RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Tipperary => Topic started by: kricha1 on Monday 02 March 09 22:37 GMT (UK)
-
Hoping someone can help me to find information on my gggrandparents John Butler & Mary (Luby) Butler. Mary Luby was born c1805 but not sure of John's DOB. They were married c1827 and had 6 children..Mary, Pierce, Julia, Margaret, John & James. I have found baptismal records for Mary (1829) & James (1838) in Bansha Parish. Unfortunately, neither record lists an address or occupation for their parents, John & Mary Butler. Family stories passed down say Mary Luby was from Clonmel & was possibly a lady in waiting or some similiar position in a household. She was shunned by her family when she married John who was Catholic. Supposedly, we are somehow connected to the Butlers of Kilkenny but not exactly sure how. It is said John was murdered, crucified to a barn door by British soldiers and this was witnessed by the family. Mary then came, as a widow, c 1840 with her six children to Ontario, Canada. I have been successful in locating several relatives in Canada & the US but really need to find our Irish roots. Thanks....Kathy
-
Hi I have a Mary Butler who married a James Maher around 1864 in Thurles Tipperery. I have absolutely no trace of Mary's family could she possibly be your Mary's daughter?
-
Have you the marriage certificate mags c will give you father's names at least
James Maher
Registration District: Thurles
Year: 1864
Volume 8 Page 570
Mary Butler
Registration District: Thurles
Year: 1864
Volume 8 Page 570
Can order marriage cert from www.groireland.ie include the registration district, year volume and page number where you can as form is not designed specifically for this information a photocopy of the cert would be best option.
Another option is to view the marriage on here
North Tipperary Genealogy Centre (http://tipperarynorth.brsgenealogy.com/quis.php?type=birth&page=0&prevStartQuery=0)
Not sure will that contain same information its a pay per view site and might save you the wait.
Ger
-
Thanks for the responses. Unfortunately, I don't think we're connected. Mary Butler (born 1829) married Michael Farrell here in Canada in 1865. I have not been able to come up with any info as to where John Butler & Mary Luby were married, or the year, but know that two of the children (oldest Mary & youngest James) were baptized in Bansha parish. Still hoping someone will be able to make a suggestion to point me in the right direction...
Kathy Butler Richards
-
Here is all of the Luby's in Griffiths Valuation
Luby Surname Griffiths South Tipp (http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=doNameSearch&familyname=luby&firstname=First+Name&baronyname=&countyname=TIPPERARY%2C+SOUTH+RIDING&unionname=&parishname=&Submit.x=43&Submit.y=13)
Luby Griffiths Valuation North Tipp (http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=doNameSearch&familyname=luby&firstname=First+Name&baronyname=&countyname=TIPPERARY%2C+NORTH+RIDING&unionname=&parishname=&Submit.x=35&Submit.y=18)
Griffiths was not a Census but more of a recording of what rents paid at the time by tenants most people at the time were tenants. Only heads of house were recorded or basically the person paying the money.
If was taken around 1851 for Tippeary but gives you some idea of the Luby name popularity.
The Tithe may also help which was a record of religious tax paid in 1820's.
Of course none of this confirms family connections but is a start.
Some of the Luby's in Griffiths are within 10miles drive of Bansha.
Ger
-
Templeneiry and Clonbulloge are the old Civil Parish names of the modern parish of Bansha/Kilmoyler.
Dara.
-
Thank you for your suggestions.....it gives me a starting point.
Merry Christmas, everyone !!!!
Kathy
-
Hello,
I am also researching the butler family. According to family information we are the Butler's from Tipperary . I am looking for any information on a Thomas Butler born ABT 1811 Ireland died 1881 in Montreal Quebec who married and Anastasia Costello. They had a son John Butler born December 25, 1827 in Ireland and died in Montreal Quebec in 1907. I would really love any help to discover the parents of Thomas Butler b abt. 1811 Ireland. This is where I hit a brick wall.
Thank you so much for any help,
Maggie
-
You may want to consider YDNA testing for your Butler line. I am one of the admins for the R-L226 haplogroup project - one of the three larger known haplogroups that are thought to be Irish. For those who can trace their lines back to Europe, 80 % list the following counties: Tipperrary, Clare, Limerick, Cork and Kerry. Another 10 % are across the rest of Ireland with another 10 % primarily in England and other parts of western Europe. We currently have 522 testers that are either confirmed or predicted to be L226. There is a very large surname cluster of related Butlers (17 testers). For their YSTR signature under L226, 100 % of this signature are Butlers and the genetic distance between these testers is classified as very closely related (200 to 400 years). These individuals all have genealogical summaries and trying to connect their lines together. To date, all these Irish Butlers only belong to this one branch which is quite unusual and no non-Butlers belong to this large surname cluster as well. Here is a high level summary of these Butler testers:
http://www.rcasey.net/DNA/R_L226/Haplotrees/L226_Home.pdf#Page=33
It is highly recommended that you start with the 67 marker test (111 markers is not needed and 37 markers is a good test but charting is not possible with 37 markers).
https://www.familytreedna.com/products/y-dna
-
Thank you . Did you have the testing done? What did it reveal? I did have my DNA tested through ancestry.ca . I am mostly Irish, secondly British and thirdly Scandinavian .
