RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Westmorland => Topic started by: Yorkslass on Thursday 09 October 08 22:48 BST (UK)
-
Hello all,
Can anyone tell me anything about Captain French, Kendal.
We have ancestors marrying there in 1851.
I've googled it, but all that comes up are maps and addresses for business etc.
It sounds as if it has some history, but I can't find anything!
Any help appreciated,
Yorkslass.
-
In the 1841 census there's Captain French, but in the 1861 census, that seems to be Captain French Lane ~ here's a picture of that 'One of the narrow streets that climb the hillside westwards from Kendal's main street'
http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/167454
and a map here http://www.rootschat.com/links/04hj/
Barbara
-
Captain French Lane is less than a hundred yards from where I am sitting right now. What I don't know is whether or not there is, or was, a chapel where a marriage might have taken place.
I think that it was originally an area of Kendal, rather than just the one street. If I can dig out my history of Kendal books tomorrow, I'll see what I can find.
Jen
-
Hello,
Thank you both for looking this up for me, Barbara and Jen.
Barbara, the photo is lovely - it looks like the place hasn't changed much in 150 years - pretty hillside cottages. I do wish the enumerators had put actual street numbers on those censuses - then we could find the very place, as it's obviously still there.
Jen, how lucky you are to live there! William Wilcock and Agnes Read were married at the Parish Church in Kendal on 23 March 1851, and their first son was born at Captain French 14 December 1852.
It is the name that intriques me -did a French Captain live in Kendal, and become so famous that a street was named after him? I wonder. I really would appreciate your looking in your Kendal Books.
Thanks again to you both,
Yorkslass
-
I've walked up the road, but never thought about the name until now, I can't seem to find anything about a Captain French, but the local library probably knows, if your books don't tell you, Jen! From the National Archives site there are land documents etc. going back to the 1700s for Captain French Lane, so its history goes a good way back.
Barbara
-
I've just had a quick look where I thought my books ought to be but guess what... they've disappeared. And it being after midnight, I thought I'd leave it until morning to go rummaging. I know that one of my books has references to Captain French and how it got its name. And yes, failing all else, I can nip into the library and do a quick search there.
The Parish Church is two hundred yard in the opposite direction. :D
Jen
-
Jen, I didn't mean that you should go to the library, just thought maybe Yorkslass could contact them if your books didn't have the story :)
Look forward to hearing about the Captain, curious that there doesn't seem to be anything about him on the web or local Kendal sites :-\
Barbara
:)
-
Good morning Jen,
I'm sorry you have to go rummaging- I know what you mean about things "disappearing". It happens to me all the time!
I don't want to put you to any trouble - if you can't find your own book, please don't make a special trip to the library.
Thanks again,
Yorkslass
-
I found it - lurking behind a load of my partner's spy novels. How did that happen?
Here are some passages from a chapter named "Captain French Lane, Tenterfield and their characters" in Memories of Old Kendal by Jack O'Connor. Published 1961. I hope I'm not breaking the rules here and that the acknowledgement makes it legit!
"It would be difficult to separate Captain French from Tenterfield - one is part of the other. Captain French traditionally owes its name to a certain Captain French but our local chronology supplies the added name of Brougham's Lane, after the name of the parliamentary candidate in the 1818 election. Evidently, the inhabitants favoured the True Blues."
"In Speed's plan of 1614, this lane is called Rotten Row - or Routine Row - so named because the corteges went by that route from Soutergate to the old cemetry on Kirkbarrow, the church burial ground. The Captain French from whom it took its name was a churchwarden at the Parish Church in 1660. He it was, perhaps, who built most of the houses in the little thoroughfare."
" Like Fellside, Captain French and Tenterfield inhabitants had handlooms to provide them with extra bread and dripping."
" There is something about a community such as Captain French which is less noticeable in suburban areas. Interwoven into the fabric of the inhabitants' lives is something from the vocation they followed............As Kendal was divided from Kirkland by a tiny beck*, it follows that Captain French Lane had its territorial divisions. The clan spirit was as much in evidence as over the border. The place names are not recorded on the survey maps but Neddy Broo, Pig Hull Square, Back Folly and Bush Yard were thresholds over which you 'stept at thi peril.'"
" The names of the handloom weavers........included Tom Smith, Dick Troughton, Harry Wardley, William Wilcocks, Edward, Jackson, George Noble, Harry Megson and a Dixon whose forst name couldn't be remembered."
There is masses more of this but I don't want to post stuff which is not of interest so I'll stop there.
* the tiny beck in question is currently in spate, running literally just outside my front garden wall!
It was, like a lot of Kendal on this side of the river, basically an area of woollen industry. There are references to the tenterhooks on from which materials were stretched to dry. How many people when talking about being apprehensive about something, refer to being "on Tenderhooks", so misquoting the real term, of "on tenterhooks" which is what is is really all about.
If you want more, give me a shout.
