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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Pembrokeshire => Topic started by: John_Lewis-Spencer on Thursday 07 May 09 07:46 BST (UK)
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Hi All,
I'm researching Pembrokeshire Photographers for a Narberth Museum project. I am hoping to find out
more about our local photographers and add this detail to the Museum's photographic image collection.
My main interest is the period 1860-1920, photographers working in Pembrokeshire.
I do have outline information and dates for about fifty local photographers so far.
Not many of these photographers were 'Welsh born', in fact they came from all over the UK.
One example is Charles Smith Allen of Tenby, coming from Rugeley in Staffordshire. Two of his
sons were also photographers. Charles Allen was supposed to have been one of Queen Victoria's favorite photographers. Perhaps he was invited to Osborne house on the Isle of Wight. Charles specialised in photographing large mansions and produced photographic albums for the gentry.
Frederick Nedahl came from Hamburg and was a jeweller as well.
Sidney Webb was born in Bristol and Harry Goodden came from Oxford.
Arthur Squibbs came from Bridgewater, Somerset and George Villiers was born in Norwich.
I would be interested in hearing from anyone interested in Pembrokeshire photographers .
Perhaps I can help you as well.
Regards
Llanfallteg
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I know there is a photographic shop in Warren St Tenby (not sure of their name) and they have taken photos for many years including postcards. I passed there the other day and they had loads of old b/w photos in the window.
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Hi
I have 2 Postcard Photos
One of my Greatgrandmother taken by W John,Clynderwen
There other by C Edwards of Fishguard & Newport,Pembs.
Love visiting Narberth Museum when on holiday.
Hope this helps
Omega
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That's interesting. I have two family photos. taken by Arthur Squibbs, but don't know who the people are. These family connections were between Pembrokeshire and Plymouth, Devon.
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Hi Researchers,
Thanks for your interest and input.
1. Lambkin.
The photographic shop in Tenby was possibly the one that R Keeble-Jowett started in the 1890's.
Keeble-Jowett's adverts in the local press suggested that he was patronised by HRH the Duchess of York. He called his studio 'Lafayette' and it was situated in Warren Street, Tenby and become Napleton Studios. During 1902 this business was taken over by Arthur Squibbs
2. Omega 1
William John of Clynderwen was a local photographer born in Penfford Pembrokeshire about 1888.
He was well known in the area around Narberth and many of his photographic images, especially postcards remain. My favorites are his pictures of the James Brothers early biplane that flew from Clynderwen to Carmarthen.
Charles Edwards had several studios in Fishguard during the period 1891-1926. 1891-1914 he had a studio in the high Street Fishguard. From 1910-1926 he had a studio in West Street, Fishguard. From 1914 to 1926 he also had a photographic studio in Quay Street, Goodwick, Fishguard.
Glad to hear that you like to visit the Museum. We have recently acquired the 'Old Bonded Stores' in Narberth and started to convert this building into a new museum. This will of course cost a few bob! The Heritage Lottery Commision have helped us recently, but another couple of million would help!
3. Clottedcream.
Arthur Squibbs was born 1875 in Bridgewater, Somerset. He came to South Wales around 1901 with his brother Harold and they had a studio in Newquay. Arthur then opened studios in Milford Haven and Pembroke Dock. The Tenby studio of R Keeble-Jowett became his main base until the business was sold in 1953. Sadly he died soon after retiring in Tenby during 1953 at the age of 78.
Regards
Llanfallteg
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Here is an extract from some researching I have been doing..
In tangent with Sidney Webb was a family with the Head being William Trindall who had a photographers studio in Dimond Street, Pembroke Dock too. In the 1861 Census he was down as Photographic Artist (born Oxford) , but in the 1871 Census he too had a studio in Dimond Street. He died in 1875 and his wife Sarah carried on the business under the name of William Trindall and remarried in 1876 to a George Middleton. George is missing from the 1881 and the1891 Census and by 1901 Sarah is a widow but her children from Trindall are still running the business as Trindall’s of Dimond Street. I have a photo of my great grand aunt and husband photographed by H F Trindall C1905. Hugh Frederick Trindall.
Steven
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Regarding the photographer Allen - I have a photo of my mother taken in Pembroke 1942 by a S J Allen. I know this is after your date of interest, but the family were taking photos then.
