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Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: craizi daizi on Monday 29 December 08 22:40 GMT (UK)
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Hi all
This is a REALLY bad copy of a death cert, but am trying to figure out where the birth place is.....
I think it says something ? Hill....maybe
Daizi
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Have to say hard to read but something Hill perhaps Coburg Hill ???
on the indexs says his birth place is London
Jenn
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To me it looks like Goburg Hill, England.
Arthur Prust died 1950 aged 72 ......... so was born around 1878.
Free BMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl
Search for Arthur Prust born between 1870 to 1885 brings up only one result.
Medway is in the county of Kent. If you click the word Medway you can find out more information about the districts in Kent.
Cheers, Red
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Daizi
I had a look at the census records and there appears to be only 1 Arthur Prust says born Bethnal Green or Hackney which I think are in the same district of London, but don't quote me on that.
The father's name is William and the mother is Laura
Also checked family trees on A...y and this is confusing for Arthur PRust born 1879c in Bethnal Green/Hackney a couple have him dying in 1950 at Ringood NSW another dying in 1936 in Hackney England and another one showing him on the 1911 cenus in England as an engineer which if that is the case it cannot be the same ARthur Prust. very confusing.
Daizi may be a copy of his wedding certificate in Australia might reveal more, after all he has supplied the information.
Jenn
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Hi All
Related link of Daizi's
I had a look at the census records and there appears to be only 1 Arthur Prust says born Bethnal Green or Hackney which I think are in the same district of London, but don't quote me on that.
The father's name is William and the mother is Laura
Jenn [/i] http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,348694.0.html
Sue
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Yes thats the problem Jen, thats the only one on there, and is the wrong one..... :'(
My one says (on death cert) that he had been in Aus for 63 years ...so if born abt 1878ish, would only be on 1881, cant find any shipping records coming to OZ for him ( must have arrived abt 8 / 9 years old so doubt alone....so trying to figure out details from death and marriage to find this man.....he will be the death of me...
Daizi
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Redmr2red
Thanks will google that place and see where it is...
Thanks
Sparrett - Didnt mean to cross / confuse posts, just wanted the place name ...lol
Daizi
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May I ask how you know that the Arthur, of 1881 census, is the wrong one?
I notice that on that census, Arthur has a sister Alice. On his death cert he has a daughter Alice. Not a connection?
Where does it say he was born on his marriage cert?
J.
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Jamjar
I know because i have his birth cert and had been following THAT family THAT Arthur is still in London in 1911 (census) and dies abt 1956 - unmarried = whilst MY Arthur is in OZ married in 1905 and died 1950 in Victoria
Also on his marriage cert in OZ he gives different parents names - NOT William and Laura
Daizi
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Daizi
what names does he give for his parents please
Jenn
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Daizi, if you are trying to find the name of a place in England, you might be better off posting the image on the England board.
It does look like *oburg Hill England. I thought that *obury Hill sounded more "English" but the last letter looks like the other 'g's' on the page. It certainly may be the same of a 'suburb' rather than a town or village. Person writing the word may also have misheard the place name. I certainly have slightly incorrect names on d/c's.
I take it that you have also searched for variations of that surname when searching for shipping records - it looks like a prime candidate for a mistranscription. Have you checked for his arrival in other states?
Sorry didn't read the link to your other thread so ignore me if I'm covering old ground .... ;)
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Sorry Jen
Marriage certs states he was born in West London, parents William Prust - deceased and Elizabeth Prust - nee unknown
daizi
Ruskie - dont apoligise - i appreciate ANY input
Daizi
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Thank you,
I've now read your other, linked post.
J.
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I was wondering if the family may have settled in NZ first. That would account for them not being on the 1881 census.
Some of my ancestors did this and there is no record of them coming into Australia, but they did.
Do you have his parents' death certificates?
J.
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Jamjar
This is what we are trying to do....find his parents, or any thing about him, all we know is what is on the certs....
Daizi
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Sorry, I'm a tad old and slow.
I haven't looked at BDM, Victoria, yet. I was thinking that Prust is an unusual name so if they came here when Arthur was a lad, and his father was deceased at the time of his marriage, his father's death would be on BDM. If they died in Victoria, the death cert would list the children's names etc.
J.
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Jam
I have checked , rechecked , and again gone over the indexs, and can find nothing of his parents, and as Arthur and his wife only had 3 children, and only 1 of them married and had a family, there is probably no-one else looking at this line, so , is all a bit of a mystery
Daizi
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As you asked for any input :)
Place; JOHNS HIll ( think the letter under is confusing it)
There is a St. Johns Hill in London
Agree that 63 yrs in Victoria does not mean they were elsewhere before.
Arthur could have been the name he was known as, and could have been something like George Arthur Prust or even PROUST.
Trish
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Morning Trish,
Yes always after ANY input......St Johns Hills sounds good, i did google the other suggestions (Gobury Hill etc ) and nothing came up.
