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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Leitrim => Topic started by: AshkeJ on Friday 17 October 08 19:50 BST (UK)
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Hello!
I am hoping that somebody here can point me in the right direction!
I am looking into the family of a friend of mine at work, and through the census returns have traced her paternal line back to George Shaw Rutherford. He was a surgeon superintendent on convict ships to Australia :- Prince of Orange 1820, Shipley 1822, Commodore Hayes 1823, Marquis of Hastings 1826, Lady Rowena 1826, Eliza II, 1827, Lord Melville II 1829 and Royal Admiral 1830. George Rutherford was assigned a convict servant in 1822 and arranged permission for a passage to Newcastle, NSW, later that year.
It seems likely that George Rutherford was born in 1789 at Cornastauk, Leitrim, Ireland and later in Australia called his estate on the Hunter River after his home 'Leitrim'.
(This I got from a Google search.)
George's family seemed, however, to remain in England throughout these forays (but then again George didn't marry until 1832 when he would have been about 41). He died in 1868.
I'm afraid that I don't know a lot about Irish research, and wondered if anybody here had any pointers for me to go about tracking down Dr Rutherford and his family!
Many thanks!
Dominic
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There will quite possibly be more information in Australian records than what will be available in Irish records for such an early date.
Did George S. Rutherford marry or die in Australia? If so the certificates might list his parents, etc.
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Thanks for the reply, aghadowey. Unfortunately George married in Kent and died in London, so although his marriage certificate would have at least his father's name and occupation on it, not a lot else!
I'm afraid that I really do know zip about Irish research! Are parish/church records available for that kind of period?
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There were no birth, death or marriage records in Ireland far enough back to trace George. To find church records (if they exist) you need to know the family's religion and where they lived (parish if not actual townland not just the county).
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*thinking of a rude word*
LOL Thanks though. I do appreciate it! :D
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Have quite a bit of information on George Shaw Rutherford born in Ireland in 1789. He is my husband's great, great, grandfather. Cannot find anything on James his father nor his mother, Mary. A big mystery! Know that the Rutherford "clan" all settled around Manorhamilton, Ireland in the 1700's. Have a information on George's brother James and on several cousins in Manorhamilton.
Contact me if you would like.
Thanks.
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http://search.freefind.com/find.html?si=13812782&pid=r&n=0&_charset_=UTF-8&bcd=%C3%B7&query=Rutherford&s=leitrimstones
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Newspaper: Roscommon & Leitrim Gazette
Newspaper Content: Death notice of above, only daughter of John Rutherford
Date: 07 February 1835
Newspaper Subject: RUTHERFORD MARY DECEASED AGED TWENTY FOUR YEARS CORNASTALK NEAR MANORHAMILTON
In order to source this newspaper article, please supply all of the information below in an email to localstudies@leitrimcoco.ie
Bib #: 225807
LDR: 00000nam 22000255 4500
1000: $a newsNM
900: $a Roscommon & Leitrim Gazette
902: $a 07 February 1835
903: $a Death notice of above, only daughter of John Rutherford
904: 0 $a RUTHERFORD MARY DECEASED AGED TWENTY FOUR YEARS CORNASTALK NEAR MANORHAMILTON
907: $a 3 c5
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Newspaper: Roscommon & Leitrim Gazette
Newspaper Content: Application by above re; his intention to register a freehold at Clooneen, in Barony of Dromahair and freehold at Foughry in the half barony of Rosclogher.
Date: 19 September 1829
Newspaper Subject: RUTHERFORD JOHN CORNESTALK CURNESTLAK CORNASTALK
In order to source this newspaper article, please supply all of the information below in an email to localstudies@leitrimcoco.ie
Bib #: 225742
LDR: 00000nam 22000255 4500
1000: $a newsNM
900: $a Roscommon & Leitrim Gazette
902: $a 19 September 1829
903: $a Application by above re; his intention to register a freehold at Clooneen, in Barony of Dromahair and freehold at Foughry in the half barony of Rosclogher.
904: 0 $a RUTHERFORD JOHN CORNESTALK CURNESTLAK CORNASTALK
907: $a 1 c3
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Hi Hallmark and thanks so much for the information. The name I have is James Rutherford for George Shaw Rutherford's father. This was the posting for his obit. Maybe his father was John James? I really appreciate everything you send. You are amazing.
Thanks again.
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Newspaper: Roscommon & Leitrim Gazzette
Newspaper Content: Application by above re; his intention to register a freehold at Brickpark and Foxfield, Barony of Dromhair.