Steven
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Sorry me again
Just realized this photo on my profile is by Sidney Webb!
Steven
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Hi Mothball,
Thanks for the interest and information about the Trindalls.
This is the 'timeline' for the Trindalls that I've found so far.
TRINDALL Richard St Thomas' Green, Haverfordwest 1868
TRINDALL Rchard. Bridge St, Haverfordwest 1871
TRINDALL William 37 Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1868
TRINDALL W. Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1871, 1875 Diamond St in 1871
TRINDALL Mrs Sarah Ann 37 Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1880
MIDDLETON & TRINDALL Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1884
MIDDLETON Mrs S.A. 37 Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1891
TRINDALL & Co. 37 Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1895, 1901, 1910
TRINDALL Hugh Frederick 37 Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1906
These dates mostly came from trade directories.
I have a small collection of carte-de-visite photographs by Pembrokeshire photographers.
I'm interested in the backs of the cards, although the front can give some idea of the date.
Regards
Llanfallteg.
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Hi Mothball,
This is the 'timeline' for Sidney Webb.
WEBB Sidney Commercial Row, Pembroke Dock 1868, 1871
WEBB Sidney Dimond St, Pembroke Dock 1875, 1880
WEBB Sidney Laws St, Pembroke Dock 1884.
I think he was active for many years as I've four different styles of his cards.
The advertising motives were in red, green, blue then black with the Prince of Wales feathers.
Sam John Allen one of Charles Smith Allen's sons was in Pembroke as well as our Sid and the Trindall family. The docks produced a fair amount of photographic trade.
ALLEN Samuel J. 26 Bush St, Pembroke Dock 1891, 1895, 1901 S.J. 1891 + 1895
ALLEN S.J. Creswell Buildings, Bush St,Pembroke Dock 1906, 1910
ALLEN Samuel J. Picton Place, Haverfordwest 1891, 1895, 1901, 1906
ALLEN S.J. Picton Place 1901 and 1906
ALLEN Samuel J. Cartlett, Haverfordwest 1910, 1914, 1920
I think that when photographers took over existing businesses they used the printed cards from the previous owner for a short while. This does cause some confusion.
Regards
Llanfallteg
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Hello Llanfallteg
Interesting project you have.
I have Sidney Webb on the 1891 census occupation as Watchman and in 1901 aged 67, occupation Brick Layer, some mistake I think?
Here is a link to the discussion about my photo when I first joined rootschat, you might find some of the comments of interest.
There is also a scan of the back of the photo too.
(I notice many call Dimond Street Diamond Street - I think that is a local thing)
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,372640.0.html
Regards
Steven
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Hi Stephen,
Thanks for the link to the old thread.
I'll cover that in another reply.
I followed Sidney Webb through the census the same as you've done.
I couldn't see why he turned to bricklaying and was sure that I had gone down the wrong route.
I wondered why he was bricklaying later on in life! Perhaps there was more money to be made after the first run of good years with picture taking.
I've edited your carte-de-visite image and its attached. Didn't know how attachments looked when sent until I saw your old thread, otherwise I would have used them before.
I'll look at the Webb backs that I've on file, and be on line again this evening.
Regards
John
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Hi Stephen,
Found a few Sidney Webb carte-de-visite backs of the cards.
I've never seen the one you have before, must 'tie in' to when he had a photographic job at the dockyard. I did read about him recently, possibly in Pembrokeshire Life and how he was employed taking photographs of ships in the dockyard. I'll have a search through the back numbers.
Regards
John
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Thanks very much for those. I thought I read somewhere that he worked in photography in the early 1900's, but am not definite. The census could easily be wrong, would seem a bit strange to start a career in bricklaying at that age.
Did you notice in the 1861 census his occupation was Licensed Victualler?
A dab hand at everything!
The link in the other thread takes you to a small discussion with one his descendants, here it is
http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/DYFED/2002-11/1038063106
Steven
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Hi Steven,
I've looked at the census information again. Fairly sure its the same family, so he did end up as a bricklayer!
The last time I have him advertising as a photographer is 1884. In 1881 he seems to be still very operational.
Regards
John
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Hi Steven,
In case you wondered what it looked like..... Dimond Street about 1900-20.
Regards
John
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Hi,
Sidney Webb was my gg grandfather and I have information about him if you are interested.