I have trawled :D the indexs from 1875 - 1880 and couldnt see any births for Arthur Prust (other than the Arthur Watson PRUST) or any with middle name Prust hmmmm
BUT did fond and Arthur PRUSE ?? b 1878 in Selby - but that seems to be down Yorkshire area
Daizi
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Hi Daizi,
Boy :P is he hard to find.
Have to go off line now, but found this one so maybe someone can check thru census to confirm/eliminate.
George Charles .A. Prust,
June 1877
Medway 2a 461 ( in kent)
Also a few, not many, Prust BMD in NSW worth looking at.
Mariners site has a Mrs PrOust and 2 children sailing between Victoria and Sydney on" Rotondo "1880.
Sorry to throw this in and run,
Cheers,
Trish
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Thanks Trish
Will look into it
Daizi
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OK
Looked at the NSW BDM's - been there before, but double checked, they are all cousins of the Arthur Watson PRUSTs - have them all in my OLD :'( tree
There are 1 or 2 Prusts on the early Vic Indexs i cant place, - maybe related to my new lot.....time will tell
Daizi
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Just signed back in as 'googled' prust genealogy and found this
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Home: Surnames: Prust Family Genealogy Forum
Hello all
I am looking for information and descendents of PRUST So far i have gone back only as far as William Edward Pascoe PRUST b abt 1841 and died in 1925 in Hackney, - who married Laura Elis in 1861s in Shoreditch, London
His children were William, Alice, David, Louisa, Arthur, Fred and John. Arthur (Watson Prust b abt 1878 and died 1950abt in Australia - married Elizabeth Christie, Arthur and Elizabeth had 3 children Alice , Henry and Arthur....
Hoping someone out there can help
Belinda
From genoforum genealogy.com.
There are a few replies to this.
Got to go now,
trish
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hey Trish
Thats ME ...LOL when i thought i had the right family...alas...... :-\
daizi
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Daizi
you no doubt have noticed this in your trawlings
there is an Elizabeth Prust marrrying an Arthur Kimber in 1911 birth place england
now when she dies in 1965 aged 88 parents Prust unknown and mother unknown
same time frame as your Arthur a coincidence? totally unrelated?
Jenn
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Hi JEnn
She is one of the Prusts on the index that i cant place, also an Esther (i think) but is hard to say if related as no one gives parents names....lol
I have just found a person on GR who is doing the Christie line and sent a msg, (Arthurs wife) but not sure if it will help with Arthur as when i crossed searched she dosnt seem to come up a match for Arthur
Fingers crossed........ ::)
And also thanks for all your help....
This man is doin' my head in, i have trawled census records BDM's etc he just seems to arrive at the church to get married !
Daizi
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Do you know that on the early electorall rolls he was a florist
Jenn
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I think that was on a previous thread Jenn
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,313558.0.html
Cheers
Cando
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Hi Guys, am so sorry to have mixed all the threads up.... :-\
Yes i am aware Arthur was a Florist, it changes from Florist / Farmer and i think at 1 stage he is a labourer
Once again i am sorry these are all mixed up, i originally posted this post to get the name from cert...lol
Any way all info is great and welcomed with open arms......
Daizi
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Hmm I have just spent a couple of hours on Arthur (so to speak - LOL). On Ancestry census entries I looked at all 2000 Arthurs shown who were born in London 2 years either side of 1878 but there is nothing I can find that fits your Arthur. I looked at any with parents William and Elizabeth and any boarding or visiting anywhere. It wasn't too onerous a task as there were many who could be immediately eliminated.
I also looked up the shipping for the Esther Prust who arrived in Melb in 1887. She was aged 14 and listed as a servant. Because she was an unassisted immigrant I would have thought she may have accompanied her master/mistress but it wasn't possible to see who she came with (if anyone) as she was just listed among a whole lot of similar occupations.
I wonder if she is the sister of your Arthur - she is invisble on the 1881 census as well! Now, there is a freebmd entry for an Esther Prust born 1870, registered in Kensington district which could be the same one who came in 1887 - I can't imagine the ages given in shipping records are all that accurate! Esther Prust's place of birth according to the Vic reg index is given as London.
Have another look at the d. cert you have - it COULD possibly be Notting Hill that is given as the birthplace?? Notting Hill is definitely in the Kensington reg district.
There is another factor to consider here - if Arthur was so young when he came I would think his own knowledge of where he was born could be fairly sketchy.
As well as that there is the notoriously poor transcriptions of the census on Ancestry - my Newman family are indexed as Rehmann.
You have really got me intrigued, Daizi!!!! Cheers, Judith
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Oh Jud
Thanks you so much....you have out done your self, i also have looked, trawled, pulled my hair out over this man in the last few week - the last few years we thought we had him sorted....1911 census >:(, wonder if it was better to be in the dark......There was talk in the family of an adoption, as i said earlier, am wondering if it may have been our Arthur and maybe we never know any more ??