Date: 11 December 1830
Newspaper Subject: RUTHERFORD JAMES FOXFIELD
In order to source this newspaper article, please supply all of the information below in an email to localstudies@leitrimcoco.ie
Bib #: 225703
LDR: 00000nam 22000255 4500
1000: $a newsNM
900: $a Roscommon & Leitrim Gazzette
902: $a 11 December 1830
903: $a Application by above re; his intention to register a freehold at Brickpark and Foxfield, Barony of Dromhair.
904: 0 $a RUTHERFORD JAMES FOXFIELD
907: $a 3 c3/4
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Newspaper: Roscommon & Leitrim Gazette
Newspaper Content: Application by above re; his intention to register freehold (house) in Manorhamilton, Barony of Drumahair and freehold called Gwinkens Park in half Barony of Rosclogher, estate of the Earl of Leitrim
Date: 19 September 1829
Newspaper Subject: RUTHERFORD JAMES MANORHAMILTON
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This is probably your James
Newspaper: Leitrim Journal
Newspaper Content: Death notice
Date: 04 November 1852
Newspaper Subject: RUTHERFORD JAMES CARRICK ON SHANNON
In order to source this newspaper article, please supply all of the information below in an email to localstudies@leitrimcoco.ie
Bib #: 230850
LDR: 00000nam 22000255 4500
1000: $a newsNM
900: $a Leitrim Journal
902: $a 04 November 1852
903: $a Death notice
904: 0 $a RUTHERFORD JAMES CARRICK ON SHANNON
907: $a 2 c5
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joined the navy in 29.3.1812
navy list of medical officers 1814
married Elizabeth Tilden 16.2.1832 Northfleet Kent England, daughter Elizabeth 1834, George Sydney 1835, Mary Elizabeth 1839, John James 1841, William Albert 1843, Lucy Letitia in 1848 all in Marylebone
read more about him on this site
write up about him on this site http://www.jenwillets.com
then come down the page and click on Convict ship surgeon superintenents,
then come down the page till you find his name and click on it.
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sorry missed at 't' out of willetts
http://www.jenwilletts.com
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Thanks so much. I have all the Jen Willits information. I am looking for the father and mother of George Shaw Rutherford. I have all of the certificates that are available for George Shaw and nothing has any information on his parents. When George Shaw and Elizabeth were married his father and mother were not at the wedding. I do have a copy of the Leet's directory that shows James Rutherford, Esq. listed in Cornastauk, Leitrim, Ireland in 1814. That is about the only thing I have found that confirms he existed. For a son that has so much information about him on the internet, there is nothing but that on his father. I also cannot find anything about William Shaw, Esq. of Sligo, Ireland who was the father of Mary Shaw (George's mother).
Thanks again for the information.
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RUTHERFORD, George Shaw, Esq., M.D. (ofCornastalk).Son of the late James Rutherford, Esq., of Cornastalk, co. Leitrim, by Mary, dau. of William Shaw, Esq., of Clunie, co. Sligo ; b. 1789 ; to. 1832 Eliza-
beth, 2nd dau. of John Tilden, Esq., of Ifield Court, Kent. Is a Surgeon R.N. This family is descended from the Rutherfords, Borderers, of Roxburgshire, and is intimately connected with the family of the late Sir Walter Scott, whose mother’s maiden name was Rutherford. — 23, Devonshire Street, W.
Heir, his son Jolm James, b. 1841.
RUTHERFURD, William Oliver, Esq. (of Eclgerston). Son of the late William Oliver, Esq., of Dinfulgre,
and nephew of the late James Rutherfurd, Esq.;b. 1781 ; s. his father in 1830, and his uncle in
1834 ; m. 1804 Agnes, dau. of Alexander Chatto,Esq. Educated at Eton and Edinburgh University ; called to tbe Scottish Bar 1803 ; appointed Sheriff of co. Roxburgh in 1807 ; is a Magistrateand Dep. Lieut, for co. Roxburgh, and Convener for co. Roxburgh. — Edgerston, near Jedburgb,
Roxburghshire.
Heir, his son William Alexander, b. 1818.
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Online hallmark
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Re: George Shaw Rutherford
« Reply #12 on: Today at 08:52:14 AM »
Quote
This is probably your James
Newspaper: Leitrim Journal
Newspaper Content: Death notice
Date: 04 November 1852
Newspaper Subject: RUTHERFORD JAMES CARRICK ON SHANNON
In order to source this newspaper article, please supply all of the information below in an email to localstudies@leitrimcoco.ie
Bib #: 230850
LDR: 00000nam 22000255 4500
1000: $a newsNM
900: $a Leitrim Journal
902: $a 04 November 1852
903: $a Death notice
904: 0 $a RUTHERFORD JAMES CARRICK ON SHANNON
907: $a 2 c5
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James Rutherford, Esq. listed in Cornastauk, Leitrim, Ireland in 1814. That is about the only thing I have found that confirms he existed...
