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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Sussex => England => Sussex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: diroka on Tuesday 23 December 08 01:21 GMT (UK)

Title: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Tuesday 23 December 08 01:21 GMT (UK)
I am looking for any information on Streeter Morris Newman, abt 1843. in a place called Hooe? I do not have a birth/baptism date for him or a death date. He also had a son by the same name. He married Amelia Pearson in 1865 in West Hartlepool.
Thanks,
Kathy
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: willow2670 on Tuesday 23 December 08 01:28 GMT (UK)
1851 census HO107/1635 Folio 20
John Newman Head 38  b Brightling, Sussex            Farm labourer
Harriet Newman Wife 37  b Brighton, Sussex
Frances Charity Newman Dau 18 unm b Guestling, Sussex 
George Newman Son 12  b Guestling, Sussex
Thomas Newman Son 10  b Hooe, Sussex
Streeter Newman Son 8  b Hooe, Sussex
Elizabeth Newman Dau 6  b Hooe, Sussex
John William Newman Son 2  b Fairlight, Sussex
Eliza Morris Visitor 20 unm b Winchelsea, Sussex              Dressmaker
Cottage at Lush?? Hill??, Guestling, Sussex

Sue
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: willow2670 on Tuesday 23 December 08 01:31 GMT (UK)
Birth
Streeter Morris  Newman
Year 1842 Qtr Sep Dist: Hailsham Vol 7 Pg 323
http://www.freebmd.org.uk/
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Tuesday 23 December 08 01:38 GMT (UK)
Thanks for the information from both of you. I will look up the census record.
When I looked up the index for Streeter, it only gave his son's birth date, not the fathers.
Kathy
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Eyesee on Tuesday 23 December 08 08:06 GMT (UK)
Found this on the Sussex Marriage Index

Guestling, East Sussex, 15 Mar 1834
Harriet MORRIS
John Newman RIGGLESFORD
 
1881
6 Cambridge Rd, Holy Trinity, Hastings
Thomas RICKLESFORD, head mar 40, Carman, born Hooe, Sussex
Kate RICKLESFORD, wife mar 41, Lodging house keeper, born Icklesham, Sussex
Streeter M NEWMAN, nephew s 12, Scholar, born Hartlepool
+ a couple of servants
RG11/1026/F67/P51

Thomas Newman RICKLESFORD married Catherine LEADBETTER, Mar qtr 1864, Hastings, 2b 47. This is the Thomas NEWMAN aged 10 in 1851, brother to Streeter.

1871
58 Stonefield Rd, St Mary in the Castle, Hastings
James SELLINS, head mar 37, Carman, born Sussex, Westfield
Frances C SELLINS, wife mar 35, born Sussex, Guestling
Thomas J SELLINS, son 9, Scholar, born Sussex, Westfield
Elizabeth I SELLINS, dau 6, born ditto
William J SELLINS, son 3, born Sussex, Hastings
Carlos SELLINS, son 10mo, born ditto
same address
John NEWMAN, head mar 58, Warehouseman, born Sussex, Brightling
next page
Harriet NEWMAN, wife mar 57, born Sussex, Brighton
Martha M NEWMAN, dau 15, Dressmaker, born Sussex, Westfield
Streeter MORRIS, father wid 82, labourer, born Sussex, Fairlight
RG10/1031/F27/P46 & 47

Streeter is Harriet's father not John's I would think.

Frances Charity Newman RIGGLESFORD married James SELLENS, Dec qtr 1859, Battle, 2b 93

Looks like somewhere along the line some of the family have dropped the RIGGLESFORD name off the end and used NEWMAN as the surname.

1841
Martins, Hooe, Sussex
John NEWMAN, 25, Ag lab
Harriet NEWMAN, 25
Frances NEWMAN, 5
George NEWMAN, 2
Thomas NEWMAN, 6mo
same address
Streeter MORRIS, 50, Ag lab
Frances NEWMAN, 45
All born in county
HO107/1109/B2/D11/F12/P18

Streeter MORRIS bapt 8 Jan 1788, Guestling, s/o Thomas and Ann - IGI submitted entry.

