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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Cheshire => Topic started by: adj05 on Thursday 30 July 09 16:07 BST (UK)
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I am desperatly trying to find out about an area of Bowdon in Cheshire called Spring Bank.
On the 1871 census I have found my ancestors down as living at the address, Spring Bank in Bowdon. There is no house number there and although it does show on an up to date map it does not appear to look like a street. Please can anybody offer me some help? Many Thanks, Adam.
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I am desperatly trying to find out about an area of Bowdon in Cheshire called Spring Bank.
On the 1871 census I have found my ancestors down as living at the address, Spring Bank in Bowdon. There is no house number there and although it does show on an up to date map it does not appear to look like a street. Please can anybody offer me some help? My ancestors were the Ollier family and although husband and wife are registered at birth in Northwich it appears that they moved to Bowdon for about ten years in and around 1870 where they started to raise their family. Does anybody know if they may have moved here for work or what Spring Bank used to be or was? Many Thanks, Adam.
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Adam, welcome to RootsChat.
There is a complex of flats (I think it may be a sheltered scheme, I'm not sure) called Spring Bank, on Ashley Road - more or less opposite the junction with Hale Road. If this is what you've seen on the current map it is a block built in the last 10-20 years.
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Hi
Thanks for your speedy reply.
Yes, the Spring bank that I have seen on the map is the one that you are talking about.
I wonder if it is the same area as spoken about on the 1871 census?
Adam
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When I lived in the area as a child/teenager, Spring Bank was a large green area at the bottom of Stamford Road at its junction with Ashley Road. Having googled for Spring Bank, Hale, Cheshire (it is debatable whether it was in Hale or Bowdon), I found an apartment for sale called Spring Bank with the directions suggesting you go from Ashley Road Hale, towards the traffic lights (not there in my day), turn right (still Ashley Road going towards Altrincham) and Spring Bank is on the left. So it looks as though it has been built on, which is not surprising.
Perhaps there were properties on it in 1871 but by the 1940s and 1950s they had gone as we used to play on there.
Lizzie
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Adam, I'll try and see what I can find - in the meantime there's an old (but sadly undated) photograph on the Trafford Lifetimes site at
http://www.trafford.gov.uk/content/tca/display_image.asp?ImageID=5234
I know there are several other posters on here whose local knowledge goes back beyond mine, so may be more able to help.
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See also
www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=395756.new#new
I've given a fuller answer on that thread, but I think we all agree where it was.
Lizzie
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Adam - sorry I really should have thought of this one before
http://maps.cheshire.gov.uk/tithemaps/TwinMaps.aspx?township=EDT_59-2
This gives you side by side two maps of the same area different dates. If you change the left one to 1875 and then move the right hand one to the right so you can see both railway stations (Hale & Altrincham) - then zoom in about halfway between the two & you have old & modern Spring Bank.
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Thanks for that Lizzie - much appreciated
Adam
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Thanks for that but I have a really slow mobile internet connection and Im having trouble opening the link.
Do you have any idea where I could go and see an old map in person or where I would find more information out about Spring Bank?
Adam
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Adam - the tithe maps website is I think the best online for Cheshire old maps - perhaps a visit to a library?
Bowdon, Hale & Altrincham (Spring Bank seems to be at the junction of all three) now come under Trafford. Trafford Local Studies Library is in Sale & they have a collection of maps from the past as well as trades directories, some electoral rolls, local papers (film) and other local material.
http://www.trafford.gov.uk/LeisureAndCulture/Libraries/RecordsAndArchives-LocalStudies
Cheshire Records Office in Chester also has old maps & will probably also have some of this area.
http://www.cheshireeast.gov.uk/leisure_and_culture/record_office.aspx
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This is Spring Bank in 1911.
Stan
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This is Springbank in 1911
Image removed
Stan
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Just a little bit to add.
Springbank in 1871 was in the parish of Bowdon. Hale, Altrincham - and Bowdon, I think - were all townships in that parish. The maps given above show the area where it was.
Looking at the c1875 map on the Cheshire Tithe Map site it looks a little as though SptingBank took up the whole of the land fronting Ashley Road and bounded by Stamford Road and 'the road by the side of Culcheth Hall, nowadays a school. There is obviously a 'big house' in the middle.
