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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Clackmannanshire => Topic started by: Hermit73 on Friday 23 January 09 20:24 GMT (UK)
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Hi,
If anyone happens to be going to Alloa Greenside cemetery, I'd love to know if there is a stone in plot:150 - Section C . I'm looking for a David S Bonthrone, buried 12th April 1909.
Thanks v. much
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Hi,
According to Clackmannanshire M.I. there doesn't appear to be a gravestone in Greenside Cemetery containing the Bonthrone name. The name Bonthrone isn't listed at all in the book.
Jim
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That is strange, Jim.
It was the clacks cemeteries dept that gave me the burial info! Thanks for checking for me anyway.
Hermit.
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Hi,
According to Clackmannanshire M.I. listings no.150 in Greenside Cemetery, which I presume, to be the plot number, is occupied by the families Gibson and Vance.
Jim
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That is strange. I have double-checked my email from landserv, and it says
David Stage Bonthron in Greenside Cemetery Lair No 150 Section C
ErrorSPAM
REPORT THIS POST AS SPAM (Use 'Report to Moderator'). DO NOT CLICK ON ANY LINKS IN THIS POST. DO NOT REPLY TO THIS PERSON.
][/color]. I'll need to get back in touch with them and ask them to check again.
Thanks Jim.
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I think there might be some confusion here between the lair number and the numbering system used in the Mitchell's MI book. As far as I know, that system bears no relation to the lair number but is simply a key to use in conjunction with their location maps. Also, as the Mitchell's only recorded MI relating to pre-1855 events, your Bonthrone stone, if it exists, wouldn't be listed.
Hoe this helps to clarify, unfortunately I won't be going anywhere near the area soon so I can't help with your look-up.
Joyce
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Aha, that makes sense Joyce.
I'll just keep the request here in case someone local happens by.
Thanks :)
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Hi Hermit
Did Clacks Council give you a map? or directions inside?
Am in Alloa once or twice a week so could go look, but need to know where plot and sections are - it's quite big and I've never been inside.
Buzzy frae Alva
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Hi Buzzy,
That would be fantastic. No, they didn't give me any idea how the plots are laid out. I'll email them tonight and see if I can get some more info, & let u know.
Thanx,
Hermit.
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Hi,
I got a reply from landserv.
They say you'll need to go to the glass-fronted building in front of Tesco to get the cemetery key, and if you ring them a bit before you arrive Nancy will have the section of the lair map copied for you.
If you need it, I can PM you Nancy's number. Hope this isn't too much hassle.
Thanks ;D
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Hi Hermit
Fine - that is Kilncraigs, a former textile mill which got an award when it was renovated a few years ago. Silly me, I was thinking of Sunnyside Cemetery! Greenside is very old and much smaller, have only seen it from a meeting room in Kilncraigs, so that will be interesting to get a close-up.
Clackmannanshire's main contribution to Homecoming Scotland 2009 (www.homecomingscotland2009.com) is to be an art installation there.
Council will be closed at weekend, so I'll phone on Monday although can't go until Wednesday, hopefully with spouse who is a more competent photographer.
Will be in touch when mission accomplished.
Buzzy
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Hi Hermit
No joy as yet, sorry - I did go that Wed, got a clear map from Nancy Smith, but couldn't locate stone, let alone plot. Nothing obvious - if you have any other names connected to BONTHRONE, that might be helpful.
So I have emailed NS asking if she can give me names on surrounding stones and/or at ends of rows of plot 150, alternatively if she prefers me to have another look see and instead give her names on exisiting stones so that I get lair nmbers from her and than work out location. Will let you know when I hear more.
Sad to see so many toppled stones, I was hoping that 1909 inscription would still be standing, altho lair records of course doesn't necessarily mean his death recorded on a gravestone. I had an interesting tramp about, and a look at the older bit of kirkyard (behind photographer, by old kirk) and it was interesting to see that the backs of gravestones in that enclosure commonly noted how many lairs, deep-cut inscription and v visible.
Meantime, first photo (1294) is taken about 100 yards after the wide entrance to graveyard, looking vaguely east/ ENE: the old building straight ahead on the left is the former Kilncraigs Mill, now Council offices. You'll see a rough V-shaped path in middle of photo: look to the right and see light/ wear shining on a pale pink granite tall stone with a cross on top/ approx in the bottom left hand window of the yucky '60s/ '70s white building right. Lair 150 should be behind that.
2nd photo, 1295, is taken looking in the opposite direction. If you go follow muddy grass path up the left of this photo, past a wee white gravestone with red&white flowers, then a pediment on its right, then next you will see that tall pink granite again (its cross not in this photo). (Just trying to get orientated!). Towards the middle of the photo, you'll see the base of a stone with two rusty spokes out top of it. I reckon your BONTHRONE is buried approx to right & front of that.
Will be in touch when I hear more.
Best wishes, Alvagirl (Buzzy)
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Photos
Hermit, please send PM (personal message) with your addy - rootschat not liking my big files!!
Alvagirl
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Hi Buzzy,
I'm looking forward to seeing your pics. It's a shame that the cemetery is so difficult to search, but thanks so much for your efforts.
will email u...
Extra info.... David Stage Bonthrone 1818 - 1909, died in Marchglen.
Spouse Jane Goodall 1820 - 1868, died in Marchglen,
children:
Margaret Jane Goodall Bonthrone 1850 - 1940 (unmarried);
Jane/Jean 1852 - 1939 (unmarried);
Andrew 1855 - 1919;
John 1857 - 1860;
Elizabeth/Lizzie 1859 - 1952 (married Andrew Smith);
Mary Ann 1864 - 1865.