Whos bright idea was this genealogy stuff any way !! ;)
But once again Jud you are a champ, and i am also intrigued / peeved ?
Daizi
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Hi Daizi,
As to my posting re YOUR Tree :-[ :-[ :-[
I too have gone through several thousand possible postings
like Judith :)
My gosh he is frustrating ;D
Trish
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Putting my twopenn'th in I would say the poor handwriting does actually read Notting Hill which would fit your West London link
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Oh sorry i know Trish...you all are great., and as you will see i have been posting for a long time on this family.....
So i do thank you ALL
Hi Siegal, Ok Notting Hill., i think some one found an Arthur from near there., will have to go back over the posts...lol
Thanks for that
Daizi
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Hi
In your previous topic you mention adoption, is it possible that Arthur was adopted and that Prust was not his birth name.?
Andy
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I had downloaded the death certificate and just had a microspoic look AGAIN and it is possible it could be maybe Notting Hill I noted the person filling out the form hasn't crossed any T but then again we are all assuming an area of London, based on his marriage information.
Jenn
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Hi Jen
Yes i had another look too, and it may well be, the man ' A Worrell ' who was the registered informant - i have no idea who he is, but am gathering the wife Elizabeth gave the info......
I had a phone call back from the funeral directors and they had disposed of all the records pre 1970... >:( so no clues there.
Well if this Esther (on the indexes) was born Kennsington - and apparently Notting Hill is close, i wonder if i should get her birth cert, although they dont have all the details that OZ certs have - like other kids ect .....soory thinking aloud here - have also checked the indexs many times for NSW - SA - WA - Tassie - QLD even Northern Territory and nothing, seems Prusts were mostly in Victoria (although only a couple) and a sprinkling in NSW - but i can account for all them........
ahhhh atleast the rain is here for a moment and cooling the house, maybe my brain might work better
Thanks all
Daizi
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and a very welcoming drop of rain it is too, ahh thats so lovely for a short while that is.
Daizi
going back to the marriage please, can you tell us who the witness's were.
Jenn
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Hi Jenn
OOPS sorry - carried away with the rain, NOW the marriage, it seems 1 of the witness's may be some one to do with the place they married (as in on a few of the certs as a witness) and the other " looks like " ? W J McClea ? or ? i will attach to this post hang on....lol
Daizi
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Hi Daizi,
It looks like Ringwood to me, does that fit?
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Have to agree with you Daizi
W J McCLea and the other is no doubt the wife or sister of the minister
I see it does state his father is deceased, so was the William Prust on the 1911 census Daizi?
So he was also old enough to have been registered to vote in 1903 but he doesn't appear to be on the rolls.
Jenn
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Hi and Welcome Kate
Sorry but am a bit confused - easily done, does what say Ringwood ?
Daizi
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Hi Jen
Much MORE than a drop of rain here in town.... ;)
Now, the Arthur in 1911 (parents William and Laura) that Arthur never married and died in 1956 (?) if i remember correctly,
Is that what you meant ? sorry
Daizi
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no actually meant was the father William listed on the 1911 census please
Jenn
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Well, well
I see the William Prust and Elizabeth Hudson marriage on Free BMD, 1874, was registered in Kensington also, although the marriage is later than Esther Prust's birth. A long shot but possibly a connection of some kind!
Cheers, Judith. (I have just had a look on IGI - boy there are a gazillion Prust families in Devon - you'd never be able to work them out!)
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Sorry should have thought of this to go in the one before. The A Worral who is the Informant on the death cert is the funeral director - his address is the same as the funeral parlour in the funeral notice. it is the registrar who has the appalling writing - anf poor quality ink LOL
Judith
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Hi,
Read through some of posting but not all. Think it reads NOTTING HILL LONDON an area west of central London.
John
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Hi,
Having read through thoroughly see Notting Hill was mentioned before. However, have found an ARTUR WATSON PRUST SEPT 1/4 1879 BETHNAL GREEN 1C 197. He is on freebmd as PRUET and as a****y take their details from freebmd he appears there in that name also.
Not sure if this helps or not as cannot find any Arthur Pruets on census returns.
John
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igi shows an ARTHUR WATSON PRUST Born 8.8.1879 bethnal green the son of WWILLIAM EDWARD PASCOE PRUST AND LAURA ELLIS.
jOHN
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Hi,
Feel a complete !!!!!. id not see your other posting re Arthur and all the previous details. Sorry to waste anyones time.
John
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HI John
And thanks for your imput, dont feel like that, i followed the wrong line for a few years.....
Daizi
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I am sure there is a Box Hill in London, so is my husband???
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Hi,
I think your mysterious name is Notting Hill, a district of London.
Regards
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Box Hill is in Surrey not too far from Reigate