Currently - and for some time, as LizzieW mentioned - there had been an open park area on that part of that land bordering Stamford Road and Ashley Road. There have long been some houses on the corner - fronting Ashley Road on the other corner by the Culcheth Hall school. In the middle I think will have been Springbank - the house? - which much more recently, as has been said, has been converted into, I think, retirement apartments.
Reiver
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Thanks for all the help.
I am wondering if anybody could tell me from their knowledge and expertise how I would go about finding out who lived there at the time and who it actually belonged to?
Adam
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Thanks for all the help.
I am wondering if anybody could tell me from their knowledge and expertise how I would go about finding out who lived there at the time and who it actually belonged to?
Adam
You don't say who your ancestor is, but in the 1871 Census the occupier of "Springbank" was a Joseph B. Forster, who was a Sugar Refiner, he and his wife had four children and two servants, a cook and a housemaid.
RG10/3682/82/76
Stan
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Hi Stan
Im getting really confused here.
For the address spring bank I have the following information:
Head:George Ollier-age 44-birth year of 1827
Wife:Hannah Ollier- age 46- birth year of 1825
Son:John Ollier-age 22- birth year of 1849
Daughter:Sarah E Oliier-age 19- birth year of 1852
Son:Richard Ollier-age 17-birth year 1854
Son:George Ollier-age 13-birth year of 1858
Daughter:Mary H Ollier-age 11- birth year of 1860
Daughter:Martha J Ollier-age 9- birth year of 1862
Son:Ernest Ollier-age 6-birth year of 1865
Aunt:Elizabeth Spencer-age 64-born 1807
It gave the address as Sping Bank, Bowdon in the civil parish of Bowdon
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Hi Stan
Im getting really confused here.
For the address spring bank I have the following information:
Head:George Ollier-age 44-birth year of 1827
Wife:Hannah Ollier- age 46- birth year of 1825
Son:John Ollier-age 22- birth year of 1849
Daughter:Sarah E Oliier-age 19- birth year of 1852
Son:Richard Ollier-age 17-birth year 1854
Son:George Ollier-age 13-birth year of 1858
Daughter:Mary H Ollier-age 11- birth year of 1860
Daughter:Martha J Ollier-age 9- birth year of 1862
Son:Ernest Ollier-age 6-birth year of 1865
Aunt:Elizabeth Spencer-age 64-born 1807
It gave the address as Sping Bank, Bowdon in the civil parish of Bowdon
I am getting my information from Findmypast.com
It says the following:
civil parish = bowdon
registration district = altrincham
county = cheshire
enumeration district = 12
RG number = RG10
Piece = 3684
Folio = 6
Page = 3
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There appear to be two Spring Banks in Bowden having a name and the census details helps to determine which one. :)
RG10; Piece: 3684; Folio: 6; Page: 3;
Stan
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Might you be able to help me now you have that information?
Adam
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There is an oddity here in that Springbank does appear on the citation provided ny Stan AND also that provided by Adj05.
It would appear that the 'big house' occupants are what Stan has found and the rest of us found the Olliers - with other families as well - in District 12. (I've not checked yet in what District Mr. Forster, the sugar refiner, was found.) Wit the new layout on Ancestry I've not yet found my way to looking at the District descriptions. Maybe one enumerator had the larger properties.
The start of the thread referred to the name Ollier and that was found. What made you pick up on the other one, Stan?
Regards
Reiver
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Hi all
I've now downloaded a copy of the original image of the 1871 census.
When it says 'No. of schedule' does that mean the house number?
In the next column along it asks for 'road, street and No. or name of house'. In this column it simply says 'Spring Bank' for the Ollier family.
The entry on the same page before the Olliers also gives the address as Sping Bank.
I thought I was doing so well with tracing my family tree but It seems so hard to do!
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It would appear that there are two - one might say several Spring Banks in Bowdon.
Joseph B Forster - he who Stan found - is living at the 'big house' on Ashley Road - the place that we have been writing about.
George Ollier - and several other families - (about 9 in all) are at 'Spring Bank' in that part of Bowdon on Langham Road. The Enumerator's schedule for District 12 - where George is living - includes the words " All that part of Bowdon Bowdon Vale ...Street Heaf, Bow Green, Vicarage lane . . . .