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Hi Hermit
Just to confirm there is no visible stone. In the 2nd photo (1295), I said I thought it was near a stone with two rusty spokes sticking out the top. Have now found out that this is lair 158 - and your lair 150 would have been to the immediate right of that. So unfortunately no visible stone, just a photo of a grassy space.
Buzzy
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Aww, thanks anyway Buzzy. It's good to know that for the future. If I win the lottery I might go around Scotland putting up all my family's missing grave stones!
Take care.
Hermit
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Hi,
I got a reply from landserv.
They say you'll need to go to the glass-fronted building in front of Tesco to get the cemetery key, and if you ring them a bit before you arrive Nancy will have the section of the lair map copied for you.
If you need it, I can PM you Nancy's number. Hope this isn't too much hassle.
Thanks ;D
I live in the US but will be passing through Alloa (home of my Scottish ancestors) later this week. I hope to have a little time for some family history research including a visit to Greenside Cemetery. Some of the above is confusing to me. I take it Tesco is a department store and I have found it's address. Is this glass-fronted building in front of Tesco "landsev" or something else? Can anyone tell how to contact Nancy by e-mail or phone? The grave location I am trying to find is from "Clackmannanshire M.I." and apparently not the physical location.
Thank you
John Donaldson
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Yes
Tesco is one of the 4 or 5 multi-nationals that we have here in a small but important town, and yep, we use a lot of glass.
Coming from the east, and going across the new Clackmannanshire Bridge, in the middle of the town, turn main left for Tesco. As you approach it, park in Tesco's but eyes immediately right for view of the old mill building with tasteful glass-fronting that is Kilncraigs. Alloa Tower is in the middle. Kilncraigs is one of the main council buildings. Services are based here & in a couple of other places.
BUt you would be much better to contact them beforehand (they don't call us 'the Wee County' for nothing).
Most graveyards are closed, and for your search it's helpful to have the map & lair numbers, you prob have to get permission & keys, so think ahead.
Nancy Smith is the most helpful council person for you in my opinion, her email is nsmith[at]clacks.gov.uk, the tel area code in UK is (01259) and her no. is 452611. She works part time, so get your skates on!. If no joy, go to www.clacksweb.co.uk, or phone their main tel no.
Sorry but I am away from home when you visit - but I do urge you to be prepared - if you now give Nancy's email a note of who you are looking for when, I'm sure she will be as helpful as poss.
PLEASE LOOK OUT all the info you have before any of the above - Clacks MIs - what on earth source would this be? Do give N as many details as poss as could save your time in yr fleeting visit. LOL - they don't come of the shelf - LOL.
Hey, you would be better staying longer in Clacks & eg taking one of our "Meet the Ancestors" tours in Clacks . . .
Happy hunting
Alvagirl
Moderator Comment: e-mail edited, to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please replace [at] with @
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Hi Alvagirl:
Thanks for your prompt and very helpful reply.
I did e-mail Nancy right away so everything should be setup by the time I get to Alloa.
Monumental Inscriptions (Pre 1865) In Clackmannanshire compiled by John and Sheila Mitchell for the Scottish Genealogical Society. It was referenced earlier in this thread.
We are going to Scotland for my niece's wedding. I have never been to Scotland before so I am trying to see as much of your country as possible while there and every once in a while sneak in a little family research. :)
Once I get better organized there is always a chance for a dedicated research trip.
John
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From the date you are looking for I would be surprised if your ancestor is buried in Greenside Cemetery. This is an ancient churchyard dating from the 1700's. It would seem more likely they are buried in Sunnyside Cemetery especially when you have plot numbers and section numbers which is a more modern idea of burials.
The Clackmannan Person
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Thanks for that suggestion, The Clackmannan Person, it makes a lot of sense. I'll make a note of it on David Bonthrone's profile. An on-going project.
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Hello Hermit73
Although I agree with The Clackmannan Person that Greenside is an old graveyard, inscriptions on stones continued until at least mid 1950s, and a David BONTHRON sure was buried there in 1909.
We really do need to look further than MIs cos not everyone could afford a gravestone - kirk session and burial records could help. Who owned the lairs? A name on a stone does not mean someone is actually buried there. (Sorry i don't know when burials ceased at Greenside).
There are two parts to Greenside Cemetery: to the west is the older one around the old kirk; to the east is the newer part which is nearer Kilncraigs. Hermit73, I think I sent you photos a few years ago of where I reckoned your DB was buried.
Burial records for Clackmannanshire (1866-2014) are now available free online at www.clacksweb.org.uk/community/burialrecords/ From this you will see, Hermit73 that a David Bonthron was buried on 12 April 1909 in New Ground, Section C, ?stone? 150, lair 1.
This is a good resource to explore.
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Yeah, that's right Alvagirl, you did send me a photo of the plot area where the stone should be. Very possibly that is the site and no stone was purchased. I think other members of the same family do have stones, in Tillicoultry graveyards, so I was hoping David did too. Frustrating when I live so far away now, but it seems like David's grave is a bit of a closed book for now. I can't find any newspaper articles about his death either, so - a dead-end for now. Thanks for your help :)
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http://www.clacksweb.org.uk/community/burialrecords/
You can search on this site for any body in any graveyard in the county and I located a D Bonthron died 1909-4-12, in Greenside, gives grave location and map of the sectors. Good hunting.
The Clackmannan Person
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http://www.clacksweb.org.uk/community/burialrecords/
You can search on this site for any body in any graveyard in the county and I located a D Bonthron died 1909-4-12, in Greenside, gives grave location and map of the sectors. Good hunting.
The Clackmannan Person
Really fantastic that the search browser is now online!! Thanks for the link to it, The Clackmannan Person! :D