From the Sussex Marriage Index
Mountfield, East Sussex, 22 Nov 1813
Frances RIGGLESFORD
Elias NEWMAN

Might be the Frances NEWMAN with Streeter MORRIS in 1841
.

No connection. Frances and Elias are in Hellingly in 1841, 1851 and 1861.

Ian C
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Wednesday 24 December 08 03:58 GMT (UK)
Thanks Ian,
so how did you figure out that their last name was once Ricklesford/Rigglesford? Is this Sussex index available to everyone?this is great information. Thanks.
Kathy
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Eyesee on Wednesday 24 December 08 05:46 GMT (UK)
Streeter born 1869 was with his uncle Thomas in 1881, who was Thomas NEWMAN/Thomas Newman RICKLESFORD, who married using the full name. John and Harriet's daughter Frances also married using the RIGGLESFORD name.

I thought Harriet's maiden name might have been MORRIS. Could not find a John NEWMAN marriage on the SMI but did find a Harriet MORRIS.

I am picking that John may have been born out of wedlock, and that his mother was a RIGGLESFORD. Quite often in those cases the fathers surname is given as a second name, in this case NEWMAN, hence John Newman Rigglesford. It became recognised that his fathers name was NEWMAN, and so the RIGGLESFORD was dropped.

The SMI can be purchased from the SFHG, link in the Sussex Resources page.

If you can get access to the Brightling PRs you might find his baptism to confirm this one way or the other.

See that Harriet's death was registered Jun qtr 1875 as Harriet Newman RIGGLESFORD aged 61, and John's Dec qtr 1877 as John Newman RIGGLESFORD aged 64.

Ian C
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Wednesday 24 December 08 05:48 GMT (UK)
I am in awe.. thanks..
Kathy
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Eyesee on Wednesday 24 December 08 06:02 GMT (UK)
Looks like John might have married again in 1876 after Harriet died as well.

Ian C
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Thursday 25 December 08 02:39 GMT (UK)
where did you find this information? I am in contact with John's direct relation and I wonder if she knows this..
thanks.
Kathy
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Eyesee on Thursday 25 December 08 02:50 GMT (UK)
On FreeBMD there is a John Newman RIGELSFORD marriage in 1876.

Ian C
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: censusmick on Monday 26 January 09 11:02 GMT (UK)
References are acknowledged as from the G.R.O. Indexes that used to be up the FRC in London.
Possible acknowledgements, also, are for the ONS from where the info originated ?

Dear Kathy

A colleague in the NNS abstracted this some years ago ( but not related )

MARINE DEATHS 1837-1965
Streeter Morris Newman    Age 35    Ship = Rosegrove      Year 1903   Page 200

Computed Birth year = 1868
No other info supplied - hope the above may be of some help ?

In the 'ordinary' BDM : under the NEWMAN surname -
Look-ups are acknowledged as from the excellent FreeBDM site ( long may they transcribe )

Streeter Morris - Birth 1841-Q3 @ Hailsham SSX
Streeter Morris - Marriage 1865-Q2 @ Hartlepool DUR
Streeter  - Birth 1868-Q4 @ Hartlepool DUR
Streeter Morris - Marriage 1898-Q3 @ Hampstead MDX   

Found using STREETER as the MOTHERS Maiden Name who married a NEWMAN :
Look-ups are acknowledged as from the excellent FreeBDM site ( long may they transcribe )

Frederick        1859-Q2-Birth   Horsham
Esther          1860-Q4-Birth   Horsham
Mabel          1867-Q1-Birth   Horsham
Richard E       1918-Q4-Birth   Mile End
Harold E          1921-Q1-Birth   Mile End
Leslie C          1922-Q4-Birth   Poplar

Mick - a small, worn down, cog in the Newman Name Society (NNS) ( OK, its a plug !! )
Always looking for Newman info to populate our (NNS) data-base !!

