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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Derbyshire => Topic started by: Aks on Thursday 09 October 08 16:56 BST (UK)
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I just came across a website called Sue Brown's Derbyshire Marriage Index 1538-1837 at http://www.derbyshiremarriageindex.co.uk which purports to offer look ups of marriages at various parishes in Derbyshire.
This would be of great interest for me for one, however, the contact form page says "Please complete this form to send us an email with marriages that you would like researched from this index ", but there is no form and I don't see any email address anywhere.
Does anyone know anything about this?
Alan
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The website was constructed by these people ...
http://www.mrsite.com/contact.asp
see if they will pass on your query to their client ?
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Hello Allan,
There are some Phillimore Transcripts for Derbyshire on the following site:-
http://www.uk-genealogy.org.uk/england/Derbyshire/index.html
Scroll down page for list of towns, click on town if there is a Phillimore transcript
available it appears in blue as a sub heading.
Hope this is of some help.
Spendlove.
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Dear spendlove and Newf,
Thank you very much for your replies. As regards, the website indicated, i.e. http://www.uk-genealogy.org.uk/england/Derbyshire/index.html, there only apear to be census returns for the places I am particularly interested in (Lullington and Coton-in-the Elms). It looks like I cannot avoid a trip to the Derbyshire records office, unless they offer lookups!
Alan
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http://dialspace.dial.pipex.com/town/terrace/pd65/dby/kelly/cotonintheelms.htm
COTON-IN-THE-ELMS
Lullington, Derbyshire
SYLVIA
The Andrews Pages : Coton in the Elms, Derbyshire :
BRIDES AND GROOMS Searched for http://homepage.ntlworld.com/sherwoodoutlaw/derbyshiremarriageindex.htm
old site slight difficulty getting on
sylvia
I CAN CHECK NAMES IF YOU WOULD LIKE ME TO TRY
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/Derby/
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Thanks Sylvia(?) for this information.
I'm afraid http://dialspace.dial.pipex.com/town/terrace/pd65/dby/kelly/cotonintheelms.htm is not the right period and I can't access http://homepage.ntlworld.com/sherwoodoutlaw/derbyshiremarriageindex.htm.
I have an ancestor, Martin Farnell born in Coton-in-the-elms abt 1750 who married Frances Mathews of Edingale, Staffordshire. She seems to have been born in 1771 and their daughter Phoebe was born about 1796, so I suppose they must have been married between about 1789 and 1796. I suppose this might have been in Lullington, since there was no church in Coton-in-the-elms in this period. I believe Martin was high sheriff of Derbyshire in 1789 (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Sheriff_of_Derbyshire.)
I am still hoping to get to Matlock records office to check this out, unless of course you (or someone out there) have access to some of these records. That would be great as I'm not in England and it's hard to get there!
Alan
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Hi Alan
I spotted your post and wondered if you had seen this will which is available through the PRO
(don't know where they got Oxfordshire from though Sutton Coldfield is definitely in Warwickshire :D)
Online Document PROB 11/1584
Will of Martin Farnell Gentleman Sutton Coldfield , Oxfordshire . Will of Martin Farnell Gentleman Sutton Coldfield , Oxfordshire Date: 1816.
Have you checked this one at all? I notice the Martin Farnell who lived at one time at Coton-in-the-Elms was buried in 1823 in Clifton Campville (aged 67), so I was wondering if this will was for the same person or if there was another Martin Farnell around at the time. :-\
DebbieG
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Hi DebbieG,
Thank you very much for this information. No, I had not seen this will, although I did recently discover another document suggesting that Martin Farnell became bankrupt in the early 1800's. It seems as though some information has come online fairly recently. This might be his will, since his daughter married Thomas Rochford from Sutton Coldfield, so he might have moved there also.
Can you tell me where you found the record for the death of Martin Farnell in Clifton Campville in 1823? Perhaps there were two Martin Farnell's? Family sources indicate that "my" Martin Farnell died around 1815, which seems to tie in with this will. I have so far found very little information on him, so it is very difficult to tell. I only know that he was some kind of squire and, therefore, assumed that it must have been him that was the high sheriff, but if there were two Martin Farnell's, that would make it more complicated.
Thank you very much for your help. I do not have the greatest experience in these matters!