Cheers,
Jen
-
Very interesting Jen
Barbara
:) :)
-
Oh wow, Jen, that is fantastic!
Thank you so much for looking and especially for typing it all out.
There's plenty there to get my teeth into. My husband will be delighted too, as it's his ancestors who lived there.
To find his name, too - is a special bonus.
I'll have a look to see if that book is still in print, or whether it's one I can get off the internet.
Once again, thanks a million,
Yorkslass
-
I found the book, a signed first edition, in a second hand bookshop. It's really old fashioned in its style of writing but fascinating stuff. Published by the Westmorland Gazette so it might be worth contacting them to see if there are any copies lurking in their archives.
Jen
-
Thanks Jen,
I've had a quick look online, and the book is for sale on quite a few sites - ranging from £6 to £30, so it's a must!
Yorks
-
Yorkslass,
Can I just thank you for the original query which has resulted in me digging this book out. It's ages since I read it and I've really enjoyed leafing through it again this morning! Buy it now - you'll love it.
Jen
-
Hello I to found this name in a census,when looking for my Bibby side of my family,they were weavers,one was a wool weaver and one a flax dipper living next door to each other,when I was last in Kendal I had a wander that way,sorry nothing to help you with,happy researching Gillian ;D
-
Hi There,
I came across this site by accident when researching my family. Imagine my surprise to see my relative mentioned in this blog. My family name is Megson and Harry Megson mentioned in the book is I believe my great great great Grandfather. However I think the house was a family home because his father Jesse lived in Captain French also, he was born in 1807. I must get a copy of the book.
Thanks for the info Jen
-
Hello Meggiegirl,
and welcome to Rootschat.
I too was really grateful to Jen for telling me about this book, and I did manage to buy a copy. It gives a real flavour of life in "Old Kendal", and is full of photos of lovely (and not so lovely!) buildings which are no longer there, and old places and faces.
Hope you manage to get a copy.
Yorkslass
-
hello yorkslass,
this is the first time i've looked at rootschat, i was looking for captain french also. My ancestor on captain french lane was william wilcock, which is my surname. can we help each other ?
regards
trawdenboy
-
Hello trawdenboy,
I hope we can help each other too! It's great to hear from someone else researching this Wilcock line.
There were two William Wilcock families living at Captain French Lane in the early 1850's - mine was the one who married Agnes Read in 1851 and the family subsequently moved to Bentham in Yorkshire. There was another family, a William Wilcock who married an Isabella Marshall in 1852, and also lived at Captain French - I'm afraid this line sent me in the wrong direction for quite a while....
I haven't been able to get back a very long way, as William's birth/baptism still eludes me!
Hope to hear from you again,
Best wishes,
Yorkslass
-
Hello Yorkslass,
my relation is the one married to Agnes Read, I believe. My great grandfather moved from Bentham to Colne, Lancs when the Leeds Liverpool canal was being dug out. They were carters. I haven't looked at my fam history stuff for a while, but will do in the next few days and will be in touch again. Benthan parish registers record Wilcock's back into the 1600s ! My son's partner is expecting a baby next May so the Wilcock line continues. Sorry for hasty reply, busy just now, will be in touch again.
Regards
Trawdenboy
-
Hi all - it has been some time since the last post on this thread, but I just came across it.
I also have an interest in Captain French Lane. My family were the Pickthalls and my interest starts in 1871. My g.g. grandfather, Robert William Pickthall was born at no.7, Yard 14, Captain French Lane. Is this name known to anyone?
-
My family the MITCHELLS lived in Capt. French over a long period of time, as did alot of other families.My grandad`s middle name was Lund as was at least two of his uncles.Their surnames were Harrison and Nelson. All names of families living there around 1881-1891.
I was hoping someone might know if a family called LUND also live there or near by, probably earlier.
Hoping someone can help,
Caron.
-
Hi Caron - I don't know the Mitchell family I'm afraid but it's always good to "meet" someone with an interest in the same area/street. I do however have connections to the name Lund, though whether it is the same branch as you, I don't know.
My g.g. grandfather, Robert William Pickthall (born 1872, Captain French Lane) married (1897) Elizabeth Kitching. Elizabeth's mother (father unknown) was Mary Kitching (b. Helsington, 1827). Mary's mother was Elizabeth LUND (1805 - 1867), who married (1825) John Kitchen/Kitching (1805-1870). Please supply more information on your LUNDS and I will try and make the connection :)
-
Thanks for your reply.I think that the middle name LUND, given to my grandpop, originally came from a friend and neighbour about 50 years before !!!.
Looking through the census` for that district i found a Thomas Lund, born 1801 at Barnard Castle,Yorkshire.(His mother was a Jane Parkin born 1815 also of Barnard Castle).
Thomas Lund and his family were neighbours for at least 20 years of the Whiteley family on Captain French Lane.
Margaret Whiteley born 1851, was my gt, gt grandma.She married Wm . Mitchell.
