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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lincolnshire => Topic started by: lourdes96 on Tuesday 25 August 09 05:41 BST (UK)
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I know that Charles Rufus Marshall Workman was a British Resident Commissioner for the Solomon Islands in the Pacific from 1917 to 1921. He used to travel to many places in the South Pacific and also used to work in Nauru as an administrator from 1914 to 1917.
I know that he went to Gambia after working in the Pacific.
Can anybody help me with his wareabouts? When and how he died, etc...did he has children???
Thanks.
Best regards,
Lourdes
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Hi lourdes96 and welcome! :)
Just to save others looking for the obvious-
Births Sep 1874
WORKMAN Charles Rufus M Camberwell 1d 686
Marriages Jun 1900
WORKMAN Charles Rufus M Grimsby 7a 1634
WINTRINGHAM Kate Grimsby 7a 1634
1901
10 Shelly Crt, Chelsea
Charles WORKMAN 26 Barrister at Law, Camberwell
Kate 24 Grimsby
Susan THOMPSON 25 Housemaid, Binbrook
Edith RAND 22 Cook, Binbrook
I suspect this was one of theirs
Births Jun 1902
WORKMAN Katharine Mary W Chelsea 1a 396
Marriages Jun 1924
WIDDOWSON Benjamin C (Workman) Oxford 3a 2480
WORKMAN Katherine M W (Widdowson) Oxford 3a 2480
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Thank you Geoff-E
I am happy for your information on Mr Workman. I wish his daughter still somewhere in England and survived with children.
Actually I am on the other side of the globe....lolz...do not know how to contact this family of Mr Workman. If could be offered more assistance on this matter, I would be very grateful.
Thank you very much again for your kind assistance and support on this research.
Regards,
Lourdes.
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Hi again :)
I'm afraid RootsChat is not a facility for getting in touch with living people - and we are not allowed to post things about living people. :(
As far as I can see, Benjamin and Kath WIDDOWSON had one child - a son - in 1933. I can't see an obvious marriage for him in the marriage index, nor a death between 1984 and 2005.
This (he donated to the British Museum) suggests he died in 1942 http://www.britishmuseum.org/research/search_the_collection_database/term_details.aspx?bioId=156769
Looking at the GRO death index confirms that he did
Death Q2 1942
WORKMAN Charles R M (aged 65), Caistor 7a 1034, so he died in Lincolnshire.
I don't think I can give further assistance.
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I just want to thank you very much for your assistance.
I understand completely what you said and I really appreciate all the assistance that you have given me. Thanks again.
As I said there is a big distane between us and as you said.....you cannot give more further assistance on this matter. Please let me know if there is an organisation or someone (web sites or contacts) who carry out these kinds of research from England, London in particuar and their charges. I am willing to pay (the resonable amount) to get all the information I can get about Mr Workman and his living family if he has any today..it is a very important thing for me to know.
Have a nice day.....
Best regard,
Lourdes :)
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Hi Lourdes
I have Charles Rufus Marshall Workman in my tree. His sister Eliza Mapson Workman married John Fildes Wintringham in 1891.
C.R.M.W. married Kate Wintringham in 1900, she was the sister of John Fildes Wintringham. Their brother was Thomas Wintringham MP who married Margaret Longbottom, who i think ( if ive worked it out right) was my 3rd cousin twice removed
regards Jo
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Hi Jo,
Thank you very much for your reply. I think I got the right person to ask to about the wareabout of Mr Charles Rufus Marshall Workman who worked in the Pacific and in Kiribati for specific as a Residence Commissioner during the colonial period (1910s)
I just want to know if Charles is survived with children and all about his relationship because in that way I may be able to track where I really come from and who are my blood relatives!
Charles was known in Kiribati as 'Tiareti' a local name given to him (which is the Kiribati prounounciation of Charles).
I have spent the last 6 years looking for families of Charles in England because I know that my great grandmother never had a chance to know them as promised by his father to the French priest (Fr Corbrett) who took care after her since her father left for the first world war in Europe.
Please let me know more about this strange lost long ancestor of mine.
