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Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Westmeath => Topic started by: bupski on Friday 24 April 09 11:28 BST (UK)
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I am trying to trace my great great grandma elizabeth Keegan born 1864 in Kinnegad, father michael Keegan, mother esther Clarke. She married edward Walsh in 1892, she was living in Killucan at the time. I believe she is buried in the old village graveyard in Killucan. can anyone help or give me some directions?
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Hello,
I am also searching for Keegans, but I am not entirely sure if they are from Westmeath or Kildare. My relatives came to the US between 1842 and 1860 (New York) but they were Lawrence Keegan (Born ~1800) and Bridget Keegan (Born ~1810). Their children were Patrick (b1830), Lawrence (b1832), William (b1834), Margaret (b1836), Mary (b1838), and Catherine (b1842-d1933). Do any of these names sound familiar?
Thanks!
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1901 census Keegan is a James (35) Mary (28) and children Kate, Mary, Lezzie, Bridget living at 44 Kinnegad Westmeath
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Westmeath/Kinnegad/Kinnegad/1781731/
you might have to type this yourself.
cannot find anything else no Edward Clarke
Moderator Note : Link fixed
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Hi bupski,
We are related!
Michael Keegan and Esther Clarke are my ggg-grandparents through their daughter, also Esther, born in 1860. I had only done some preliminary research into them, so this information is from my notes from last year.
They were married in 1844 in Kinnegad RC parish and I have found 8 children, including your ancestor, Elizabeth (the last), in 1864. There are a good few Keegans around Kinnegad/Killucan area, so I have not definitively narrowed down our Michael Keegan's address. There are 4 possible townlands for Michael Keegan in Griffith's in the civil parish of Killucan:
Aghamore
Derrymore
Kinnegad
Riverstown
The birth certificate for Elizabeth may give us the correct townland, but I have not acquired it from the GRO yet (it's still on my todo!).
Esther, my ancestor, moved to Dublin and married a Peter Coyne, a train driver. Some of the rest seem to have ended up emigrating to Newport, Rhode Island (Francis, Margaret and Mary). I had found Elizabeth's marriage to Edward Walsh in the index, but did not get the record.
As for what happened to Michael and Esther (snr), I have some possible death records from the civil registration indexes, but have not followed up on them. Once we have the address, that may lead us to the correct graveyard.
Going back further may be possible with records from the Tithe Applotments and deducing relatives from the marriage record witnesses and children's baptisms, but it's tough to say at this point.
Sure let me know your information and see if we can piece together some more details.
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Hi bupski,
I got the civil birth record for your ancestor Elizabeth in the GRO today. It lists the address for Michael & Esther Keegan as Kinnegad. Michael was a labourer. Looks like they lived in the village and not in the surrounding countryside.
PM me if you want more details.
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Wow, I was not imagining I was going to come onto this site and find people related to me. But, Elizabeth Keegan and Edward Walsh are also my Great, Great Grandparents. I am related via their son William Walsh who is my Grandmother's father. My Grandmother moved to England with her husband in the early 1950s. This thread has given a tad more info about her I didn't know she was buried in Kilucan, so thank you very much! I know this thread is quite old, but, have either of you heard the rumour that Elizabeth was related to Molly Keegan a famous Soprano singer? My grandmother always used to say she was. We have a picture of Elizabeth Keegan and Edward Walsh if anyone is interested.
Also, I know that both Elizabeth, Edward were living in Bolton, Lancashire, England in 1901. I assume they lived there for a time for work before returning to Ireland.
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Hi,
Good to find someone else in the family! I had searched for Elizabeth and Edward Walsh in the 1901 census in Ireland but didn't find them. The fact they were in Bolton would explain why, so thanks for the information.
I would love to see the picture if possible.
We have no information on Molly Keegan. The only thing I can offer is that Elizabeth had an older sister, Mary (Molly?), born in 1858 in Killucan. I found a death certificate for her (99% sure it's the right Mary Keegan) in Newport, Rhode Island in 1947: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/F843-MS2
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Hi, don't worry about Molly Keegan, I suspect that might be unsubstantiated family legend. I would be willing to scan the photos and send them as an attachment, but, that could take a few days (another family member has them at the minute). But, if you have an Ancestry account another long lost family member has uploaded photos of Elizabeth and Edward as well as some other family members to a public family tree. If you put in Elizabeth Keegan's details into a search the right tree should appear. Hope that helps :).
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Thanks Faye, I got the pic from Ancestry. It's great to see a picture of a member of that family, as we have no contact or records of that side at all.
With regard to the Keegans, since the address for Elizabeth's birth record has them in Kinnegad, there is a Griffith's Valuation record of Michael Keegan in Kinnegad (plot 12a). Although Michael is a labourer according to the birth cert of Elizabeth, Griffiths lists him as the owner of the small plot of land ("in fee").
Have you been able to trace that family further back?
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Hi, I've been trying to trace Michael Keegan and i've found a possible birth with parents Michael Keegan and Catherine Smythe. But, there seems to be quite a few Keegans in Kinnegad, so i'm still trying to verify if that birth is correct.