Maggie
-
Yes - I have tested YDNA extensively for my Casey line which is L226. I was the first in the world to take a Next Generation Sequence test for L226 from Full Genomes Corporation. With my test, I received 55 private YSNPs that were private only to me at first. Two years later, eight of these private YSNPs are now branches of mankind - including two branches in the genealogical time frame (this is a genetic testing term that the vast majority of testers have the same surname). Here is my part of the our L226 descendant chart:
http://www.rcasey.net/DNA/R_L226/Haplotrees/L226_Home.pdf#Page=27
I have the following brick wall my Casey line: 1) we now that this line arrived in western South Carolina in the early 1750s; 2) By 1800, there were around 50 males in the census and traditional research of South Carolina records have only revealed around 10 connections (mostly the sons of one prominent family); 3) We have been researching this line for 40 years and have been to South Carolina dozens of times (over 50 Casey researchers) with little progress on connecting our lines via traditional reserch; 4) a very poorly written manuscript in the 1960s connected all the lines which people just copy and paste - he had our South Carolina line tied to Virginia Casey lines.
Here is what we have learned to date: 1) Several of the Virginia Casey lines have been tested that are supposed to be connected - none are even remotely connected genetically to our South Carolina line - still the Internet connections remain. We now believe that our Casey family moved from Ireland in the 1740s during the massive crop failures and that they probably directly moved to western South Carolina (vs. coming earlier via Virginia); 2) Around 20 different lines have now tested - all but one line are very closely related (200 to 400 years). One line, Elisha Casey, just randomly showed up with the others - his lines have a lot recent ties to Ireland.; 3) We now have two YSNP branches that are genealogical in nature. If you test positive for FGC5647, you are related to our Casey line in the last 200 to 400 years. If you test FGC5639, you are related in the last 200 to 300 years; 4) only person has tested FGC5647 positive and FGC5639 negative. He traces his line back to Oxford, England in the early 1600s. His surname is Kersey but he is definitely Irish in the last 400 years. We believe that he moved from Ireland to England in the 1500 to 1600 year time frame and changed his surname to Kersey (an English surname) to hide his Irish ancestry; 4A) we only have 75 Casey testers from the United States - none from any of the other English colonies and no Caseys from Ireland have tested to date. I will pay for a 37 marker test for any Casey that has his Casey ancestry back to 1850 and would allow me to continue to extensively test our first Irish Casey tester.
5) We have a couple of surprise adoption/out of wedlock non-Caseys. One is a Hanvey, he already knew via YDNA testing that his line prior to 1830 all match Hanveys and all of his line post 1830s only match our Caseys. His Hanvey family also received property from a Casey probate record as well that matches the time frame of the genetic change. We also have a Meredith adopted line (living in Virginia in 1810).
6) We have a very strong YSTR branch (quite rare), half of our Casey have one value and half have another value, so we now know an early branch. I had been researching around five Casey lines in great depth (200 pages), four belonged to my STR branch but one did not belong to my branch. So, I now less interested in this fifth line but more interested in more Casey lines that are more closely related to my branch.
Eventually, we know that all 50 lines will eventually be separated over the next five to ten years. Until two years ago, L226 was my most recent YSNP branch, we just discovered our 46th branch recently and adding a new branch every couple of weeks these days. Under L226, we now have 65 NGS tests ($575 each). Around six months ago, we helped FTDNA design a L226 only SNP pack test that tests 40 branches plus another 100 YSNPs that are private or equivalent YSNPs. This test has been ordered 65 times (different lines than the NGS tests). Out of the 522 tested at 67 markers, almost 25 % have tested 40 to 45 branches. Due to this extensive testing, I can chart exactly how 80 % of these testers are connected. One-third of our L226 branches (15) are genealogically in nature (over 50 % one surname). We also know that YSNP branch Y5610 means that you are a direct descendant of King Brian Boru. We also know that L226 is Dal gCais in origin since the majority of testers have Dal gCais surnames and 80 % lived in five counties in Munster, Ireland.
-
Hi Maggie Moon, I don't know whether this will help. My great grandfather was Thomas Butler born 1866 at a farm called 'Blackstairs' Hollyford Ireland. When I googled it, I discovered that a Thomas Butler still lives there so it might well be a family name. ( Some of my relatives even visited the family). I also found some graves for Butlers nearby in the neighbouring county. It seems they have farmed there for a long time and produced lots of children who emigrated.
Do you have any more family names?
Maria
-
Hi Maria,
That is very interesting ! The names I have are Thomas Butler born abt 1811 Ireland who's son was John Butler born 1827 Ireland ( he eventually immigrated to the USA and Canada. Going back-and-forth quite a bit between the two) He married Margaret Harrington then Sarah Kane .. He had children with the two wives:
Ellen, Thomas Patric Butler, Michael , and and Bridget .
Thank you
Maggie
-
Hi Maggie,
Do you have access to roots Ireland?
I had 50 free searches when it was new. I found lots of relatives on it.
It has transcriptions from parish registers from most counties.
But now it costs.
Maria