Regards,
Lourdes
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Hi Lourdes. posting to u pm too like last time...
this looks interesting >>>
Katharine M W Widdowson
Gender: Female
Age: 69
Death Date: 25 Jun 1971
P of D Vancouver
Registration 1971-09-009690
bca B13311
gsu 2034262
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His death is Given in Who Was Who in 1942. It was also reported in an Australian Newspaper in 1942. Sidney Morning Hearald Monday 6th July 1942
NAURU LEADER DEAD
LONDON. July 5 (A.A.P.).-Mr. Charles Rufus Marshall Workman' has died. He was in charge of the Aus- tralian expedition which took posses- sion of Nauru in 1914, and became Administrator of the island at that time. He was Resident Commissioner in the Solomon Islands for some time from 1917.
The only likely English death record is as follows: (No guarantee it is him)
Charles R M Workman
Death Registration Month/Year: 1942
Age at death (estimated): 65
Registration district: Caistor
Inferred County: Lincolnshire
Volume: 7a
Page: 1034
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as these dates ive just found, ive deleted on here and pm Lourdes
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Very interesting account of his wife's family and his marriage, if this is the right chap...
http://findarticles.com/p/news-articles/grimsby-telegraph/mi_8063/is_20080626/all-good-things-must-end/ai_n48200551/
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Another mention in the Solicitiors Journal 1942
Mr. Charles Rufus Marshall Workman, CBE, died on Sunday, 28th June, aged sixty-five. He was educated at Leys School and Christ Church, Oxford, and was called by the Inner Temple in 1899. He then joined the Colonial Service.................
Its in Google Books, but that is all I can see on snippet view. Perhaps someone who has access to the journal could paste the rest?
This is a most interesting post!
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Info i was given... ;)
on CRMW
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,280765.0.html
Jo
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C.R.M.W. married Kate Wintringham in 1900 - anyone got a death date for her? Did he marry a second time? Have I missed something? Who was the mother of the child raised by the priest? PM
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C.R.M.W. married Kate Wintringham in 1900 - anyone got a death date for her? Did he marry a second time? Have I missed something? Who was the mother of the child raised by the priest? PM
Kate & CRMW had a daughter Katharine Mary Wintringham Workman who married Benjamin c Widdowson who was a cof e clergyman, they had a son who was born in 1933, so i personal messaged Lourdes with his name.
still looking for kate seniors death
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THANK YOU ALL FOR YOUR KIND ASSISTANCE,
It is very interesting to know that Mr CRM Workman had a daughter and grand-daughter! All I heard about (story being passed down) was that Mr Workman asked the priest for his baby to be born to keep it safe for he did not have a son and he will surely come back for it! These words were never came true for Mr Workman never came back or maybe because he learned from the priest that his baby was a girl...who knows???...he might have his own reasons but thanks to him that we are now existed in this world with many of us (in the family) having a fair skin color and most of all that we are now Catholics (Christians) which was his dream! (He did not want his baby to be raised by her grandparents who were missionaries of the protestant church) and that was why we became strong Catholics.
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Hi Lourdes. I'm not a direct descendant of Charles Workman, but his sister was my great-grandmother. If you want to know more about him in the Pacific, see if you can get hold of an old book called A Pattern of Islands by Arthur Grimble, who was a very young colonial officer when Charles had a senior post in the Gilbert & Ellice Islands before WW1. There are cheap 2nd-hand copies available on Abebooks. There are several vivid stories about Charles - he was a highly educated and very charming man, but sometimes dangerous to know!
I'm sorry to hear how badly he behaved in relation to your great-grandma. Did he at least help to support her? Where was she born?
I don't know any more about his daughter beyond what's already been posted here, I'm afraid. I do have a photo of her with her mother, as a child, and could post that if you're interested.
BTW, I don't think Charles Workman's parents were missionaries - his father was a lawyer, I think. But they may have had strong religious beliefs.
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Thank you Caro,
I think I may have some unclear phrases in my post about Charles Rufus Marshall Workman. I meant to say that the daughter of Mr Charles Workman who was my great-grandma was the grand-daughter of the Protestant missionary couples from her mother's side.... I did not know about her grandparents from her father but thanks to you that I have some ideas about them now. Also, the priest I was talking about was a French priest called Fr Corbrett (locally called Fr Ukenio) who was a close friend to Charles when he was on the island of Beru here in the Gilberts Islands. This was the priest who became a center of communication between Charles (when he was abroad) and his baby daughter who was left in the care of her mother on the island of Beru.