I've posted his death notice twice!!! So that is not the only thing to prove he existed, you now have his death notice!!!!
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Thanks so much. I sent them an email requesting this information and how to purchase it. Does the article mention any family or where he was buried?
You are a wizard at this and I cannot tell you how much I appreciate your help.
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I don't know what article contains.... you know all I know! It could be short, or a write up of next of kin etc, who he was...
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That would be so great. Thank you so much again for your help.
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it is all pure luck how detailed the notice of his death was..... It MIGHT say who his family were, etc etc... where buried.
Often the Death Notice can be a few days after Death as it was a weekly paper.. if he died on a Wednesday and paper came out on a Thursday then it would be too late to get it printed... so in next week's paper.
I'd be interested in how detailed it was, so let me know!
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I will. I hope I hear from them soon.
Thanks again so much.
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Well they've a good reputation for sending stuff out!
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Just found James Rutherford (SR) and Mary Shaw's marriage license bonds in 1771 in Elphin, Diocese!
I am jumping up and down for joy right now! You can pobably hear me where ever you are!!!!!
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Oh I can.... and I'm in Leitrim!! :-)) Did you look at the gravestone photos I took for Manorhamilton??
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Are you really in Leitrim? If so, we need to chat. We will be there next year on holiday...still looking for the Rutherfords! Yes, I can't read the gravestones very well. No, I do not have old lady eyes!
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Not from here just where I live. The old stones can be difficult to photograph and at least those are wet so you get better images at least. Certainly looks like James is there but as you say they can be hard to read....
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Lucky you. The google maps are so beautiful.
I agree. It does look like he is there.
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http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/leitrim-manorhamilton/target23.html looks like James!
I only spend a few minutes in any g/yard and my contributions are here
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/markers.htm
Some may not be perfect but at least one knows g/stones exist!!
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http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/leitrim-manorhamilton-coi/target84.html
MIGHT be worth noting??
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couple of Rutherfords here..
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/leitrim-manorhamilton-coi/index.html
looks like someone was "researching" one judging by the damage done to it!!
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Mary, dau. of William Shaw, Esq., of Clunie, co. Sligo I think is Collooney!!
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/sligo/photos/tombstones/sligo-collooney-coi/target19.html might be worth noting??
Only took a few photos but there's an email address on notice board photo!!
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/sligo/photos/tombstones/sligo-collooney-coi/index.html
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http://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~irlsli/gravecollooneychurch.html
In affectionate remembrance of the family of William and Susan SHAW of Cloonen. Called away in the bloom of life. James Aged 19 years. Elizabeth 13. John 28. Maryanne 18. William 25. Samuel 30.
CERTAINLY A POSSIBLE!!
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http://www.logainm.ie/en/45293
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You are amazing. Everything you sent is certainly worth noting and keeping. Do you know anything about Killroosk, Ireland? A cousin of George Shaw Rutherford, Major William Henry Rutherford owned a lot of acreage there. Actually owed it. If any of the descendants of his are alive, I might be able to trace a lot of the family history I am looking for through them. He left the land to his brother Adam Montgomery Rutherford (another cousin!).
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Still haven't heard anything from the people regarding the death notice for James Rutherford. I am re-sending my email to them today.
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Hallmark - Did you hear me jumping up and down again? Find my past has a record of James Rutherford's will written in 1816 - Cornastauk, Leitrim, with the Prerogative Court. How do I write for a copy?
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Hallmark - Did you hear me jumping up and down again? Find my past has a record of James Rutherford's will written in 1816 - Cornastauk, Leitrim, with the Prerogative Court. How do I write for a copy?
http://www.from-ireland.net/research-help-wills-administrations-deeds/ and you can read about them... it might just be an index!!
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You are amazing. Everything you sent is certainly worth noting and keeping. Do you know anything about Killroosk, Ireland? A cousin of George Shaw Rutherford, Major William Henry Rutherford owned a lot of acreage there. Actually owed it. If any of the descendants of his are alive, I might be able to trace a lot of the family history I am looking for through them. He left the land to his brother Adam Montgomery Rutherford (another cousin!).
Well I would put too much importance on the acreage as it is quite poor land there, about 3 miles north of M/hamilton.... http://www.logainm.ie/en/29941?s=Kilroosk
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fib/ gets you all Leitrim born Rutherfords in Ireland 1901
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fic/ gets them all
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fid/ gets you Wills who died IN Leitrim...