"Staying single - like my Father and his Father before him .... "

Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Stovepipe on Monday 26 January 09 14:17 GMT (UK)

Always looking for Newman info to populate our (NNS) data-base !!


I have some - if your database covers India and has the info I'd be grateful for details of the children's births and their father's death.

Charles Henry NEWMAN, born 1871, Duncton, SSX
 - married Elizabeth FIELD, E. Preston, Q3 1895
 - died c. 1900, India?

Charles NEWMAN, born c. 1899, Mhow, India
Thomas NEWMAN, born c. 1900, Nasirabad, India

The children's mother is back in Sussex, a widow, in 1901.  See RG13/962/137/32.

Cheers,
Stovepipe
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Tuesday 27 January 09 00:48 GMT (UK)
Thanks for all of the info on Streeter. Interesting family, to be sure... At least with somewhat unusual names it is easier to find any information if it's out there.  Marine deaths... does that mean that he died while on board or just died and was still a mariner or whatever his occupation was?
Thanks.
Kathy
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: censusmick on Monday 09 February 09 11:04 GMT (UK)
Kathy, sorry, not sure as to the meaning of Marine Deaths,
as you will see from my reply to 'stovepipe' below.
Apologies if I have Hijacked your thread

Mick


The following are acknowledged as originating from the G.R.O. indexes that were originally
located at St. Katherines House and later at the Family Records Centre in London, now at Kew ?.
I believe that the 'umbrella' department is the O.N.S.
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Hi Stovepipe,

One of our N.N.S.lady members transcribed a lot of the Newman entries in
the G.R.O. 'Miscellaneous' Indexes some years ago.

( Newmans only - ? indicates a bad page image - typed characters filling in !! )

==========================================================================

Army Returns - Register of Births - Land Forces - Serving out of the UK.

Charles Frederick - Nasirabad - (Year) 1898 - (Page) 401?
Thomas Henry - Nasirabad - (Year) 1899 - (Page) 431 ?
==========================================================================

Regimental Births - 1761-1924 - Army Births & Baptisms

Charles F - Nasirabad - (Year) 1898 - (Regiment) 7th - (Volume) 884 ? - (Page) 69 ?
Thomas H - Nasirabad - (Year) 1899 - (Regiment) 7th - (Volume) 884 ? - (Page) 69 ?

==========================================================================

Army Returns - Register of Deaths - Land Forces - Serving out of the UK.

Charles  (Age) 33 - Nasirabad - (Year) 1899 - (Page) 420

==========================================================================

I know that your next question will be 'how do I get the certificates'.

I'm sorry but I don't know - I just have these basic facts,
( sounds like that old B/W police show Dragnet (?) "just the facts maam ..." ).
This will need another query to the RootsChat members for this info.
I shall be looking at the answers myself as I have a Newman 'rellie'
that is in the indexes for 1914 when H.M.S. Pathfinder was lost in WW1.

With regards to the Marriage mentioned ie 1895 Q3 East Preston SSX,
do you have the certificate ?, what is the name / occupation of Charles father ?

I only ask due to the difference in the age of Charles at death,( 33 cby 1866 ? )
assuming that the Charles death in Nasirabad is your Charles ?.

The Charles Henry b 1871-Q4 (Petworth RD) is in the 1881 Census (Petworth RD)
with his parents Charles and Rachel Newman ( nee HEDGER ? ) - Charles a carpenter.

Hope the above will be of some help ?           Mick







Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Stovepipe on Monday 09 February 09 21:33 GMT (UK)
Many thanks, Mick - that's great information.