It was told that Fr Corbrett used to visit my great-grandma and with him always he brought money, clothes and other baby stuff who he claimed to have come from Mr Charles Rufus Marshall Workman. Thus, Mr Workman did support my great-grandmother when she was a baby girl until there were no more words from him. Please note that in those days, there were a lot of troubles in relation with communication...there were only one sailing boat to come to Kiribati every 2-3 months or even longer in a year!!!
We have no idea how Mr Workman left the Pacific when the World War I broke...how he died and so forth. This is only matter for us to know more about him....this is all we want to know especially if he had children. We would like to know whom we are related to in blood and flesh if that is acceptable.
Well, there is much more to say about Mr Charles Rufus Marshall Workman...how he met the mother of my great-grandmother etc.....how he had descended a well known family here in Kiribati (Gilbert group of Islands)
As you said, if you still have a photo of Charles, please send it to my email...I really appreciate having it. Maybe we could not have him as a real great-granddad but a photo would fill in that empty space in our family.
Thank you and I hope to hear from you as soon as possible Caro.
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Hi Lourdes. This is my first go at sending a photo to Rootschat: fingers crossed! I think I've sent you a photo of Charles as a boy, and also a pic of his father. Hope they arrive OK.
In 1915, according to Arthur Grimble in A Pattern of Islands, Charles was District Officer on an island called Tarawa. By the end of the year he was Administrator of Nauru.
I believe he was Resident Commissioner in the Solomon Islands in 1919-21, and he then spent 10 years in Gambia in Africa. He retired to England, and died in about 1942. Some of the things he brought back from the Pacific were donated to the British Museum after he died.
I can't add anything more about his daughter I'm afraid - other people have already posted the details of what I know, here on this website! She moved to Canada after her marriage, I believe, and I don't know if she kept in touch with cousins etc. I've never seen a photo of her as an adult. Her mother was my great-grandfather's sister - so it's interesting that there's so little information. Maybe all the photos etc went to other relatives?
I hope this helps to fill in a few gaps. Please let me know if I can help in any other way - there are other photos but I'd have to dig them out, will have a look if you're interested. Do you live in Kiribati?
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This is very interesting and attracting me a lot....I am one of the closest descendant of Charles' Daugther...I completely agreed with what lourdes96 said and the phrase "We would like to know whom we are related to in blood and flesh if that is acceptable"....F.Y.I. I am one of the Grandkid of Charles' daugther....
cheers
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Hi Caro W and Famkiri,
Yes, I live here in Kiribati and wish that one day I'll be able to find and meet those related to me in flesh and blood!
fyi the late Resident Commissioner and leader of Nauru did not marry in Kiribati. However, he made 1 of the local girl pregnant and asked the French Priest to look after his child before he left Kiribati knowing that my great-great grandmother was pregnant!
They said that Mr. CRM Workman used to send the priest $$$ and baby's stuff after he left the Pacific (this is just the story).
Sorry I should have responded but unfortunately lost access to my Lourdes96 account.
Hope everyone is still interested to help find my root.
Thank you all for your time...really appreciate it.
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Hi Caro W and Famkiri,
Yes, I live here in Kiribati and wish that one day I'll be able to find and meet those related to me in flesh and blood!
fyi the late Resident Commissioner and leader of Nauru did not marry in Kiribati. However, he made 1 of the local girl pregnant and asked the French Priest to look after his child before he left Kiribati knowing that my great-great grandmother was pregnant!
They said that Mr. CRM Workman used to send the priest $$$ and baby's stuff after he left the Pacific (this is just the story).
Sorry I should have responded but unfortunately lost access to my Lourdes96 account.
Hope everyone is still interested to help find my root.
Thank you all for your time...really appreciate it.
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The picture of the late Charles Rufus Marshall Workman's father is amazing! He had the same face as my grandfather's.
I'lll take my grandpa's picture and post it very soon!