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01fie/ gets you Wills ... BUT by where they DIED!!
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Still haven't heard anything from the people regarding the death notice for James Rutherford. I am re-sending my email to them today.
I'M NOT SURE IF THEY OPEN EVERY DAY OF WEEK plus they might have people on holidays, normally they are reasonably quick.. maybe a few days or so!
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http://records.ancestry.co.uk/ann_rutherford_records.ashx?pid=3747088
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Marriage of JOHN TATE of MANORHAMILTON CO LEITRIM and ANNA MARIA RUTHERFORD of 23 PALMERSTON PLACE etc......
If you go to http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/ and just put Rutherford in you get some interesting bits..like the above!!
Don't mind the addresses as many were hotels where people had to stay for so many days (18?) before marriage if nto marrying from home.
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I can't rectify/edit errors for some reason....
if nto marrying from home should be if not marrying from home.
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RUTHERFORD, George Shaw, Esq., M.D. (ofCornastalk).Son of the late James Rutherford, Esq., of Cornastalk, co. Leitrim, by Mary, dau. of William Shaw, Esq., of Clunie, co. Sligo ; b. 1789 ; to. 1832 Eliza-
beth, 2nd dau. of John Tilden, Esq., of Ifield Court, Kent. Is a Surgeon R.N. This family is descended from the Rutherfords, Borderers, of Roxburgshire, and is intimately connected with the family of the late Sir Walter Scott, whose mother’s maiden name was Rutherford. — 23, Devonshire Street, W.
Heir, his son Jolm James, b. 1841.
RUTHERFURD, William Oliver, Esq. (of Eclgerston). Son of the late William Oliver, Esq., of Dinfulgre,
and nephew of the late James Rutherfurd, Esq.;b. 1781 ; s. his father in 1830, and his uncle in
1834 ; m. 1804 Agnes, dau. of Alexander Chatto,Esq. Educated at Eton and Edinburgh University ; called to tbe Scottish Bar 1803 ; appointed Sheriff of co. Roxburgh in 1807 ; is a Magistrateand Dep. Lieut, for co. Roxburgh, and Convener for co. Roxburgh. — Edgerston, near Jedburgb,
Roxburghshire.
Heir, his son William Alexander, b. 1818.
Sorry to "butt in" on the thread but I thought I'd ask here as you are knowledgeable about Sir Walter Scott's family.
Would you know whether Sir Walter Scott was related to these Rutherfurds please (but with a u)? Henry Thomas Rutherfurd of the 35th Regiment died in Jersey, Channel Islands in 1828. Henry's sister had a quite a public annulment of her marriage:
Henry's father-in-law was Robert MacKay, paymaster of the 21st Regiment, who was called to give evidence:
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=-htDAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA779&dq=mackay+paymaster&hl=en&sa=X&ei=URSHVdjYGs7o8AXu3ZjQAQ&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=mackay%20paymaster&f=false
According to some online trees, Henry Thomas Rutherford was the son of Capt John RUTHERFURD of 79th Regt & Hunthill (1765-1799) and Margaret EDGAR.
Capt John RUTHERFORD was the son of Henry RUTHERFURD of Hunthill b. 1742 and Agnes
LAUDER
Henry RUTHERFURD was the son of Sir John RUTHERFURD, advocate (1687-1764) by his second marriage (1740/1) to Sarah NISBET
However they're not mentioned here:
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=0NEKAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA1167&lpg=PA1167&dq=henry+rutherfurd+agnes+lauder&source=bl&ots=a7MYhV7zod&sig=booM23oaO_K4hDMVVENc_2VAXgM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=uqmMVYT_PMScsAWl1L-4Cw&ved=0CDUQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=henry%20rutherfurd%20agnes%20lauder&f=false
Or would you have any knowledge of Robert MacKay's background? One of the charts below shows that Walter's step-mother was an Ann MacKay.
I've looked at these charts, and it suggests that they're not related, but I have found errors in some other charts on this site.
http://www.swintonfamilysociety.org/web%20charts%20Jan%202005/Swint%20Ch.01-3/SWINTON_Ch01D_Sh1.pdf
http://www.swintonfamilysociety.org/web%20charts%20Jan%202005/Royal-Wright/RUTHERFORD_Ch1.pdf
http://www.swintonfamilysociety.org/web%20charts%20Jan%202005/Royal-Wright/SCOTT_Ch1_Sh1.pdf
Thank you for any insight you can offer.
Edit: This version (1863) does mention Sir Walter Scott on page 1309. It still doesn't include the people mentioned above though.