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Hi Faye,
Yes, Keegan seems to be a popular name around those parts. I didn't come across the Michael Keegan/Catherine Smythe record myself (didn't see it on rootsireland anyway).
I've had success in the past deducing the correct parents based on siblings and their presence as god parents. I work about 10 mins from the National Library of Ireland, so can get the details of Elizabeth's siblings and their god parents. If there is a correlation between them and Michael Keegan's siblings (i.e. their aunts/uncles), then we may be on to something.
If you want to send on your details and we can compare notes and I can organise a trip to the library some lunch time to verify.
Thanks,
Alan.
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at family search.org irish section, births 1620 to 1881. elizabeth keegan 06 feb 1864 killucan co westmeath
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Thanks Dathai, but I already have the original cert from the GRO.
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Hi, Spuncy, I have been doing a bit of research on Esther Clarke, do you know her birth date by any chance? I'm struggling to find a birth record for her. Thanks.
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Hi Faye,
Unfortunately my search for anything related to Esther Clarke has not turned up much. Since she and Michael Keegan married in 1844, it's likely her baptism was before records began in Kinnegad. Assuming, of course, that she was born there.
I had focussed on attempting to find a civil death record for her (under Esther Keegan) in Mullingar, any time from 1864 to 1901 (she's not in the 1901 census that I could see). Unfortunately, the only record that may have matched was a "Hestor Keegan" 1813-1884. No other record seems to match in any registration district up to 1930.
If she was born in 1813, then she got married at 31 (1844) and had children until she was 51 (1864), so seems quite unlikely! Of course, her age at death could have been recorded incorrectly.
I might get that record to eliminate it from our investigations though.
One other piece of information is that Esther Clarke/Keegan's daughter, Esther (my ancestor), married in Dublin and her husband's witness was a Thomas Clarke. It could be a coincidence or this could be a cousin or relative of my Esther. Tracking back that line may shed more light on the Clarkes, potentially.
Alan.
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Ah, I see. That's probably why I am encountering the same problem.
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I’m also a descendant of Elizabeth Keegan and Edward Walsh, like Faye via their son William, my Grandfather. I can add the following updates.
The photograph of Elizabeth was scanned from a black and white copy of the original. My dad had a copy which I now have. I expect all his siblings have or had one. It was her engagement photograph.
Another sister, Ellen (1862-1937) also emigrated to Rhode Island. She married a James Leary.
There is the death of an Esther Keegan listed on familysearch.org in Rhode Island Deaths and Burials on 9 January 1892, d.o.b 1826. Her parents are listed as Patrick and Esther Clarke. Perhaps she had gone out to RI to be with her children. Unfortunately her spouse is not listed.
Molly Keegan was her married name. I don’t know which Keegan she married though. Apparently she was somewhat less than popular amongst the Walsh family due to her lack of concern when Elizabeth was very ill.
Elizabeth was buried in St. Etchen’s Church of Ireland churchyard in Killucan. All denominations were buried there at that time. I don’t know the date though.
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Hi s_p_w & Faye,
I did a little more digging with regard to the Esther Keegan death record in Rhode Island and think there's enough circumstantial evidence to conclude that this is most likely our Esther - mother to Elizabeth and my Esther.
I found a ship record for Esther Keegan, 55, housewife, Irish in July 1883 on the Phoenician from Glasgow-Derry-Galway-Boston. She arrived in Boston on the 18th of July 1883 and final destination was listed as Newport.
She was listed in various City Directories in Newport from 1884 to 1891. I cross-referenced her addresses and they also coincided with addresses of Francis Keegan and Mary Keegan. She is listed as "Mrs" until 1886, then in 1888 she is "widow". I didn't see a reference in 1887.
So we know that Michael Keegan and Esther Clarke had children called Francis, Mary and Margaret:
I investigated Francis Keegan (b. 1852) - he arrived in 1877, became a soldier in the US Army (4th Artillery L Company) in 1882 and discharged in 1887. He became a labourer and was widowed by 1905. I saw on Ancestry someone had him in the family tree and he married a Mary Fitzgibbon - presumably not the infamous Molly Keegan?
Mary (b. 1857) and Margaret (b. 1853) are in the census as laundresses.
Back to Esther. Her father is given in the Rhode Island death record as Patrick Clarke and mother also Esther. I looked at Griffith's Valuation for 1854 in Kinnegad. Michael Keegan is in 12a and Patrick Clarke is 9b, both on the Mullingar road coming from Kinnegad - next door neighbours.
Interestingly, a relation of mine told me that my grandad (brought up by his granny, Esther Keegan Coyne) used to visit relatives in Kinnegad and their house was located in that place. We had always assumed it was Murphys rather than Coynes or Keegans.
I have attempted to locate Michael Keegan's death record. I found one Michael Keegan 1807-1885 Jan-Mar that is most likely, but I will have to pop to the GRO to get it and confirm.
Thanks for all of your info.
Alan.
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Great work Spuncy. Much appreciated.