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Hi Lourdes. This is my first go at sending a photo to Rootschat: fingers crossed! I think I've sent you a photo of Charles as a boy, and also a pic of his father. Hope they arrive OK.
In 1915, according to Arthur Grimble in A Pattern of Islands, Charles was District Officer on an island called Tarawa. By the end of the year he was Administrator of Nauru.
I believe he was Resident Commissioner in the Solomon Islands in 1919-21, and he then spent 10 years in Gambia in Africa. He retired to England, and died in about 1942. Some of the things he brought back from the Pacific were donated to the British Museum after he died.
I can't add anything more about his daughter I'm afraid - other people have already posted the details of what I know, here on this website! She moved to Canada after her marriage, I believe, and I don't know if she kept in touch with cousins etc. I've never seen a photo of her as an adult. Her mother was my great-grandfather's sister - so it's interesting that there's so little information. Maybe all the photos etc went to other relatives?
I hope this helps to fill in a few gaps. Please let me know if I can help in any other way - there are other photos but I'd have to dig them out, will have a look if you're interested. Do you live in Kiribati?
Thank you very much Caro for the photos...I got them and it's amazing Charle' s father looked very much like my grandfather whom everyone called him an 'halfcast' lol.
My apologies I should have responded but unfortunately I lost access to my Lourdes96 account and the internet connectivity back in 2012 was unreliable.
These days we can access our emails and browse the internet anytime!
I hope you still can access this account of yours.
Giles Peace same as Lourdes96
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His death is Given in Who Was Who in 1942. It was also reported in an Australian Newspaper in 1942. Sidney Morning Hearald Monday 6th July 1942
Hi,
This is the right ancestor I'm searching for information about his families in England or anywhere in the world!
Just very curious to know who they are, do they look the same as us in terms of appearance cos most of my uncles, aunties and cousins are fair!
Hope you can help me find them please.
NAURU LEADER DEAD
LONDON. July 5 (A.A.P.).-Mr. Charles Rufus Marshall Workman' has died. He was in charge of the Aus- tralian expedition which took posses- sion of Nauru in 1914, and became Administrator of the island at that time. He was Resident Commissioner in the Solomon Islands for some time from 1917.
The only likely English death record is as follows: (No guarantee it is him)
Charles R M Workman
Death Registration Month/Year: 1942
Age at death (estimated): 65
Registration district: Caistor
Inferred County: Lincolnshire
Volume: 7a
Page: 1034
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There is a probate entry in 1942 that matches the death registration:
Charles Rufus Marshall Workman of Owmby Mount, Owmby, Grasby, Lincolnshire; died 28 June 1942.
Probate granted to Elizabeth Florence Waring Wintringham, spinster. Effects £854 1s 7d.
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There is a probate entry in 1942 that matches the death registration:
Charles Rufus Marshall Workman of Owmby Mount, Owmby, Grasby, Lincolnshire; died 28 June 1942.
Probate granted to Elizabeth Florence
Waring Wintringham, spinster. Effects £854 1s 7d.
Thank you Nanny Jan for this information.
The Charles Rufus Marshall Workman I'm looking for is the one mentioned by Caro W!
I'm wondering if he's survived with children and I will not rest until I find them!
Thank you again.
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A copy of his Will might help; cost is £10 and are usually emailed within 10 days. Details of how to order here:
https://www.gov.uk/search-will-probate
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If you want to get his death cert,which might name a family member you can apply online for £9-25 to https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/
Deaths Jun 1942
WORKMAN Charles R M age 65 in Caistor volume 7a page 1034
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If you want to get his death cert,which might name a family member you can apply online for £9-25 to https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/
Deaths Jun 1942
WORKMAN Charles R M age 65 in Caistor volume 7a page 1034
Thanks Carol8353,
My ancestor Charles Rufus Marshall Workman died in July 1942 aged 65.
I believe he was survived with children whom I'm looking for this time. I'm not after his possessions but very interested to find out about those I'm related to by blood!
Thanks for your advice.
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A copy of his Will might help; cost is £10 and are usually emailed within 10 days. Details of how to order here:
https://www.gov.uk/search-will-probate
Thank you Nanny Jan.
Pleasant day.
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I believe he was survived with children whom I'm looking for this time.
