the ref?
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that must be it liz...cutts makes no sense! so william was thomas....\?
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I did ...I followed your instruction to a "t". but I stupidly checked "express"!!!
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i have to go out for the day....but will be back later...thanks for your help! Can you tell who Thomas/William's parents were....
I have a William and Hannah but no dates?
Back later on....
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A good tip is that when you get to the Checkout section of the ordering service - always do exactly that - check it out and if you are paying more than seven pounds per item, go back and do it again. There is a back button which allows you to do that. It's expensive enough as it is without paying above the odds!
:D
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Can you tell who Thomas/William's parents were....
I have a William and Hannah but no dates?
1) I wouldnt even think of going any further back till you have confirmed what we have got with a few certs.
2) you say you have a William and Hannah for Thomas/William's parents? where does this come from? Had you already got details of Thomas/William then before we found him? (so .... which is he? ;D)
3) we are now getting back before censuses and central registration of BMD's and into the realms of parish registers - so info generally will be thinner on the ground and harder to check out.
4) You are very quick to accept my theory about Broomheads/Cutts! Never assume anything in Family History. You need to confirm everything a step at a time before you move on. OK, we have raced through here -but that is purely because we were dealing with unusual names and a family that was consistant in their census entries (apart from Thos/Willm). Family history is not a speedy hobby - sometimes it can take years to sort out a particular person in order to be sure you are following the correct line.
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thanks Liz for all your help..I truly appreciated it.
1) I have as I said, order at least ther cert. for Gilbert and Mary's wedding.
2) I had no details when I posted this thread, just bits and bobs. I got the information about William and Hannah from "chat".
3) thanks for the tip about the census.
4) i was assuming you know much more about this than I do...just seemed very unlikely that's all. I am duly humbled by your wisdom and wil try not be be so quick next time.
Again...thanks for your help.
And Jen...thanks for the cert.tip!
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Toria,
It's not that we know more about anything, just that we know where to start looking. FreeBMd, Ancestry.com, Familysearch and other resources all there to help in our research.
Rootschatters enjoy helping others but I have to say that the best thing is finding something for yourself. When that certificate arrives, you will know what I mean. ;D ;D I had three arrive this week and it was like Christmas for me!!!
Good luck,
Jen
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thanks so much jen. you were great...so now what happens to this thread? can we keep it open until I find out more information?
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You can leave it open but it would probably make more sense to start a new one when you have another query, maybe after the certificate has arrived.
New queries will attract new people to respond so when you are ready, post a new thread and I have no doubts that several people will be there to help you.
Cheers,
Jen
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ok thanks Jen
I do have one more question though...
Can you get a reference # for me? I want to send for another cert.
I need a birther cert. for John Roanld Gough b 1910 in Llandudno.
Parents Harry Gough and Martha Woollet
siblings Alfred JL Gough b 1917
Daphne E Sept 1912
Patricia j b 1919
Kenneth b 1915.
Another interesting thig has just surfaced from information form one of my cousins. Aparently he knew that Matha Woolley were never married. Apparently Harry had another family in Ireland , including children! How about that...!lol
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Bigamists in the family eh?? What fun.
Birth Ref:
March 1911 Conway, 11b/401
Gough - John R
Conway registration district covered Llandudno.
Jen
And don't pay more than seven quid for it this time!!! ;D
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thanks Jen, you are a doll...can you tell me the codes again...
ie: conway would be the district 11b?401???
and his wife said (she's still alive) that he was born 1910. I s 1911 the registration date?
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also...I am sorry...the link again to get the certs?
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http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/
Make sure you save it this time!
(We seem to have deviated to the Gough/Wooleys on here. Note to anyone reading, there is a whole thread about them elsewhere)
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u r right liz...my mistake...sorry
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Toria Jane
You really need to bookmark Free BMD http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/ you will be able to do your own look ups up to around 1920 ish.It's so much more rewarding finding your own rellies....quite exciting in fact ;D
And also the GRO website- save it in your favourites or write it down with your family history stuff http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/
You can always google search these and any other geneaology sites.
Hope that helps
Carol
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When you go to the Certificate ordering site, it will ask you for the registration district - Conway, in this case, the volume - 11b and the page number - 401
The registration happened in the first quarter of 1911 so in fact, the birth could have been at the back end of 1910. Only the certificate will tell you that. It will have the date of birth and the date of registration.
Order from:
www.gro.gov.uk/content/certificates
Jen
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ok got it all...thanks Carol and Jen....
see you later.
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u r right liz...my mistake...sorry
No problem - I just noted it to stop any enthusiatic rootschatters strating to spend their time looking up anything that had already been done.