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=Ni4BAAAAQAAJ&pg=PA1310&lpg=PA1310&dq=sir+john+nisbet+henry+rutherfurd&source=bl&ots=n6m7PJwptK&sig=serrMK_4S1KP3rCYRNavxZI4OPE&hl=en&sa=X&ei=67KMVfCHOIvZtQWDtaO4BA&ved=0CCEQ6AEwATgK#v=onepage&q=sir%20john%20nisbet%20henry%20rutherfurd&f=false
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Offline hurworth
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Posts: 60
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
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Re: George Shaw Rutherford
« Reply #45 on: Today at 01:55:14 AM »
Quote
Quote from: hallmark on June 17, 2015, 05:40:15 PM
RUTHERFORD, George Shaw, Esq., M.D. (ofCornastalk).Son of the late James Rutherford, Esq., of Cornastalk, co. Leitrim, by Mary, dau. of William Shaw, Esq., of Clunie, co. Sligo ; b. 1789 ; to. 1832 Eliza-
beth, 2nd dau. of John Tilden, Esq., of Ifield Court, Kent. Is a Surgeon R.N. This family is descended from the Rutherfords, Borderers, of Roxburgshire, and is intimately connected with the family of the late Sir Walter Scott, whose mother’s maiden name was Rutherford. — 23, Devonshire Street, W.
Heir, his son Jolm James, b. 1841.
RUTHERFURD, William Oliver, Esq. (of Eclgerston). Son of the late William Oliver, Esq., of Dinfulgre,
and nephew of the late James Rutherfurd, Esq.;b. 1781 ; s. his father in 1830, and his uncle in
1834 ; m. 1804 Agnes, dau. of Alexander Chatto,Esq. Educated at Eton and Edinburgh University ; called to tbe Scottish Bar 1803 ; appointed Sheriff of co. Roxburgh in 1807 ; is a Magistrateand Dep. Lieut, for co. Roxburgh, and Convener for co. Roxburgh. — Edgerston, near Jedburgb,
Roxburghshire.
Heir, his son William Alexander, b. 1818.
Sorry to "butt in" on the thread but I thought I'd ask here as you are knowledgeable about Sir Walter Scott's family.
Would you know whether Sir Walter Scott was related to these Rutherfurds please (but with a u)? Henry Thomas Rutherfurd of the 35th Regiment died in Jersey, Channel Islands in 1828. Henry's sister had a quite a public annulment of her marriage:
Henry's father-in-law was Robert MacKay, paymaster of the 21st Regiment, who was called to give evidence:
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=-htDAAAAcAAJ&pg=PA779&dq=mackay+paymaster&hl=en&sa=X&ei=URSHVdjYGs7o8AXu3ZjQAQ&ved=0CC4Q6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=mackay%20paymaster&f=false
According to some online trees, Henry Thomas Rutherford was the son of Capt John RUTHERFURD of 79th Regt & Hunthill (1765-1799) and Margaret EDGAR.
Capt John RUTHERFORD was the son of Henry RUTHERFURD of Hunthill b. 1742 and Agnes
LAUDER
Henry RUTHERFURD was the son of Sir John RUTHERFURD, advocate (1687-1764) by his second marriage (1740/1) to Sarah NISBET
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Too huge to even consider!!
Even Napoleon Bonaparte's wife was a Nesbitt widow!! Yes it connects to Scott etc...
If you google "Gainsboro" AND "Blue Boy" you'll find the Nesbitts owned the painting and from there you should find a link to Nesbitt website which is massive.....
The Nesbitts start with 3 brothers in Donegal... one went south via Carrick on Shannon, the other to Cavan/Monaghan and the other to Antrim.
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http://www.nesbittnisbet.org.uk/html/lismore.html
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Marriages
Henry Stewart of Maherboy f. Pat. Stewart to Jane Shaw of Cloneen 1867 3rd Apr No 80
http://www.thestewartsinireland.ie/sligo-records/
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Rutherford Allan Manorhamilton Old Church County Leitrim
Rutherford Anna Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Annie Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Bertie Lurganboy Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Burriss Lurganboy Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Charles Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford E Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Elizabeth Manorhamilton Old Church County Leitrim
Rutherford Emily Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford F Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford George Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford John Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford John Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford John Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford John Manorhamilton Old Church County Leitrim
Rutherford M Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Mary Manorhamilton Old Church County Leitrim
Rutherford Nellie Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Robert Lurganboy Church of Ireland County Leitrim
Rutherford Robert Manorhamilton Church of Ireland County Leitrim
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Hi - Haven't been on for a while. They sent me the article of the death of James Rutherford in 1852 Carrick-on-the-Shannon and it wasn't the James Rutherford I am looking for. He was only 19 years old. My problem is the records are not avilable for James Rutherford's will, marriage, etc. When his son George Shaw Rutherford, M.D. married Elizabeth Tilden in England, James Rutherford (Sr.) didn't attend the wedding and neither did his mother Mary Shaw Rutherford. Very odd for this family. My suspecious mind tells me he may have been ill or already died. The Rutherford men didn't marry until well into their 30's. George Shaw happened to be 41. I had the death date of the oldest son James Rutherford who was born in 1779 and died in 1862.