If one picks up on the Enumerators route before the 9(?) Spring Banks he calls at South Downs Cottage and Black Fiels Lane (?). Afterwards at Yew Bank and Bowdon Hall. Yew Bank is named on www.oldmaps.co.uk. Bowdon Hall is on Langham Road not too far from the junction with Langham Road.
As they say I hope this helps. Afterwards I might go out and see if I can find it.
Regards
Reiver
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Hi Reiver
Im ever so confused about your last message. Couyld you possibly explain a little more?
Are they in totally different areas?
Adam
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I'm sorry Adam.
Going back to your first message you had found your George Ollier at Spring Bank, Bowdon. If you can look at the census image again, you will note on George Ollier's page - and the next = several households with that same address.
When you asked the question where was Spring Bank in Bowdon we all knew where it was in our different ways. Someone produced a couple of maps of it even. On the face of it, that was it.
Stan then found Joseph B Forster, a sugar refiner, at Spring Bank, Bowdon. It was apparent from the citation that he gave that it was not the same Spring Bank where your George Ollier lived. Looking at the reference which Stan gave, there was only the one address Spring Bank. You will have seen from the map two or three postings ago that Spring Bank is a large property in large grounds, the sort of property one would expect a Sugar Refiner to live in with his family.
Your George Ollier lived about a mile down the road at a group of addresses under the title Spring Bank. I went out before to see whether I could spot anything but wasn't successful. I was given one or two clues and I am hoping I will be able to locate your Spring Bank in about a week. I'll let you know.
Are you at all familiar with the Bowdon / Altrincham area?
Regards
Reiver
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Hi Reiver
My parents have just moved to West Timperley so I am staying with them for the summer. I dont know Altrincham/ Bowdon at all really so its hard to try and picture things and places.
How have you have worked out that George Ollier lived about a mile down the road at a group of addresses under the title of Spring Bank?
I am ever so new at this and i am very much the novice.
I must say, I am extrememly grateful for all your help.
Adam
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Hi Adam
Its a bit complex. I use Ancestry. - You may have used a different program to look at the 1871 Census. Towards the top of the census image you should find a District number possibly put there by the program. Your Spring Bank was in District 12.
A District was allocated to an Enumerator and a schedule of the properties he was to enumerate was written down and given to him. This document can be accessed on-line. It was this document that referred to the District comprising Vicarage Lane, Bowdon Hall and others which I referred to previously. I recognised where most of those places were and hence was able to say they are about a mile 'down the road.
Regards
Reiver
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Thats a great help. Thanks very much.
I look forward to hearing from you.
Adam
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A question for Stan who provided the 1911 map showing Spring Bank.
Stan,
Is there a road called Spring Road or Spring Bank in your 1911 map of Bowdon, please? I am anticipating it may be as follows:-
Follow Langham Road (runs south from Spring Bank passed a junction with Heald Road and off the image).
Continue following Langham Road
Pass Vicarage Lane on the left.
Pass Graveyard on the right,
Pass Bow Green Road on the left.
What is the name of the nest road on the left?
(Today it is called The Springs)
Regards
Reiver
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Hi Reiver,
Unfortunately the only map I have is the 6 inch Cheshire Sheet XVIII N.W. and the continuation you refer to is on Sheet XVIII S.W.
Stan
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The 1881 Census has Spring Bank, Langham Road which appears to be between Grange Road and Vicarage Lane west of Bowden College.
1 Spring Bank Langham Road, Census Place: Bowdon, Cheshire, England
Ref RG11 Piece 3505 Folio 59 Page 9, 2 Spring Bank, UNINHABITED,
3 Spring Bank, then there is How Bank No 1, UNINHABITED, and How Bank No 2.
Stan
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Thanks Stan
Your second reply regarding the 1881 Census has 'cracked' the problem I think :)
Unfortunately you did not have the other sheet of the Map, which would have given me the name of that road in 1911 - but in fact I'm now pretty sure it was not on that road anyway - if that makes sense? :)
When I read your note about the apparent whereabouts of Spring Bank - and it being on Langham Road - and it being between Grange Road and Vicarage Lane I realised I knew somebody who was born at that location who lives about 200 yds away from me. I called on him and he confirmed that those houses were indeed called Spring Bank.
Adam,
I'm sure these houses are your Spring Bank.
Regards
Reiver.