I've followed Francis, Mary and Margaret on familysearch through various Rhode Island and US Census data until their deaths. I've got Mary Fitzgibbons listed as spouse on Francis's RI death record 7 Feb 1937.
As for Molly, I've searched the Irish Times Archive which has returned some results but I haven't plucked up the courage to subscribe at this time.
You said on an earlier post that you had found eight Keegan children. I have Patrick, Mary (1849), Francis, Margaret, Mary, Esther, Ellen and Elizabeth. I believe it was common to reuse names of deceased children at the next opportunity. It's quite likely I've missed a couple as I have gaps in the timeline from 1845 up to 1864.
If Patrick was named after Esther's father, could Francis have been named after Michaels father?
More thoughts to follow later this evening.
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Hi Spuncy,
Coincidence what you say regarding visiting relatives in Kinnegad. My father used to spend the long summer holiday in Killucan with his father's relatives as a boy. O'Briens or Twomeys, I believe, cousins of the Keegans. I have some photographs. PM me if you'd like a copy.
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Hi s_p_w,
Yep, I had those 8 and it seems as if the first Mary died and they named a later child Mary. I don't think I could find anything on the eldest, Patrick, though.
I went to the GRO and got 2 records:
- Michael Keegan 1807-1885 death (Mullingar Jan-Mar) but it was not the right Michael.
- Patrick Clarke 1799-1865 death (Mullingar) and again, not our Patrick Clarke.
So not sure when Michael Keegan died and where. It's possible his death may not have been registered.
I've seen instances where the first child has been named after both the mother's father and father's father (more usual). Unfortunately, we may never find out as the records from that time are all but non-existent. I did a quick search for baptism of Michael Keegan, father Francis, on rootsireland but didn't find anything. Perhaps the Twomey or O'Brien links can be explored further?
Probably the most interesting thing in the records about Michael Keegan is that his house/land in Griffith's is 'in fee'. It's a quarry so I wonder if he or his family had anything to do with that.
We may need to call in Sherlock Holmes!
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Hi spuncy,
I could not believe my eyes when I read your posting. We may be related. My GGgrandmother is Margaret Clarke from Kinnegad, Westmeath. She moved to Newport, RI and married my GGgrandfather, James McDonnell on October 29, 1865. Her parents were Patrick and Margaret. I hope that my Margaret Clarke is the same one that you mentioned. I have been working with a volunteer researcher for a year and he has not been able to find anything about Margaret but he did confirm that Patrick Clarke leased a farm in Kinnegad at the right time period.
If you think our two Margarets are the same, please let me know how we can share information. I have a lot on Margaret from the time she married until her death.
Thank you in advance for any scrap of information that you can give to me.
Best regards
Don K.
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Hi Don,
A Clarke from Kinnegad, ending up in Newport RI definitely seems like too much of a coincidence alright!
Esther Clarke Keegan, who moved to Rhode Island to be with her son Francis and daughters Mary and Margaret in 1883, died in 1892 and her death cert in Newport listed her parents as Patrick Clarke and Esther. The question is: could her mother be listed incorrectly?
From a preliminary search on rootsireland, Patrick and Margaret Clarke have 3 baptism records in Kinnegad:
1826 Esther (corresponds very well with our Esther as death cert has her birth in 1826)
1830 Richard
1834 Francis (our Esther had a son, Francis, so seems to run in the family).
Add to that Esther's daughter Margaret and we have a matching up of names. It does seem increasingly likely that the death cert had Esther's mother listed incorrectly and it potentially should be Margaret.
The fact that there's a connection to Newport and perhaps that's why Esther's son Francis moved there, does increase the likelihood that your gg-gm Margaret Clarke was our Esther's sister.
However, there were quite a number of Clarkes around Kinnegad and it's common for people in a general area to emigrate to the same place in the US or elsewhere. I think if we can find correlation between our Esther and her children in Rhode Island with your gg-gm Margaret, then we can perhaps tie it down better.
I am in contact with several members of the family, including some who are still in Rhode Island. I will send you a PM.
Talk soon,
Alan.
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Don you need to make 2 more posts before Alan can send you a PM
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Hi Sinann, spuncy, keyreg, s_p_w, Faye 567 and any others,
For some reason I had not received any of these messages even though I had started this thread, but I am now back in the loop. My tree is under walshtreemaker and I would be happy to share and would also like to share in your trees.
bupski
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My ancestor Patrick Keegan came from Baltigeer Ballinabrackey near Kinnegad, maybe around 1860, he married Bridget Daly Derryroe Castletown Geoghegan Co. Westmeath.
I've heard Patricks brothers and sisters emigrated to Argentina, about 2 years ago I discovered some went to America, I have no info on Baltigeer Keegans that went to America, I have relatives in America who are decended from the Castletown Keegans.
Francis is a common name in our branch too.
The Keegan headstone is in Kilkeran Cemetary Ballinabrackey, the earliest name on it is James Keegan 1776, the last name is Ellen Keegan 1880.
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Hi bupski,
I have just edited your settings to get a message of a new reply instantly, if you had missed your first reply it was set up just to notify you the once ;)
Regards
Sarah