Everyone I have written to regardin the will of James Rutherford in 1813 says it is either not available anymore or too fragile. I just want to know if there is any information in there!
Thanks so much for all your help.
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The Will might not be there but did the inheritors register their inheritance at Will/Deeds, Henrietta St, Dublin??
Most likely!
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well you know now where the Shaws were from! Clunie, Collooney, Co. Sligo and contact details are on notice board for that church!
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How do I know which church it is? There seemed to be several?
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? I posted the church where they were!!
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Do you know any of the history of Leitrim Lodge? The Rutherford boys, (George Shaw, his son William Albert) all called their homes Leitrim Lodge. George Shaw in Australia and William Albert in London.
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Can I hire you?
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Well they probably called them after the County! One of the houses they lived in is still inhabited but not called Leitrim Lodge.
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21 November 1863: Thomas Rutherford & Lilla Flynn
At St Peter’s Church Dubllin, Thomas Rutherford jun. of Macken Lodge, county Leitrim, Esq., to Lilla, daughter of the late Rev. Daniel Flynn of Harcourt Street Dublin.
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Where is the house located? Also, I must be denser that I already think I am. I can't find the name of the church for Elphin Diocese for Sligo. Nor can I find any board posts. Sorry I am such a pain, I just don't see it.
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Don't have a thomas rutherford in my family tree that I am aware.
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https://www.google.com/maps/@54.30481,-8.115334,3a,75y,180h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1spemqDhtj_1c7R0_dd9YLyw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 is one of the houses they lived in!
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Where is the house located? Also, I must be denser that I already think I am. I can't find the name of the church for Elphin Diocese for Sligo. Nor can I find any board posts. Sorry I am such a pain, I just don't see it.
Reply #33 on this thread!!
ttp://www.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~irlsli/gravecollooneychurch.html
In affectionate remembrance of the family of William and Susan SHAW of Cloonen. Called away in the bloom of life. James Aged 19 years. Elizabeth 13. John 28. Maryanne 18. William 25. Samuel 30.
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The Cork Examiner, 9 December 1864 -
BIRTHS.
On the 6th instant, at Macken Lodge, county Leitrim, the wife of
Thomas Rutherford, jun., Esq., of a daughter.
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The other idea I had was to find the parents of William Henry Rutherford, his brother Adam Montgomery Rutherford and his sister Margaret Rutherford (she lived in Manorhamilton). William Henry was a Major in her Majesty's 55th or 87th regiment. They are all cousins to George Shaw Rutherford. Hopefully I could find James Rutherford's birth date that way and find out if he was born in Scotland or Ireland.
William Henry Rutherford owned property in Killroosk, outside Manorhamilton and willed it to his brother Adam Montgomery Rutherford.
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Yes but land is extremely poor round there!
https://www.google.com/maps/@54.337556,-8.193277,3a,90y,180h,68.96t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1slrQ8usqYSltXpmAZil05Ew!2e0!7i13312!8i6656
The g/stones I photographed in Manorhamilton contains a lot of the names you are after!!
I posted that link too
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commission agent & traveller Rutherford William Albert, Leitrim-lodge
http://www.newspapers.com/newspage/35632162/
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Thanks for the information on William Albert. I worked with someone at British Ancestors who provided me with marriage certificates, naval, army, etc. records on George Shaw, Elizabeth Tilden and all the children and their children. Can you please send me the website again for all of the grave markers you sent with the Rutherford's? I must not have seen it and I went back to all the posts. I think you are right about all the marker's.
I am not sure why there are so many Rutherford's in the Manorhamilton Leitrim area. I do know that my 4th great grandfather, James Rutherford that I am hunting for was a flax grower and also a hops grower. George Shaw Rutherford grew flax himself in Australia. His brother James died in 1862 in Sligo and he didn't have a will. Letter of Intestate (?).
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SEE Reply No6 on this thread for link to gravestones.
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Hi - I looked at the marker for James Rutherford over and over and could not make out any dates. From your picture, can you tell anything? Also, I didn't see Mary Rutherford. James' tombstone looks very old and worn. I made it as large as I could on the my screen, but still couldn't make out the age. Surely that is not a 9_?
