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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Antrim => Topic started by: dwrcrawford on Wednesday 07 January 09 19:25 GMT (UK)
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I am hoping that someone can help with finding my 18th century ancestors.
My G/G/G Grandfather Robert Crawford b.05.04.1791 d.12.12.1874 from Clough (Ballycraigagh) was married to Ann Strahan b.12.11.1786 d. @Dec 1848.
I have been to Clough graveyard and found their childrens graves (2 of their sons are ancestors) but crucially not their graves.
My feeling/hope is Ann would have been buried in her family graveyard with her parents. Following this Robert would have been placed with her when he passed on in 1874.
Does anyone know of a way to locate their resting place?
Happy new year, and thanks for any help.
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Hello - Just posting some information on my database and checking Strahan names on internet when I noticed your connection of Ann & Mary Strahan. Ann Strahan certainly fits with your information except Robert Crawford's birthdate is given as 5 Apr 1781 ( I have no clue whether this is right or not) and I have a Mary Strahan being married to Daniel McKay - her birthdate is given as 1812. I am trying to confirm the names of the parents of Ann and Mary Strahan. I am finding my info hard to follow. Mary and Daniel had daughter Jane who married Robert Aicken.
Any Strahan information much appreciated. I am trying to build our Northern Ireland Strahan line. Cheers
Lyn
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Hi Lyn42
Daniel McKay and Mary Strahan were my gt gt gt grandparents but they married in 1833 so no marriage certificate is available. From family information I understand that Mary's brother Samuel Strahan married Mary Hyndman in Ballymena in 1848, so I ordered a photocopy of their marriage certiciate and it gives his father's name also as Samuel of Rathkenny. He is likely to be the Samuel Strahan of Rathkenny in the 1851 census whose wfe Mary is shown as having died in Spring 1846.
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Hello
Thanks for your prompt reply. This is certainly the line I am trying to sort out. On the database I have there seems to be a mixup with the Samuel Strahan and confusion reigns or it does with me anyway and I am trying to get my head around it.
The Samuel and Mary (they have Samuel's death date as 25 Jan 1855) and quote Samuel of Dunbought but for Mary Strahan who married Daniel McKay it looks like they have parents as Samuel Strahan of Rathkenny who married Jean Martin.
Can you enlighten me - much appreciated.
Lyn
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It is my belief that Daniel McKays mother was Jean Martin....not Mary Strahans. I have Samuel Strahan married to Mary McIntyre b1794 d1846
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Hello again. You may have solved a very big mystery for us.. Thank you very much.
The naming patterns make it very hard to follow at times.
This is not my direct line - my Strahans coming from Armagh but another friend here in West Australia is from the Antrim line and I am trying to help her sort her line.
It is the early Strahans that we have trouble with. If I can be of assistance with any Strahan information I am happy to help. There are many Crawford's mentioned in the info I have just been given.
Cheers
Lyn
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HI. thanks for the offer. I'm assuming you have just been given something from Mr Kane. We have been in contact in the past with regards to this line...(I think I'm correct in that we are 4th cousins)...the mckay line and the crawford line intertwine regularly, as do the strahans and alexanders. Basically i think there were only 4 families in Clough at that time :) and they all intermarry.
Going back to your earliest message...
Ann Strahan is Samuel Strahans sister....therefore Mary Strahans aunt.
I have nothing but guesswork beyond this. For some reason I have taken a guess at Anns father being a John Straghorn but i dont remember why> possibly his name is on a census or griffiths valuation for the ballycraigagh area.
I would love to find their graves but was disappointed to discover they werent in Clough graveyard when i went hunting there at xmas...Daniel and Mary (Strahan) McKay are there and have a very fine monument to them and their family.
Does anyone know if there is another graveyard in the general vicinity which would have been in use around 1850s as I think this is where Ann Strahan, Robert Crawford, Samuel Strahan etc may all rest?
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Hello,
Try the History from Headstones website. I think I found Robert and Ann's headstone inscription there.
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amazing. can you give me the Graveyard Name, Civil Parish, Town/townland your search thru up so i can purchase some credit and get the right one to view. Thanks.
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I think, it's in Dunaghy Old graveyard.
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Just wanted to post a public thanks to SIMW who has directed me to the info. Apparently it was were i thought it should be but the gravestone has been laid flat...definitely going to have a look next time i get home to NI.
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???
Well, well, well, why haven't I found you sooner, and I think I may recognize a contributor or two! I, too, am seeking to place my surname ancestor, who is an immigrant to the United States from Co. Antrim 1800-1803, a James Strahan b. 1777, who married an Ann Jane Blair in Donegore Seceder (sp?) Church ca 1800, dau of Hugh Blair and Jane Thompson. I've been working on this ca 39 years, and have corresponded with a number of researchers over the years and am finally getting around to trying to sort out conflicting reports of wives and relationships and to pin down places and times of events and if possibly to find the 'bones.'
There are several comments by several persons in this exchange that I would love to jump in on, but I'll try to take one at a time.