You were given information about his daughter Katherine in reply #1 of this thread :)
Your new thread about her here (just for information to other contributors to this thread :) )
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=776505.msg6301895#msg6301895
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Charles Rufus Marshall Workman of Owmby Mount, Owmby, Grasby, Lincolnshire; died 28 June 1942.
Probate granted to Elizabeth Florence Waring Wintringham, spinster. Effects £854 1s 7d.
The CRMW living at that address in 1939 was described as "Colonial Service (retired)"
Elizabeth WINTRINGHAM was also at that address, possibly with her father, a John WINTRINGHAM (solicitor). She became Mrs NEALE in 1943.
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Charles Rufus Marshall Workman of Owmby Mount, Owmby, Grasby, Lincolnshire; died 28 June 1942.
Probate granted to Elizabeth Florence Waring Wintringham, spinster. Effects £854 1s 7d.
The CRMW living at that address in 1939 was described as "Colonial Service (retired)"
Elizabeth WINTRINGHAM was also at that address, possibly with her father, a John WINTRINGHAM (solicitor). She became Mrs NEALE in 1943.
Thanks Geoff-E
I'm not sure but I feel that the right death date of Charles Rufus Marshall Workman was 6th July 1942 as in the previous posts. Was there a possibility that death dates could be entered wrongly?
C.R.M.W. married Kate Wintringham in 1900 - anyone got a death date for her? Did he marry a second time? Have I missed something? Who was the mother of the child raised by the priest? PM
Hi Pastmagic,
Charles Rufus.Marshall Workman did not marry a second time. It was even forbidden to have an intimate relationship with the locals (brown or black people)!
However, he did ask the French Priest on the island to look after his unborn child before he left (that's what the priest claimed when he came to my great-granma's mother and grandparents to take her away)!
My great grandma was then looked after by this French Priest and nuns since she was just 5 years old! She was educated at the Catholic school along with the other white children!
They said that local children in those days were not allowed to attend school!
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Charles Rufus Marshall Workman of Owmby Mount, Owmby, Grasby, Lincolnshire; died 28 June 1942.
Probate granted to Elizabeth Florence Waring Wintringham, spinster. Effects £854 1s 7d.
The CRMW living at that address in 1939 was described as "Colonial Service (retired)"
Elizabeth WINTRINGHAM was also at that address, possibly with her father, a John WINTRINGHAM (solicitor). She became Mrs NEALE in 1943.
Thanks Geoff-E
I'm not sure but I feel that the right date of Charles Rufus Marshall Workman was 6th July 1942 as in the previous posts. Was there a possibility that death dates could be entered wrongly?
Not unless the probate and newspaper announcement were wrong !!!!!!!!!!
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Charles Rufus Marshall Workman of Owmby Mount, Owmby, Grasby, Lincolnshire; died 28 June 1942.
Probate granted to Elizabeth Florence Waring Wintringham, spinster. Effects £854 1s 7d.
The CRMW living at that address in 1939 was described as "Colonial Service (retired)"
Elizabeth WINTRINGHAM was also at that address, possibly with her father, a John WINTRINGHAM (solicitor). She became Mrs NEALE in 1943.
Thanks Geoff-E
I'm not sure but I feel that the right date of Charles Rufus Marshall Workman was 6th July 1942 as in the previous posts. Was there a possibility that death dates could be entered wrongly?
Not unless the probate and newspaper announcement were wrong !!!!!!!!!!
Thanks Sandra.
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If you want to get his death cert,which might name a family member you can apply online for £9-25 to https://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/
Deaths Jun 1942
WORKMAN Charles R M age 65 in Caistor volume 7a page 1034
Thank you Carol8353,
I really want to pay for his death certificate but we are not yet up to the banking system to do that with credit cards, visa..etc.
Is there a possibility I can get the certificate through Western Union payment transfer?
Sorry to bother you but I would appreciate any assistance.
Pleasant day!
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Hi Giles,
I have no idea if the GRO accept Western Union,as I have only ever used my credit or debit card.
Why not email them and ask.There is a FAQ page which must cover the 'how to pay' question.
Carol
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Thank you Carol8353
really appreciate your help.
Pleasant day!