Alan
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Hi Alan
I found a reference to a certified copy of Martins burial in the on-line A2A indexes. If you go here and put a search in for Farnell there are several documents indexed which refer to Martin Farnell of Coton-in-the-Elms.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/a2a/records.aspx?cat=026-d3155_2&cid=-1#-1
I am fairly sure that these all refer to the one who was sherrif and who went bankrupt (several of the documents refer to him as a bankrupt), however as he appears to have died in 1823 - I checked the entry in the National Burial index and it gave his age as 67, in Clifton Campville I am not sure that he is 'your' Martin Farnell, though I do think the 1816 will is for your man, given the connection with Sutton Coldfield.
I hope that makes sense :)
DebbieG
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Hi DebbieG,
Thanks for enlightening me. In my ignorance, I was not familiar with the National Burial index. You learn things all the time. I think I understand what you mean. Thanks again.
Alan
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Many thanks to all those who helped me with this, particularly DebbieG and Spendlove.
I had previously thought that Martin Farnell Esq. from Coton-in-the-elms (abt 1750-1815), who is the object of this search, and his wife Frances Matthews had one daughter, Phoebe.
However, it appears from his will that Phoebe was Frances' daughter from a previous marriage. This is stated in one place and, in another place, he refers to Phoebe as his adopted daughter. I supposed this would mean that Matthews was probably the surname of Frances' first husband and that Phoebe was born as Phoebe Matthews. Based on this, (bingo) I found her on the IGI christened on 9 May 1796 at Lullington, Derbyshire, mother Frances Matthews.
This is probably not new to most people on Rootschat, but it shows that one has to look at all sorts of documents to find the information one is searching for.
What I'm wondering now is is whether such an adoption would have been an official thing in those days or not?
Alan
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I wouldn't think the adoption would official - as in no paper work for it, it would just happen when the mother remarried.
I am pleased that the will proved useful, can I ask if it mentioned any other of Martins relatives? I am interested as certain property in the village where I live was owned by the Farnell family at that time - members of the Ashby-de-la-Zouch branch and I am wondering where the Sutton Coldfield lot fit in.
DebbieG
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Hello,
I have just come across this board and see you need some further information as to my Derbyshire Marriagee Index 1538-1837. Sorry about the web site, it has died, the reply page went first and I couldn't get it to work.
The index covers all the parishes (pre 1837) in Derbyshire that were licenced for marriages. I have abstracts from all parishes but the index is not yet complete as there is still a lot of checking to do. The information contained is taken from Phillimore, parish registers and the BTs, it was originally started on 5"x3" slips in 200+ shoeboxes. These days it is slowly bing put onto a computer database, printed out and then checked - firstly against the PRs and then the BTs. A list of the progress so far can be obtained from myself by email. If you want a search doing then just let me know groom's name, brides's christian name and year of first known child. I will then do a search and send you the possibilities.
Sue
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Hi Sue, Please could you look up George NUTTALL, b. Alfreton about 1779? Christened 7 Sep 1779. Married 17 Sep 1805 to Hannah Green. Father's name Samuel. George's son, William NUTTALL born between 1810-1822 (and any other children born to George). I'd be very grateful for your help. Regards Louise
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Hello Louise,
All Christened at Alfreton, the children of George Nuttall & Hannah:-
Samuel Christened 18.10.1806
William " 31.7.1809
Mathew " 16.6.1811
You can search for these on the new family search site:-
https://www.familysearch.org/#form=advanced-records
Spendlove
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Thanks for replying so quickly. In fact I've just posted a look up request on the board as I'm fairly new to rootschat and haven't always had replies to previous queries. Regards Louise
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Hello Louise,
The only likely Samuel I have is married in 1763, I've checked 1750-85 and he's the only one.
Wirksworth PR Saml Nuttall, innkeeper, 21 Apr 1763, Phebe Plats, spinster, both of Wirksworth, licence
Sorry for delay, but I've been away.
Hope it helps,
Sue
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Hello Sue
Thanks for the message. I've sent away to Lichfield for the licence of the marriage of George Nuttall in 1805 to Hannah Green at Alfreton and hope that he turns out to be Samuel and Phebe's son. If George is also a 'Saddler' then I'm getting somewhere as this will link with my 2nd G Grandfather, William Nuttall.