He was indeed a stonemason by trade and moved to Pembroke Dock in the 1850s to help build the town. How he became a photographer I don't know, but he was also a licenced victualler - I think the photography may have been a bit of a sideline for him. Although in later life he was working again as a bricklayer, his death certificate records him as a photographer.
Sandra
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Hello Sandra
Welcome to RootsChat!
I've been interested in this post started by Llanfallteg, who am sure will be in touch with you. I was curious how he Sidney Webb had so many occupations.
I have an old photo by him on my profile to the left here.
I was born in Pembroke Dock but unfortunately was brought up elsewhere, as now am learning all about Pembroke and Pembroke Dock. One grandparent came from Pembroke and the other from an old Pembrokeshire family of Morris who lived on Front Street for decades (Divers a lot of them).
We always went there a few times a year as my Gran lived there up to the 1980's.
Off to bed now
Regards
Steven
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Hi Sandra,
Interested to hear that you're a descendant of Sidney Webb. I have done a little research on him but not in depth.
I remember looking for his marriage to Ellen but didn't think I'd got it right, as it was in London!
When I looked at the 1901 census I found that she had been born in London so this was possibly correct.
Do you happen to have a photograph Sidney? Photographs of photographers are not that common. I've been a photographer for most of my life and there are not many pictures of me!
Regards
John
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Hi John,
I don't have a photograph of Sidney Webb unfortunately. You have the correct marriage for Sidney & Ellen Webb, they married at Marylebone in 1854, and were in Lewis Street, Pembroke Dock by 1858 when their first son Thomas was born, his occupation then was bricklayer journeyman. The family story is that Sidney Webb came to PD to help build the town and he was certainly a stonemason on his marriage certificate, as was his father Peter Webb. He was in Commercial Row by January 1861 and still a bricklayer when daughter Rosa Ellen died, but was a licenced victualler by May of 1861 when his daughter Emma was born in Commercial Row. On the 1861 census he was a licensed victualler at the Pembroke Dock House, Commercial Row. They were still in Commercial Row in 1864 when son Sidney Elliott Webb died - now a photographer! By the time my great grandmother Ella was born in 1871 they had moved to Dimond Street. They later lived at the Prince of Wales pub on the corner of Dimond Street and Laws Street and Sidney Webb died at 12 Laws Street in 1918 aged 85 years and still recorded as a photographer. I suspect he 'kept his hand in' over the years with the bricklaying and building while also working as a photographer and Ellen looked after the pub side of things. 12 Laws Street was still in the family up until my great grandmother Ella died in the 1950s.
Regards
Sandra
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Hi Sandra,
Thanks very much for the new information about your ancestors.
I will take some photographs of the houses you mention and the public house next time I'm in Pembroke.
I think Sidneys job in the docks was quite important to be able to use the information on the back of his carte-de-visite cards. Somewhere I read that he photographed all the dock workers, an early security pass I suppose.
I'll keep in touch.
Regards
John
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As a descendent of Fredrick Nedahl I have collected what I can find on the web, and a couple of items of family history. I'm afraid that family knowledge or records is practically non-existent in my branch of the tree.
I would be interested in information that might enable me to do further research, hopefully for all of our interest.
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Hi Zalib,
I did have a look at Frederick Nedahl some time last year. I attach a tree that I did at the time, don't know if it is correct in every aspect.
I had a chance to see one of his Cart-de-visite photographs with his name on the reverse, I've added this as well.
Regards
John
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Hello. I have come across a photograph album with photos taken by the Arthur Squibbs photographer. Would anybody be interested in having these pictures - i cannot date them but they look old and look like they should be in a local museum. Happy to send them off.
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Do you know what the postage will be please.
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Replying to Lambkin. I am happy to send the photographs to someone like yourself who appreciates them. I do not know who the people in the photos are so they mean nothing to me. I also do not want any payment - I just don't think they belong in the bin. If I have an address then I will send them on. I have to say I find this forum difficult to navigate as replying personally has been blocked???
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Is this the thread you refer to?
topics merged
You can reply just by clicking on to reply at the end of the thread.
The Personal messaging system only becomes available once you have made 3 or more posts. So make a couple more, then if you need to contact Lambkin directly for any reason, you will be able to.