Like others of you have various Samuels with various wives and sometimes the same Samuel with different reported wives:
1) there's the Samuel who is the freeholder in Rathkenny/Skerry in 1776 who may be the Samuel married to Jean Martin's father (the birth order and naming of the Sam married to Jean Martin's children would suggest that his father was a Samuel)—this is the Sam w/ the sister Ann married to Robert Crawford and the daughter Mary married to a Daniel McKay;
2) one researcher held that there was a Samuel in Lisnacrogher (Rathkenny?) who was a brother of George d.1784 Lisnacrogher and that this Samuel had three sons—a James, a George, and another Samuel, the Samuel of Rathkenny married to Jean Martin. Apparently Ann married to Robert Crawford would have been their sister. [I think there may have been another son John] Does anyone out there know anything about a James Strahan and John Strahan, farmers in Inshamph in 1783? I have wondered if these could be sons of the Samuel who is in Rathkenny in 1776.
3) then there is Samuel and Jean Martin's son Samuel married to Mary Hyndman, who is also a Sam of Rathkenny.
4) the there's a Samuel of Syndenham, Co. Down, who dies 1889 and is an executor for another of Sam married to Jean Martin's sons;
5) and there's this Samuel of Dunbought or Clough, depending on researcher, who is married either to a Sarah Mary Alexander or a Mary Brown or both [grandson born in US is Samuel Brown Strahan]—depending on researcher this Samuel is either s/o George d.1784 Lisnacrogher son James or the brother Samuel's son James or the son of an Alexander born 1750 Aberdeen.
So my question does anyone out there has dates for any of these Sam Strahans and/or their spouses?
I can report that both a child of Samuel married to Jean b. 1822 Rathkenny and a child b. 1825 Dunbought/Clough of Samuel of Dunbought/Clough married to Mary Brown/Sarah Mary Alexander in the 1880 census report that they and both of their parents were born in Scotland! So presumeably none of them were in Co. Antrim in 1776!
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wow....i've had to print out your last post Yodi to try to make head or tail of it. and i'm still a bit flummoxed. I think you've mistakenly named samuel strahan as married to Jean Martins father....which i think you'd agree is wrong on several counts. I wonder if you'd possibly re-read your message and edit it if possible where necessary to clarify who you're talking about. (the Jean Martin example i've just cited isnt the only one i'm afraid which has me confused.) Sorry about that! but i think the info you are providing is going to be extremely useful to me but at the moment i am stuck!
:)
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I have looked on my tree and found the Samuel Strahan (b1823 d1888) & Mary Hyndman branch.
I have Samuels parents as being Samuel Strahan b c1790 d 1855 and Mary McIntyre b c1794 d 1846
Samuel Strahan (b1790 d1855) is Ann Strahan's brother. Ann Strahan b1786 d1848 married Robert Crawford.
I dont believe Jean Martin was anything to do with the Strahans. As far as I know she married a McCay...and they produced Daniel McCay who married Mary Strahan (the daughter of Samuel & Mary McIntyre)
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Thank you for getting back.....I am very very puzzled by all of these Samuels and differing spouses. I received the information re the Jean Martin from a long time researcher in a family descended from their son Andrew, whose wedding was performed in NYC by my Strachan/Strahan immigrant's nephew-in-law the Rev. Hugh Henry Blair. She's quite definite about Jean being wife of Andrew's father and would support it with Martin being a given name among the grandchildren of the couple as in Thomas Martin Strahan's being a son of John the Builder d. 1892 Belfast?
I'm wondering if Jean Martin could have married twice or Samuel married twice—once to a Mary McIntyre and once to Jean. She also has same born ca 1750 and start family after age 60, so he might have been previously married, which another son of John the Builder says happened to his father (and I think he meant his grandfather)
Do you have any dates on the Sam married to Mary McIntyre?
I'm also wondering if this Sam is s/o a Sam who is a freeholder in Rathkenny in 1776 and if he may have been married to Mary McIntyre.
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Hi Cousins
According to the information I have Jean Martin was definitely the mother of Daniel McCay who married Mary Strahan. This came from a typewritten family tree which another cousin gave my mother several years ago. Of course as we are descended from both the McCays and Strahans someone may have got the grandmothers mixed up years ago and, once written down it, any mistake would be perpetuated. I have certainly not seen any original documentary evidence that Daniel mother was Jean Martin. I have however seen the 1851 census transcript for Daniel's father in law, Samuel Strahan, which shows his wife was called Mary, not Jean.
1851 Census Returns of Ireland Co Antrim - Dunaghy Parish - Donbought Townland
19. SAMUEL STRAGHAN, 60 (Head) [Widower] - FARMER (Antrim) (R/W)
SARAH STRAGHAN, 30 (Daughter) [Unmarried] - HOUSEWORK (Antrim) (R)
JOHN McCALISTER, 20 (Servant) [Unmarried] - LABOURER (Antrim)
Absent from Household 30th March 1851:
MARGARET STRAGHAN, 23 (Daughter) - NONE {America}
Died Since 6th June 1841:
MARY STRAGHAN, 52 (Wife) - NONE - Inflamation - Spring 1846
I will have a good look at Yodis information and try to fit it together which what I have.
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Trouble with replies is that I can't look at your message as I write.