Genjen and Carol have given you some good advise here.
It will be worth you spending some time just investigating these sites. Why not "practice" using them by looking up some of the things that we have already looked up for you, you can then see how you are doing! And you will then gain confidence to look up new things for yourself.
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i will liz...thanks for the vote of confidence!!! Thanks everyone...I'll be in touch again!
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it's asking for "quarter" on the cert. application what is that?
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March - if you are doing the Conway one.
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thanks jen\
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can you tell me how to get back to the gough thread?
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Click on your name on the left in blue - then you will find a page that says Show the last posts of this RootsChatter.
Scroll down through your posts till you find the Gough one.
Carol
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found it Carol thanks...just posted another question there!
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ok I have the right thread now....sorry...got lost!
any suggestions on how I can find church records for
William broomhead b 1817 (apparently no census then) wymeswold leicester. Wife Sarah Kirk.
I need to get a birth cert for william and/or sarah
Thanks
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Hi,
Registration of births, marriages and deaths did not start until 1837; you will need to look for a baptism in a church register.
If William and Sarah married after July 1837 then the certificate should have the names of their fathers; this will help to find their baptisms in a parish register.
The first census was in 1841.
Nanny Jan
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hi Nan/jan
where would i start looking for that information....?
Thanks for the reply
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I did answer part of your query on the other "help" thread .
See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,329836.msg2107382.html#msg2107382
Carol
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I live in Canada....Carol
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That's why I suggested that you get the film in to your nearest LDS centre.
They are worldwide. See http://www.familysearch.org/eng/library/FHC/frameset_fhc.asp
Unless you are lucky enough that someone on the right board has access to a CD rom of the right parish records. Or even google searching will find some places have transcribed them and you might find them online somewhere.
Good luck
Carol
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got it...thanks
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I am still having a bit of trouble with the broomheads.... I hsve tried a search and I am not getting anywhere....
I need the children for Gilbert Arthur Broomhead wife Mary Fletcher married 1918 I think. Nottingham
I have got a Cyril H 1919
a Harold G 1914
I am missing a Ronald.
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Free BMD has him
Sept 1928
Nottingham 7b/520
Ronald B Broomhead, mother's maiden name Fletcher.
Jen
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Gilbert A Broomhead married DecQ 1913 Nottingham 7b 780.
Nanny Jan
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thanks Gen...I'll send for the certs.....now I need to go back to my first thread for the Goughs!
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Hi
I now have some certs.!!! So exciting. I have the marriage cert for Edwin Broomhead and Julia annie Moss . 1878. Edwin's father is now listed. Thomas Broomhead. and Julia's father is now listed. William Moss. I can't get any other information on these two. Any help would be appreciated.
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Well done Toria,that's great news.
Can you tell us what the certs say- which church,what exact date,what jobs did the dads do,who were the witnesses,what addresses do they both give,how old were they both?
The more info you give,the more chance one of us has in finding them ;)
Regards
Carol
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This doesnt add a lot - but here they are in1871
RG10 3525 9 12
2 Arthur Place Nott'm
Thomas 54 Lace Maker bn Leicestershire Waggonswold?
Sarah 55 bn Nott'm
Edwin 16 Machine fitter bn Sneiton
Arthur 14 Lace Warfrer bn N'ham
Frank 11 bn N'ham
Ann Harris 60 boarder - paralysed.
Looks like we were right with this one then people ;D
Hoping Toriajane will be able to confirm a few facts for us later...when Canada wakes up ;)
Carol
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hello there...just wanted to add the Broomheads in my family...any connections ?
Frederick Broomhead 1843 - Born Nottm married annie eliza saxton
Rasin Henry Broomhead 1871 -
Harold Broomhead 1899 - born Ferozepore West Bengal India married mary ann sladen
Rasin Henry Broomhead 1906 -
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HCarol...I'm awake!lol Here is the cert info (this is the marriage cert)
no. 491
when married : April 22 1878
names: Edwin Broomhead 23
Jiulia Annie Moss 23
residence: 12 Grey Friar Gate, Derby Rd. Nottm.
father: Thomas Broomhead Lacemaker
father: William Moss Engineer
married in the Parish Church.....Bamus? MH MacKensie , curate
inthe presence of (looks like) Granville Henry Broomhead and Fanny (looks like) Varney
Hope this helps to find Thomas's parents.
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Hold on Hold on - we have only just confirmed that Edwin's dad is Thomas.
So the family we found earlier in this thread certainly appears to be the right one - with the Dad called Thomas apart from one census when he was William. They had an older child Granville, so he appears to be one of the witnesses.