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I think your reply is here
Topics merged :)
I'll ask mods to combine the threads
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I would like to know if any of Sydney Webbs photographs of the cutting of the first sod of the Pembroke & Tenby Railway in 1862 still survive and if so, where can I get a copy to go with my research into that railway line.
Regards
Graham
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John,
Just came a cross your old interest in Charles Smith Allen.
Living at his birth town (Rugeley) I am keen to write a brief biographical note for our local history society.
I am trying to check the veracity of a couple of statements that appear on-line and wonder if you could help.
1, It is stated that there are a few of his paper and silver negatives/prints of Tenby dating to the 1840's - but I have asked Tenby museum if they have them or know of them but they have replied that they do not have them and are unaware of them. Have you any information as to the origin of this statement or where they might be? If true and accurate this dating is significant as being very early and he being still young.
2, The other is the one about being one of Queen Victoria's favourite photographers that you allude to. Any idea of the origin of this statement? I am aware of the album of photographs in The Royal Collection 'Sent by Lady Cawdor, by Your Majesty's permission'.
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Hello All,
I`m hoping this portrait may be of interest to those of you here, as it may well have been made by one of the photographers under discussion.
Here is as much information about it that I know of. The portrait seems to be a cross between a photograph and a charcoal sketch. The subjects are my GGG Grandparents, John Lloyd (c.1816 Warren - 1879) and Mary (nee Rees, c. 1818-1888 of Penally). John`s father George was from Pembroke and they moved to Monkton around 1845. The Census finds them as follows:
1851 East End Back, Pembroke
1861 Green Alley
1871 Main Street.
Judging by Mary`s clothing, I`m guessing that the portrait was made around 1863?
I haven`t been able to get any info from the back yet as it is in safekeeping in Wales, whilst I live in Japan!
Apologies on only providing a link (below) to the portrait, but I don`t have the skills to make it a smaller file for posting here directly.
If anybody has any comments that may deepen my understanding of it, I love to hear them.
Thanks in advance,
Owen
(http://www.wikitree.com/photo.php/0/00/Lloyd-1700.jpg)
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Hi Llanfallteg
I know this is an old post, but i am trying to identify an old family photo that was taken by I think S J Allen Pembroke. I was wondering if there is any way of finding this kind of information out. I am pretty new to researching my family so sorry if this is a silly question.
Kind regards
Maria
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Hi Maria,
I think that knowing the photographer is about as far as you will get. Some photographers kept records that might have been passed on to family members. The photographers name would have normally been on the back of the photograph but was placed on the front from about 1900.
With regards to identification you could try a family history site. Ancestry does has a researchers part where you can place photographs and request contacts or information or you could use social media.
I have placed photographs on this site some time ago.
Regards
John
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Hi John
Thank you for your help, the name was printed on the front of the photo so that helps to know that it's after 1900.
I will also do as you suggest and post the photo on Ancestry to see if someone can identify it.
Thank you
Regards
Maria
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Hello Maria,
A huge welcome to RootsChat :)
There are two sections here on RootsChat that may help you our dating photo section here http://www.rootschat.com/forum/free-photo-restoration and our photo recognition section http://www.rootschat.com/forum/handwriting-deciphering-recognition if you can scan your photo you can add them to your RootsChat posts.
Regards
Sarah :)
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Hi Sarah
Thank you for the welcome. I will add the photo to the boards you suggested to see if anyone can identify it.
Kind regards
Maria
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I have a cabinet photograph of a jockey dressed in royal silks by S J Allen / Ernest Allen of Pembroke Dock/ Haverfordwest / Cardigan . Does anyone know if they are the sons of Charles Smith Allen photographer of Tenby and what years they were active. The jockey looks very much like Fred Archer.
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Hi To the original poster - I realise your OP was 2009, so I imagine your museum project may have been completed long ago! However, I am seeking information on my great-grandmother C.C. Higgs who I am told may have had a photographic studio on the High St in Haverfordwest circa 1910. Was she one of the fifty you mentioned in your original post? I would be very grateful for any information you may have or to be pointed in the right direction in my efforts to find out a little more about her. I am happy to receive a PM about this. I have links local newspapers that used her photos at that time. Thanks for any help you can give me.
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Hello Malroy,
Welcome to RootsChat :) The poster has been notified of your reply and has been online recently hopefully they will reply to you very soon.
Regards
Sarah