Sorry I can't help with certificates - the Newman connection is a fairly remote twig on my tree and my budget doesn't run that far.  All my information comes from the FreeBMD indices and the 1901 census page where Elizabeth Newman is a widow with two children born in India.  I merely guessed the birth registered in Petworth was that of her husband because the age was about the same as Elizabeth's and the middle name Henry matched that of the Charles Newman on her page of the marriage register.  But Charles' age at death does throw some doubt on that.  Can the Petworth born Charles Henry Newman be positively identified alive anywhere in the 1901 census?  There's a 33-year-old with no middle name born Kirdford - the other side of Petworth from Duncton, so not a good match with the 1881 census.

Good luck with your N.N.S.!

Regards,
Stovepipe
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: bobrob on Tuesday 24 February 09 15:28 GMT (UK)
Kathy
 I have information on the marriage and familyof Frances Rigglesford and Elias Newman parents of John Newman Rigglesford

Bob Rigarlsford
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: censusmick on Monday 09 March 09 11:01 GMT (UK)
Hi stovepipe,

The lady who supplied the previous information has sent
another letter to me with the following extra information.
( she is not on the Internet )

Bombay baptisms :

1898 June 21st ( bn 1898 June 8th ) St Pauls - Nasirabad
Charles Frederick NEWMAN
son of Charles Henry and Elizabeth of Nasirabad
Sergt  1st Royal Fusiliers - N/3/79/228

1899 December 23rd ( bn 1899 November 30th ) St Pauls - Nasirabad
Thomas Henry NEWMAN
son of Charles and Elizabeth of Nasirabad
Sergt 1st Royal Fusiliers - N/3/82/307

Bombay burial :

1899 December 5th  ( d December 4th )
Charles NEWMAN age 32
Sergt 1st Royal Fusiliers
Valvular disease of the heart
Nasirabad - N/3/82/411

( So he never got the chance to see his second son ! - sad )

Hope the information is new and of use to you ?

I know you have 'put off' obtaining that wedding certificate,
but have you thought about the Attestation papers for when he
joined the Army ? - just a thought for the future !!

Cheers          Mick Newman

Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Stovepipe on Monday 09 March 09 11:47 GMT (UK)
Many thanks, Mick - that's great information.  Please convey my gratitude to your correspondent, too.

Hadn't thought about the attestation papers - that should resolve the issue of Charles Henry's identity, but my money's on him being the chap born in Duncton.  I'll let you know if I ever find out for sure.

I understand Nasirabad is quite some distance from Bombay - is that why Charles never saw his son?  I.e. son born in Nasirabad while father had just a few days to live in Bombay.

Thanks again,
Stovepipe
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: bogroll on Saturday 28 March 09 19:35 GMT (UK)
FRANCES RIGGLESFORD bap. APRIL 5TH 1795 BRIGHTLING
MARRIED ELIAS NEWMAN NOV.22ND 1813 MOUNTFIELD
son JOHN NEWMAN RIGGLESFORD(FARM BAILIFF) bap. AUG 25TH 1813 BRIGHTLING
                                                                              d.1877 HASTINGS
MARRIED TO HARRIET MORRIS b. 1814 BRIGHTLING d. 1875 HASTINGS
CHILDREN: FRANCES CHARITY NEWMAN RIGGLESFORD b. 1836
                     m.1859 to JAMES SELLENS

                  GEORGE NEWMAN RIGGLESFORD b. 1839 GUESTLING
                     m.1864 RYE to CAROLINE MONK b.1833 d.1906
                      children: LOUISA KATE NEWMAN RIGGLESFORD b.1866
                                     ANNIE M. NEWMAN b.1868
                                     ALICE NEWMAN b.1871
                                     EMILY HARRIET N.RIGGLESFORD b.1873 d.1933
                                     FLORENCE SARAH N. RIGGLESFORD b.1877
                   died as GEORGE NEWMAN RIGELSFORD d. 1906 HASTINGS