So the dad, Thomas, according to the censuses was born approximately 1817ish, in Leicestershire, so we are moving areas a bit. I think the only clue we had was when I noted "Waggonswold?" so that is not a lot of help in finding the parish is it?
I see that the eldest child of Sarah and Thomas that we know of is a Thomas born about 1838/9ish. I winder if they married before or after 1837 when Civil registration began.
I'm off to have a look at FreeBMD and will report back in a mo.
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Well - this could be a possible:
Oct/Nov/Dec 1837
Basford
ref 15 833
Thomas Broomhead
one of brides on page-Sarah Charlsworth
I had been rather thinknig she would come up as a Harris, after seeing the Harris rellies with them later.
This may or may not be them. You caould try getting the cert and seeing if the ages/occupations/address etc tie up. the cert will then give his father's name.
Or we can pursue the waggonwold in Leics and try to pin down where that is and see if any one had access to Parish registers there, or look on IGI
modified to add - nothing on IGI
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Hello…..
Hope this goes a little way in finding your family but could do with someone else’s opinion on this as on the 1861 Edwin’s father is called William and the 1851 is called Thomas….but is the same family?? ???
Baptism - Sneinton St Stephen; 9th September 1855
EDWIN BENJAMIN BROOMHEAD – father Thomas, mother Sarah, occupation Lace maker, abode Eldon Street.
1861 - RG9/2451/76/19 Woodland Row, Snelland, Nottinghamshire
William Broomhead,head, aged 44, Lace Maker, born Wymeswold, Leicestershire.
Sarah Broomhead, wife, aged 45, seamstress, born Nottingham.
Christopher, son, aged 14, joiners assistant, born New Basford.
Mary Ann, dau, aged 10, born Snenton.
Edwin, son, aged 6, born Snenton.
Arthur, son, aged 4, born Nottingham.
Frank, son, aged 1, born Nottingham.
+ Ann Harris aged 50 – lodger
Elizabeth Harris, aged 21 – lodger – both born Nottingham.
1851 – H0.107/2130/ Prospect St, Sneinton, Nottingham.
Thomas Broomhead, head, aged 34, Lace maker, born Wymeswold? Leicestershire.
Sarah Broomhead, wife, aged 35, born Nottingham.
Thomas, son, aged 12, silk winder, born Ison Green, Nottingham.
Granville, son, aged10, Threader, born Basford.
Frederick, son, aged 7, born Basford.
Christopher, son, aged 4, born Basford.
Mary Ann, dau, aged 7 months, born Sneinton.
Best Wishes
Sheila.
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I think we had those census details way way back on this thread and noted the "William" in 1861
we also had them on other censuses and the link with the Harrises continued - so I believe we were satisfied they were the same lot.
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so Thomas' father is also Thomas?
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I wil send off for the cert with the ref # you gave me Liz...thanks muchly!
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I wil send off for the cert with the ref # you gave me Liz...thanks muchly!
Of course you really ought to confirm Sarah's maiden name by getting one of the kids birth certs,probably Granville's,otherwise how do you know that the Thomas Broomhead marrying Sarah Charlsworth is in fact the right couple?
Births Mar 1841
Broomhead, Granville Henry in Basford volume 15 page 445
Carol
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so Thomas' father is also Thomas?
? ?
No - where has that come from?
You may prefer to get one of the children's birth certs (Edwin maybe if he is your direct ancestor) first to check out his mother's maiden name.
That marriage I found was only a possible to think around- Thos and sarah could well have married pre 1837!
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OK gotcha! I will sent for Granville's cert. Thanks Carol & Liz!
can you give me the link to the freeband search. I am at work and don't have my information. I need to look up the fletcher side now. Mary Fletcher married Gilbert, son of Edwin, son of Thomas!
Thanks again!
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The link to free bmd is earlier in this thread- you can also google it at anytime . All search engines throw it up.
Start a new thread please for each surname,and make sure you choose the right county board for where they lived.
You stand a chance then of getting answers from local people with the right knowledge for the area you want.
Carol
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I have Thomas Broomhead who married Sarah charlsworth in my tree is this same person ?
Birth: 1817
Wymeswold, Leicestershire, , England
Death: Jul 1903
,Nottinghamshire, , England
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Looks very much like it!
I suggest you and Toria Jane get together!
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I think we need to ..
also some of the spelling for places like Boxford is actually Basford and Ison Green is Hyson green....
its so exciting !
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wow...does this mean I may be talking to another relative???
can I give my email on here?
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how cool...pm me your e mail !!!
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sure...how do I do that?lol
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I got it! just sent you the email! :)
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did you get the email address? I think I sent you a pm! ???
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yes i have just e mailed you ;D
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got it....this is so exciting!