Her sister was Mary Jane Whiteley. Both sisters gave the middle name Lund to a son, this tradition seems to have been pased down.
Regards Caron.
-
Well, this is all new to me! ...I too have links to Capt. French/Entry Lane/Low Fellside...
With name such as....
Thomas Pickthall Wilson, Lund, Whiteley, Harrison, Nelson, Heap, Macnamara, Armer, Carling, Robinson...
Any 'hits' with anyone here?
Roger
-
We must all be related !!!
All these families must have been so close.
Even naming their children after each other.
Do you have any info. on the Whiteleys ?
Around 1932 my mum was living at 39,Low Fellside , as you probably know Entry Lane leads onto Low Fellside.
Regards Caron.
-
This should cause a stir!...... I take no credit for much of this detail. Most was supplied to me by a cousin, to whom I am extremely grateful.... The 'hairdresser' detail at the end came from pictures in books I obtained from Kendal and elsewhere.
Richard Nelson (b.1819) and Margaret Lund (b.1823) were married at Kendal Parish Church on 23 Jan 1847. Their dates of birth aren't shown, just that they are of age. Witnesses were William Whiteley and Mary Ann Atkinson.
1851 - Margaret (Lund) Nelson and son Thomas, live with her father, Thomas Lund, and her brother and 86 year old grandmother Jane Parkin. William and Jane Whiteley live next door to the Nelson/Lund's. (Address?)
1861 - Richard Nelson and his wife Margaret (Lund) Nelson live at 11, Captain French Lane. Their children are Thomas, Edward, Martha J., Mary A., and young Elizabeth, 8 months old. Also there is Mary J. Whiteley, age 10, described as a 'servant'. The Whiteley family have another daughter, Margaret, age 8.
1881 - William Whiteley, wife Jane and their daughter Mary Jane Whiteley, 30, are at 49 Captain French next door to the Nelson's at 51. Listed are the so called 'children' of William and Jane, ...Thomas L. Harrison 8, William J. Harrison 6, Richard E. Harrison 4, William T. Mitchell 9, and Jane Hannah Nelson, 10 months! The three Harrison boys were actually the children of Mary Jane Whiteley by a Thomas Harrison, but it seems Mary J. was not married to him? Mary's sister Margaret was married to William Mitchell.
1880 - A marriage record exists for a Francis Nelson and Mary Jane Whiteley in the March quarter of 1880. However, in the 1881 census she used the surname Whiteley and is described as a widow.
1881 - Workhouse records for Kendal have two Thomas Harrison's on file. Both are 55, one an 'imbecile', the other a 'wool comber'. Were they one and the same?
1891 - Mary Jane Whiteley is shown as wife to Francis Nelson. The Harrison boys are listed as (Nelson) stepchildren, and Frank and Mary J. are shown as having two children of their own, Margaret A. 5, and James, 1. Mary J.'s mother, Jane Whiteley, 71, lives with them.
1902 - (Edward VII's Coronation,) Whiteley Hair-Dresser, at 59(?), Highgate, Kendal and pre-WW2, W. Whiteley & Son, Ladies & Gents Hairdresser, 173 Highgate, Kendal.
How's that?
-
Fabulous Palladium !!!!
The William T Mitchell on the 1881 bit was my Great Grandad, He went on to marry EdithSpeight and their son, James Lund Mitchell was my grandad.
Although there is no connection.The Hairdresser part was also interesting because before my dad, Jack Stobbart, retrained as a special schools teacher he was a gents hairdresser. !!!
Thanks for all the info. Caron.
-
Hi,
One of my ancestors Maria Brown lived on French Captain lane in 1861.
-
As I've been walking up and down Captain French Lane every day for the past 2 weeks I was curious and googled 'Captain French Lane Kendal"
I found this: http://www.kendalwiki.co.uk/wiki/index.php?title=Captain_French_Lane
before I thought I might find out more here
I have not read all the replies you received (you might already know about this site), but there is some interesting additions to some of the curiosity around family names and Captain French being the church warden in the Parish Church in 1660 ...
good luck
-
Many of my ancestors lived on this street as well. The Troughton, Shepherd and Carradus families all lived here. Would anyone know about the 10 cottages on Captain French Lane which were referred to as Proctor Gardens and where their exact location may be today. Thanks, Ella
-
Hiya Ella, It`s me again !!!! I have a couple of old maps i will get them out tomorrow and have a look .
How are you and how is your research going .
Caron xx :)
-
@Lennie13
Nice to hear from you. Will PM you. Thanks for your help. :)
-
Hi trawdenboy,
This thread is quite old but I've only just joined so forgive me if it all seems done & dusted for you.
We seem to have a common ancestor in William Wilcock who married Agnes Read/Reed in Kendal and moved to Bentham circa.1852-1855.
Does your tree come down his son John's line?
I'd love to know where you've gone with this.
Regards, Roses Lass.