                  THOMAS NEWMAN RIGGLESFORD b. 1840 HOOE
                    m.1864 to CATHERINE LEADBETTER b.1840 ICKLESHAM d. 1906 HASTINGS
                     remarried 1907 to ANNIE ELIZABETH HARMAN d.1923 BATTLE
                   died as THOMAS NEWMAN RICKLESFORD d.1911 HASTINGS

                  STREETER MORRIS NEWMAN b. 1843 HOOE
                     m. 1865 HARTLEPOOLS to AMELIA PEARSON
                     1871 census shows STREETER 28,master mariner
                                                     AMELIA 25,
                                                     JOHN D 5,
                                                      STREETER 2,

                     ELIZABETH NEWMAN b.1845 HOOE

                     JOHN WILLIAM NEWMAN b. 1849 FAIRLIGHT

                     MARTHA MATILDA NEWMAN RICKLESFORD b. 1855 WESTFIELD
                      m.1873 to RICHARD WHITE
                     1881 census shows them living at 10,PARADISE STREET MIDDX.
                               Daughter ELIZA 5,living with Aunt FRANCES CHARITY
                      1901 census in HACKNEY
                       













               
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: allibaker on Sunday 05 April 09 08:43 BST (UK)
Streeter born 1869 was with his uncle Thomas in 1881, who was Thomas NEWMAN/Thomas Newman RICKLESFORD, who married using the full name. John and Harriet's daughter Frances also married using the RIGGLESFORD name.

I thought Harriet's maiden name might have been MORRIS. Could not find a John NEWMAN marriage on the SMI but did find a Harriet MORRIS.

I am picking that John may have been born out of wedlock, and that his mother was a RIGGLESFORD. Quite often in those cases the fathers surname is given as a second name, in this case NEWMAN, hence John Newman Rigglesford. It became recognised that his fathers name was NEWMAN, and so the RIGGLESFORD was dropped.

The SMI can be purchased from the SFHG, link in the Sussex Resources page.

If you can get access to the Brightling PRs you might find his baptism to confirm this one way or the other.

See that Harriet's death was registered Jun qtr 1875 as Harriet Newman RIGGLESFORD aged 61, and John's Dec qtr 1877 as John Newman RIGGLESFORD aged 64.

Ian C

don't know if this helps at all?
john newman rigglesford baptised 25th april 1813 brightling sussex .mothers name listed as frances rigglesford no father listed.
regards
alli
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Eyesee on Sunday 05 April 09 09:44 BST (UK)
Probably means the marriage I crossed out earlier between Frances and Elias can be uncrossed as being John's parents.

Ian C
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: 581hilary on Saturday 22 August 09 10:50 BST (UK)
Hi there,

My mother's maiden name was Newman and have traced back to Elias Newman who married Frances Rigglesford. Would be interested if you have got back any further as have come to a dead halt.

Best Wishes

Hilary
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: bobrob on Sunday 23 August 09 16:58 BST (UK)
Hilary
Thomas Rigglesford bapt 1659 Lindfield
Married 1693 Lindfield,  Anne Granby
John fifth child of 14 bapt Dec 26 1699 Maresfield
Married Jan 14 1730 Maresfield, Mary Older
Joseph the forth child of 12, bapt Dec 14 1735
married 1761 Framfield, Ann Martin
John forth of 10 children bapt May 24 1767 Framfield
                                            buried 1846 Brightling
Married July 27 1791 Mountfield Sarah Roots
Frances bapt April 5 1795
third  of 11 children

Bobrob
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: 581hilary on Monday 24 August 09 08:29 BST (UK)
Thank you, that information is very helpful. Did you have any more information about the Newman side

Best Wishes

Hilary  :D
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: bobrob on Monday 24 August 09 10:22 BST (UK)
Hilary
All my research on John Newman Rigglesford is identical to that listed by Bogroll
exept John remarried 1876 to Eliza Staples
The 1898 Hampstead married of Streeter Newman could be father on son
have never checked on this.