In the censuses, William consistently said he was born at Wirksworth. In his marriage certificate he said his father was 'George Nuttall, Sadler'. Although there is a William Nuttall baptised at Wirksworth 19 Sep 1816, the father was William Nuttall. There isn't another likely candidate. As you said, Samuel & Phebe were married at Wirksworth and three of their 12 children (John, Lydia & Samuel), were baptised at Wirksworth but the others were baptised at Alfreton, including George (b. 1779). George & Hannah Green's son, William, was baptised at Alfreton 31 July 1809 and I think this is my ancestor but why did he say in every census that he was born at Wirksworth?
I'm trying to find the link between Wirksworth & Alfreton for the Nuttalls. If you're a Derbyshire person perhaps you might know the answer? Very grateful for your help. Regards Louise
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Hello Louise,
If Samuel in Wirksworth was an innkeeper then he should appear in the 'Alehouse Recognisances' where the alehouses were licenced by the justices from c1753. If the Sam who appears in Alfreton has the same occupation then the connection is likely but if he changed his occupation it makes the link more difficult! Pub names are rarely given in these records. They are kept at Derbys RO at Matlock, sorry I haven't got any reference nos.
Sue
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Thanks Sue, your info is much appreciated. Louise
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Sue has just done a new website http://www.derbysmarriages1538-1837.co.uk/
I hope this helps.
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I must be doing something wrong as I can't get it to work. Search results come up with the name Newton even though I have'nt put that name in.
Anyone else having trouble?
Carol
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Just tried the site and am also getting information about the Newton family which is not a name that I inserted.
Peramar
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Hello everyone, I'm afraid that the site went live (not by me) before the problems of accessing it had been sorted. I have the same results as you when I try entering a query, it's not quite how I envisaged it somehow!
If you have a specific query then let me know and I'll search the index for you.
Sorry about all this.
Sue
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Hello,
This is just to let you know that the web site is now live and behaving itself, the name you search under should bring up your request.
Sue
http:\\www.derbysmarriages1538-1837.co.uk
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Sorry, got the slashes the wrong way round.
Should read http://www.derbysmarriages1538-1837.co.uk/
Sue
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Thanks for all your hard work Sue. I found one marriage I didn't have.
Anne
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Thank you! Glad to know it's of use. There's 74,000 marriages on at the moment, more to come later.
Sue
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Wonderful site Sue - Thank you
Carol
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Another 4000+ marriages added just.
Sue
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Anyone else having trouble with this site? I can get in ok, but can't get beyond page 1 if there are several pages to a name.
Carol
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Hello Carol,
Yes, it's a problem that is known about and I have passed this on to the guy who maintains the site so hopefully it will be fixed soon. In the meantime if there is any particular marriage you are looking for let me know - less than 1/2 the index is online anyway.
Cheers
Sue
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Thanks Sue, I'll keep trying
Carol
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I have the Coton in the Elms Parish registers ..if you think i can help...........and i suspect the people offering derbyshire Marriage look-ups..are simply using the Phillimore records..which are available frre of charge on line.
Derek.
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I take it by your reply that you have never been on the site !!!!
Carol
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Hello carol. yes i have..and i still prefer Phillimore...the site gives no more information than does Phillimore..except on the occasions that Phillimore only goes to 1812..........
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Hello Carol,
The search facility is now working again.
Happy New Year,
Sue
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Brilliant - thanks a lot Sue
Happy New Year to you too
Carol
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Hello
Just to let Derbyshire researchers know that the Derbyshire Marriage Index 1538-1837 at http://www.derbysmarriages1538-183.co.uk has just been updated with 36000 more marriages. The total is now 114611.
Sue Brown.
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Thanks Sue
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Just to update the link - it should be http://www.derbysmarriages1538-1837.co.uk/
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Thanks,
More haste, less speed etc etc.
I should have noticed it myself but ...
Cheers,
Sue
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Hi, not sure if you are still actively searching this, but I am researching the private banks of England, and your Martin was the senior partner of a bank in Ashby-de-la-Zouch, 1790-1805.
His father, also Martin had a brother Joseph, we'll call him Snr. Joseph Snr had at least three sons, John (1743-), Joseph Jnr (1747-1802) and Thomas (1752-1826). Martin Jnr and these three cousins were the partners of said bank.
Martin's will was dated 15th Nov 1815 and proved in London on 8th Oct 1816, which gives us an 11 month window for his death.