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97
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Is there a date of any kind? That might give me his birth date or death date and I can subtract 97!
Can you tell me what the marker says?
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You took those pictures didn't you? I put the names together. Wow. You are very dedicated to Ireland and that is so impressive.
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Well you can see http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/leitrim-manorhamilton/target0.html and 2nd photo after just to see the lousy day that it was, and the long grass... I just spent a few minutes to take some photos and if they were dry you'd get less!
So it's just what's there!!
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You took those pictures didn't you? I put the names together. Wow. You are very dedicated to Ireland and that is so impressive.
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/markers.htm lists the Cemeteries I and a few others have taken photos at while there!
All voluntary... all it needs is more people to take photos!!
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Is it far from where you live? If so, I would be glad to pay for your time and expense to go there and see if you can read it and find any dates.
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About 35 miles away...
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Is it far from where you live? If so, I would be glad to pay for your time and expense to go there and see if you can read it and find any dates.
A lot depends on what you want..... the Rutherfords are buried in 3 graveyards that I know of!
Some at Bawnboy for example!
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/leitrim-lurganboy-coi/target26.html and might be others there too. Only has few minutes while passing!! Other at new Cemetery in Manorhamilton where it looks like someone was researching them judging by damage to g/stone!
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So, do you get over that way for business? If so, please let me know and as I said, I would gladly pay your expenses for re-reading it for me. I am pretty sure that this is my James Rutherford. The date of his death could explain a lot of things for me. Like why he was not at George Shaw's wedding. I am not sure when James Jr. married. I know on his death info. in 1862 his wife was Eliza Shaw and I think I found something on Find My Past for that, like he married in 1834 ish in Ireland. I have George Shaw's wedding certificate and none of the Rutherford's are listed. His father isn't even listed, not even as deceased. Can you tell that I am obsessed in finding out this information? I have been looking on and off for 3 years and really got serious about a year ago. You have been the biggest help since I immigrated to Ireland from England!!!!
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Just really want anything on James Rutherford (97 years old) and Mary Shaw Rutherford.
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Whoops! The Old Manorhamilton Marker.....right?
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No don't go that way on business... was just on way home from Sligo that day.
Same with Bawnboy and other Cemeteries..
Apart from the Carrick on Shannon and Drumshanbo ones the rest were taken while coming home from Sligo while my son was getting Dental treatment/checkups there when he had braces etc..
Otherwise the cost of going to those places and back just to take photos would be quite high... too high.
The http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/markers.htm
list is quite long but as you can see by the dates, taken over a few years, and while I was nearby or passing!
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Whoops! The Old Manorhamilton Marker.....right?
This one??
http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/leitrim/photos/tombstones/leitrim-manorhamilton/target23.html
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well I am sad. Would there be a listing of it in any of the church records?
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From what I can gather... that is the first time it was recorded!!
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Well, a friend of mine is going to take the picture and do some thing to make the image larger. Does that sound possible? It seems to me it would just get blurred. I am going to get that information one way or the other. How much is too high?
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70 miles return... 2 hours of time!
In order to photograph stones like that they need to be wet... then try and get them at an angle to capture details!
Possibly there are Programs which might increase details etc. They are Copyright, and for non commercial uses, http://www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/headstones.htm has search boxes for Names and Counties.
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... I am pretty sure that this is my James Rutherford. The date of his death could explain a lot of things for me. Like why he was not at George Shaw's wedding. I am not sure when James Jr. married. I know on his death info. in 1862 his wife was Eliza Shaw and I think I found something on Find My Past for that, like he married in 1834 ish in Ireland. I have George Shaw's wedding certificate and none of the Rutherford's are listed. His father isn't even listed, not even as deceased. ...
There's no way to tell exactly who might have attended the marriage ceremony solely from the certificate- all you'll know for certain is that the bride, groom, clergyman and two witnesses were there. As for the father's name being left out- it may just be that the minister forgot to ask and/or record that item.
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He was the Son of the late James Rutherford, Esq., of Cornastalk, Co. Leitrim, by Mary Shaw, dau. of William Shaw, Esq., of Clunie, co. Sligo ; born. 1789 ; married to Elizabeth, 2nd dau. of John Tilden, Esq., of Ifield Court, Kent in 1832
"Son of the late James Rutherford, Esq..."
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?
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Hey - Hope you are doing well. Is someone else looking for George Shaw Rutherford? I am still looking for the real James Rutherford, none of the ones that we have talked about in the past have proven to be my James, except for the one gravestone and I will be in Ireland next year to find out for myself! I do have the wedding certificate for James Rutherford and Mary Shaw who married in 1771 that we already talked about.