The Joseph Rigglesford born 1735 was brother to my ancestor William born 1740

Bobrob
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: 581hilary on Monday 24 August 09 11:13 BST (UK)
Thanks a lot

Hilary ;)
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Atlanta1 on Monday 18 January 10 14:40 GMT (UK)
Hi, Im a decendant of Margaret Rigglesford daughter of Robert, son of James, son of John, son of Joseph, John and finally Thomas 1659.  Would love more info on the family bobrob took most of this info from your post -
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Atlanta1 on Monday 18 January 10 14:45 GMT (UK)
Hi, new at this already sent a post but sending another one anyway.  I am a decendant of the Rigglesford family my Great, Great grandmother being Margaret Rigglesford her father robert son of James, John etc.  would love any other info you have.
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: bobrob on Monday 18 January 10 18:28 GMT (UK)
From Margarets family came the start of the Riggulsford spelling,
The origin of our name started in Yorkshire
Early Yorkshire records state that the village of Wridlesford, now called Woodlesford. gave its name to a family of distinction in the 12 century.
we know that Samson de Wridlesford 1150 - 1210 appears as Steward of Robert de Lacy, the Wridlesford family at the time were closely connected with de Lacy and de Warenne families both of Norman descent,
a Walter de Ridelisford suggested by historians to be the younger brother of Samson, is recorded in Irish history after the Anglo/Norman invasion of 1171
Walter and son Walter are of frequent occurrence in the Calendar of Documents, Ireland 1171-1251
It was in 1251 when a Walter de Wridlesford sold all his land to Edmund de Lacy and migrated to Sussex, where they are recorded in the Cuckfield and Bolney area Walters heir is recorded as Ralph de Writlesford
the earliest use of the ( g ) in surname occurs in 1308/9
now we have six different surname spellings originating from Sussex
There is so much more that could be added to this, hope this helps a bit

bobrob
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Atlanta1 on Monday 18 January 10 18:38 GMT (UK)
wow thank you so much for your reply - we are obviously related would love to see and hear more about the family. 
Atlanta
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: Atlanta1 on Tuesday 19 January 10 12:13 GMT (UK)
Hi, me again.  do you know who thomas rigglesford married b.1659 or do you know who his father was.  am I right in thinking our decendants came from Ireland.. sorry getting a bit confused.  Would you be kind enough to simplify for me  ???  What is the correct spellings for the name through time could I have a brief outline.. hope you dont think I am a pest!
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: bobrob on Tuesday 19 January 10 15:15 GMT (UK)
This is like writing on the back of a postage stamp,

Could you send me your e-mail address
E-mail address removed - please use the private message facility - Global Moderator
Regards
Bob Rigarlsford

Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: percynew on Friday 02 December 11 13:36 GMT (UK)
Hi

I have just joined rootschat and Elias Newman was my 3x Great grandfather. I have also reached a brick wall in trying to find out who Elias's parents were. Did you have any luck, any information would be great.

Peter Newman
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Sunday 27 October 19 19:26 GMT (UK)
Does anyone have the death date for Streeter Morris Newman, born 22 Nov 1868? I know he was alive until 1904 because he is listed in the Electoral Registers. I have nothing after that date.

Thanks,
Kathy Kennard
[email protected]
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: chempat on Monday 28 October 19 18:09 GMT (UK)
Reply 11 has
Marine deaths
Streeter Morris Newman    Age 35    Ship = Rosegrove      Year 1903   Page 200

The electoral registers take time to be compiled and printed, so people can easily be in them after they have died.
Title: Re: streeter morris newman
Post by: diroka on Friday 08 November 19 18:27 GMT (UK)
Thank you. I used to have the newspaper article for his father, also named Streeter Morris Newman, when he also died in a marine death. He died Dec 1873.  It stated something about the shipwreck and some survived. I can no longer find the article. Can anyone tell me where to find it?
Thank you,
Kathy