I think other researchers have Samuel of Dunbought married to Mary Brown or Sarah Mary Brown because her grandson is Samuel Brown Strahan by James Alexander Strahan and neither his wife's mother's maiden name nor his mother's mother maiden name was Brown.
If you look at the census for Daniel McCay the name of his second daughter is Mary not Jean. .
My guess is that the Mary McIntyre was his mother and Jean Martin was Mary's mother as the oldest daughter is a Jane.
At least so far as I understand naming practices, this explanation would make sense: 'tis Mary McIntyre or some Mary was Daniel's mother and some Jean/Jane Mary's mother.
It's really easy to interchange the names especially if you are not looking at the whole family group. . . .
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Trouble with replies is that I can't look at your message as I write.
All previous posts are shown underneath the reply message box, just scroll down a bit! :)
Alan NZ
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I'm back . . . another Crawford/Strahan matter:
my surname immigrant to USA is found in 1820 Fed Census and 1825 Illinois census with a William B. Crawford living next door born ca 1772 Scotland. His son Blair Strahan is still living next door to a William B. Crawford, the grandson, in 1870. This is in Randolph Co., Illinois, and a family file for this Crawford family is to be found at familysearch.com.
Now my immigrant and his siblings and possibly his parents immigranted from Co. Antrim and we have reason to believe that his father was a cousin to Sam of Rathkenny married to (thought to be) Jean Martin. AND all kinds of people from Co. Antrim reunited with folks from Co Antrim in that community in Illinois—and they came to Illinois via Virginia, Tennessee, South Carolina, Pennsylvania...
Now we have this Crawford family stuck side by side with us for the good part of a century—and it is supposed to be from Dreghorn and Irvine in Ayrshire. The first William B.'s father is supposed to have been William Crawford b. 1772 married Helen Beveradge [sic] m. 21 May 1796 in Dreghorn and buried in the Old Cemetery Irvine. She is buried in the Caledonia Cemetery, Sparta, Illinois They had fourteen children, the oldest of which is a Andrew b. 1797 then a David b. 1799. . . Most of them died in Scotland. The third son John died in Havana. The younger children died in the USA in Illinois or Kansas and include a Bryce Crawford.
Now I know from Bryson research that some Brysons who came to this country from Co. Antrim and Co. Down had actually been born in Scotland around the same time.
So my question is do you know if any of your Crawfords had family members in Dreghorn or Irvine, Ayershire? Do you have an idea of when your Crawfords came to Co. Antrim?
I'm inclinded to think that these families in Randolph County had known each other in either Ireland or Scotland.
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Hi again Yodi,
well your info is very interesting indeed and would be great if it was only 1770s when Crawfords came to Antrim cos we'd have half a chance of tracing them with scottish records.
As you know already my ancestors relating to you are "Robert Crawford and Ann Strahan" and "Daniel McCay and Mary Strahan".
Robert was born in Co. Antrim (presumably Ballycraigagh) around 1790s.
Robert Crawfords farm was in Ballycraigagh (near Clough, Antrim). Robert and loads of his descendants are buried in the nearby cemetery known as Dunaghy Old.
2 pieces of circumstantial evidence I have relate to these 2 facts.
1. On June 1st 1776 the freeholders list found on the PRONI website details a Matthew Crawford as the head of household in Ballycraigagh.
2. There are some old headstones in Dunaghy Old one of which was for John Crawford of the colliery. He died aged 49 in 1769. There is a family crest on the headstone and a coat of arms. I researched this particular coat of arms and it is for the Crawfords of Kilburnie in Scotland.
It's my belief that the Crawford family in Clough would have originally come from there.
That is not to say they couldnt have come via Irvine. It's possible so my question to you is have you any idea of the ancestors of William B Crawford? maybe a baptismal record which one could then trace any other children of those parents...would be nice if they had children called Robert, Matthew and John as well as William.
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Although I have often used them as a starting point, basing your assumption of parent's names on usual naming patterns seems a weak argument against an established family tradition. This is especially the case when the second son is named for the maternal grandfather and none of the 4 sons bear their father's name, as with Daniel and Mary's family.
In addition, Mary is noted in some places as "Mary McIntyre Strahan" so the McIntyre name clearly comes from the Strahan, not McCay, side. Of course naming a child after an unrelated friend or neighbour also happened - causing much confusion to later generations as I've found before. The middle name "Brown" is also found recurring in one of my lines and it took me years to discover the original "Brown" in my line was named after his mother's brother in law!
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Hello All,
It's been many years since there was any activity on this subject so I know this is a long shot.
I have several Strahan (along with half a dozen spelling variations) which have come up as DNA matches. They all come back to Samuel and sister Ann (wife of Robt Crawford Ballycregagh).
I've done a lot of work on this, but have hit a brick wall.
RE: Samuel Strahan b ca 1790 and Mary McIntyre.
I have a Jane Strahan b ca 1821 died 1893 Ballymena RD who married Robert Buick. Her husband Robert, Craigs farmer, has a will on PRONI site 14 Jan 1886.
Is there a researcher out there who can confirm Jane (noting source) as a daughter of Samuel/Mary?
Any assistance is appreciated.
Genedigger