I have so much information on George Shaw Rutherford. We will be viewing his grave site next year in England. Maybe then I can tell you exactly when he was born!
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Hoping someone has information on Mary Shaw mother of George Shaw Rutherford and Elizabeth Shaw who married James Rutherford.
George Shaw Rutherford was the uncle of Francis James Shaw (my Great great grandfather), born 1821 in Sligo (Father Robert Shaw, mother Christian Carroll on his death certificate). He moved to Australia in 1841, succeeded in business and became Mayor of Newcastle NSW. In approximately 1852 suffering with eye problems, he returned to London where he was treated by his uncle George Shaw Rutherford, then visited his parents and sisters in Ireland before returning to Australia.
George Shaw Rutherford received a land grant in NSW near Newcastle but never lived there. It was where the town of Rutherford is now located.
Francis James Shaw, named his home Rutherford, as well as passing the name on when christening a number of his children.
Can anyone help with the Shaw connection. I cannot find a Francis anywhere.
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You're not going to find them in Church records.
They had property. Some went to England, Oz etc.... so did any leaving Ireland Sell/Lease their property to other Shaws??
There are a good few Deeds between Shaw and Shaw... have these been checked? There are 6 on this page alone!
I didn't see a Marriage Agreement Shaw to Rutherford but didn't check for Rutherford to Shaw!
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Some Sligo Shaws are in there but are they your line?
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There are a few Rutherford to Rutherford in 1700's.... BUT if they sold out to someone else then the others would need to be checked.
Maybe they have been checked already so I didn't use my time looking.
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Many thanks. Probably not much to find in the property info as Francis James Shaw left Ireland aged approximately 21 in 1841.
After returning and visiting his uncle George Shaw Rutherford and his parents and sisters, he left for Australia on the ill-fated Tayleur. He survived the shipwreck in 1854 but lost four hundred pounds worth of goods provided by his father to help with his life in Australia. His father replaced the goods and found him another passage.
Any info on the wife of Charles Shaw Rutherford's son James might be useful.
Regards
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The Tayleur didn't get far!
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Indeed it did not!
Likewise my journey of discovery seems to have hit the rocks. However, like my ancestor, I will push on.
Hoping to find out more about the wife of James, son of George Shaw Rutherford.
Cheers
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Many thanks. Probably not much to find in the property info as Francis James Shaw left Ireland aged approximately 21 in 1841.
You never know.... often they are named as "having received a gift of 'whatever' as their share" or being left X if they returned within a certain amount of time .... or being left 1 shilling, which then stops them making any further claim!
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Following up on your note of 2018 about George Shaw Rutherford who you say was uncle of Francis James Shaw (himself, per your info, born 2821 in Sligo to father Robert Shaw and mother Christian Carroll. My own family line go back to Shaws of Cornstaulk in Manorhamilton which is same address as various Rutherfords. My GGGrandfather was George Warren Shaw (c1792-1874) (married Isabella Whittaker in 1834 after first wife Margaret died). Whilst my direct line is through Francis Whittaker Shaw(c1838 - 1887), one of his siblings had the middle name "Rutherford" so there was clearly a close connection to Rutherford family but I've not yet been able to work this out. GW Shaw's father was George Shaw (c1765 - c1845) who married Margaret Warren (c1759 - 1835) and it is possible that his sister was Mary Shaw who married James Rutherford, with family including your George Shaw Rutherford. But this would not make GS Rutherford the uncle to your GGGrandfather so I'm trying to see where the connection might be. You also mention your GGGGrandfather Robert Shaw and his wife (your GGGGrandmother) Christian Carroll but how does that link to G S Rutherford work since I think that G S Rutherford married an Elizabeth Tilden (so not a Shaw) and FJ Shaw's father and mother are not Rutherfords. All thoughts welcome!
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Does anyone from this line of Rutherford - Manorhamilton, Leitrim - have their DNA on any of the websites? I am T013505 on gedmatch.com and my father is T621117. We are from the Rutherfords of Cootehill, Cavan, Ireland. Would like to compare please.
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I don't match you, but I do match your father at 5.2 cM (my Gedmatch number is BP2045450). I am a 6th generation descendant from Robert Rutherford, who emigrated to Toronto (then York) in 1820. Various documents mention Manorhamilton, Killasnet, and Cornastauk (or Cornstaulk) as his place of origin, but I don't know the names of his parents. I also have a distant DNA match on Ancestry DNA to a descendant of the Justus Rutherford from Killasnet, who settled in Southern Ontario in the early 1800's. They were likely close relatives to George Shaw Rutherford as well, based on the Manorhamilton location.